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DNF #1
Duke 3D #1
No, it was never "Duke Nukum 3D", ever.
The Supreme Topic of Miscellaneous Knowledge "Trivia, Research, etc."
- Weaponized Autism
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#922 Posted 30 August 2014 - 11:02 AM
MetHy, on 30 July 2014 - 11:18 AM, said:
Interesting read. Is it still true today that the Build Engine is the engine with the most commercial games released?
https://en.wikipedia...al_Engine_games
MetHy, on 30 July 2014 - 11:18 AM, said:
It would be interesting to learn more about Blood's modified version of the engine, too.
High Treason, on 30 July 2014 - 10:19 AM, said:
Though Blood was heavily modified with things like the QSystem (Replacing tags and such) how many of those alterations were technically engine-side and game-side is unknown to me and only a round estimate could be determined by looking at the source from the Alpha.
It's interesting. While I don't believe Monolith modified the Build object file itself, they did use their own versions of engine functions with extra functionality, particularly in the editor.
High Treason, on 30 August 2014 - 07:04 AM, said:
Given that (If I remember correctly, it was the only one they got working) it's meant to be the oldest prototype of Duke II.
At the same time, the files are named
NUKUM2.-NM
NUKUM2.-ST
NUKUM2.EXE
NUKUM2.MNI
for all the prototypes that I have. That was only changed near-final, I guess.
MrFlibble, on 30 August 2014 - 02:56 AM, said:
A correction would be in order, however I'd like to first get more info from you guys. Is there any evidence to "Duke Nukum 3D" ever being a "working title"? More importantly, is there any positive evidence against this claim?
From 1994-04-16:
#923 Posted 30 August 2014 - 12:26 PM
Hendricks266, on 30 August 2014 - 11:02 AM, said:
At the same time, the files are named
NUKUM2.-NM
NUKUM2.-ST
NUKUM2.EXE
NUKUM2.MNI
for all the prototypes that I have. That was only changed near-final, I guess.
From 1994-04-16:
NUKUM2.-NM
NUKUM2.-ST
NUKUM2.EXE
NUKUM2.MNI
for all the prototypes that I have. That was only changed near-final, I guess.
From 1994-04-16:
Great, thanks a lot!
Lunick, as for your issue with the credits dates, the guys at MG told me that this is already included in the list of site bugs to be fixed.
#924 Posted 15 September 2014 - 04:13 AM
Is it known why Iguana enemy from Carribean expansion pack was scraped?
Do you think he was intended only as sprite replacement for some old monster, or made for new enemy from scratch? I think he was supposed to be added as another original enemy next to pigcop in inflatable dragon and seagull. I presume he was being worked at earlier stages of development, as all shots with him dont include any new texture and decoration sprites, except for new look of enemies and he propably have been removed sooner, than his complete sprite sheet could be finished because all screenshots capture him at the exact same angle.
Any theories?
Spoiler
Do you think he was intended only as sprite replacement for some old monster, or made for new enemy from scratch? I think he was supposed to be added as another original enemy next to pigcop in inflatable dragon and seagull. I presume he was being worked at earlier stages of development, as all shots with him dont include any new texture and decoration sprites, except for new look of enemies and he propably have been removed sooner, than his complete sprite sheet could be finished because all screenshots capture him at the exact same angle.
Any theories?
- Fraka kaka kaka kaka-kow!
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#926 Posted 15 September 2014 - 11:39 AM
Given the chainguns, it would replace the Enforcer? The Enforcer was removed because its hard-coded actor is used for the female that follows you.
Like you said, it only has one pose, so probably there wasn't anything but what is seen in these screenshots.
Like you said, it only has one pose, so probably there wasn't anything but what is seen in these screenshots.
- Dr. Effector
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#928 Posted 18 September 2014 - 06:27 AM
Two D3D scrapped sector effectors
Decided to experiment with these a bit.
At least these two effects exist in the LD code that don't exist in the final version, there might even be more.
While these are useless now, it still interesting to see what different ideas they had in mind before overwriting these slots with other stuff.
SE 18 - Vacuum, Similar to the one seen in various videos.
