[Micky C]

There were a lot of cool cut features in Duke 3D, such as a lot of levels (some of them came back in The Birth), and items such as the Spacesuit that allows you to walk in a vacuum (and jump around in low grav!!!). One early magazine even mentioned being able to break windows in space then all the enemies get sucked out and killed, which sounds pretty neat. So considering all the stuff they cut, I'm not surprised if they didn't have time to code in a feature such as that.

Another problem is that players might use the objects in ways that were not originally intended, and they could cheat and skip parts of levels.Oh wait what am I thinking? This is Duke 3D not DNF. In Duke 3D there was nothing wrong with having the ability to skip parts of levels say with the jetpack, and of course back then the levels were actually good enough enough that you wouldn't want to skip parts in the first place. DNF on the other hand... (Seriously though it probably might have led to extra blocking of walls or something)

Mappers these days are free to use the feature in DukePlus though.

[KareBear]

 MrFlibble, on 14 October 2012 - 04:39 AM, said:

What keeps me wondering about Duke3D is that I can't remember a single level that would use pushable blocks. It's such a notable feature in Powerslave for example (and generally an improvement over other 2.5D engines that was added in Build), and it allows for some nice puzzles and level design, but somehow it seems to me that it was left unused (or underused) in the most well-known Build game.

Am I wrong here?

I noticed that too while playing Powerslave/Exhumed recently.Its pretty jarring considering the rest of the game (the control scheme for example) is so archaic compared to the "Big Four" Build games.

[t800]

I heard some rumors about textured automap (second mode of map). It was supposed to display not only player but also monsters and pickups, so the game could be played in almost three ways - from fps and tps view and up-down view from map. Maybe they found it too unpractical for gameplay, or were too lazy to do sprites for all enemies from top-down view. One reason or another they sadly decided to scrape it. Pity, I would like to try another original way how to play Duke. Surprisingly no modders ever tried to implement this function in their projects as far as I know.

Source of information: http://dukenukem.wik...used_data_(DN3D)

EDIT: Question adressed to experienced modders (CON coders) and/or EDuke32 developers - is it possible in Eduke32 to do such a thing?

[Jimmy]

 MrFlibble, on 14 October 2012 - 04:39 AM, said:

What keeps me wondering about Duke3D is that I can't remember a single level that would use pushable blocks. It's such a notable feature in Powerslave for example (and generally an improvement over other 2.5D engines that was added in Build), and it allows for some nice puzzles and level design, but somehow it seems to me that it was left unused (or underused) in the most well-known Build game.

Am I wrong here?

Pushable blocks really don't fit with the run and gun theme of Duke. It works for Powerslave though.

 t800, on 14 October 2012 - 06:01 AM, said:

I heard some rumors about textured automap (second mode of map). It was supposed to display not only player but also monsters and pickups, so the game could be played in almost three ways - from fps and tps view and up-down view from map. Maybe they found it too unpractical for gameplay, or were too lazy to do sprites for all enemies from top-down view. One reason or another they sadly decided to scrape it. Pity, I would like to try another original way how to play Duke. Surprisingly no modders ever tried to implement this function in their projects as far as I know.

Source of information: http://dukenukem.wik...used_data_(DN3D)

EDIT: Question adressed to experienced modders (CON coders) and/or EDuke32 developers - is it possible in Eduke32 to do such a thing?

Yeah, some of the graphics were left in the game, like top-down views of most of the 1.3d aliens. Mods like Nuclear Showdown and AMC TC have implemented similar features, but not as far as showing aliens on the map.

[TerminX]

My old "Project X" TC had implemented the top down views for the enemies in-game through the use of floor aligned sprites that weren't visible outside of map mode.

[Jimmy]

Oh, cool. I never noticed that. In that case, it means it's very possible in EDuke32, hahah.

[Fox]

There is also a second style of icons, which would display Duke's face (2452) of a skull for enemies (2453).

[High Treason]

I noticed when scanning the ad in the Terminal Velocity box that this shot has a different movie title in it, "Slashmaster II" as opposed to "Bleach Blonde Biker Bimbos".



Never seen anyone point this out before. I'm sure there's a proper version of that image somewhere, if someone wants to link it.

[Jinroh]

Wow that's really interesting HT, good eye.

[Hendricks266]

I remember seeing that and thinking "What a boring title."

[Daedolon]

I really like how the theatre looks, though, and sector LARD car? Cool.

