[MusicallyInspired]

Just to be clear, I'm not talking about implementing an animation-blending system for existing animated tiles, but actually creating new assets with 3 times (or more) the amount of frames as the original animation has and playing 3 frames (or whatever number) at a speed that would match with the regular speed that EDuke32 would normally play 1 frame.

Like what was done with the Monkey Island 2 Special Edition remake. They created two or three times the amount of animation frames for every object and character in the game and the engine rendered it on top of the original game seamlessly and in perfect time/sequence in real time (as the remake was built right on top of the original game and you can switch modes seamlessly during play). Of course BUILD is quite a bit more complex than SCUMM especially with the new resource-hogging polymer renderer, but I'm not worried about performance issues as my system has none with polymer yet. I have some programming experience, and while I'm no where near able to implement such a design myself at my stage because I don't understand where everything comes from, I understand the process involved and can't see it being as difficult as you're describing. I don't mean to say it would be a cakewalk either. You'd probably have to mess with rendering code and whathaveyou which could be agonizing to implement into the actual engine, I don't know. But it's all just a matter of messing with variables and performing a bit of extra math to perform the actual effect of adding an extra number of frames per frame animation, isn't it? Isn't something like this worth it, though? We're already enhancing the engine so much. The animation of tiles is one of the bigger things holding it back to an outdated look, really. It's worth at least thinking about.

Of course, I'm not complaining. We've already got way more than we could ever imagine out of this engine already and I'd be perfectly happy if work suddenly had to stop on EDuke32. It's come an amazingly long way. I'm just thinking about future possibilities. Hey, at one time we thought the very notion of programming an entirely new rendering engine with dynamic lighting was a pipedream.

[Fox]

You can code animated walls or sprites yourself via CON.

The gamevar totalclock is used to control the animations from the .art files, and it may interest you that for some reason it actually has 4 times more frames than the actual game. But I think the only instance which the game actually uses that amount of frames is to create the glowing effect in the Shrinker ammo sprite.

[Micky C]

MusicallyInspired, on 18 April 2012 - 09:31 PM, said:

Of course, I'm not complaining. We've already got way more than we could ever imagine out of this engine already and I'd be perfectly happy if work suddenly had to stop on EDuke32. It's come an amazingly long way. I'm just thinking about future possibilities. Hey, at one time we thought the very notion of programming an entirely new rendering engine with dynamic lighting was a pipedream.

Well, me and probably a few other mappers would have quit by now if it weren't for both polymer and TROR, so eduke32 has certainly come very far and thanks to TX, Plagman and Helix, and has gotten a very nice set of features, but there's still a long way to go before it gets to a point where people can agree that it doesn't need any more work.

[Diaz]

In fact it has become a nice platform for indie development, and it has the potential to look really good. Of course it isn't UDK, but it is thousands of times easier to work with, and that's a big plus. We can't thank the development team enough!

[MusicallyInspired]

Micky C, on 18 April 2012 - 10:04 PM, said:

Well, me and probably a few other mappers would have quit by now if it weren't for both polymer and TROR, so eduke32 has certainly come very far and thanks to TX, Plagman and Helix, and has gotten a very nice set of features, but there's still a long way to go before it gets to a point where people can agree that it doesn't need any more work.

Oh, of course! That was actually my point. But being an entirely unpaid effort I wouldn't throw a fit if TX, Plagman, and Helix had to give up working on EDuke32 altogether due to real world obligations and leave the community forever. Though, I can't see that happening. My point was just that EDuke32 has come a long way, more than we ever dreamed so far, but there's still some improvements to be made. As long as they are going to continue to improve it why not do everything we can?

Diaz, on 19 April 2012 - 02:03 AM, said:

In fact it has become a nice platform for indie development, and it has the potential to look really good. Of course it isn't UDK, but it is thousands of times easier to work with, and that's a big plus. We can't thank the development team enough!

Well, yeah. But since it's under a license you couldn't actually sell any project made with EDuke32, could you?

[Helixhorned]

MusicallyInspired, as I suggested, the technical side of having more animation frames isn't that exciting, but without actual data to use it with there's no incentive to implement it. So pointers to papers/algorithms/implementations are welcome, maybe someone of us will get interested.

[Fox]

MusicallyInspired, on 19 April 2012 - 07:38 AM, said:

Well, yeah. But since it's under a license you couldn't actually sell any project made with EDuke32, could you?

You can, as long as you don't include a copy of Eduke32.