When paired with a typical SE15 sliding door, the point where the SE is at will be the source of the vacuum.
This will drag all in various enemies and other objects such as explosion sprites.
SE 23 - Flooding sector
A rather buggy effect that changes a dry sector to divable water while flooding it to a set height.
-> Diving itself works the same as normal SE7 underwater transport.
-> As a side effect, Sector #0 gets lowered to the same height as the bottom of the dry pool.
-> Flooding process starts once the player gets in the sector.
-> Biggest bug is that the underwater sector also has it's floor texture changed in to a water texture but it's not divable.
Create an empty pool, this will be the flooding sector. This can be split in to as many child sectors as you wish.
Create the underwater section of the pool, same as above, you are free to split this one.
Link these in a typical SE7 water transport fashion.
Unlike a typical divable water, the top side must be dry and lowered to the same height as the bottom of the underwater sector for the least glitchy outcome.
Now every affected sector that is over or under water has to have the same hitag.
Create a single SE 23 sprite that will determine the height that the water will rise in to on the dry pool sector.
For reference: Dry sector - Dry sector in editor - Underwater sector
- - --
There are other effects that got unused in the final game but actually exist in some of the maps in lameduke so you get to see them in their "natural habitat"
I suggest reading the URL for more information.
SE26 - Escalator
A rather buggy effect that raises and moves a single child sector in a certain direction before resetting it's position instantly. Having multiple of these chained gives the illusion of moving escalator steps.
Seen in E1L5 on LD.
SE5 - "Boss creature" / helicopter
Another effect that is pretty buggy but gets used on E1L7 and E1L8 maps in lameduke.
While infosuite refers it to as the turret, it's obvious what it was meant to be.
SE19 - Airlock windows
Makes the sector go shut (from top) if it detects that a glass was broken inside it. One of the videos suggested that it was combined with the vacuum at one point, possibly the room would have that applied until it got fully shut.
This gets used in E1L1 of LD.
Found another one, as far as I know, this is unused even in LD levels.
SE16 - Rotate reactor sector
This combines two main effects:
1) Piston, once the level starts it will lower the roof of the sector to floor level.
The piston will start moving up and will remain at the roof level unless there is another (any) sprite in the same sector.
Movement speed is slightly faster when the piston goes down and slower when it goes up.
2) It applies rotation to the sector, which is the usual rotation. What makes this different is that this SE also acts as a pivot sprite.
In the end this combines roughly 3 different SEs in to one, along with the variable speed for directions which is not really seen elsewhere.
- This effect works with retail AND lameduke, the main difference is that the retail version accepts only the reactor sprite inside it before it starts working.
once the reactor is destroyed (or the placed sprite in LD), the effect halts. I guess the requirement was changed as in LD you can stop it quite easily with just generic projectiles.
Strict requirements might be why it isn't that well documented. Still quite a lot of potential applications!
I think that is all that LD offers when it comes to SEs, roughly around 26 there seems to be nothing above it.
Decided to experiment with these a bit.
At least these two effects exist in the LD code that don't exist in the final version, there might even be more.
While these are useless now, it still interesting to see what different ideas they had in mind before overwriting these slots with other stuff.
SE 18 - Vacuum, Similar to the one seen in various videos.
When paired with a typical SE15 sliding door, the point where the SE is at will be the source of the vacuum.
This will drag all in various enemies and other objects such as explosion sprites.
SE 23 - Flooding sector
A rather buggy effect that changes a dry sector to divable water while flooding it to a set height.
-> Diving itself works the same as normal SE7 underwater transport.
-> As a side effect, Sector #0 gets lowered to the same height as the bottom of the dry pool.
-> Flooding process starts once the player gets in the sector.
-> Biggest bug is that the underwater sector also has it's floor texture changed in to a water texture but it's not divable.
Create an empty pool, this will be the flooding sector. This can be split in to as many child sectors as you wish.
Create the underwater section of the pool, same as above, you are free to split this one.
Link these in a typical SE7 water transport fashion.
Unlike a typical divable water, the top side must be dry and lowered to the same height as the bottom of the underwater sector for the least glitchy outcome.
Now every affected sector that is over or under water has to have the same hitag.
