[Plagman]

I think I played PC builds of Duke3D that said ARMOUR...

[Jimmy]

MrFlibble, on 08 May 2014 - 10:14 AM, said:

This is from the Doom corner thread discussion but I suppose it belongs here.


The PC version sprites were definitely created with the 4:3 aspect ratio in mind - that is, they are all shrunk down vertically a bit (I don't know the proper term for this) so that they are stretched back to their intended dimensions when a 320x200 image is displayed on a 4:3 screen.

However I'm not sure what happens to the PS version of the game, since the sprites that you have provided except the RPV have the same proportions as the PC version ones. Moreover, the game appears to be more or less identical to the PC version in this video, however in this one the monster sprites seem to get stretched vertically even further compared to their PC counterparts. I can't tell but the second video may be authentic footage of the game being played on the console, while the first one might be recorded from an emulator. I'm not sure in either case though.

And don't forget that the Duke3D sprites were touched up by hand while the TM sprites seemed to have just been dumped and then had their colour depth decreased to whatever the limitations were. This would be why they're closer to true-colour than Duke3D's.

[OpenMaw]

It also explains why Duke's pants are so screwed up.

[Fox]

Each set of sprites has it's own 4-bits palette. The result doesn't look so good for Duke sprites.

[MrFlibble]

Well, if the PS version sprites are indeed "overstretched" vertically when run on a real console, then this probably means that the game code does some 4:3 aspect correction (perhaps similar to what the PC version does for 4:3 high-res modes), but the result is further stretched when displayed on an actual TV screen.

I suppose that the PS version screenshots at MobyGames have been taken in an emulator and thus represent the "raw" image, prior to it having been stretched to fit the TV screen dimensions. The monster sprites appear to be already aspect-corrected, like these Octabrains here:


Here's a shot of a Pig Cop from the PS version:

And here's a shot from the PC version in 640x480 mode for comparison:


And just to be sure, another shot in the 640x400 mode, which shows non-corrected sprites:


I think it's safe to assume that the monster sprites in the PS version are already stretched to proper dimensions (note though that the HUD and weapons are not). The aspect ratio of the PS screenshots, however, is not 4:3, and the image is probably further stretched to fit the 4:3 TV screen, thus creating the effect of "overstretched" sprites.

[High Treason]

What about 720x576 (5:4) in PAL versions? Many console games were developed primarily for PAL resolutions and then just cropped, scaled or altered in some other way when running in NTSC modes.

As that aspect is taller than 4:3 it would theoretically not stretch the sprites as much.

[MrFlibble]

Actually I have no idea about the consoles in general, so I'd welcome a (brief) explanation of the resolutions.

[Fox]

Doom



Screen size: 320 × 200

Everything is rendered with a 1:1 pixel ratio, as a result it is made taller using an old monitor with non-square pixels. Wall textures are not the same as in floors, and the automap is distorted.

Some of the artwork was created with non-square pixels in mind (note the fat face of the player).


Duke Nukem 3D



Screen size: 320 × 200

The level structure (such as walls or "flat" sprites) was shortened to compensate for non-square pixels. However, game sprites or HUD sprites have a 1:1 ratio.

The artwork for enemies was created with non-square pixels in mind. This is also true for the loading screen (note the oval nuke symbol), but the title screen looks stretched compared to the box art.


Duke Nukem: Total Meltdown



Screen size: 320 × 214

The level structure has a 1:1 ratio and game sprites are narrowed, mimicking the DOS game with an old monitor. However, the HUD has a 1:1 ratio, so it looks shortened in relation to the level structure or game sprites.

Like the PC version, artwork for enemies was shortened. However, screens or videos ignore any possible distortion (note the circular nuke symbol in the loading screen)


Duke Nukem 64



Screen size: 276 × 208

Everything is rendered with a 1:1 pixel ratio, so game sprites are too wide and HUD sprites too short.

The new artwork ignore any possible distortion (note the circular nuke symbol in the main menu)


Duke Nukem 3D (Sega Saturn)



Screen size: 320 × 240, 320 × 256

Everything is rendered with a 1:1 pixel ratio, so game sprites are too wide and HUD sprites too short. Some backgrounds were made taller (such as the loading screen).

[MrFlibble]

Thanks for the explanation!

Fox, on 10 May 2014 - 10:53 AM, said:

Duke Nukem 3D

<...>

the title screen looks stretched compared to the box art.

I never noticed that before, interesting. It is my understanding that in Doom, conversely, it is the aspect-corrected version of the title screen that matches the box art.

Fox, on 10 May 2014 - 10:53 AM, said:

Doom

<...>

the automap is distorted.

I've read about the automap distortion here but I did not realise that it is also true for the vanilla game.

[Fox]

define GRAVITATIONALCONSTANT 176

This value is used for the gravitational acceleration, and the terminal velocity is set at 6144.

In the real world, the gravitational acceleration is 9.8 m/s² and the terminal velocity for a person in freeflying position is of 320 km/h.

If we assume that a 32px texture (8192 z units) equals 1 meters, the real world figures would be translated as of:

9.8 m/s² = 2676.053
320 km/h = 24272.592

So Duke 3D is quite not right.

