[3D Master]

Room over Room? Sounds good, but then, it begs the following observation:

There's already a Build engine version out there with room over room, seethrough water (which is a result of room over room), and controllable (sector created) vehicles; namely the Shadow Warrior engine.

What would it take to run Duke under the Shadow Warrior engine / upgrade Duke's Build build to the Shadow Warrior Build build. (No pun intended.)

In other words: merge the two engine projects together. It would have several advantages:

1. Both Duke and Shadow Warrior would benefit from improvements in engine/renderer; you don't need two separate projects. (Shadow Warrior doesn't yet have a Polymer/dynamic lighting renderer does it?)

2. Duke gains all the improvements the Shadow Warrior engine had, which would improve future mods/projects. Most notably controllable vehicles, and if that control scheme could be applied to models as well as sector-based vehicles, you could put a model jeep in there and control it.

[Plagman]

Except these are all game-based effects. The only features that SWBUILD had over DN3DBUILD back when the games were released were voxel rendering and some tweaks in the mirror code. These weren't SW-specific at all and came from Ken's own Build tree. When Ken released the Build source in 2001, it had all these features and more; that's what 3DRealms put alongside the Duke3D source code, so anything that was in SW is also in the codebase used by JfDuke and by extension EDuke32.

The room over room from Shadow Warrior was just a multi-pass approach based on the game code calling drawrooms() more than once. That's exactly what's done with the SE-based RoR, and it works today. If you don't want to use the SEs, you can use CON code and the showview command (interface to drawrooms) to re-implement it yourself.

See-through water is the same thing, there's even an example map that demonstrates the SEs that has it; it ships today with EDuke32.

Vehicles are just a matter of moving the sectors, like doors or whatever. Anyone could implement sector-based vehicles today using CON code. It's not an engine thing.

In other words, JfDuke and JfSW are based on the same engine code, and so is EDuke32. There's nothing to benefit here.

[Helixhorned]

Plagman, on Nov 7 2010, 10:20 PM, said:

Vehicles are just a matter of moving the sectors, like doors or whatever. Anyone could implement sector-based vehicles today using CON code.

In fact, I have begun doing just that. That's what the new CON commands were for. I won't have time to work on it in the near future though, so if anyone is interested to develop it further, drop me a note. Sidenote: the really hard thing is clipping on rotation.

[Helixhorned]

Just an idea that sprung to my mind: do we need to connect the ROR ceilings/floors by their indices at all? The simplest implementation would be to have a new ceiling/floorstat bit mean "don't draw this ceiling or floor". This way, people could begin to build stuff right away while the editor would accumulate some convenience features to deal with ROR over time.

[Plagman]

Yeah, both the renderer and the engine would need that link to the next sector.

[Hendricks266]

Helixhorned, on Nov 7 2010, 04:03 PM, said:

In fact, I have begun doing just that. That's what the new CON commands were for. I won't have time to work on it in the near future though, so if anyone is interested to develop it further, drop me a note. Sidenote: the really hard thing is clipping on rotation.

IMO, the ideal thing would be a model with your new sector collision. Ability to traverse multiple sectors, vehicles that look like vehicles, etc.

[Helixhorned]

There could be a slight misunderstanding here of what my code handles and what it doesn't. It does handle collision of things against model sprites. It does not handle collision of the model sprite against other sprites or the map geometry in a new way. Why the asymmetry? The reasons are that the API doesn't work that way (you only pass coordinates to clipmove, for example) and if it did, there would be many new issues to deal with, including the aforementioned clipping on rotation.

Plagman: you're right, of course. What I was trying to express was that there shouldn't necessarily be a 1 to 1 relation, nor should the walls of one sector necessarily match the other. Think of an elevator shaft with the exits slightly off on every level. With the restriction, a mapper would need to put points in every sector where any lower or upper sector had points, wasting the most precious map resource. In a way, this resembles the problems mappers face when they want to model the floor and ceiling separately.

[Plagman]

Ah, I see what you mean. I think the linked sector outlines should be identical, cause we probably don't want holes in the map. My idea was that the editor would take care of duplicating the walls when you use the "stack" function to create your above/below sector, and that any dragpoint after that would be sure to drag all the corresponding points in the stack. This'll waste some walls, yeah. I don't see another way, though. If the mapper has to draw the outlines of the stacked sectors and make sure they're moved together this feature is probably going to be a major annoyance in the long run. That doesn't mean the two rooms of the stack have to be the exact same shape since you can always put red walls around them.

[DavoX]

Is there any way to make Eduke32 load like 2 or 3 maps in the first loading as to connect them with a seamless corridor or something (like the HUB) but you don't actually exit the level? This way people could separate the map in different parts and not worry about the wall or sector limits.

[DavoX]

Sorry for double post, but will this get fixed sometime? Sprites pasted to the wall show z fighting :



This didn't happen before.

[High Treason]

I could be wrong on this, but try pressing O on the sprite (for the time being - it still needs fixing).