Create a single SE 23 sprite that will determine the height that the water will rise in to on the dry pool sector.
For reference: Dry sector - Dry sector in editor - Underwater sector
- - --
There are other effects that got unused in the final game but actually exist in some of the maps in lameduke so you get to see them in their "natural habitat"
I suggest reading the URL for more information.
SE26 - Escalator
A rather buggy effect that raises and moves a single child sector in a certain direction before resetting it's position instantly. Having multiple of these chained gives the illusion of moving escalator steps.
Seen in E1L5 on LD.
SE5 - "Boss creature" / helicopter
Another effect that is pretty buggy but gets used on E1L7 and E1L8 maps in lameduke.
While infosuite refers it to as the turret, it's obvious what it was meant to be.
SE19 - Airlock windows
Makes the sector go shut (from top) if it detects that a glass was broken inside it. One of the videos suggested that it was combined with the vacuum at one point, possibly the room would have that applied until it got fully shut.
This gets used in E1L1 of LD.
Found another one, as far as I know, this is unused even in LD levels.
SE16 - Rotate reactor sector
This combines two main effects:
1) Piston, once the level starts it will lower the roof of the sector to floor level.
The piston will start moving up and will remain at the roof level unless there is another (any) sprite in the same sector.
Movement speed is slightly faster when the piston goes down and slower when it goes up.
2) It applies rotation to the sector, which is the usual rotation. What makes this different is that this SE also acts as a pivot sprite.
In the end this combines roughly 3 different SEs in to one, along with the variable speed for directions which is not really seen elsewhere.
- This effect works with retail AND lameduke, the main difference is that the retail version accepts only the reactor sprite inside it before it starts working.
once the reactor is destroyed (or the placed sprite in LD), the effect halts. I guess the requirement was changed as in LD you can stop it quite easily with just generic projectiles.
Strict requirements might be why it isn't that well documented. Still quite a lot of potential applications!
Spoiler
I think that is all that LD offers when it comes to SEs, roughly around 26 there seems to be nothing above it.
This post has been edited by oasiz: 18 September 2014 - 01:13 PM
#929 Posted 18 September 2014 - 09:08 AM
Those features would of been amazing to have in the full game, it's a shame they never made it in but they all sound fairly easy to recreate via con code at least now.
#930 Posted 18 September 2014 - 09:35 AM
Indeed would have been really cool, this sounds like the kind of effects that are more advanced (more advanced than any SE we got in DN3D) and that they scrapped in order to finish the game sooner. Then they knew the engine better once DN3D was done and Shadow Warrior did get more advanced effects....
That's my theory at least.
That's my theory at least.
- Dr. Effector
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#931 Posted 12 November 2014 - 08:36 AM
Not really aware of maps that utilize this
Basically a kick operated door.
This also exists in the retail (try kicking a door in E1L3 main hub for instance), possibly a remnant from an era where duke was to be able to kick doors open.
It's also possible to trigger SE with this as it can be linked to activator or MS sprites.
Just link the wall tag of the surface you kick with A or D and you are good to go. Although you might want to add a dummy L in to prevent regular use.
I also think that it requires the surface to have a texture that has a door attribute in it..
Possible scenario: Malfunctioning door that needs a bit of an extra kick to work, either to open or a scenario where a bunch of enemies are chasing you and a door refuses to close without some manual operation.
Or with SE, only the imagination is the limitation. All the possible things that only Duke's kick could activate
#932 Posted 12 November 2014 - 08:52 AM
That is really fucking cool . Pretty amazing you find a new DN3D effect in 2014!
The only problem I see with this (and it's a pretty big one), is that players aren't used to this, therefore they'll never think of it unless you tell them or hint at it somehow.
. Pretty amazing you find a new DN3D effect in 2014! The only problem I see with this (and it's a pretty big one), is that players aren't used to this, therefore they'll never think of it unless you tell them or hint at it somehow.
- Dr. Effector
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#933 Posted 12 November 2014 - 09:02 AM
I don't want to solely take credit for this as this is something that has been sorta discovered during speed running the game (you can skip various keys this way).