[Gambini]

Daedolon, on 18 October 2012 - 03:26 PM, said:

I really like how the theatre looks, though, and sector LARD car? Cool.

You wouldn´t believe that when I got the game back in 1996, and then saw that shot in some magazine (presumably an old magazine) It drove me crazy, because I thought the police car was there and that I had to cheat somehow to make it spawn. I had null access to any kind of information, due to the lack of internet and my very limited english. So, I began to play with the game launch parameters thinking that would do the trick. I remember that at some point I read "coop" somewhere but didn´t realize that cop and coop weren´t the same thing. Then, tried all possible ways to make that "coop" thing work in the game... Thinking that it would change the E1L1 map by one with the police car included.

I completely forgot about that pathetic and irrelevant evening of launching duke3d.exe a thousand times, till today, when I see that image for second time, 16 years later.

[DNSKILL5]

Was stalking this thread again when I watched this video for the billionth time... sorry to reply to an older post, but..

High Treason said:

http://www.youtube.c...GjXzFwCs#t=121s

In the part where you see the Pig Cops.. look REALLY closely, don't they look like they walk differently? They also look like they shoot differently so I think this version shown has the Pigs with the double barrel shotgun, which are not as cool as the really old ones IMHO.. but still.. Somebody HAD this version outside of 3DR!!

[Jimmy]

That video is so strange, because it was done sometime after the plutonium pak was released and I've never seen more footage from that era of the game before. No idea where it even comes from.

[High Treason]

I'm glad you brought that up, think I'll start composing that letter (forgot about this) to the TV station it was broadcasted on, apparently they still have the rights to the show but it's long since dead, they may, however, have something in the archive, even if it was just the footage from the video, it'd be nice.

I'll just be happy to get a response of "No!" though, my letters to big companies usually result in no response at all.

There's definitely something odd with those pigcops, I did notice it at the time. They did have several revisions as time went on though.

There's a croatian bloke on YouTube going around saying he has an older beta, but I'm not inclined to believe him as he went silent when I asked for a link.

[DNSKILL5]

Yeah, Romero even mentions the Atomic Edition.. That's what confuses me..

A. 3DR's sent this footage to the studio, why? The only theory is that they recorded this stuff, and didn't record anything from the retail (I find this total BS, but you never know).. Example, Blood. There's a lot of pre-release footage from Monolith floating around (go to the post mortem forums and see for yourself, it's not the alpha either, it's a later build). So maybe 3DR was just being lazy and sent in old stock footage... or they made a mistake, didn't mean to send old footage?

B. The studio didn't want to purchase Duke Nukem 3d, and so 3DR gave them an older version instead? Or maybe again, 3DR made a mistake, and sent the wrong version? (This means the studio had a copy of this version, and somebody played it in order to make the footage).

C. Who the fuck knows!!!

I'd love for you to write to them High Treason, maybe show us what you wish to send out (in the same fashion Hendricks did), before sending it? I wouldn't believe the Croatian, because he may not know how to speak English well, and could be talking about Lameduke, or he's just lying.. I always dreamed I'd go to some old computer store, and the owner is like "psst, I've got Duke Nukem stuff" and then I get every single build of Duke Nukem, but that will never happen lol.

EDIT: Excuse if this post sounded like rambling, I just got finished watching a movie, and I'm trying to get my mind off of it >_>

EDIT2: Maybe, just maybe... Someone could try contacting Scott Miller instead of Joe about the alphas/betas? He has the higher position anyways. He has a Facebook and accepts request.

[Jimmy]

No surprise about Blood, though. They really tried to hype that game, and that was right when computers were just good enough to play short crappy videos and you could get video games on television.

[DNSKILL5]

Hmm, yeah never thought about that

[Fox]

You guys are overthinking, that is just an archive footage. Don't forget that the box art of Duke 3D barely has any screenshot from actual gameplay.

[DNSKILL5]

But there must be a reason why they used those images and videos, and this "archive footage" has appeared nowhere but in that video, a video about Romero's favorite games. I think you're mad because you're underthinking.

[t800]

Maybe Romero was at good terms with 3D Realms at that time of Duke3D development, so they sent him some pre-0.99 version only for private use. And later when Duke3D was not so fresh thing anymore (so he wouldnt have to fear possible prosecution) he decided to provide it to studio. Maybe?

[Fox]

gerolf, on 03 November 2012 - 11:54 PM, said:

But there must be a reason why they used those images and videos, and this "archive footage" has appeared nowhere but in that video, a video about Romero's favorite games. I think you're mad because you're underthinking.

