[Kyanos]

I started on the powerpod one night. Didn't get too far though. I just made a diamond mesh and a good uv-map for it. The skin needs lots of work.

@DT- Take a look at this one and let me know if it's close to what you have in mind. I keep on trying to start this, then I don't know where to go. Magical, mystical... If you could find a suitable picture it would help me. I find it very hard to start a model without a "blueprint".


2 hrs later

Wraping vines around sticks, funwow. I am torn between just doing the one simple vine at each crossing point like the picture, or wrapping more vines around it. More would look good, but these add lots of polys and we don't want that do we?
PS. They don't need to be vines. I had leather at first but it was hard to work with, it didn't stand out like the green. I can change that later if you want.

[Danukem]

About the power gem. Let's start by looking at what we have. The first image shows the current power pod used in game. We want to preserve the basic outline, at least roughly, so that the new model will work smoothly in the maps it is already used. You place the pods into sockets, typically on a wall. But we don't have good sockets, we just have square animated texture with lightning animation on it.

The second image shows some gems. The blue one on the top might be suitable as a "power gem", although it doesn't need to be quite so rounded. The third image shows a gem progression from Diablo II. Notice how in the final progression, the gem is being held in a decorative metal housing. Something like that could work for the power gem socket. What you would see on the wall is the housing for the gem, then you insert the gem. That means there might need to be 3 separate models -- one for the gem, another for the housing, and another showing the gem in the housing. The third of those might be necessary due to clipping issues.

Now nothing I'm saying here is definitive, I'm just trying to give you the general idea.

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[Kyanos]

Thanks for that DT, it points me in the right direction.
@Marked, unless you want to do it I will take on the power gem. I won't start it yet, I want to finish the two stick fences I am working on.

[Mark]

I'm still working on a few other models plus working on my map. We'll see how it goes later this week.

ADDED: I'm going to attach a zip shortly with eveything I have so far. My version of the Ladder uses the same defs as Drek's original.

// GOLD CHAIR MODEL BY MARKED
model "misc/goldchair/1037goldchair.md3 " {
scale 6 shade 0
skin { pal 0 file "misc/goldchair/1037goldchair.png" }
frame { name "none00" tile 1037 flags 0 }
}


//BARREL BY MARKED
model "misc/barrel/barrel491.md3 " {
scale 5 shade 0
skin { pal 0 file "misc/barrel/barrel491.jpg" }
frame { name "none00" tile 0491 flags 0 }
}

//voxel misc/fence/fence7091.kvx { tile 7091 }
// FENCE MODEL BY MARKED
model "misc/fence/fence7091.md3 " {
scale 4.2 shade 7
skin { pal 0 file "misc/fence/fence7091.jpg" }
frame { name "none00" tile 7091 flags 0 }
}

[Kyanos]

I've finished the first fence. I wanted to get your opinion before I start the next one. I will be changing this model to make the other, so I want this finalized before I go further with the pair. I included a second skin, it just changes the string texture to green vines. I had to tweak it a lot to make it line up correct with itself and also if a sprite is backwards in the line, it will still line up. We might to add this to the clipshape map. You can get just a bit too close for my liking. If I offset it to avoid this then all sprites must face the same direction to line it up properly.

// Tile 3821 FENCE MODEL BY DREK
model "misc/fences/3821-fence.md3 " {
scale 16.59 shade 0 
skin { pal 0 file "misc/fences/3821-skin.png" }
skin { pal 40 file "misc/fences/3821-skin2.png" }
frame { name "FRAME1" tile 3821 flags 0 }
}

[Danukem]

Wow, guys, you have been busy! I will check all of this out as soon as possible.

I was working on the maps for the new key system, and I remembered we still need 3905. It's essentially the same metal spikes that are already in Drek's old fence model, so it should be very easy. Just keep in mind that the spikes are upside down in the art, so the model has to be upside down as well (in the maps they are usually flipped).

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[Mark]

Drek. I remember you mentioning making skins was not your specialty. I like the shape of the latest fence. About the only thing it needs to better match the original is more or thicker rope ties.

This was just a quick fix on your skin texture as an example. As I mentioned before, you should have a portion of it darkened a bit. That way you can apply that darker part to the sides and underside of the wood posts. Otherwise it just looks flat if there is no Polymer light shining on it. Also the texture was too clean. I added some dark smudges for added texture.