But I did investigate that curiosity since it made absolutely no sense and nobody really understood why certain doors worked this way.
But now it makes perfect sense and instead of showing it as a bug, make it a feature
Personally I would make such a thing very obvious and more about being a one time gag at some point with a stuck door or similar.
But I did investigate that curiosity since it made absolutely no sense and nobody really understood why certain doors worked this way.
But now it makes perfect sense and instead of showing it as a bug, make it a feature
Personally I would make such a thing very obvious and more about being a one time gag at some point with a stuck door or similar.
This post has been edited by oasiz: 12 November 2014 - 09:04 AM
#934 Posted 12 November 2014 - 09:08 AM
That's actually mentioned as a valid way to open doors in an early magazine preview. This might be a remnant from the development phase that article was written. Nice find!
- Dr. Effector
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#935 Posted 12 November 2014 - 09:17 AM
Ah, it was that article
I remember reading about this somewhere quite recently but couldn't remember where.
For those who are curious, just take a look in levels like E2L2, E3L6 and E1L3. All of those have some doors that have been wall-tagged to the activator.
Maybe this could be one indicator of the level's age ?
Also I remember that the doors in LD always react on projectiles, I believe this is more closer to the original vision where every door reacted this way without the need for wall tags.
Considering that older duke versions have a much slower mighty foot that stops duke when it's being used, maybe it was intended to be a multi purpose tool and they kind of re-purposed it during final months ?
I remember reading about this somewhere quite recently but couldn't remember where.
For those who are curious, just take a look in levels like E2L2, E3L6 and E1L3. All of those have some doors that have been wall-tagged to the activator.
Maybe this could be one indicator of the level's age ?
Also I remember that the doors in LD always react on projectiles, I believe this is more closer to the original vision where every door reacted this way without the need for wall tags.
Considering that older duke versions have a much slower mighty foot that stops duke when it's being used, maybe it was intended to be a multi purpose tool and they kind of re-purposed it during final months ?
#936 Posted 12 November 2014 - 09:26 AM
MetHy, on 12 November 2014 - 08:52 AM, said:
That is really fucking cool . Pretty amazing you find a new DN3D effect in 2014!
. Pretty amazing you find a new DN3D effect in 2014! Weird, I knew about it a thought that it's a well - known bug
I think speedrunners use this trick a lot when playing E1L3, at least in the videos I saw on youtube. Also, I think someone already suggested that it's an unused feature.
#937 Posted 12 November 2014 - 09:29 AM
There is a difference between 'knowing about something that happens with a few doors in the original game', and now having defined it and being able to use it as an effect in maps.
#938 Posted 12 November 2014 - 09:05 PM
MetHy, on 12 November 2014 - 08:52 AM, said:
The only problem I see with this (and it's a pretty big one), is that players aren't used to this, therefore they'll never think of it unless you tell them or hint at it somehow.
I always thought it was a known feature since I was succesfully kicking doors in E1L1. Weird...
- Honored Donor
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#939 Posted 12 November 2014 - 09:18 PM
MetHy, on 12 November 2014 - 08:52 AM, said:
That is really fucking cool . Pretty amazing you find a new DN3D effect in 2014!
The only problem I see with this (and it's a pretty big one), is that players aren't used to this, therefore they'll never think of it unless you tell them or hint at it somehow.
. Pretty amazing you find a new DN3D effect in 2014! The only problem I see with this (and it's a pretty big one), is that players aren't used to this, therefore they'll never think of it unless you tell them or hint at it somehow.
You guys are all noobs. This stuff is all in the infosuite: http://infosuite.duk...pecial_textures (look up doortile).
I'd been meaning to play around with it when I get a decent chunk of spare time. For example, according to the infosuite it works with sprites as well. Imagine if you could combine it with an SE 13 and kick a hole in a wall
- Dr. Effector
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#940 Posted 12 November 2014 - 09:32 PM
Well, damn
Good to know that it has some proper documentation outside of this at least !
Like I said, it's not completely a new thing, more like an oddity that nobody seems to utilize in their maps really.
Most sensible scenario I can think of is to have a kick operated montage after a hurtrail spawn, just a minute or two worth of game play where the player just has to kick his way trough.
