[TerminX]

 Lunick, on 17 July 2019 - 07:51 PM, said:

No, it's always been a post-release thing

Yep... not enough software engineering talent to go around here as far as finishing multiple major overhauls in a relatively short period of time is concerned.

[Hunter0911]

Hey guys, do you get a bigger share of the sales on GOG or steam ? Not asking for numbers, I want to get this game and GOG is my favorite platform, but most importantly I want to support you the best I can while buying the game.

[Micky C]

If you want to give them the biggest share, get it from the 3DR website. It’s DRM free.

[Hunter0911]

 Micky C, on 17 July 2019 - 11:06 PM, said:

If you want to give them the biggest share, get it from the 3DR website. It’s DRM free.

Oh, didn't know that, thanks !

[Emmanuelexe]

Yeah, Ion Fury sounds weird but it's ok, i will play the game for sure (bought it yet but waited for the v1

Not sure but i read somewhere, 3Drealms and the Voidpoint team could have kept the name "Ion Maiden" but they were scared if some other problems come later (other sue), right?

[Micky C]

They were sued already. I’m not sure how you missed it, there was plenty of discussion both here and on several gaming media sites.

[John Brown]

Will the soundtrack and making-of booklet be available digitally? Even if it costs extra (eg. "Digital deluxe edition upgrade"). I would like to order the big box, but I really do need to save money and I did already pay twenty dollars for the game.

[MusicallyInspired]

Finally bit the bullet and bought it. Currently saving money for a trip to PAX West so I haven't gotten the new big box package like I originally wanted to wait for and get. But I sacrificed enough of that fund for the actual game at least. How long is the new big box run going to run for anyway?

 Micky C, on 17 July 2019 - 11:06 PM, said:

If you want to give them the biggest share, get it from the 3DR website. It’s DRM free.

You could also wait for the price increase.

[Micky C]

There’s going to be a price increase?

[Hunter0911]

 MusicallyInspired, on 18 July 2019 - 06:04 AM, said:

You could also wait for the price increase.

I was also thinking about getting the box, but I don't know if it's reasonable for me to do that (that box art tho), and I'm not sure if they'd ship the box in France ? I couldn't find any mention of that on the website or on the announcements posted on multiple websites (steam, etc).

[MusicallyInspired]

Yeah, price increase happens today. They explained the reasoning is because the scope of the project has doubled in size.

3DR have confirmed on social media they ship worldwide.

[Hunter0911]

 MusicallyInspired, on 18 July 2019 - 06:19 AM, said:

Yeah, price increase happens today. They explained the reasoning is because the scope of the project has doubled in size.

3DR have confirmed on social media they ship worldwide.

Oof, the temptation is now doubled... Thank you, I'm not much on social media, missing lots of info I guess

[Micky C]

A $5 price increase? I honestly expected $10 judging by the trailer.

[DavoX]

 MusicallyInspired, on 18 July 2019 - 06:04 AM, said:

How long is the new big box run going to run for anyway?



You could also wait for the price increase.

Unlimited. Of course being realistic don't expect it to last years.

[MusicallyInspired]

Sweet. Then perhaps I'll be able to get one yet. I will regret not getting the old box design and the floppy USB drive, though. I had thought it would be the same package just with less feelies. But the change makes sense.

[Master O]

Question for the Eduke32 devs:

After August 15th, what will be the statuses of the other games to be added to Eduke32? For example, Redneck Rampage and Shadow Warrior?

Also, will Ion Fury be natively supported in regular standalone eduke32 builds after that date?

[Jimmy]

TerminX, on 17 July 2019 - 06:55 PM, said:

You can still do Duke3D-style levels in IF, though. Most of the effects originally used in Duke3D work exactly the same as they always did and nothing prevents anyone from making maps that only use those simpler effects.

Remember, AHB and Levelord made the levels in World Tour using Mapster32 and it had been 20 years since they had touched the original DOS version of the editor. I think you are underestimating what people who are determined to make something can do.

You aren't wrong about the interface in general, however. Maybe if IF sells well enough that making another game on the engine seems worthwhile we can put some of the revenue toward a UI rework.

I think this attitude people have is largely nonsense anyhow. Duke Nukem 3D is still the easiest game in the world to mod for and I challenge anyone to prove me wrong. The only real difficulties arise because of things that are undocumented. That's our only real setback. I used BUILD when I was like ten years old, and I'm not a genius by any means. There are quality of life improvements that could be made across the board but with like ten minutes of research you can get to work modding this game in every way imaginable.

[MusicallyInspired]

Yeah, even despite not having really truly mastered the Mapster32 controls to this day, I can still whip up something after a long hiatus of never using it that would look way better and be far easier to make than if I loaded up Hammer and had a go at it. Or Unreal. Or Unity (I've never tried it). Or whatever Quake/2 uses nowadays (Hammer as well?).