[Striker]

Do you guys think that MOV will be useful? I wish I could have got a version that wasn't cut off, but, it was the best I could afford... It isn't cheap..

The CD where it originated from can be found here, but it's $200 - http://www.amazon.co...e/dp/B000F8O120
(And for all I know, it may still have the widescreen cutoff...)

Where I bought the individual effect from - http://www.pond5.com...on-mush001.html

[Spiker]

I don't think buying it is a good idea. It would easier to make it from scratch. I think I could make something similar to this pretty easily if only I had time.

[Tea Monster]

You've got to get it in game somehow. A sprite would work, but it's going to look kinda bleh. You could do the old crossed planes trick.

If you check out Doomsday, they can do all manner of cool crap with thier particle engine. Depending on what graphic you use, you can get a simple billboard emitter to do fire, sparks or smoke.

Speaking of engines, Doom 3 has just been open sourced, and there are a group of people putting together a nifty little pakage including lighting improvements and editor re-packaging. If people aren't happy with EDuke....

[Striker]

Brain Damage, on 19 April 2012 - 09:14 AM, said:

I don't think buying it is a good idea. It would easier to make it from scratch. I think I could make something similar to this pretty easily if only I had time.

http://www.youtube.c...player_embedded

Uh, I already did, and provided it.

http://www.mediafire...vl0q9ey6vjolp73

[Hendricks266]

I hate to say it, but I don't think that website is the true original source or the right place to buy it. 3DR (and TV programs I have seen on the History Channel) used a version that wasn't cut off to match the widescreen fad, so we should be able to find one that requires no major editing.

By the way, I've seen that website linked before, and it also has the original movie for the Octabrain mindblast (COOLEXPLOSION1) but it too is cut off. IIRC it also has the fire from the game.

[Jimmy]

LOL. Dude. What a waste of money.

[Striker]

Don't dare fucking laugh. You know how goddamn disappointing this is?

FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK.... I always fuck up somehow.. *sigh*

I shouldn't have got it... but I wish the fucking site would have warned about this... You'd expect the preview to be cut off, but the full thing? ugh... I'm a fucking idiot... my fault for not checking before getting it. Leave it to me to want to help out, but get something useless.

[Hendricks266]

All is not lost. That DVD you linked had the issues of, well, being a DVD, meaning it is limited to the tiny DVD video resolution. Also, there are probably licensing and copyright issues that prevent these from being included in the HRP, although they could work as an independent pack.

StrikerMan, you should contact the company you bought it from since you know for a fact the movies it provides are cut off along the top and bottom to fit in a 1080p movie file. Ask if you can get the proper footage, and if not, where you can or where they got it from.

[Fox]

StrikerMan780, on 19 April 2012 - 06:25 PM, said:

Don't dare fucking laugh. You know how goddamn disappointing this is?

FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK FUCK.... I always fuck up somehow.. *sigh*

I shouldn't have got it... but I wish the fucking site would have warned about this... You'd expect the preview to be cut off, but the full thing? ugh... I'm a fucking idiot... my fault for not checking before getting it. Leave it to me to want to help out, but get something useless.

Well, the site indeed said "HD 1080 (1920x1080)" so it was predictable.

But everyone do mistakes like that in their life.

[Tea Monster]

Strikerman780 - don't panic. If you paid that much for it, you most likely paid for usage rights as well. There will be some kind of documentation on the site that will tell you what your usage rights are. I don't want to get your hopes up, but as EDuke is pretty non-profit anyway, you should be OK.

You can always bitch at them and ask where the top of the file is. If not, Photoshop is your friend. I think it's great that you cared enough about the project to shell out hard cash for an asset like that. Thank you!

[NUKEMDAVE]

It's the same explosion footage they used in the DNF intro. I compared it.



1:50

[MusicallyInspired]

Helixhorned, on 19 April 2012 - 07:55 AM, said:

MusicallyInspired, as I suggested, the technical side of having more animation frames isn't that exciting, but without actual data to use it with there's no incentive to implement it. So pointers to papers/algorithms/implementations are welcome, maybe someone of us will get interested.

Right, of course. Hopefully someone with the necessary knowledge and willpower will.

I realize suggestions and talk are cheap. I'm not begging for it to be included I'm just wondering what's possible, if things have been thought of already, and if so why they weren't pursued is all. I was seriously asking a question when I said "Why is it so seemingly impossible?" rather than attempting to start an argument, if I came across that way. If I was coming off as overbearing, my mistake.

