[Zaero]

I tried both def and con methods but none seem to work. Well, too bad. Thanks for the help anyway.

How about the other stuff I posted? What do you think?

[Danukem]

Zaero, on 12 April 2012 - 08:12 AM, said:

I've found some bugs in recent (1.40) version of Attrition:
1. When monster is loosing health (by "wound" ability) and Freezer is selected, he gets frozen just before his HP reaches 0, even if he wasn't shot by freezer itself
2. When player is holding expander upgraded with "clone" ability, all enemies shot by any expand ray gets cloned, even if ray itself was a friendly-fire from Evil Duke, not player

It sounds like the code is only checking for the weapon type and not checking for whether the player caused the damage. This surprises me, since it's an obvious check and I know that my code in other mods does check that. In any case, I should look into it and fix it for the next release (whenever that is).

Zaero, on 12 April 2012 - 08:12 AM, said:

Suggestions for futher releases:
1. Change the limit of "Level abortions" from 5 to 1 + 1 per 100 000 points. This makes more sense cuz:
-when you start the game there is a slight probability the level would be too hard for not upgraded Duke, or simply player will be unable to finish it for some reason
-as the game progresses the chance of levels repeating increase. I mean: not only the repeating of levels in single gameplay (there are about 100 levels total so it's not a big prob) but from other gameplayes. The player may be simply bored in this case, so why not let him skip level is the's score is big enough (the bigger the score the longer the gameplay)?

I'm pretty sure the levels DO NOT repeat in a single gameplay. If that does happen, it is a bug. I personally have not observed it happening with the latest version. As for the "Abort Mission" command, I agree that the player should be allowed to use it a lot. It's sort of like when you have a lot of music on your iPod/Mp3 player, but you get sick of most of the songs and just want to skip them when they come up. Maybe the player should even have the option of making his own episode by selecting a set of maps when the game starts.

Zaero, on 12 April 2012 - 08:12 AM, said:

2. Add "radar" like the one showing nearest enemy in "War of attrition" mode. The radar would display nearest wall crack, switch, key card or level exit button for easier level progression. Probably should be disabled by default, but turned on in "Attrition menu".

Having a radar that shows keycards/card slots/cracks/switches would not be too difficult. But highlighting the object that you need to use next requires a lot of intelligence and would be very difficult for me to code. I'm not sure how useful it would be to just show the objects on the radar.

Zaero, on 12 April 2012 - 08:12 AM, said:

I also have some ideas for some DukePlus-Attrition hybrid. The thing is to add new gameplay elements which are both cool and less "arcade". Will share if Dan's interested.

It would be good to have multiple characters, skill trees, and lots of weapons (like Borderlands) but that's a huge amount of work, and my first priority is another project that I'm working on which also has rpg elements.

[Zaero]

Trooper Dan, on 12 April 2012 - 03:57 PM, said:

It sounds like the code is only checking for the weapon type and not checking for whether the player caused the damage. This surprises me, since it's an obvious check and I know that my code in other mods does check that. In any case, I should look into it and fix it for the next release (whenever that is).

Good to hear that.

Quote

I'm pretty sure the levels DO NOT repeat in a single gameplay. If that does happen, it is a bug. I personally have not observed it happening with the latest version. As for the "Abort Mission" command, I agree that the player should be allowed to use it a lot. It's sort of like when you have a lot of music on your iPod/Mp3 player, but you get sick of most of the songs and just want to skip them when they come up. Maybe the player should even have the option of making his own episode by selecting a set of maps when the game starts.

Ok, but what with the "High score challange" mode? In theory it is possible to play the episode as long as player remains alive, right? And even when s/he's dead, its possible to load a savegame and play some more. In this case there is a chance to play all the levels included and at some point some level MUST repeat itself. Unless.. "High score challange" is limited somehow?

Anyway I hope both features you've mentioned will be added at some point.

Quote

Having a radar that shows keycards/card slots/cracks/switches would not be too difficult. But highlighting the object that you need to use next requires a lot of intelligence and would be very difficult for me to code. I'm not sure how useful it would be to just show the objects on the radar.

I was thinking about a radar which works exactly the same way as in WoA mode, but the group of objects shown would be keycards/card slots/cracks/switches/level enders, not enemies. No intelligence of any kind, just a nearest thing. This would be useful especially those new maps, played with HRP where some stuff is so tiny or translucent and therefore hard to find.