[Danukem]

@Marked: The new ladder and your new fence are not working. The models not loading; it looks like you changed to a different frame name. Remember, we can't use them unless the def has the correct frame name. EDIT: It's definitely a frame name issue with the new fence, but with the ladder there is no complaint about wrong frame name in the log, so I have no idea why the model will not show.

EDIT: The new fence works fine, my bad! I had put it in the "fences" folder and did not notice your def referrred to the "fence" folder.

Still not getting the ladder to show, though.

[Danukem]

@Drek: The model is good, and looks good in game. The skin is too red, however; it looks like the wood was painted red. I'm struggling to find places where 3821 is actually used in game. There are somewhat similar fence tiles 3821 and 3825 which are used a lot in wgx2.map, and your model makes a pretty good stand in for those, but not perfect since those are somewhat different looking sprites.

[Danukem]

@Marked: The barrel is great, as is the skin on the chair (although if I were to nitpick I would say the new decal is a bit too low-res). The barrel scale should be closer to 4.75 to match the sprite.

[Kyanos]

DeeperThought, on 05 September 2011 - 01:33 PM, said:

@Drek: The model is good, and looks good in game. The skin is too red, however; it looks like the wood was painted red. I'm struggling to find places where 3821 is actually used in game. There are somewhat similar fence tiles 3821 and 3825 which are used a lot in wgx2.map, and your model makes a pretty good stand in for those, but not perfect since those are somewhat different looking sprites.

The skin can be changed easily enough, it looks red because I used cherry wood , I will post something new soon.
I was trying to make the fence stand in for tile 3821, then changing it to make tile 3825. What would you have me do to the model to make it replace 3821. I know the sprite had more ropes, I left them out in hope of saving some fps if someone were to line up a few of these. I think it would look better with more rope, and thicker stuff like what marked added.

[Danukem]

Drek, on 05 September 2011 - 01:43 PM, said:

I was trying to make the fence stand in for tile 3821, then changing it to make tile 3825. What would you have me do to the model to make it replace 3821. I know the sprite had more ropes, I left them out in hope of saving some fps if someone were to line up a few of these. I think it would look better with more rope, and thicker stuff like what marked added.

Well, as you can see from looking at the sprites,3825 is very similar. The main difference is that one of the sticks in 3825 is taller than the others. This makes the whole tile 64x90 instead of 64x64.

[Mark]

Thats odd. The ladder model and def file both have AnimFrames00 for frame name.

Do you have a "ladders" subfolder in the misc folder. That is where the model and skin should be.

[Kyanos]

DeeperThought, on 05 September 2011 - 01:55 PM, said:

Well, as you can see from looking at the sprites,3825 is very similar. The main difference is that one of the sticks in 3825 is taller than the others. This makes the whole tile 64x90 instead of 64x64.

Ya I can change the model to fit the other sprite's shape. I just don't want to do the whole thing from scratch. This one will be two seperate md3s for each sprite. Possibly just the one skin though. Which brings me to....

Added: Do you want more ropes wrapped around?

[Danukem]

Marked, on 05 September 2011 - 02:00 PM, said:

Thats odd. The ladder model and def file both have AnimFrames00 for frame name.

Do you have a "ladders" subfolder in the misc folder. That is where the model and skin should be.

Yes, I have a ladders folder, it had Drek's ladder in it, and its frame name was "FRAME1" I guess the frame name got changed somewhere along the way and no one told me. Your models usually come with frame "none00" so I was expecting that to be it if FRAME1 no longer worked.

EDIT: That is a great ladder and skin, now. It actually looks better suited to the game than the sprite did.

[Mark]

Any model I create has none00 for a frame name. If I modded the skins on any of Drek's they have his original name of Frame1 or AnimFrames00

[Kyanos]

DeeperThought, on 05 September 2011 - 02:07 PM, said:

Yes, I have a ladders folder, it had Drek's ladder in it, and its frame name was "FRAME1" I guess the frame name got changed somewhere along the way and no one told me. Your models usually come with frame "none00" so I was expecting that to be it if FRAME1 no longer worked.

Marked made a new UV-map for the ladder then applied his skin to it. It was in that process the name changed. We now have two seperate md3s of the same ladder. I am willing to bet Markeds UV-map is better for that model, just delete mine and the skin for it. We can share the credit and the check
@Marked: I assume you used this shading technique you are trying to teach me. I will probably pick it up by looking closer at your models. I am going to do that now. I also need a crash course in photoshop. I just barely learned the basics for blender.