[DavoX]

That makes it worse

[Awesomebob]

DavoX, on Nov 8 2010, 08:08 PM, said:

That makes it worse

Hover the sprite 1-2 units from the wall?

[DavoX]

That's not the only issue regarding sprites. Spritework used to be much more effective before. Now if you make a bridge with stretched sprites and look from around a corner, half of the damn bridge dissapears, rendering the spritework useless.

[Plagman]

Before what? Are you talking of a difference between classic and Polymost or Polymost and Polymer?

[DavoX]

Bear in mind I've been absent from the Mod scene for one year at least. That's what I call "before" and I didn't use Polymer at that time, just polymost. I believe it wasn't even released.

I'm talking about the difference between polymost and polymer.

Now that I'm testing, I'm having the same result with polymost and polymer, probably it's something that both are sharing now.

[Plagman]

Can you post a sample map that exhibits the behavior you're talking about? I don't remember any changes that would affect sprite visibility in Polymost, only models.

[Stabs]

is your map in an oversized grid and on the grid its fair distance from the centre?

i remember having severe sprite z-clipping in the first DNE realease because the map was moved so far from the centre

[DavoX]

I was thinking about this the other day... Plagman, if ceiling and Floor ROR worked... it would be like a portal, right? Well... can it be used on walls as well? To make interiors and exteriors two separate places... the result would be interesting.

[DavoX]

I'm getting this thing when I have several sectors and different Polymer lights:



As you can see, the two lights don't blend properly. If I raise the floor a little bit the lighting looks better, but when I save it all looks wrong again.

[Plagman]

Does increasing r_pr_maxlightpasses fix the problem?

[Danukem]

If he is using the latest DukePlus, that might explain it because it includes an autoexec file that reduces light passes to increase performance. In that case, he should edit the autoexec file to increase them.

[DavoX]

ACtually I'm still using dukeplus 2.0 ... I'm going to check out that maxlightpasses thing.

[Sobek]

I've been away from mapping with Duke for a while now, but I've just started up again and I've noticed some improvements here and there, such as Polymer lights now affecting HUD models properly. I've been out of it for many months now, can anyone summarise some of the major changes that have happened recently? Obviously there's the HUD model lighting, which is really fantastic... But has there been anything else?

*edit* Also, what's the go with clipshapes? I'm reading back through the thread but I'm still a little unsure of how it works. How detailed is it? Does it just create a basic square square blocking shape around the model in question, or does it conform to the smaller details on it? The details about it in the Samples folder don't seem very clear to me... Is this just a test for something that will be integrated automatically into the renderer, or are we always going to have to use some second .map file to work out clipping on models.

Has me a bit confused is all.

[Helixhorned]

Basically, you provide special maps called _clipshape0.map through _clipshape9.map in which you model the clipping behaviour of a given tile with one or more bunch of sectors. When playing, every sprite with that tile number has this clipping information transformed to its position and rotated, and behaves as if the sectors were in its place. For a start, I'd recommend reading the doc and taking a look at the example _clipshape0.map provided in the samples directory.

[The Commander]

Yeah Sobek this feature should benefit your mod quite nicely.

[TerminX]

Choosing to give Helixhorned svn commit access is probably one of the best decisions I've made regarding EDuke32 during the entire life of the project.

[Helixhorned]

Hey, I'm just a guy who got way too emotionally attached to Duke3D in my childhood years, so hacking the port is my way to repay the countless hours of fun.

[Mike Norvak]

I having some problems with eduke under windows 7 , it crashes imediatly, the only way to run it is on 8 bit mode.
The log:

EDuke32 2.0.0devel 20100727
Application parameters: -game_dir DukePlus
Using D:/EDUKE33/HOST-DUKEPLUS/ for game data
Using DukePlus/ for game data
Windows 7 (build 6.1.7600) w/ nedmalloc.dll
Initializing DirectDraw...
Searching for game data...
Using D:/EDUKE33/HOST-DUKEPLUS/DukePlus/ for game data
Using 'duke3d.grp' as main game data file.
Compiling: EDUKE.CON (36 bytes)
Including: DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON (410671 bytes)
Using DEF file: dukeplus.def.
Wrote eduke32.cfg
Wrote settings.cfg
Using config file 'DukePlus/dp.cfg'.
Including: DEFS.CON (35992 bytes)
Including: USER.CON (45482 bytes)
Including: DukePlus/dpcons/DEFSPLUS.CON (54312 bytes)
Including: DukePlus/dpcons/USERPLUS.CON (58072 bytes)
Including: DukePlus/dpcons/LIGHTS.CON (26026 bytes)
DukePlus/dpcons/LIGHTS.CON: In state `paltoRGB':
DukePlus/dpcons/LIGHTS.CON:839: warning: duplicate case ignored.
Including: DukePlus/dukebike/DUKEBIKE.CON (87216 bytes)
DukePlus/dukebike/DUKEBIKE.CON: In actor `DUKEBIKE':
DukePlus/dukebike/DUKEBIKE.CON:1013: warning: found local gamevar `cameradist' used within an actor; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dukebike/DUKEBIKE.CON:1013: warning: found local gamevar `cameradist' used within an actor; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
Including: DukePlus/dpcons/HUDPLUS.CON (67030 bytes)
Including: DukePlus/dpcons/PLAYERPLUS.CON (125401 bytes)
Including: DukePlus/dpcons/MONSTERPLUS.CON (230388 bytes)
DukePlus/dpcons/MONSTERPLUS.CON: In actor `TANK':
DukePlus/dpcons/MONSTERPLUS.CON:10167: warning: found local gamevar `rendmode' used within an actor; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/MONSTERPLUS.CON:10174: warning: found local gamevar `rendmode' used within an actor; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON: In actor `NEWSMOKE':
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:7447: warning: found local gamevar `rendmode' used within an actor; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON: In event `EVENT_EGS':
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:13746: warning: found local gamevar `rendmode' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:13746: warning: found local gamevar `framerate' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:13803: warning: found local gamevar `rendmode' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:13803: warning: found local gamevar `framerate' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:13814: warning: found local gamevar `rendmode' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:13814: warning: found local gamevar `framerate' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:13825: warning: found local gamevar `rendmode' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:13825: warning: found local gamevar `framerate' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:13842: warning: found local gamevar `rendmode' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:13842: warning: found local gamevar `framerate' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:13968: warning: found local gamevar `framerate' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:14017: warning: found local gamevar `rendmode' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:14017: warning: found local gamevar `framerate' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:14027: warning: found local gamevar `framerate' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:14041: warning: found local gamevar `rendmode' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:14041: warning: found local gamevar `framerate' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:14157: warning: found local gamevar `framerate' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:14159: warning: found local gamevar `rendmode' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:14159: warning: found local gamevar `framerate' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:13746: warning: found local gamevar `rendmode' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:13746: warning: found local gamevar `framerate' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:13803: warning: found local gamevar `rendmode' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:13803: warning: found local gamevar `framerate' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:13814: warning: found local gamevar `rendmode' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:13814: warning: found local gamevar `framerate' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:13825: warning: found local gamevar `rendmode' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:13825: warning: found local gamevar `framerate' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:13842: warning: found local gamevar `rendmode' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:13842: warning: found local gamevar `framerate' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:13968: warning: found local gamevar `framerate' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:14017: warning: found local gamevar `rendmode' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:14017: warning: found local gamevar `framerate' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:14027: warning: found local gamevar `framerate' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:14041: warning: found local gamevar `rendmode' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:14041: warning: found local gamevar `framerate' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:14157: warning: found local gamevar `framerate' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:14159: warning: found local gamevar `rendmode' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:14159: warning: found local gamevar `framerate' used within a synced event; expect multiplayer synchronization issues.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON: In event `EVENT_CHEATGETJETPACK':
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:17300: warning: found `setplayer' within a local event.
DukePlus/dpcons/DUKEPLUS.CON:17301: warning: found `setplayer' within a local event.
Found 46 warning(s), 0 error(s).
Resizing code buffer to 125624*4 bytes
Script compiled in 91ms, 125616*4b, version 1.4+
3011/11264 labels, 749/2048 variables
307 quotes, 46 strings, 40 events, 428 actors
Initialized 24.0M cache
Loading 'dukeplus.def'
Warning: Failed including duke3d.def on line dukeplus.def:1
Warning: Failed loading MD2/MD3 model "highres/sprites/characters/1405_duke.md3"
Warning: Failed loading MD2/MD3 model "highres/sprites/firstperson/2524_pistol.md3"
Warning: Failed loading MD2/MD3 model "highres/sprites/firstperson/2530_clip.md3"
Warning: Failed loading MD2/MD3 model "highres/sprites/firstperson/2532_cliphand.md3"
Definitions file 'dukeplus.def' loaded.
RTS file DUKE.RTS was not found
Initializing OSD...
Switching kb layout from 0000080A to 00020409
Initializing DirectInput...
- Enumerating attached game controllers
- No game controllers found
Uninitializing DirectInput...
Executing "DukePlus/dp_settings.cfg"
Executing "autoexec.cfg"
Disabling desktop composition...
Setting video mode 1280x1024 (32-bit fullscreen)
Enabling ATI FBO color attachment workaround.
OpenGL Information:
Version: 2.0.6747 Release
Vendor: ATI Technologies Inc.
Renderer: ASUS X1550 Series
Cache contains 17450684 bytes of garbage data
Initializing music...
Initializing sound...
Fatal Signal caught: SIGSEGV. Bailing out.
g_errorLineNum: 0, g_tw: 0

Wrote DukePlus/dp.cfg
Wrote DukePlus/dp_settings.cfg

I remember it ran pretty fine the last time i used Windows 7, at the begining of 2010

[The Commander]

What if you trying running the latest version instead of one from all the way back in July?

http://dukeworld.duke4.net/eduke32/synthes...101112-1727.zip