[NeuralStunner]

Your page is by far my favorite spot on Duke4. Definitely looking forward to the Heretic, Hexen, and unofficial Plutonia packs! (No pressure of course. No, seriously.)

Question: Do you have an SC-55 recording of Lee's full version of Grabbag? That would be pretty sweet.

Comment: By downloading the OGG versions and changing the extension to ".logg", they can be played as seamless loops by hcs64/kode64's vgmstream plugin (Winamp, foobar200). I can listen to the definitive version of Stalker for literal hours.

[MusicallyInspired]

Thanks! I can make one, but I think someone else already did. I could do it with seamless looping, though. I'll add it to my list.

[SpooferJahk]

Been a lurker of your content for a while MusicallyInspired and I have to say your efforts are amazing. They actually inspired me to eventually get one of those units but even then, your packs are great and I use them for the lappy when I can not lug the unit around. Thanks again for the preservation/sharing efforts of your music packs.

[MusicallyInspired]

Thanks for the kind words! I'm glad you're enjoying them.

[Sledgehammer]

MusicallyInspired made me appreciate MIDIs even more, also wanted to get one of these and SC-88Pro too for my old computer, right after upgrading my current old GPU on my main computer. By the way, one year ago they released SOUND Canvas VA for Windows and Mac, no idea if it's as good as actual hardware. That was a big surprise anyway considering Roland preferred to stay away from PCs.

Spoiler

Hopefully you'll make System Shock pack before I buy both

[MusicallyInspired]

If I do it won't work with the game.

[Sledgehammer]

Yeah, I know, just wanted it for personal use. Though the day might come when it would be useful if NDS release source code or if the music will be shitty in the upcoming reboot. I do listen to your sound packs quite often, especially Duke OST.

[Hendricks266]

https://twitter.com/...805379117494272

[Master O]

Hendricks266, on 26 December 2016 - 05:29 PM, said:

https://twitter.com/...805379117494272

Oh, so that's where Shodan is from. Never played System Shock, but all I ever hear is how great it is.

Is it really that great a game? Glad to see another company coming to its senses and making a classic open source. That means soon there will be no more need to play it in DOS.

[Hendricks266]

[Tiddalick]

Great work with the Music packs.

I have a question on what settings were used when you recorded them though.

I was mucking around with a SC-55 the other day and I thought I would try and replicate the quality of the Blood flac files from your site by running the Midi files through it.
I could get the music sounding like I remember in DOS, but I couldn't get it sounding as punchy/crisp as you have in your flac files.
Did you change the Reverb/Chorus etc settings when you were recording these files?
I am curious to learn a little more about your technique and tweaks that you use. No matter what I seemed to change, I couldn't get it sounding identical. As far as I could tell, it was the same hardware that you used for generating the music.

[MusicallyInspired]

Here's the SC-55 recording of the newly released beta track It's Green by Lee Jackson made for the recent 3D Realms Beta Trailer! Available in FLAC, OGG, and MP3 with metadata loop tags (except for the MP3 of course)!

Quote

It's Green
Copyright © Lee Jackson
All Rights Reserved.

[MusicallyInspired]

Please forgive me! I somehow missed this post at the beginning of the month!

Tiddalick, on 02 October 2017 - 05:48 AM, said:

Great work with the Music packs.

I have a question on what settings were used when you recorded them though.

I was mucking around with a SC-55 the other day and I thought I would try and replicate the quality of the Blood flac files from your site by running the Midi files through it.
I could get the music sounding like I remember in DOS, but I couldn't get it sounding as punchy/crisp as you have in your flac files.
Did you change the Reverb/Chorus etc settings when you were recording these files?
I am curious to learn a little more about your technique and tweaks that you use. No matter what I seemed to change, I couldn't get it sounding identical. As far as I could tell, it was the same hardware that you used for generating the music.

Interesting. When I record now I do some post-processing effects like multi-band compression as the levels are quite low in-game and I can't increase the amplitude without clipping. So I compress it and then raise the gain to make it louder so that the transients don't clip. Gives the effects of a more punchy sound. However, I didn't do that to my Blood recordings. Those Blood recordings are very old. Of the first batch I ever recorded and I've since improved but haven't gotten around to rerecording them yet. I'm not sure what the difference could be. I made no changes to reverb or chorus settings. As far as I know I recorded them unedited. Except for the possible exemption of duplicate MIDI channels dedicated to other devices that shouldn't be played by the SC-55 (GUS and FM). I don't remember if the Blood MIDIs have them or not but they need to be muted. Can you share one of your tracks?