[High Treason]

Probably not the most interesting find and it'll likely be irrelevant soon, but whilst referencing the in-game MIDI files for volume levels I discovered that some have a copyright date of 1995 - most are 1996. The ones labelled 1995 are;

Spoiler

Ahgeez
Dethtoll
Gotham
Grabbag
Snake
Stalker
Streets
Thecall
Watrwld
Whomp
Xplasma - Which we already knew was old because of the video TX posted.

Most of the oldest MIDI's appear to be Bobby Prince's and are for Episode 1, this kinda implies that many weren't done until after the shareware was already out. Unfortunately I can't presently check if the file dates reflect the markers. This was from the Atomic GRP also, 1.3D may be different though I doubt it.

The MIDI information is written in markers, which is unusual, possibly the MIDI format used didn't support the metadata I usually find, but Inhiding has no markers of info! Invader also has none as well as Lordofla and Spook too.

Streets contains some weird markers like "Move the Open HiHat in from far right" or "Randomize Chinese Cymbal placement" and similar, presumably Bobby altered these things and left the markers behind.

[Player Lin]

Off topic but have to say...

MrFlibble, on 10 May 2014 - 12:22 PM, said:

wiki link from doom.wikia.com

Please don't use any link from that long dead wikia site since the most of DooM communities had been abandoned that site years ago and move to their own made one -- doomwiki.org. Due wikia.com still try make their sites appeared on first/second of result in google search, so it still to hard to avoid if users just use the search engine and found the wikia one.

Use this one instead, please.

[MrFlibble]

High Treason, on 12 May 2014 - 07:19 PM, said:

The MIDI information is written in markers, which is unusual, possibly the MIDI format used didn't support the metadata I usually find, but Inhiding has no markers of info! Invader also has none as well as Lordofla and Spook too.

Not sure, but IIRC the MIDIs of Booby Prince's music in ROTT don't have any copyright information for some reason, while Lee Jackson's do.

[Fox]

While the missing frames of the Overlord dying is very obvious in Total Meltdown, most people don't realize that the Enforcer and Battlelord probably are also missing some frames, since their pose is slightly different from the PC. The Cyberkeef lying on the ground is also different from the movie at the end of the episode.

[NNC]

Streets.mid have been altered between the shareware and v1.3D. Originally the part with the additional music (the "best part") was at the end of the mid, but in the final version, it have been put into the middle.

[mxrtxn]

Porn Actress inside Shadow Warrior?


Have you seen this girl before?:

Spoiler

Coincidence?



She also appears as poster sprite inside the game. (addons or fan made maps. The lower part only appears in level 18 Floating Fortress)

So the mysterious girl is Miho Nomoto, a porn actress it seems... well about the porn not 100% sure (update: hot but not xxx, sorry guys)

Here´s a playlist I found about her:

http://www.youtube.c...2A485CEF1425130

some extra info:

http://www.rottentom...ty/miho_nomoto/


Wanna see more pictures of Miho? (can´t post them here as they incluye nudity) go to:

http://swforum05.pro...-shadow-warrior

Miho, if you happen to be reading this for some miracle... What it feels like to be inside of one of the coolest FTP games ever?


Martin

[MrFlibble]

 mxrtxn, on 18 May 2014 - 07:49 PM, said:

Miho, if you happen to be reading this for some miracle... What it feels like to be inside of one of the coolest FTP games ever?

Hopefully that feeling is not an urge to file an unlawful use of likeness lawsuit.

[mxrtxn]

 MrFlibble, on 19 May 2014 - 10:13 AM, said:

Hopefully that feeling is not an urge to file an unlawful use of likeness lawsuit.

Wait... is that a possibility despite of being a game from 1997?

If I were her I would consider it a compliment, and free advertising... really.



P.S. By the way Hendricks, if you read this. Feel free to add the image to your Shadow Warrior HRP, this image has good resolution to be in the HRP!


Martin

[MrFlibble]

 mxrtxn, on 19 May 2014 - 11:46 AM, said:

Wait... is that a possibility despite of being a game from 1997?

In fact, it probably isn't possible:

Quote

Statute of Limitations

The "statute of limitations" is a term used by courts to describe the maximum amount of time plaintiffs can wait before bringing a lawsuit after the events they are suing over took place. This time limit is set by state law and is intended to promote fairness and keep old cases from clogging the courts. In misappropriation and right of publicity cases, the statute of limitations ordinarily runs from the date of first publication or exhibition of the offending use of the plaintiff's name or likeness. The limitations period varies based on state law; for misappropriation and right of publicity claims, it can be anywhere from one to six years. For specific information on limitations periods applicable to particular state law claims, see the State Law: Right of Publicity pages. [source; emphasis added]

Anyway, my previous post was more of a joke actually

 mxrtxn, on 19 May 2014 - 11:46 AM, said:

If I were her I would consider it a compliment, and free advertising... really.

Well, the name of the model is not mentioned anywhere in the game, is it?

[mxrtxn]

 MrFlibble, on 20 May 2014 - 08:35 AM, said:

In fact, it probably isn't possible:

Anyway, my previous post was more of a joke actually


Well, the name of the model is not mentioned anywhere in the game, is it?