[Tea Monster]

Quick question:

A friend of mine who did the concept of the new Cycloid head has offered to do a concept for the Liz Trooper.

His stuff looks pretty cool, but he's told me that he will lean more towards making it badass, rather than it being a straight version of the sprite. In fact, "If I was going to create something like that, the last thing I would use as reference is the sprite." I think this is brilliant, but I just wanted to get your opinions.

[Spiker]

IMPORTANT NOTE: After a lot of thought we finally decided to split the HRP completely into separate folders - Polymer and Polymost! The size has slightly increased (by today's standards) but that was well worth the price and that was a result of many ideas that we were discussing and thinking about for a few days! That was a prerequsite to changes that will happen in the future and also it will make things easier to manage and user friendly. The only thing that could be changed now in to move Polymost HRP into it's own repository. This would reduce download size and make everything more tidy without the need of scripts or hacks. For now Polymer HRP is ~ 500mb and Polymost HRP ~ 400mb. By default it should launch Polymer HRP, if you want Polmost then open duke3d.def and comment out "//" the first line and to the opposite to the second.

[Plagman]

Who's we, and how is 1G of total data a slight increase from 640M?

[Spiker]

I discussed it with Tea Monster be we knew some people won't fly over this. Please move Polymost to it's own repository (This one is called Polymer HRP so probably this should be Polymost HRP). If you do that there will be only 500mb for polymer and 400mb for polymost and eveybody will only download what he wants. Hey, at least I care and want to make things better. On a longer run it is a good move believe me. Besides 900mb is a mater of minutes even here where you can hardly call this place developed.

[Hendricks266]

Brain Damage, on 22 April 2012 - 08:38 PM, said:

IMPORTANT NOTE: After a lot of thought we finally decided to split the HRP completely into separate folders - Polymer and Polymost!

Oh God, no! No, no, no! I don't think you fully realize the consequences of your actions!

1. Any sort of mod that referenced HRP materials in the "highres" path is now broken. This includes my add-on HRPs, but I don't want to change them because that will break compatibility with all users currently. This kind of catch-22 can only be caused by an act of shortsighted retardation.

2. Major ease of use issues for the end-user always come before minor ease of developing issues for the developer. I have already posted that users are going to download ONE pack and one pack only, then expect it to work both under Polymer and Polymost. By completely splitting the HRP you have destroyed the work that LeoD and I have done (mostly LeoD) towards merging them together and setting the stage for support on the EDuke32 side for handling switching of the HRPs between renderers for the user completely. It's not about file size or "how disorganized the HRP is". In fact, it looks like you have completely duplicated the structure, inflating file size even more, so that's a detriment, not a benefit. Rather, it's about keeping things straight for downloaders and avoiding countless posts asking why the HUD RPG looks wrong and why there are no Polymer lights.

Revert this change immediately. If you do not in 72 hours and you do not convince me (by some miracle), I will find the way to do it myself.

EDIT: And just who in hell is "we" anyway? Did you not even read my warnings earlier?

[MusicallyInspired]

How about we discuss things as a group with all parties involved? People who work on the repository regularly and whose projects are based on it, not to mention those who depend on it, instead of talking to just one other person, making an executive decision, and not consulting anybody else? How about that?

Geez, can anybody just mess with the repository? Shouldn't it be closed off for this reason?

[Danukem]

Hendricks266, on 23 April 2012 - 02:34 AM, said:

1. Any sort of mod that referenced HRP materials in the "highres" path is now broken. This includes my add-on HRPs, but I don't want to change them because that will break compatibility with all users currently. This kind of catch-22 can only be caused by an act of shortsighted retardation.

Also DukePlus, War of Attrition and probably others. The "highres" path has been in the HRP for as long as I can remember, probably six years or more.

[Tea Monster]

Chill everyone. Its SVN, just revert to the previous version.

[Hank]

Tea Monster, on 23 April 2012 - 08:50 AM, said:

Chill everyone. Its SVN, just revert to the previous version.

No, can do. If you use the TortoiseSVN as a customer, me for example, I would not know the difference until I launch a TC. I think because it is the SVN, no one should just alter its settings without considering all people involved.

The only reason I am even aware of the change is because today I am at home, stuck. Otherwise I don't read through all of the forums.

[MusicallyInspired]

Hank, on 23 April 2012 - 09:22 AM, said:

No, can do. If you use the TortoiseSVN as a customer, me for example, I would not know the difference until I launch a TC.

This. I use Tortoise myself for quick and easy updating.

[Spiker]

delete