Kick operated wallcrack, pushwalls, "locked" SE13 doors and such would look pretty nice with this I'd figure.
Placing a dummy L sprite is rather important to make things single use though
Anyway.. time to think of more stuff!
Good to know that it has some proper documentation outside of this at least !
Like I said, it's not completely a new thing, more like an oddity that nobody seems to utilize in their maps really.
Most sensible scenario I can think of is to have a kick operated montage after a hurtrail spawn, just a minute or two worth of game play where the player just has to kick his way trough.
Kick operated wallcrack, pushwalls, "locked" SE13 doors and such would look pretty nice with this I'd figure.
Placing a dummy L sprite is rather important to make things single use though
Anyway.. time to think of more stuff!
- Fraka kaka kaka kaka-kow!
-
#941 Posted 28 November 2014 - 07:44 AM
The font used in Duke Nukem: Total Meltdown title is Shimano Square Black.
- Fraka kaka kaka kaka-kow!
-
#942 Posted 28 January 2015 - 06:58 AM
She wears make-up LOL
This post has been edited by Fox: 28 January 2015 - 07:09 AM
- Ancient Blood God
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#943 Posted 28 January 2015 - 08:19 AM
First time I've ever seen the "original" Pig Cop in so much detail.
#944 Posted 28 January 2015 - 10:38 AM
While rummaging through some old boxes, I stumbled across some old Duke-related paraphernalia. First is a WizardWorks product catalog from late 1996 with some Duke products in it:
Scans of the pages with Duke stuff in them, the most interesting being an advertisement on the back of the catalog for the upcoming Duke Xtreme pack which features an early (or, more likely, just a slapped together placeholder) logo:
And the next bit is a particular oddity, a mini-strategy guide for Time to Kill, only 16 pages and about the size of a DVD case.
I don't exactly remember where I got this, but it seems to have come packed with an EGM magazine circa 98/99. The actual walkthrough is completely unique from the official GameWizards strategy guide. A few extra pictures:
Scans of the pages with Duke stuff in them, the most interesting being an advertisement on the back of the catalog for the upcoming Duke Xtreme pack which features an early (or, more likely, just a slapped together placeholder) logo:
And the next bit is a particular oddity, a mini-strategy guide for Time to Kill, only 16 pages and about the size of a DVD case.
I don't exactly remember where I got this, but it seems to have come packed with an EGM magazine circa 98/99. The actual walkthrough is completely unique from the official GameWizards strategy guide. A few extra pictures:
This post has been edited by Marphy Black: 28 January 2015 - 10:43 AM
- Ancient Blood God
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#946 Posted 29 January 2015 - 12:47 AM
Still not sure about the M, it might be a variation of the font, tbh.
- Fraka kaka kaka kaka-kow!
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#947 Posted 29 January 2015 - 03:26 PM
There are some key differences with the Helvetica font.
Edit: Don't forget the logo from the Plutonium Pack CD:
Silhouettes:
Edit: I think the Plutonium logo is Berthold Block Condensed.
Edit: Don't forget the logo from the Plutonium Pack CD:
Silhouettes:
Edit: I think the Plutonium logo is Berthold Block Condensed.
This post has been edited by Fox: 29 January 2015 - 04:29 PM
#948 Posted 14 February 2015 - 07:02 PM
Nothing special but, I was looking through the ordering book that came with Duke The Apocalypse:
And apparently there was supposed to be 4 new enemies (only two in the final game) and 2 new weapons (4 in the final game):
And just for fun but irrelevant, Skunny has a terrifying boxart:
And apparently there was supposed to be 4 new enemies (only two in the final game) and 2 new weapons (4 in the final game):
And just for fun but irrelevant, Skunny has a terrifying boxart:
#949 Posted 14 February 2015 - 07:18 PM
Skunny was shrunk in a washing machine by an evil computer programer 
#950 Posted 14 February 2015 - 07:32 PM
High Treason, on 14 February 2015 - 07:18 PM, said:
Skunny was shrunk in a washing machine by an evil computer programer
I found a copy on eBay and this one too looks like it has had a rough time http://www.ebay.com....tm/121558219021
