[axl]

Zaxx, on 16 January 2019 - 11:54 AM, said:

Btw. can Hexen 2 run on some kind of a modern Q1 source port like QuakeSpasm, Mark V or Darkplaces? Maybe I'd give it another go if I could play it with a source port.

Best way to play Hexen 2 : http://uhexen2.sourceforge.net/

Edit : if you mean an actual Quake port ? That I can't say. Sorry.

[MusicallyInspired]

axl, on 16 January 2019 - 11:43 AM, said:

Interesting opinions here. It's rare to see people prefer Heretic above Doom. Anyway, I'm not too a big of a fan of Heretic as it is more like a complete copy paste of Doom in a fantasy setting.

I'd agree, as far as formula goes, but the fact that it has much more interesting level design, palette, and gameplay enhancements like inventory put it over the top for me. I've never been a huge Doom fan in the first place, though.

[leilei]

Heretic's inventory and even the 'bad weapons' is what made it really fun for me. I consider Duke3D to be a Heretic spiritual successor than anything else...

Hexen II however.... had a bit of a enthusiastic programmer featurecreep problem as well as being a bit of a rush job (especially as Raven was busy with at least 2 other titles during Hexen II's development). It's always been an unstable game with long load times and poor balance and never could like it as much as Heretic or Hexen.

[Zaxx]

Here's Quoom (Quake TC for Doom):

[NightFright]

I think it was mentioned before already, but Dimenion of the Boomed is pretty much the best Quake mod for Doom I have played in a while. It doesn't have the weapons or monsters, but it captures the atmosphere almost completely. And even better: A sequel is already on its way.

[Ezepov]

Zaxx, on 16 January 2019 - 11:54 AM, said:

Btw. can Hexen 2 run on some kind of a modern Q1 source port like QuakeSpasm, Mark V or Darkplaces? Maybe I'd give it another go if I could play it with a source port.

I used FTE for Hexen 2

[Zaxx]

Quake 1.5 is out (and it's awesome):
https://www.moddb.com/mods/quake-15

[Aristotle Gumball]

Zaxx, on 18 January 2019 - 05:24 AM, said:

Quake 1.5 is out (and it's awesome):
https://www.moddb.com/mods/quake-15

The axe is fucking awesome now.

Edit: feels like Brutal Quake (not the Doom mod, but an actual Brutal Quake). Had no idea this much gameplay modding was involved. I'm all for it, though.

[Zaxx]

Yeah, it has that "Brutal Quake" vibe really but honestly after playing through the first episode I have mixed feelings. What bothered me:

- Sometimes there are just too many enemies for Quake 1's claustrophobic level design. Feels messy.
- Dunno what happened with the movement but sometimes I feel like an ice skater, it's much easier to accidentally fall to your death than how it was in the original game.
- There seem to be buffed enemy types (like armored ogres) and that's kinda bad because Q1's shitty shotgun and super shotgun feel even weaker now against those enemies. Why the bullet sponges?
- You can't disable the slow motion death animations when you die and if you load a quicksave during them the whole game will be in slow motion. That's why it's a beta I guess.
- It's great that Q1.5 tried to make the episode 1 bossfight more interesting but honestly: in the original game it was boring, now it's fucking terrible. You run around the map, random shit happens, because random shit happened you die or get hurt pretty bad so you have to reload your quicksave. Why the need for save scumming, give me a fair and square bossfight instead of killing me with flames randomly erupting from the floor. Hated that part.
- Hard difficulty felt harder than the original Nightmare. If it's intended then okay though.

It's very promising and I love that it refreshes the gameplay with new stuff (and the maps, the maps are beautiful!) but it needs a bit more balancing and polish... and a toggle for original bossfights.

Edit: And one more thing: shamblers shake the ground with their steps now and I like the idea because it makes them feel even more powerul (+ it's a good notification to be on the lookout for them) but Quake with a shaking screen feels a bit weird. This also breaks Ziggurat Vertigo a bit because the shaking ground can pop you up in the air.

[Aristotle Gumball]

Zaxx, on 18 January 2019 - 10:22 AM, said:

Yeah, it has that "Brutal Quake" vibe really but honestly after playing through the first episode I have mixed feelings. What bothered me:

- Sometimes there are just too many enemies for Quake 1's claustrophobic level design. Feels messy.
- Dunno what happened with the movement but sometimes I feel like an ice skater, it's much easier to accidentally fall to your death than how it was in the original game.
- There seem to be buffed enemy types (like armored ogres) and that's kinda bad because Q1's shitty shotgun and super shotgun feel even weaker now against those enemies. Why the bullet sponges?
- You can't disable the slow motion death animations when you die and if you load a quicksave during them the whole game will be in slow motion. That's why it's a beta I guess.
- It's great that Q1.5 tried to make the episode 1 bossfight more interesting but honestly: in the original game it was boring, now it's fucking terrible. You run around the map, random shit happens, because random shit happened you die or get hurt pretty bad so you have to reload your quicksave. Why the need for save scumming, give me a fair and square bossfight instead of killing me with flames randomly erupting from the floor. Hated that part.
- Hard difficulty felt harder than the original Nightmare. If it's intended then okay though.