Quote

It would be good to have multiple characters, skill trees, and lots of weapons (like Borderlands) but that's a huge amount of work, and my first priority is another project that I'm working on which also has rpg elements.

Nope I meant nothing like this. What I have in mind is in fact Duke Plus with some stuff of Attrition included. It's just a rearrange, something like "Attrition Lite", where the trivia are:
0. There will be no: multiple characters (other than some EDF sidekicks), skill trees, and lots of weapons (like Borderlands)
1. Duke works for EDF and therefore he gets cash/points for each alien killed, babe save, item retrieved, dollars found etc (pretty standard, I know).
2. The above makes his personal "war budget" which he can spend on weapon/items upgrades, hookers/dancers, Soda/Snack machines, Phone booths to call EDF reinforcements etc
The total amount of points collected is score, the remaining amount is the cash.
3. There is a menu to select what Gun/item to levelup, instead of automatic upgrades like in WoA. Only about 5 levels per item, all already made for Attrition, which means no new things to code.
4. Many items can be interacted with like hand driers, food, phones, hookers etc
5. Gun-specific upgrades: I mean not all thrown in like in WoA (arcade style) but each weapon would have a set of more specific like Bleeding wounds only for Shotgun, Acid wounds only for Chaingun/Battlelord cannon etc
6. The stronger enemy-variants appears the more score Duke has, but are more unique in means of appearance, weapon, skills etc. Only enemies which have models in HRP.
7. Some stuff for mappers like functional Space Suit and vaccum sectors, invisible objects which displays a window massage from EDF's General Phil Graves with some new objective etc

I was also thinking about some storyline mod which adds some levels in-between vanilla ones with some Duke Plus stuff like motorbike runs etc. I have a few ideas in this area as well, but those would require a team of skilled mappers, so I'm not asking Dan for it.

This is a sketch of those ideas, I also have the whole system in-detail (exactly what weapon upgrades for each weapon etc), will send them to Dan if he's interested.

[Player Lin]

Zaero, on 13 April 2012 - 02:39 AM, said:

Ok, but what with the "High score challange" mode? In theory it is possible to play the episode as long as player remains alive, right? And even when s/he's dead, its possible to load a savegame and play some more. In this case there is a chance to play all the levels included and at some point some level MUST repeat itself. Unless.. "High score challange" is limited somehow?

I was asked same shit like that...

It's only limited your cheating but if you want load savegame and play over and over and over, feel free to do unless you feel boring with that.
And I remember Dan said if you played that mode enough long it may starting repeat levels you played.

[pmw]

Pretty interesting episode, especially WITHOUT stupid HRP. Mod looks like duke nukem, not any barbie game like other todays D3D-mods, and that's GOOD thing.

But here's my notice -list:

- Episodes are extremely easy, just like every other game from since something like 2005
- Level design is sometimes really nice, sometimes feels like it would be "under construction". Going from highly detailed room to another room which has only walls and no details at all.. Lack of interesting or something(??).
- Secret places....Those are supposed to be _SECRET_ places. Todays game doesn't have secret places, or if they do, they are so visible that "secret place" is totally wrong line for those. (HINT: http://kk4.fi/u/1334...uke0000.tga.jpg)

But overall, pretty intresting episode with interesting features, like that new mighty foot kick.

[Danukem]

pmw, on 13 April 2012 - 08:18 AM, said:

- Level design is sometimes really nice, sometimes feels like it would be "under construction". Going from highly detailed room to another room which has only walls and no details at all.. Lack of interesting or something(??).

There are over 100 user maps included with different styles and levels of detail. The main thing they have in common is good gameplay (although of course that's debatable).

[pmw]

Trooper Dan, on 13 April 2012 - 08:58 AM, said:

There are over 100 user maps included with different styles and levels of detail. The main thing they have in common is good gameplay (although of course that's debatable).

OK, I tried 5 maps or something... I'll need to play it more, probably. Anyway, I'm probably pretty old school guy, cause I like to play difficult games. These 5 maps were extremely easy. I always had more than 90 health. Mainly, I just ran trough maps. No puzzles, nothing. IMHO, really boring to play. But nice map structures --- sometimes. But I'll check it more when I got some time.

