[Zaxx]

While the lice are having fun I think I'll take the opportunity to talk about Doom in the Doom thread so here's another cool video from Decino explaining the RNG:

Overall the whole channel is really great, there's lots of interesting stuff and it's worth checking it out because Doom is a simple game but it has a few underlying mechanics that are quite unique and more complicated than it might seem from the outset (like the armor system for example).

[OpenMaw]

necroslut, on 01 January 2020 - 10:29 PM, said:

I've actually only watched very little of TNG in HD, and I can't recall it looking particularly bad, but as a general statement I still stand by it – it's true for a lot of shows. Raising the resolution of movies, shows or games doesn't automatically make things look better – often it does the opposite.

I think it hurt the original series more than it hurt TNG. If anything I think it does TNG some good. Keep in mind what they did. It wasn't a question of just forcibly uprezzing it. They used the original negatives to simply create a better final result. The TNG sets were built right on top of the sets that had been standing since 1979. Slightly re-arranged, mind you...But engineering in TMP is engineering in TNG. So they inherited all the movie quality construction when they redid the outer shell of things.

Not to be off topic anymore, but I think it's a question of what peoples tastes are. Like I don't mind most of the design in Doom 2016, and I absolutely admire that they went for it and were dedicated to it and din't water it down along the way. I'm just a sucker for the older designs of some things. One example where I think they absolutely nailed it was the Pinky. That is a beautiful upgrade for that creature in terms of design. However, I also love the cyber-nightmare foreskin-chewed look of the Doom 3 pinky. It's great.

[Aristotle Gumball]

Commando Nukem, on 03 January 2020 - 12:15 PM, said:

However, I also love the cyber-nightmare foreskin-chewed look of the Doom 3 pinky. It's great.

That monstrosity is what sometimes makes me want to reinstall Doom 3 again, but then I remember the rest of it and yawn.

[Zaxx]

Commando Nukem, on 03 January 2020 - 12:15 PM, said:

Like I don't mind most of the design in Doom 2016, and I absolutely admire that they went for it and were dedicated to it and din't water it down along the way.

Yeah, same here, it's just that the weapons are overdesigned garbage and overall the game has a vibe that makes it seem like it was designed for teenagers. Really, Doom 2016 is a great game I think but the color of Doomguy's eyes pissed me off so much that I uninstalled after 30 minutes.

Do I fit in now?

Edit: Oh, I almost forgot: #ReleaseTheBroussardCut

[OpenMaw]

thricecursed, on 03 January 2020 - 12:17 PM, said:

That monstrosity is what sometimes makes me want to reinstall Doom 3 again, but then I remember the rest of it and yawn.

There's some issues with Doom 3 for sure, but I think the biggest failing is the gunplay. The weapon sounds are just... Weird. The product of losing the legend of Trenty boy for whoever they could get to scrouge shit up.

That's absolutely one place that Doom 2016 was wise. It's not Doom 3, part 2. It found its own identity. I was glad they took some cues from Doom 3 though, without completely ignoring it.

[Zaxx]

A game findig its unique identity is one thing but honestly I just don't value that much because the game is a SEQUEL. The previous entries have already set the stage for how Doom should look and feel like and any kind of deviation from that goes against the established canon. For example the new shotgun doesn't make sense when we all know that Doomguy's CLASSIC weapon of choice is the Tootsie-Toy "Dakota" cap gun. I love that weapon so much that I have 7 of them at home so that I could put a different one in my mouth every day. I used to fantasize about a real bullet penetrating my skull after pulling the trigger like if I was a Lost Soul but I stopped doing that when I started taking my meds.

[Aristotle Gumball]

Commando Nukem, on 03 January 2020 - 12:59 PM, said:

There's some issues with Doom 3 for sure, but I think the biggest failing is the gunplay. The weapon sounds are just... Weird. The product of losing the legend of Trenty boy for whoever they could get to scrouge shit up.

That's absolutely one place that Doom 2016 was wise. It's not Doom 3, part 2. It found its own identity. I was glad they took some cues from Doom 3 though, without completely ignoring it.

Yeah, I think Doom 2016 got it right in terms of balance. It's got its issues too, but it has the best of Doom 1-2 with the visual aesthetic of Doom 3. My perfect shooter would have the level design and grungy aesthetic of Quake 1 with the gunplay from Doom 2016, but just overall lower bloat, including no cutscenes (only visual storytelling) and an epic sense of scale.