It's very promising and I love that it refreshes the gameplay with new stuff (and the maps, the maps are beautiful!) but it needs a bit more balancing and polish... and a toggle for original bossfights.

Edit: And one more thing: shamblers shake the ground with their steps now and I like the idea because it makes them feel even more powerul (+ it's a good notification to be on the lookout for them) but Quake with a shaking screen feels a bit weird. This also breaks Ziggurat Vertigo a bit because the shaking ground can pop you up in the air.

Mate, I just played Ziggurat and I thought it was a madhouse with all the gibs flying everywhere. I'm loving it so far. Shit's totally crazy, the chainsaw, the new guns, it fits into Quake very well. I'm playing on normal and it's already kinda hard, but i'm not complaining. The slomo thing happened to me too, but isn't associated with saving, it just seems to happen randomly (restarting Quake gets rid of it).

But yeah... really good! I'll update when I reach the first boss.

[Bloodshot]

Zaxx, on 18 January 2019 - 10:22 AM, said:

Yeah, it has that "Brutal Quake" vibe really but honestly after playing through the first episode I have mixed feelings. What bothered me:

- Sometimes there are just too many enemies for Quake 1's claustrophobic level design. Feels messy.
- Dunno what happened with the movement but sometimes I feel like an ice skater, it's much easier to accidentally fall to your death than how it was in the original game.
- There seem to be buffed enemy types (like armored ogres) and that's kinda bad because Q1's shitty shotgun and super shotgun feel even weaker now against those enemies. Why the bullet sponges?
- You can't disable the slow motion death animations when you die and if you load a quicksave during them the whole game will be in slow motion. That's why it's a beta I guess.
- It's great that Q1.5 tried to make the episode 1 bossfight more interesting but honestly: in the original game it was boring, now it's fucking terrible. You run around the map, random shit happens, because random shit happened you die or get hurt pretty bad so you have to reload your quicksave. Why the need for save scumming, give me a fair and square bossfight instead of killing me with flames randomly erupting from the floor. Hated that part.
- Hard difficulty felt harder than the original Nightmare. If it's intended then okay though.

It's very promising and I love that it refreshes the gameplay with new stuff (and the maps, the maps are beautiful!) but it needs a bit more balancing and polish... and a toggle for original bossfights.

Edit: And one more thing: shamblers shake the ground with their steps now and I like the idea because it makes them feel even more powerul (+ it's a good notification to be on the lookout for them) but Quake with a shaking screen feels a bit weird. This also breaks Ziggurat Vertigo a bit because the shaking ground can pop you up in the air.

Actually the slowmo can be turned off in the menus, as can several of the new enemies. Odd that the quicksave bug occurs, are you using F9 to quickload? I rebound quickload to a custom one that is supposed to circumvent the slowmo issue (I have an idea of how to actually fix it though)

I didn't touch the movement either, I think maybe that's just the difference between Darkplaces and other source ports? Though tbh I don't notice a huge difference. You could try playing with sv_friction

Ditto for Ogres, they are at vanilla stats so I'm not sure what's up with that. You can even blow their legs off with explosives for a quicker kill than you could originally, and I was afraid this would make them too easy!

Also you really felt the new boss attacks were random? He telegraphs the flame ground attack with an animation as well as the fireball spit (it's quicker though) and each stage of damage he takes gives him extra abilities.

Maybe the problem is that he leads his shots on hard? On normal he doesn't do that and you can dodge his attacks as long as you are moving while on hard you have to change directions based on this. I could reserve that for nightmare though

But yeah I probably should've specified enemies are z-aware now like arcane dimensions so that alone makes the game way harder, so normal is probably more akin to hard. You can turn most of the extra stuff off in the configs though if it isn't in the menu

[Aristotle Gumball]

Okay, just beat episode one. I had no issues with the boss whatsoever! Took me two tries, so it wasn't terribly hard and in the original he's no challenge whatsoever, so good job mixing it up in a creative way. I actually only have one gripe and it's a visual one - the sky texture is way too high res and pretty looking.

[Bloodshot]

What difficulty were you on? Hard?

Also you actually reminded me I was going to make that optional but I forgot and packed the script directly in the pk3 instead, future releases will have it loose so you can just delete the sky script

[Aristotle Gumball]

Bloodshot, on 18 January 2019 - 01:00 PM, said:

What difficulty were you on? Hard?

Normal.

[Bloodshot]

Yeah I changed it so he only acts that way on nightmare, on hard he leads the slow fireballs and nothing else so it's more a middle ground between normal and nightmare now

[leilei]

In productive quake news there's a new version of Trenchbroom that semi-supports Quake3 now. You can now make curveless Quake3 maps to your heart's content in a humanly-usable non-Radiant non-Quark editor finally.

https://github.com/k...ses/tag/v2019.1

[Zaxx]

Bloodshot, on 18 January 2019 - 11:57 AM, said:

Maybe the problem is that he leads his shots on hard? On normal he doesn't do that and you can dodge his attacks as long as you are moving while on hard you have to change directions based on this. I could reserve that for nightmare though

I think that's it then because a lot of time I was like "wait, how did that hit me exactly?" while moving from platform to platform. Honestly I don't think that a boss shooting prediction fireballs at you is such a good idea in a fight where you're not always paying attention to the boss.

