[The Commander]

Till ATI sorts there shit out, I highly recommend that the default texture filtering mode be set to Nearest or Linear.

This should stop the high amount of "All I see is white boxes!" from new people installing and playing eduke32 with the HRP etc.

[Mike Norvak]

The Commander, on Nov 13 2010, 10:27 PM, said:

Till ATI sorts there shit out, I highly recommend that the default texture filtering mode be set to Nearest or Linear.

This should stop the high amount of "All I see is white boxes!" from new people installing and playing eduke32 with the HRP etc.

Nop, the same, i think it´s a problem with the drivers of the graphic card or something...

[Mike Norvak]

The fucking same, i un-installed the ATI catalyst center last night and it works, but now that i reboot the computer i can´t use the 32bit mode. I´ll try to reboot one more time....

EDIT: I uninstall an "ASUS Gamer don´t know what" app and it works...

[LeoD]

Had a similar problem last year. All this additional ASUS software is crap. Guess this goes for other mainboard/graphics card vendors as well.

[The Commander]

The Commander, on Nov 14 2010, 05:27 PM, said:

Till ATI sorts there shit out, I highly recommend that the default texture filtering mode be set to Nearest or Linear.

This should stop the high amount of "All I see is white boxes!" from new people installing and playing eduke32 with the HRP etc.

Norvak, on Nov 14 2010, 05:38 PM, said:

Nop, the same, i think it´s a problem with the drivers of the graphic card or something...

That post was aimed more at the Eduke32 developers.
As anyone using an ATI card with the latest drivers installing eduke for the first time with the HRP, they are going to be getting that white bird shit problem.

[Plagman]

MusicallyInspired, you have an ATI X something right? Does that have that texture bug, or is it only newer cards? This has gone unfixed for long enough that I'm willing to figure out what's wrong with the drivers and officially report a bug to get it sorted out, but I don't have any current-gen ATI cards at my disposal.

[MusicallyInspired]

Yeah, I get white boxes too. But it's not just eDuke that doesn't work properly. My ATI Catalyst Control Centre doesn't even function at all if I use the latest drivers. I had to find these obscure 3rd party drivers using and older variation of Catalyst to get anything to work right (Xtreme-G 9.11 XP Legacy Drivers). I have an ATI X1650 AGP.

[Mr.Deviance]

MusicallyInspired, on Nov 16 2010, 07:36 AM, said:

My ATI Catalyst Control Centre doesn't even function at all if I use the latest drivers. I had to find these obscure 3rd party drivers using and older variation of Catalyst to get anything to work right (Xtreme-G 9.11 XP Legacy Drivers). I have an ATI X1650 AGP.

Yet another example of ati's driver fail
I've been hearing issues like this since ages from hundreds of people.
Ati is the biggest piece of shit card that ever existed.

[Tea Monster]

The Commander, on Nov 13 2010, 08:27 PM, said:

Till ATI sorts there shit out, I highly recommend that the default texture filtering mode be set to Nearest or Linear.

This should stop the high amount of "All I see is white boxes!" from new people installing and playing eduke32 with the HRP etc.

Based on experience with ATI cards, you might be waiting quite a while.

[Awesomebob]

Mr.Deviance, on Nov 16 2010, 07:55 AM, said:

Yet another example of ati's driver fail
I've been hearing issues like this since ages from hundreds of people.
Ati is the biggest piece of shit card that ever existed.

My ATI run everything just fine and dandy, even WoW (and blizzard is VERY bias toward nVidia). The only thing I can't play on this card is polymer eduke with filtering higher than liner. Every other game I play run fantastic on max settings with no overheat and no crashes or glitches.

All this and roughly $200 cheaper than a comparable nVidia card.

[The Commander]

Yeah all the cards (correct me if I am wrong, but I know the X1650 is one of them) have moved to that legacy driver thing, so the last official update of those drivers was in February.

If I remember correctly the 10.2 drivers worked fine and didn't give the white boxes?

[Tea Monster]

Awesomebob, on Nov 16 2010, 08:09 AM, said:

My ATI run everything just fine and dandy, even WoW (and blizzard is VERY bias toward nVidia). The only thing I can't play on this card is polymer eduke with filtering higher than liner. Every other game I play run fantastic on max settings with no overheat and no crashes or glitches.

All this and roughly $200 cheaper than a comparable nVidia card.

Yes, but the Nvidia card works!

You say that everything else you have works great, but if you check the Blender/Maya forums, and other places where software and hardware are discussed, 99.9% of the time it's the ATI guys who are bemoaning problems.

I've had about 5 or 6 ATI cards, from 1997 - 2 months ago, and each time I've had to spend a day or two hunting down driver fixes for various problems. If it works for you, that's great, but I wouldn't have one thrown at me.