[Mark]

This is what your wooden fence skin looks like after my messing with it. In this one I just used the selection tool to grab and darken the right end. In my other models yo'll see I used a gradual blending from dark to light to dark for wrapping around circular objects.

[Kyanos]

Marked, on 05 September 2011 - 02:26 PM, said:

This is what your wooden fence skin looks like after my messing with it. In this one I just used the selection tool to grab and darken the right end. In my other models yo'll see I used a gradual blending from dark to light to dark for wrapping around circular objects.

I understand the concept now. That skin won't look to good because the faces aren't laid out in any particular order. I am going to redo the UV-map with this technique in mind. Actually I will probably use that skin too.
@DT- you may have missed my question with all thats going on. Do you want me to add more ropes to that fence?

[Kyanos]

I went and changed the UV-map on that stick fence. It looks much better. Thanks Marked for the tip.
Here is the new md3 and skin. Same def code, just replace the other files.

[Kyanos]

I finished converting those spikes from the fence to the other tile. This can use the same skin from the fence.

model "misc/fences/3905-spikes.md3 " {
scale 31.8 shade 0 
skin { pal 0 file "misc/fences/fence1.png" }
frame { name "FRAME1" tile 3905 flags 0 }
}

The sprite itself is a very odd size. It doesn't fit together well in mapster, I went to the smallest grid possible to line up the ends.
@Marked- I noticed in your map the sprites overlapped. This looks good with the sprite not with the model.

[Danukem]

I'm not sure what can be done about this, but the model is going into the ground and hanging off the side, as you can see in the screenshot. The sprites had zero width, so they were generally put right on the edge, which looks fine. But when the model has depth, it hangs over. The business about going into the ground may be fixable with zadd, though.

EDIT: So now that I've had some more time to look at it: yes, it needs a zadd adjustment. Also, the spikes look like they have been supersized compared with the ones in the fence model. Putting the two side-by-size, the spikes in the spikes-only-model are much fatter. If they could be made skinnier (to match the spikes in the fence model and so as not to hang off the edges so much) while maintaining their height, that would be a big improvement.

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[Kyanos]

Ya, I cut the original in half, scaled it up, and made a few tweaks. I will fix it. As for the zadd. I am surprised it was that close having to make it upside down.

[Kyanos]

here is a better one.
same def code

[Danukem]

Excellent. Here are defs with a few adjustments:

// SPIKES MODEL BY DREK
model "misc/fences/3905-spikes.md3 " {
scale 31.7 shade 0 zadd .4
skin { pal 0 file "misc/fences/fence1.png" }
frame { name "FRAME1" tile 3905 flags 0 }
}

The models still hang off the side a bit, but that can't be helped unless the maps are modified. I see nothing wrong with with moving the sprites inward slightly; it shouldn't hurt anything and it will look much better with the model.

[Kyanos]

I have been studying up on blender. Joined a modeling forum and have learned that I have a lot to learn
Here is my first truly applicable breakthrough.

It is a shadow map based on my UV layout for the stick fence I've been working on. It shows shadows cast by my light source(s). I will use this as a semi-transparent top layer in my finished skin. It will add the shadow effect with much more precision than I could by hand or with a simple gradient.... I hope, pretty sure.... trial & error...
Added: Here is the UV map for comparision.

[Danukem]

That's great news, Drek.

[William Gee]

Wow, you guys have done so much awesome work, is so great to see!
Thanks.

[Mark]

I just downloaded Drek's spiked latest fence model. Normally I wouldn't care about it's high poly count of about 1400. But I have 152 of them in the large open area of my map which is close to having FPS issues already in some places. I'll make a comparison between the sprite and model to see if it makes much difference or not. If my map takes an FPS hit I might try using the good looking but slightly less detailed version of that model from my original Ancient Rome map. Its only about 300 polys.

[Danukem]

You had your own version of that and didn't say anything while Drek made it? What other models are you hiding?

I like both versions. His has a rugged, rough look that suits the TC well, while yours is sleeker and more refined. 1400 does seem like a lot of polys for a bit of fence. I didn't notice a fps drop in the areas of WG's maps where it is used a lot, but we should consider slower computers and also what will happen when all the other models are added. I don't have a modeling program and I don't know how many polys something is unless I am told.