The thing with Eternal that irked me from the showcases is partly what I already mentioned (cheesy nu metal aesthetic), but for example, when they show that giant alien city, you know you can't actually go there, it's just a backdrop. I miss that from the old days - everything you saw, you could interact with in some way. Now it's like you've got these epic and super detailed visuals, but with massively simplified level layouts. All that said, I'll reserve my final opinion for when the game actually comes out.

[OpenMaw]

thricecursed, on 03 January 2020 - 01:12 PM, said:

Yeah, I think Doom 2016 got it right in terms of balance. It's got its issues too, but it has the best of Doom 1-2 with the visual aesthetic of Doom 3. My perfect shooter would have the level design and grungy aesthetic of Quake 1 with the gunplay from Doom 2016, but just overall lower bloat, including no cutscenes (only visual storytelling) and an epic sense of scale.

They keep mumbling that they're going to do a reboot of Quake 1, so... Now that the technology is pretty much perfect, maybe they'll find a new Raven surrogate and get them making a Quake remake with that grungy gothic-lovecraftian level design. That would be cool.

thricecursed, on 03 January 2020 - 01:12 PM, said:

The thing with Eternal that irked me from the showcases is partly what I already mentioned (cheesy nu metal aesthetic), but for example, when they show that giant alien city, you know you can't actually go there, it's just a backdrop. I miss that from the old days - everything you saw, you could interact with in some way. Now it's like you've got these epic and super detailed visuals, but with massively simplified level layouts. All that said, I'll reserve my final opinion for when the game actually comes out.

Yeah, up to now most of my criticism, if you could even call it that is very minor. The weapon design didn't bother me while I was playing, just certain things that i'd prefer were different. One thing I actually really love that id seems to be doing with Eternal is the navigation and movement. The meathook, the dodge, the climbing, the air jumping. Great, great gameplay enhancements. It's what a lot of these throwback shooters desperately needed to start doing to actually be more than just a remake of the old games. Bring in more maneuvering capabilities. Seeing so much verticality in a First Person game made this century is honestly shocking. When you look back over the last decade of First Person Shooters, everything seems, to me, like it was very flat. Unless it was Dusk, or Amid Evil or something.

[Aristotle Gumball]

The meathook is cool and they were originally gonna have something like that in Quake 1 IIRC, but I don't like those stupid poles that you can swing from. Makes it look like a kid's playground or something. I hope they incorporate those interactive elements with more subtlety, so it feels less game-y, you know? Or make it so over the top you think you're in an Evil Dead film, no in between shit.

[Zaxx]

thricecursed, on 03 January 2020 - 01:12 PM, said:

All that said, I'll reserve my final opinion for when the game actually comes out.

I don't, I already hate it because it's popular and the weapons look like overdesigned garbage anyway. I've heard that Trent Reznor was making the sound effects but he left so now the sound effects are being made by a guy who's not a famous musician so it's shit now.

[HulkNukem]

necroslut, on 30 December 2019 - 11:02 PM, said:

Is it just me who hates the weapon models in the new Dooms (to an extent shared with the Wolfensteins)? Overdesigned garbage.

Some of them I dislike, some of them I like a lot.
The ones I dislike are generic looking and look like they came from any other sci fi FPS. The plasma gun was probably my least favorite overall, especially actually using it ingame.
Meanwhile, stuff like the Gauss Cannon I really really liked both the look and feel, though sometimes I can mistake the Gauss for the BFG at a quick glance.

That all said, I think the redesigns they've done for Eternal are all great from what I've seen. The plasma gun especially seems hugely improved.

[Zaxx]

The new Doom 1-2 ports by Bethesda were released on PC through the Bethesda.net launcher. Sneaky stuff.

[ReaperAA]

New Eternal Trailer is here


(For some reason I cannot Embed the video)

[Mr. Tibbs]

Here's the embedded trailer:

[Ninety-Six]

Looks sweet as hell.

I hope it gets subtitles soon; the audio effects are making it difficult for me to understand everything being said. Only bits and pieces.

[KaijuTurtle]

Seems like they're really leaning into developing the story more, which is fine- i just hope it doesn't interrupt the gameplay too much. Doom 4 was good for keeping the details in the fluff text with only two or three HL2-esque cutscenes, and I'm hoping it stays that way.

I still have no doubt this will be my GOTY, mind you

[Ninety-Six]

Actually, the trailer music there: Does anyone else hear the first level theme for the playstation version?