[Hendricks266]

I remember you telling me that you manually added panning to the Blood MIDIs as they are entirely center-panned.

[MusicallyInspired]

Ahhhhhhhhh That was the Blood MIDIs? That must be it. That would be why it sounds different.

[High Treason]

Hendricks266, on 24 October 2017 - 05:34 PM, said:

I remember you telling me that you manually added panning to the Blood MIDIs as they are entirely center-panned.

Apparently not.
Ugh, can never get over how noobish the retail Blood MIDIs are compared to those in the Alpha, it just has to be a different composer, there's no way it's the same guy.

[MusicallyInspired]

Yeah, checked them myself too. They do have panning information. I remember changing something that was center panned though....

[Rimantas]

Hello. Thank you for amazing music packs! I use them for games. But i have hard times to get correct music in Heretic, Hexen and Strife. Patch93's SC-55 v2.2 soundfont is similar to real SC-55, but is poorly balanced: drums are really too loud and some more instruments sounds wrong. Now my last hope for Heretic, Hexen, Strife is Merlin Vienna soundfont (downloaded in Tim Brechbill's Timidity page). I use it on Coolsoft's VirtualMIDIsynth. It's best quality and balanced soundfont i can find, but it still makes few mistakes on some Doom 1, 2 tracks, so i guess it will do mistakes on other games too. Would be great if you make music packs for Heretic, Hexen and Strife.

[MusicallyInspired]

It's on the list (I have a short "future plans" list on the website). I apologize, I started Heretic ages ago and just haven't finished it yet. It's more involved because it wasn't recorded and mixed for the SC-55 so the levels ARE indeed out of whack and there is a problem with instrument polyphony and a lot of notes get cut off so I have to make multiple recordings for one track.

I'll get to it...eventually. It's the very next one on the list and it's started. Just need to finish.

[NightFright]

I have come to accept the fact that soundfonts trying to imitate classic synths is an endeavor doomed to fail. Personally I have settled with emulation, in this case the Yamaha S-YXG50 VSTi plugin, loaded through the VST MIDI Driver and enabled under Win 10 by the Coolsoft MIDI Mapper. It's not the SC-55, but the Yamaha modules used to be the very next best thing after Roland back in the days, and some argue they were even superior (which they were, especially with native, but however rare XG support).

[Phredreeke]

1. Unless I misunderstand, Musicallyinspired is using an actual SC-55 to do this, not soundfonts.
2. By what you describe, aren't you just pushing the issue to an OS level?
3. Got some samples of it?

[MusicallyInspired]

Unless I misunderstand, I don't think he was requesting soundfont recordings but just saying that's his only fallback without an SC-55 music pack.

@NightFright I heard on the VOGONS forums that there's a new 100% authentic Sound Canvas VSTi out now from Roland. Not a SoundFont and only works really with DAWs, but they've apparently finally got their act together and put one out. It's like $150 or something, but it's nice to see something like that exists now officially and that it's far better than the old Virtual Sound Canvas.

I agree that Yamaha XG is better, but again I'm going for authenticity and the classic experience, which is hardly ever the best quality. A music pack with the Yamaha would be interesting. But not being composed to "mastered" for it there but be problems with instrument volume or ADSR (Attack/Decay/Sustain/Release) discrepancies.

[NightFright]

I am aware of the existence of that SC-55 plugin. Actually I own a real SC-55 unit (not a Mk-II, though) and a DB50XG daughterboard which I can connect to a modern system via a Doxbox, but tbh it's not worth doing it just to play Duke3D and Doom occasionally. I am just not playing enough old games with MIDI music these days to justify the effort.

If anyone wants to know what the Yamaha S-YXG50 software synth sounds like, here are a few examples (not the best quality, though):
Aliens, Say Your Prayers
Stalker
XPlasma

I am not saying that this is better than the SC-55, that's up to individual taste or preference. It's just to point out there is a decent (and free) alternative even if you don't want to rely on soundfonts or pre-recorded files. It's still great that this project exists to provide a fair chance for everyone to listen to Duke3D music the way it was meant to be heard. It only covers the original game and not any custom (non-commercial) addons that came with their own music, though. You need to be aware of that.

[MusicallyInspired]

I love it!

[NightFright]

Well, the DB50XG was quite possibly one of the best wavetable boards ever produced back in its days, and the software synth is basically a 1:1 dump of the original 4MB ROM. It should sound extremely similar if not identical to the actual board. Maybe I'll plug in that Doxbox one of these days after all and record a few more tracks, but in the end it should be the same as if you just get that (free!) VSTi plugin working with a bit of extra software.