[Danukem]

pmw, on 13 April 2012 - 10:00 AM, said:

OK, I tried 5 maps or something... I'll need to play it more, probably. Anyway, I'm probably pretty old school guy, cause I like to play difficult games. These 5 maps were extremely easy. I always had more than 90 health. Mainly, I just ran trough maps. No puzzles, nothing. IMHO, really boring to play. But nice map structures --- sometimes. But I'll check it more when I got some time.

Play it on Damn I'm Good if you think it's too easy. I modified it so that monsters do not respawn. The high score challenge and War of Attrition modes also tend to be harder. So I think there is enough challenge to be found in the mod.

[pmw]

Trooper Dan, on 13 April 2012 - 12:17 PM, said:

Play it on Damn I'm Good if you think it's too easy. I modified it so that monsters do not respawn. The high score challenge and War of Attrition modes also tend to be harder. So I think there is enough challenge to be found in the mod.

Oh sounds cool. Where did you modified that? Do you know how to change monsters respawntime?

[supergoofy]

The newest eduke32 builds made Attrition broken

Anyway, for now I'm using the build that was included with Attrition pack.

Btw, it's been a long time since I last played it, and I used an old version. It became a superb mod. Many thanks Trooper Dan (a.k.a. DeeperThought)

[Helixhorned]

supergoofy, on 04 July 2012 - 04:37 AM, said:

The newest eduke32 builds made Attrition broken

In what way?

[supergoofy]

1. in the log it gives many warnings

2. the gameplay is slow

With the old build that it is included in Attrition the gameplay (and framerate) is smooth

I would suggest you to try and play Attrition (http://fissile.duke4..._attrition.html) with the latest svn build r2800 of eduke32:
http://dukeworld.duk...120701-2800.zip


I have Phenom II quad core @3.2GHz with a Radeon HD 6850 and 8GB or RAM, under Windows 7 64bit

I have a good aftermarket cooler and I can easily overclock my cpu to 3.7GHz without problem, and the temperature of cpu cores is increased about 4-5 degrees (about 56 to 58 degrees max with a 2hours Prime95 stress test)

I'm telling this because even if I overclock my cpu there isn't any noticable improvement.

So something is broken with newest eduke32 builds.

[Helixhorned]

supergoofy, on 04 July 2012 - 06:11 AM, said:

1. in the log it gives many warnings

Yes, the CON compiler is way too lax, and in the future, more warnings will appear as various types of problems are found. However, they do not cause any difference in how the code is compiled, all they do is to tell the coder what was silent before. Also, constructs that have no meaning right now will potentially become errors or (less desirably) compilation switches. For example, what happens on overflow of a gamevar is entirely undefined (for two reasons).

Quote

2. the gameplay is slow

This is interesting, as there was another person complaining by mail about reduced performance compared to earlier builds. Is this specific to a particular renderer?

[supergoofy]

I mostly used Polymost, but I tried Polymer.


Now I'm using the latest AMD Official BETA drivers:
AMD Catalyst 12.7 (8.981.2.0 June 26) AMD Official BETA
http://www2.ati.com/...s7_20120629.exe

Build Info:
DriverVer=06/26/2012, 8.981.2.0000
8.981.2-120626a-141571E-ATI
CCC: 2012.0626.1157.19430
D3D: 9.14.10.0924
OGL: 6.14.10.11740
OCL: 10.0.938.1

I don't know why this greatly reduced performance happens on newer builds of eduke32. Memory leak or other stupid bug??? Is this bug related to AMD CPUs or GPUs??? I cannot tell.


[edit]

About the performance decrease: When you start a game the speed is normal (like in the old eduke32 build) then it gradually decreases while you play.

Except the code warnings there are no other peculiar error messages in eduke32.log.


Btw, I forgot to say that I enable Trilinear filtering and Anisotropic filtering 16x and VSYNC. Maybe something is broken with Trilinear filtering in latest builds ???

Or the problem is related with the autosaving system ???

[Come On And Slam]

Why does Eduke32 freeze when I minimize it with Attrition playing? It doesn't freeze with any other mods.

[LeoD]

Maybe you could iterate through the recent EDuke32 versions to nail down the one which has started the trouble.