[TerminX]

The reason ATI cards work fine with a lot of commercial games is because game developers spend hundreds of man hours programming specific workarounds for their malfunctioning drivers. A lot of open source software is simply written to adhere to the OpenGL spec and therefore has problems on ATI because developers of free software rarely have thousands of dollars to spend on all sorts of random hardware to do QA with.

[Plagman]

Wait, so 9.11 gives the white boxes with a X1650 but not with new cards where it starts at 10.5 or something? Weird.

Also, Blender/Maya/EDuke32 use OpenGL whereas pretty much all modern games use Direct3D these days. And Blizzard is not at all biased towards NV, in fact they're an AMD partner since a few years.

[MusicallyInspired]

Yeah, nothing works for me on the latest official ATI drivers for my card (legacy). I can't stand ATI. I really want to migrate to NVidia on my next PC upgrade purchase.

[Mr.Deviance]

Awesomebob, on Nov 16 2010, 09:09 AM, said:

All this and roughly $200 cheaper than a comparable nVidia card.

$200 cheaper is exaggerated, but even if nvidia was 200 bucks more it would still be worth it, especially when when for those extra $200 Nvidia had 3d vision for any 3d app and hardware physx acceleration that makes lots of difference in visual quality for games that support it plus drivers that work perfectly for absolutely any game and app ever made up to this day.
Ati sucks and it has been bought by amd which also sucks. 2 lame companies got fused together so they don't die alone. Amd cpu's have always been the worst POS when compared with Intel. Both AMD and ATI were 2 separate companies that went for the much cheaper approach but also releasing crap hardware for those cheap prices.
The ATI brand was so BAD that not even AMD could save it. Ati brought shame to amd and caused AMD to lose sales just beause their cards were named ATI, which is exactly why amd killed the ATI brand completely.
So have fun with your future AMD cards, they are still the same ati shit, but they are just missing the ati name.
The only great ATI card that ever existed was their top of the line ati 9800, either xt or pro I don't remember exactly which was better but that card was awesome.
Ever since that ancient card, ati hasn't produced even one decent vid card that would compensate with the lack of proper drivers...

[TerminX]

Hey, no need to slam AMD... they make good budget processors, and back in the Pentium 4 days AMD wiped their ass with Intel.

I have a couple of quad core Phenom II rigs at the moment and the price/performance ratio is pretty awesome if you're into overclocking (I am).

[SwissCm]

RAWRRRR AMD
Their cards are fine, the drivers are OK. I'm not saying they are without problems but to the consumer they work reasonably well particularly when it comes to Direct3D support. AMD are also somewhat more friendly to the open source community compared to Nvidia too due to their support of the open source driver.

Also, AMD has always made excellent processors, even the K6 series were good back in the day and their 386 and 486 clones were excellent, better than the Intel equivalents.

Besides, even if you don't like AMD, having them around means competition and competition means lower prices and increased R&D. If we didn't have AMD around you can bet that Intel would still be using terrible P4-derived stuff.

[Lord Misfit]

An interesting note on this is I'm planning to upgrade from this 5 year old hand-me-down laptop with an ATI Mobility Radeon X1300 card [which I know according to notebookcheck.net is one of the weakest of ATI's cards still on the market (a low-bottom class 4, the lower the class number being a more powerful card category on the site). I'll be bumping up to at least a Class 2 (probably not a 1 since I want to keep a 15-16" laptop and save some money)]. The card I seem to be most poised to end up with (at least according to the system I got on my Dell wishlist) is a Nvidia GeForce GT 420M w/ Optimus [or possibly the 435M if I decide to add more money by getting a Core i7 instead of a Core i5 processor), and according to plagman it should help a lot with EDuke32 at least, but I do want to do this to actually be able to play games from this recent decade with competence too. XD

I won't be attempting to get an upgrade though for a month or maybe two and I feel it might be best to see other people's thoughts on this even though I consider plagman's advice to be pretty good so far since he's one of those who I feel would know the engine specs pretty well. [maybe terminx can shed his opinions on this as well? o.o]

Thanks.

[Awesomebob]

Mr.Deviance, on Nov 16 2010, 10:51 PM, said:

$200 cheaper is exaggerated.

No, it was not exaggerated at the time I bought the card. According to tom's hardware my $199 ATI was just slightly worse (the biggest difference I could see was the memory channels) than the $399 nVidia card. So I went with the ATI seeing as I'm on a budget and all.

Did an ATI card touch you in a bad spot or something? Such rage, you should see a therapist.

[Mblackwell]

SwissCm, on Nov 17 2010, 04:18 AM, said:

RAWRRRR AMD
Their cards are fine, the drivers are OK. I'm not saying they are without problems but to the consumer they work reasonably well particularly when it comes to Direct3D support. AMD are also somewhat more friendly to the open source community compared to Nvidia too due to their support of the open source driver.