No, but consider this: She is around 40 now... she won´t be a hotie forever so when she is 60s she will have a cool story to tell her grandsons.

If I were her, even if my name were not there I would feel flatered...

[Daedolon]

Kimi Tachihara



Here's the other one. Found it from the same archives as Miho Nomoto's photo was in. It's just flipped and rather heavily edited. No clue where the background is from.

[mxrtxn]

Daedolon, on 20 May 2014 - 07:34 PM, said:

Kimi Tachihara



Here's the other one. Found it from the same archives as Miho Nomoto's photo was in. It's just flipped and rather heavily edited. No clue where the background is from.

AMAZING!!! I couldn´t find it and I thought I had good visual memory... Great finding!

THANK YOU VERY MUCH!

Now only the girls of the beta sw are missing:

Spoiler

LOL... problably these two are imposible to find. As the beta was older, he pictures must be even older than the ones of the archive.

Now the mystery is solved! (The image was highly edited probably to avoid any legal echoes)

In the case of Miho you can see only her face in the DM level House of Wang. In the TV inside the submarine (next to the kitchen, level "Floating Fortress") you can only see her white panties. I have only found a complete image as a poster sprite in the 6th level of the Shadow Warrior addon When I Was Young. In the police station.

Same reasons probably a way of the 3DRealms team to avoid getting into unnecessary troubles...

Thanks again




P.S. By the way: Do you mind share the archive site were you found it? I found Miho´s picture using a reverse image search in google...

Martin

[Daedolon]

Out of interest I just googled Miho's image and found out it belonged to an archive of images like that called "BlueBird CD2". Someone had dumped it to a site called iPhotoScrap.com. Kimi's picture is from "BlueBird CD1".

I doubt you'll have much of luck with the site for the beta girls since all of the adult content has been paywalled (that site seems pretty weird to begin with), unless you get lucky and spot them in other pictures. I'm guessing the beta images are from some BlueBird archives as well, there were a few other ones but I forgot their names, seems like this one user uploaded most of them (adult content warning).

For Kimi, it seems like she only did VA for some hentai and was in some sort of a 3D0 game called "Virtual Cameraman part 2". Where did 3D Realms come up with these girls anyway?

[MetHy]

From Broussard's personal phantasies folder

[t800]

High Treason, on 01 August 2013 - 06:09 AM, said:

As I said a long time ago;


I found my VHS. Volume is a little low, if that really is a problem I can go back and press normalize.

About 14-15 seconds in.

Sorry for responding to older post but I just noticed that this exactly same sound is also used as roar of pain by boss Kraid in Metroid: Zero Mission for GameBoy Advance.
http://youtu.be/k7UVEhie8Rs?t=29s
I wonder where else could it be found.

[Daedolon]

I've heard it a dozen times in games and movies, should've probably written them all down.

[Loke]

t800, on 29 May 2014 - 09:20 AM, said:

Sorry for responding to older post but I just noticed that this exactly same sound is also used as roar of pain by boss Kraid in Metroid: Zero Mission for GameBoy Advance.
http://youtu.be/k7UVEhie8Rs?t=29s
I wonder where else could it be found.

You can also hear it softly in Jaws after the shark has been blown up:

According to IMDB it's from the Creature from the Black Lagoon film.

[Fox]

I just realized these two take place on the same area, and it's not hard to see. Judging by the way they cut the second picture at the left, probably there was a second Duke standing in front of the monitors.



The bonus screen uses the same background texture of the title. Comparing the two, the black bar on the left is not part of the scenario, it's the end of the texture.

[oasiz]

I actually found this about a month ago but I haven't seen this mentioned elsewhere so I might just as well paste it here.

Lameduke has intermission screens between levels, you actually need to disable the developer mode in game to get these.

While many have seen these at some point, the EP1 and EP2 screens actually blend together seamlessly!



This makes me wonder if they intended for the screen to scroll between episodes or during the episode itself.
While the level order is very WIP obviously, this screen could tie in the sudden shift from space levels to the city levels during EP1.

(For reference, I made a annotated playtrough recently of the whole game in HERE, Similar to the 0.99 comparison I did).
Looking at the ingame level screenshots, U.S. bank tower is visible in the intermission screen along with being present in E1L6-8.

It's getting clear however that after space they had planned a trip to L.A. , My theory is that E1 was to be fully in space and E2 would be as-is until L4's end (Random streets of L.A.) as it seems to end in a location that would take you to E1L5's subway. This would make the most sense as the first half of E2 is in L.A as is the second half of E1.
After this a more coherent story exists:
EP1 Starts where DN2 left off, in a space station.
EP2 Duke teleports in to L.A. from space. (End of EP1 is rather vague)
EP3 Duke is captured(?), Takes a ship ride to some rocky underwater base.
EP4 Unrelated ,just two tech demos/testmaps & one DM map.

Although, a lot of this will probably be a lot more clear once the missing beta builds get released eventually

[Daedolon]

In Duke3D, tile #4181 can be broken (into #4203) by throwing a Pipebomb at it, but tile #4199 will not break in similar fashion.