I still don't get those flames coming from the floor though. At one time I died to those by moving behind a wall, hitting quicksave and then a flame coming from the ground offed me and since I had the quicksave from just before that (with it being unavoidable) I had to restart the map. Is that an attack of Chton?

Btw. yes, I use F9 for quicksaving. I disabled the in-game slow motion but the game going to slow mo after quick loading when there was a slow motion death anim going on still happened. It's not a biggie because you can fix it by simply loading the quick save again though.

And now that you mention it I've not played Darkplaces in a long time and got used to QuakeSpasm so it can be that Darkplaces is messing with my movement. I just assumed you did something because I noticed that Ranger has legs now when looking down.

Another bug I noticed but forgot to mention: on the first level the door that's after the bridge leading to the installation sometimes gets stuck and just won't re-open (meaning that you can open it for the first time just fine but if the door closes it won't open up again sometimes). Maybe it has to do with gibs but I'm not sure.

Anyway sorry Bloodshot, I forgot that you occasionally read this thread so the wording of my comment may have been a little too harsh.

Oh and I dunno if you know this but TheSpudHunter played your mod on stream, he is usually a very good source for feedback:
https://www.twitch.tv/videos/365726148
One of the best quakers of Australia save scumming on hard, now that's something.

[Zaxx]

Some QC news (at 17:30):
https://youtu.be/_1zkNxRnwXE?t=1047
I like this, it's great that they are taking their time to polish up their shitty engine so I'm fine with not seeing new content for a while with the next patch coming in March. Their monthly patch schedule is partially to blame for QC's mixed reputation, they just always fuck up something after rushing it out the door.

And hey, they promoted Quake 1.5 for a bit too so the community managers did their job fine this time.

[Bloodshot]

Yeah the flame ground is an attack for people who camp somewhere, it has a sound and a he does a summoning animation for it. The door bug may have to do with the destroyable corpses getting stuck in the door?

Also you might want to check out the patch, I fixed the slowmo issue and toned down hard chthon.

You can restore some classic difficulty by disabling ogreaim in the console btw, gets rid of their z-aware grenades. And I don't mind the harshness btw, I just sometimes don't realize my changes lean a bit too heavily in the strafe jumping dm player category a bit

[Zaxx]

I had another go with the "unpatched" version and noticed that the flames come up when you stop: I like that idea very much now that I know how it works.

As for the nerfing of Chton: I'm not sure if it's the best solution honestly. After replaying that part a lot I think the monster predicting your movement is not that much of a biggie, what's throwing me off is the fact that he's shooting even when you're behind cover + the area damage of the fireballs.

Quote

I just sometimes don't realize my changes lean a bit too heavily in the strafe jumping dm player category a bit

I don't think that's much of a problem since a large part of the playerbase is exactly that type of guy, it's just that there are not many people around who can do classic Q1 bunny hopping effectively. For example in QC I can use the CPMA characters just fine since they gain speed easily but in Q1 I usually stagnate or lose speed when going in a straight line (and rocket jumping is very costly in Q1 so that's not really an option for momentum).

Soooo how about implementing VQ3 movement?

[Aristotle Gumball]

I dug the Vore boss btw. It's hard for sure, but I would wait until you get more reviews before implementing any bigger changes. I personally like madness in my games, as long as it's not to do with maze-like levels and backtracking (fuck Q2 for that). The changes to the maps is done very tastefully as well. I'm really enjoying it honestly.

[Zaxx]

thricecursed, on 19 January 2019 - 03:24 PM, said:

It's hard for sure, but I would wait until you get more reviews before implementing any bigger changes.

This.

[Hank]

Ray tracing for Quake II
https://www.techspot...ay-tracing.html

This looks promising

from the article, the video
https://youtu.be/vrq1T93uLag

[Mark]

WOW. Thats what ICD is attempting to do for Duke3d IIRC.

[Hank]

Mark, on 21 January 2019 - 04:45 PM, said:

WOW. Thats what ICD is attempting to do for Duke3d IIRC.

Yes Sir, your memory is impeccable.

[MusicallyInspired]

That's quite nice!

[NightFright]

Amazing how much they visually pimped good old Q2. Of all the classic shooters, I disliked Q2 game controls the most, it feels a bit like walking on rails and playing a "bulky" character. Setting and hub system were nice, though.

[Zaxx]

Ggggggggggggggmanlives:

[Aristotle Gumball]

Zaxx, on 27 January 2019 - 09:34 PM, said:

Ggggggggggggggmanlives:

It feels like the Dark Souls of the FPS genre now. But yeah, playing it on hard looks like a shitfest. As bloodshot said, normal is more like hard in vanilla Quake, whereas hard is like nightmare +1 and people should probably know that before they get into it.

BTW, I saw that he included Machinegames' episode - is it accessed from a special menu/secret area somewhere or do you just select a level from the list when you press backspace?

[MusicallyInspired]

I still haven't played Machine Games' episode.