This board really showed its true power when used with MIDI files in Yamaha's proprietary XG format (which offered considerable quality enhancements). Listen to these amazing samples (pure XG MIDI playback with software synth, no additional effects or tampering):
asfarxg.mid
borg.mid
feel_nrg.mid

Unfortunately there were almost no games that ever used the XG format, in spite of its potential. Sadly, XG sounded like garbage on boards that did not support it, and besides Yamaha there weren't any that did IIRC. Probably the main reason why it died again, but it's a great pleasure listening to these tracks even today still. Ah, I am probably raving too much about it, also considering this is supposed to be a thread about the SC-55, but it's just because I am a huge fan of the Yamaha synths. Hope you guys can understand. ^^

[MusicallyInspired]

I do remember that the PC version of Final Fantasy VII came with the Yamaha DB50XG synth as part of the game installation. I also remember finding custom MIDI files online as well that people recorded of covers and original music that were meant to be played on an XG synth. Specifically covers of Jean Michel Jarre songs. Had some nice drum and synth string sounds from what I remember. Those recordings are nice as well of course.

Also, Quest Studios used to host some MIDI soundtracks of various Sierra games and some of them were in XG format. The archives are still available here: http://www.midimusic...te-soundtracks/. The Leisure Suit Larry 3 and Silpheed soundtracks are the ones with Yamaha XG downloads. Something to check out. The games never supported them, to clarify. It was just something special and custom by a fan (I don't know if it was by Tom, the original site creator, or not).

[NightFright]

Some guys converted D_E1M1 from Doom and Grabbag to XG format and it also sounds amazing. Listen to this:
At Doom's Gate (XG)
Grabbag (XG)

[MusicallyInspired]

As far as MIDI guitars go, At Doom's Gate there is one of the best I've heard. Grabbag sounds worse by comparison for some reason.

[NightFright]

The E1M1 recording is a bit distorted at the beginning due to my limited capabilities here with this PC, doesn't fully do it justice. It's impressive indeed nevertheless and makes one wonder what the full Doom soundtrack would have sounded like if a complete XG conversion had been made. I agree that the Grabbag variation doesn't really successfully tap into the sound potential of the format (it also wasn't made by the same guy that did the Doom track, I think). Anyway, no idea how Yamaha managed to squeeze that much quality out of just 4MB ROM.

[XxMiltenXx]

NightFright, on 24 June 2018 - 11:41 PM, said:

I have come to accept the fact that soundfonts trying to imitate classic synths is an endeavor doomed to fail. Personally I have settled with emulation, in this case the Yamaha S-YXG50 VSTi plugin, loaded through the VST MIDI Driver and enabled under Win 10 by the Coolsoft MIDI Mapper. It's not the SC-55, but the Yamaha modules used to be the very next best thing after Roland back in the days, and some argue they were even superior (which they were, especially with native, but however rare XG support).

MusicallyInspired, on 25 June 2018 - 05:16 AM, said:

@NightFright I heard on the VOGONS forums that there's a new 100% authentic Sound Canvas VSTi out now from Roland. Not a SoundFont and only works really with DAWs, but they've apparently finally got their act together and put one out. It's like $150 or something, but it's nice to see something like that exists now officially and that it's far better than the old Virtual Sound Canvas.

@NightFright I agree that really good soundfonts are hard to come by, you will always have some issues, e.g. wrong volume of instruments or the balance between them or other problems.
I cannot really speak for or against the Yamaha devices, as I personally didn't like most recordings I heard of those devices. But it might just be that they weren't fully optimized for it. (And Vocaroo just also butchers the sound quality in that regard).

@MusicallyInspired About that VSTi plugin: If you do not want to buy the proper hardware then it's surely the closest match you can get and also easiest to set up, however, comparing them to the real devices you will notice differences, e.g. that it doesn't fully use the SC-55 sound map, even if selected it may use drum sets from the other models and also everything just sounds "harder", as if the attack portion is set wrongly and also some minor differences are notable with certain instruments as well.

I compared it to 2 things, the Roland SC-55 and the Roland SC-D70 (which uses the 8820 map by default) and the real hardware still sounds better compared to the VSTi plugin - considering the VSTi is essentially also emulated, it's fair enough I guess.. And you can get a proper SC-55 roughly for the same price, however setting it up might prove to be more difficult.