I don't personally consider someone saying, "Fine whiners figure this shit out yourself" to be particularly supportive. They could have just released decent drivers in the first place like certain other companies, which only receive comments to open their source from diehard FOSS people. Especially when that company also contributes patches and manpower to upstream support.

[Tea Monster]

Awesomebob, on Nov 17 2010, 06:49 AM, said:

...
Did an ATI card touch you in a bad spot or something? Such rage, you should see a therapist.

Stop being a silly fanboy. ATI cards have loads of driver problems and don't run OpenGL programs correctly. This isn't something we all conspired to make up because we liked Nvidia. If you actually read this thread, you'd have seen that multiple ATI cards have annoyed me, which is why - and is in fact the ONLY reason why - I like Nvidia.

[Tetsuo]

They run most OpenGL programs in other operating systems (where OpenGL is the only choice) correctly.

[Tea Monster]

Tetsuo, on Nov 17 2010, 10:54 AM, said:

They run most OpenGL programs in other operating systems (where OpenGL is the only choice) correctly.

Oh, I see, so you are saying that they can write OpenGL drivers, they just choose not to?

[Tetsuo]

Just relating my experience with their (non-windows) OpenGL drivers that's all. Of course in OS X (for example) the drivers aren't just by them but by Apple as well.... and they need work... however it's not like all applications render incorrectly on there.

[High Treason]

I personally think there are communication issues in ATi - one team seems to go out of it's way to get the chip running OpenGL and another seems to screw the drivers as if they know nothing about the chip they are writing for... I dunno, it's hard to explain, but I studied Business at college and it just feels like communication problems within the company.


I'm an nVidia & Intel user myself, but in the old days I was not, the first rig I built was an AMD Duron 950 which at some point had it's SiS 6326 card pulled out and replaced with a GeForce 4 MX420, this was a good card but it artifacted in Flight Sim 2002 so I bought fantastic ATi 7500 (With the old Hercules 3D Prophet brand on it) - that card was AWESOME! As time went by the 7500 died in a watercooling accident and I upgraded to an ATi 9200SE which was also good, but it had some problems with OpenGL and could be out-performed by the nVidia GeForce 4 in 2D Acceleration and even in FS2002/CFS2 which is what I was doing a lot back then.

As time wore on I built several AMD/ATi systems that all failed to live long at all and I have three cupboards filled with dead AMD/ATi products and I amassed 14 working Intel/nVidia machines.

Eventually I ended up on a FireGL V300 when I built my current system in 2005 - that FireGL name is misleading as it never managed to run a single GL app, it would merely give me a black or white screen and display no image - though the program would still run making it difficult to close unless I knew the name of the .exe - I had to blindly hit Windows + R and type "taskkill /f /im:executable.exe" to kill the app. Eventually I bought a GeForce 7300GS and never had any problems and I have used nVidia since then also due to the fact that this system is still running I also chose to use Intel processors if I build any other systems.

And believe me, I know reliability, my machine is about to clock up 6 years of service and I still expect it to do next-gen things - amazingly it actually does acheive them too, wether I'm lucky or I just happen to know how to make a good system and tweak the right settings I do not know. I never Overclock so it must be good.

Edit: ATi non-Windows? I tried Kubuntu on my system - works fine if I take the RAID controllers out. Tried it on my friends system (AMD Phenom / ATi 3870 at the time) and got nothing but corrupted screens and a Wine installation that would not run.

[Awesomebob]

Tea Monster, on Nov 17 2010, 10:16 AM, said:

Stop being a silly fanboy. ATI cards have loads of driver problems and don't run OpenGL programs correctly. This isn't something we all conspired to make up because we liked Nvidia. If you actually read this thread, you'd have seen that multiple ATI cards have annoyed me, which is why - and is in fact the ONLY reason why - I like Nvidia.

Sorry for flying off the handle. I just don't like being called a "fanboy" (trust me, I'd rather have an nVidia, but DX11 support is only affordable to me with ATI at the moment), a liar or an idiot.

[Mr.Deviance]

Awesomebob, on Nov 17 2010, 06:49 AM, said:

Did an ATI card touch you in a bad spot or something? Such rage, you should see a therapist.

Dude, that's a very lame assumption based on nothing.
I'm a tech expert in an old OC club from my city and I test and burn, bench and oc lots and Lots and LOTS of hardware since geforce titanium days and pentium III days.
I was not touched by anything in a bad way, It's just that knowing everything about new and old hardware is both my job and hobby.

[SwissCm]

From experience I've found people who overclock as a hobby are fanboys and never look at hardware objectively, instead preferring to judge it purely on hearsay and personal experience.

[Mr.Deviance]

SwissCm, on Nov 19 2010, 12:54 AM, said:

From experience I've found people who overclock as a hobby are fanboys and never look at hardware objectively

Because generalizing makes your E-pen bigger...