I don't think I am mad, because I don't really give importance.

If anything, the only reason is that the overall media and even 3DRealms itself seems to not see any difference (or care about) beetween the final game and a prototype. It's not rare to find websites today using early previews.

[DNSKILL5]

It's not rare, but that video was released after Atomic Edition was released, why the fuck would they use that old of footage for a video like this?

I know that they use old footage for many things, but there has to be more to it, and the footage has to have a source, and somebody probably still has that source. Companies don't usually throw old versions away because they may have features they took out in the final version, but may wish to use them in a future title (possibly due to engine limits or various other reasons). So these builds still exist, and it seems Joe has them (and I think he said he was unable to extract the zip files), but people here in the community would know how to.

I still say someone contact Scott Miller instead of anyone else, he's the only one next to George with the power to release stuff like that.

[Jimmy]

I don't doubt that they use pre-release footage all the time, but this footage is odd, I don't think I've ever seen more footage from around this era.

[Hendricks266]

gerolf, on 03 November 2012 - 08:06 PM, said:

B. The studio didn't want to purchase Duke Nukem 3d, and so 3DR gave them an older version instead? Or maybe again, 3DR made a mistake, and sent the wrong version? (This means the studio had a copy of this version, and somebody played it in order to make the footage).

It's more likely that they went to the publisher (GT Interactive) instead of the developer (3D Realms).

[DNSKILL5]

True, but now GT Interactive is dead.. So if we wanted to contact somebody in this day and age, who would be the person(s) to contact? Joe Siegler is one of them, but he seems to be the one everyone contacts. Richard Grey is around on Facebook, but he didn't have much of a position outside of level design, however this is not to say contacting him over unreleased levels isn't worth it, or even early versions of released levels. There's Lee Jackson, but Hendricks already contacted him over basically the only thing worth contacting him about, the music. There's all the other guys too, but many have left the game scene completely. George Broussard seems to have vanished, so that leads to the person I've mentioned twice already:

Scott Miller.

He'd be the one to contact over anything Duke Nukem 3d, and would probably be the person with the power to release the alphas/betas, or at least discuss them. I have his Facebook page here. I'd contact him myself, but I'm not good with words, so maybe someone who is can talk to him, or someone could think up a great message to send, and I'll do it for you?

[OpenMaw]

gerolf, on 05 November 2012 - 05:17 PM, said:

True, but now GT Interactive is dead.. So if we wanted to contact somebody in this day and age, who would be the person(s) to contact? Joe Siegler is one of them, but he seems to be the one everyone contacts. Richard Grey is around on Facebook, but he didn't have much of a position outside of level design, however this is not to say contacting him over unreleased levels isn't worth it, or even early versions of released levels. There's Lee Jackson, but Hendricks already contacted him over basically the only thing worth contacting him about, the music. There's all the other guys too, but many have left the game scene completely. George Broussard seems to have vanished, so that leads to the person I've mentioned twice already:

Scott Miller.

He'd be the one to contact over anything Duke Nukem 3d, and would probably be the person with the power to release the alphas/betas, or at least discuss them. I have his Facebook page here. I'd contact him myself, but I'm not good with words, so maybe someone who is can talk to him, or someone could think up a great message to send, and I'll do it for you?

It was brought up on the 3D Realms forums many many many many many many many times. Joe had talked with the powers that be at 3DR, they never released anything. They have their reasons. They aren't interested in sharing some things.

Scott's answer would be basically, "No."

[Inspector Lagomorf]

Commando Nukem, on 05 November 2012 - 11:00 PM, said:

Scott's answer would be basically, "No."

Has anyone ever bothered to ask "Why not" simply for the sake of closure?

[DNSKILL5]

How do you know Joe asked? Maybe he was answering for himself, and was just saying he asked Scott and George.

Nobody has asked Scott Miller himself, nobody, and even if he said NO, it's better than not hearing anything back.


In other news...



Are these frames ever actually seen in the game? If so, what are the used for, and if not, what were they meant to be used for?

It looks like he's either looking down, or he's about to kill himself?

[Mike Norvak]

gerolf, on 06 November 2012 - 02:31 PM, said:

It looks like he's either looking down, or he's about to kill himself?

According to the tile name he's feeding, I think they made it as another position when the player faces him, just like the liztroop sitting. It is used only in one of the screens in the buy menu on the shareware version. It would be cool if someone code it in a mod to actually work, at least there's actually a model in the HRP. I don't know if that's something useful though...