[The Battlelord]

I never undesrtood the concept behind a sword being stronger than a gun (even if made of energy, against the Cyberdemon), is not that i don't like swords, they are cool, but at this point i prefer to dismember monsters with bare hands than using an integrated blade and adding slower animations.
Anyway, prepare yourself, because indigenous will come back from their graves to destroy tanks and war planes with new energy spears, arrows, blades and some axe .

[Zaxx]

[Zaxx]

Skip to 10:50 for something amazing...

[ViDi]

Looks interesting

[PikaCommando]

This needs to be done to Duke3D sprites!

[Hendricks266]

If you look closely, the features of the interpolated Cyberdemon don't move, they morph. This technique is not ready for production usage.

[Danukem]

PikaCommando, on 21 January 2020 - 09:25 AM, said:

This needs to be done to Duke3D sprites!

The new animations would take tons more tiles than the old ones, so they couldn't be put on the original tile numbers. They would need to be added to new tile numbers, then all the actor code would have to be modified to refer to the new animations (including even nitty-gritty things like actioncount based responses). The animated sprites would also take up lots more memory (like 4X as much). We already get hitches in our mods when large numbers of tiles are loaded in, so that would be fun too.

What you actually want, the holy grail in my opinion, would be a new HRP, but this time make all the models look exactly like voxels of the sprites but with smooth animations, and make them work properly with all pal swaps.

[NightFright]

Hendricks266, on 21 January 2020 - 09:31 AM, said:

If you look closely, the features of the interpolated Cyberdemon don't move, they morph. This technique is not ready for production usage.

It may not be, but it surely looks boner-inducing.

[Ninety-Six]

Based on this, it seems like everything is matching up with that one showcase Id did a few months back, where they kind of explained their intent behind the combat and how they really wanted the player to be thinking at all times. Personally I am all about that. Juggling a wide variety of enemy types and the most effective weapons to use against them, making lightning-fast do-or-die decisions in the heat of battle... That's really why I enjoy FPSes (and why I tend to favor the older ones). It seems like Eternal is really going to scratch that itch. 4 was really good and came super close, but there were a few weapons that, when upgraded, sort of became a "win most battles" button.


I know he isn't always the most accurate, but I really hope his prediction about this being a total milestone in the evolution of this genre comes true. The genre in modern times has been begging for a radical change-up for a good few years now, and if this leads to more games having an intense focus on the combat and juggling all those elements, then I will be a happy player. Won't matter if it comes from indie throwbacks or modern game studios as long as there's a juggling act.

[HulkNukem]

Not reading anything specific to avoid spoilers but it sure seems like several publications are hyping this game up as the second coming of FPS games

[NightFright]

It seems Doom Eternal will be twice as long regarding playtime as its predecessor. Also levels are twice as large. Early reviews state concerns that the new emphasis on (easy) puzzles and vertical movement might be a bit too distractive, but in general the game is just bigger, better and nicer. I also like the idea that you mainly get your resources from monsters now, depending on how you kill them. And if you are running low on supplies, it spawns some trash mobs for a quick refill.

[Zaxx]

Ninety-Six, on 21 January 2020 - 01:41 PM, said:

I know he isn't always the most accurate, but I really hope his prediction about this being a total milestone in the evolution of this genre comes true.

I don't know how you'd describe what a milestone means but I think that there is a very low chance of Eternal becoming a "trend setter" or anything like that, in fact this seems like a very risky game at this point.

From what I'm seeing Eternal really looks like a game that will test you when it comes to utilizing the mechanics of an old school shooter. If you look at the Noclip interview with Hugo Martin there he says that they watched the infamous Polygon gameplay video of Doom 2016 and what they learned from it was that the game should have killed that player for not playing the game the way it was meant to be played (movement, "push forward combat" etc.). As a result Eternal will kill you if you play like Polygon.

That's risky because they are banking on player skill while the general audience (and especially journalists) usually suck at playing FPS well. In order to combat this they made the devs seemed to have made the game very color coded in its looks plus just like in Doom 2016 the hitboxes will be huge etc. and those things will help a lot but they won't make bad player habits magically go away. If you started playing FPS with corridor shooters and military shooters then forgetting all that and learning how to play an arena FPS is quite tough.

And really, this seems like a game made for "sweaty" players as Spuddy, one of Australia's best Quake players puts it:


Guess a lot will depend on how the lower difficulties will be balanced.

[Zaxx]

This is the best thing I've ever seen:

Top of the line budget and animation talent used for the stupidest shit, I love it.