[Plagman]

Can you post eduke32.log?

[supergoofy]

I'm using BASSMIDI driver 3.0 and I thought that maybe this was the problem. I have uninstalled it but that didn't solve the problem. After all BASSMIDI driver 3.0 works great with the older eduke32 build.

[supergoofy]

This performance loss is getting to my nerves. I don't know why it happens. I'm willing to help finding the cause. @Plagman, Helixhorned and the rest of the team, when you have some free time, please tell me what info should I provide and what tests to do, so that we can investigate the problem.

To me it seems the problem is lying to the saving/auto-saving system. Maybe there is a memory leak there. But what is it's trigger? I'm not a programmer so I cannot tell.

[Helixhorned]

supergoofy, on 07 July 2012 - 12:50 AM, said:

This performance loss is getting to my nerves. I don't know why it happens. I'm willing to help finding the cause. @Plagman, Helixhorned and the rest of the team, when you have some free time, please tell me what info should I provide and what tests to do, so that we can investigate the problem.

I haven't gotten to checking this out yet, but if you bisected the synthesis builds to find out between which revisions the performance becomes poor, maybe the cause will be obvious from looking at the changes.

[supergoofy]

ok I'll try that. I'll let you know about the results.


[edit]

OK tests are done with ADG02.MAP


ADG02.MAP - r2798 works fine

ADG02.MAP - r2799 crashes without error (eduke32 exits to desktop)

ADG02.MAP - r2800 slow performance

[Plagman]

Gah, I should probably back out these changes until the regressions are understood then.

[SigFloyd]

Sorry if this has been asked before, but if I wanted to make a custom chapter that runs through the entire pool of random missions plus the three boss maps before having it end, without the preset difficulty that Highscore Challenge has, how should I go about doing that? I like the long haul Highscore mode has, but I find difficulty 4 too full of frustrating situations like going up against, say, 5 or 6 protector drones that have cloak, speed, and near bottomless health bars at the beginning of a map, give or take a half dozen or so elite Evil Dukes and Robots and a few very angry kitchen sinks. No amount of invisi-goggles/holoduke/damage amp trickery can overcome that point where the game decides you're through, full stop. I just want to see all that there is to see and max all the weapons without pulling my hair.

[Come On And Slam]

I think I would like this mod more if the missions weren't completely random. I'm not asking for a deep story or anything, but I do like it better when I beat an earth level that has you go into space and travel for the next mission to be in space, or vice-versa.

Also, I would like to have the old explosions and graphics back

[SigFloyd]

Slippy_Pig, on 08 July 2012 - 06:29 AM, said:

Also, I would like to have the old explosions and graphics back

Same here. I prefer to play in software mode for that old school feel, and the new explosions do not play nice with that at all.

[LeoD]

supergoofy, on 07 July 2012 - 12:50 AM, said:

Maybe there is a memory leak there. But what is it's trigger? I'm not a programmer so I cannot tell.

r2799/r2800 has only two files changed. You may try the two attached executables to identify the one which causes your troubles.

Weird discovery: when I rename eduke32.exe to eduke32-backpatched.exe, Windows7's User Account Control steps in when I try to start it...

Attached File(s)

•  eduke32-test.7z.zip (912.52K)
  Number of downloads: 344

[Danukem]

Sorry guys, I have been unable to mod for the past week (again), but I do intend to come back to this and make improvements. I do read comments and take feedback seriously, even if I don't reply.

[supergoofy]

LeoD, on 08 July 2012 - 03:25 PM, said:

r2799/r2800 has only two files changed. You may try the two attached executables to identify the one which causes your troubles.

Weird discovery: when I rename eduke32.exe to eduke32-backpatched.exe, Windows7's User Account Control steps in when I try to start it...

eduke32-2820-new-polymost.c.exe has the problem

I will test the other


[edit]

eduke32-2820-new-mdsprite.c.exe works ok

[supergoofy]

To let everyone know, the problem is fixed in r2825:

------------------------------------------------------------------------
r2825 | Plagman | 2012-07-10 21:39:01 -0700 (Tue, 10 Jul 2012) | 1 line

Revert hightile factoring for now.
------------------------------------------------------------------------

[supergoofy]

check this