[Micky C]

BlitZ, on 18 July 2019 - 12:33 PM, said:

Duke Nukem 3D is still the easiest game in the world to mod for and I challenge anyone to prove me wrong.

What about Doom? Although I note you specifically said modding, not mapping, and I'm not too familiar with Doom's modding workflow.

I thought a lot of the tools available for Duke modding, such as art file editors, are fairly old and outdated? Not to mention, aren't there lots of little hard-coded issues which can make things more complicated? I'm not sure how far the eduke standalone builds go to address this.

[Jimmy]

How are you going to try to refute me when you don't even know what you're talking about? I've modded for both games. Duke3D is still easier despite lack of documentation and "old and outdated" tools. Just because something is old doesn't mean it doesn't work.

[Micky C]

Because the discussion has predominantly been about mapping, and I would have thought that mapping for Doom would have been faster and easier due to the simpler engine. Creating a mod requires either additional sets of skills, or coordination with those who have them, which makes it a less straightforward process. The discussion with mapping was in regards to something something you can jump straight into easily and quickly.

[Jimmy]

Modding includes mapping. Doom Builder is way more complicated, it just has more documentation. I'll take Mapster any day of the week.

Also, guys I just noticed that the main page of the forums is still advertising Ion Maiden.

[The Kins]

BlitZ, on 18 July 2019 - 12:33 PM, said:

Duke Nukem 3D is still the easiest game in the world to mod for and I challenge anyone to prove me wrong.

This is normally the bit where I launch into a 20-minute rant about how CON scripting is an abberation towards God, but the bit where there are only like three people on Earth who still actively do it probably says enough.

BlitZ, on 18 July 2019 - 08:04 PM, said:

Modding includes mapping. Doom Builder is way more complicated, it just has more documentation. I'll take Mapster any day of the week.

GZDoom Builder is quite lovely and easy to use, as can be seen by its prodigious output, but BUILD/MAPEDIT/MAPSTER32/etc would be just as effective (possibly more so in some cases) if it weren't for the acknowledged issues that come with having an interface straight out of 1995. The bigger issue, frankly, is adding new art to the game. Existing .ART tools kind of suck, and juggling different copies of TILES014 and TILES015.ART for different maps is painful.

To be fair, though, if you use a tool for however many decades you become used to (and somewhat blind to) certain usability issues that you learn to work around or live with.

[necroslut]

The Kins, on 18 July 2019 - 11:23 PM, said:

This is normally the bit where I launch into a 20-minute rant about how CON scripting is an abberation towards God, but the bit where there are only like three people on Earth who still actively do it probably says enough.

GZDoom Builder is quite lovely and easy to use, as can be seen by its prodigious output, but BUILD/MAPEDIT/MAPSTER32/etc would be just as effective (possibly more so in some cases) if it weren't for the acknowledged issues that come with having an interface straight out of 1995. The bigger issue, frankly, is adding new art to the game. Existing .ART tools kind of suck, and juggling different copies of TILES014 and TILES015.ART for different maps is painful.

To be fair, though, if you use a tool for however many decades you become used to (and somewhat blind to) certain usability issues that you learn to work around or live with.

With EDuke32 you can use per-map art, so you don't have to juggle art files the same way anymore. Makes distribution easier, if nothing else.
Also, yeah, Mapster/Build is really not hard to use, but I guess it looking like a DOS program could make people think it's way more complicated than it really is.

[Master O]

BlitZ, on 18 July 2019 - 12:33 PM, said:

I think this attitude people have is largely nonsense anyhow. Duke Nukem 3D is still the easiest game in the world to mod for and I challenge anyone to prove me wrong. The only real difficulties arise because of things that are undocumented. That's our only real setback. I used BUILD when I was like ten years old, and I'm not a genius by any means. There are quality of life improvements that could be made across the board but with like ten minutes of research you can get to work modding this game in every way imaginable.

https://www.doomworld.com/cacowards/

https://www.doomworld.com/10years/

[Jimmy]

Just because Doom modding is robust does not make it easier. The learning curve is much steeper. CON is so easy a monkey could do it.

[Master O]

BlitZ, on 19 July 2019 - 07:37 AM, said:

Just because Doom modding is robust does not make it easier. The learning curve is much steeper. CON is so easy a monkey could do it.

*imagines the next Geico commercial spoofing that.*

[Tea Monster]

Duke 3D started off with a WYSIWYG editor from shipping. Doom only got one later through the work of community coders.
Although you had to learn a ton of arcane key commands, placing sprites and moving sectors around was relatively child's play and you got immediate feedback as to what your level looked like and if it was usable by the player.
If you printed out Mr. Bishop's Build Guide, then the 'Enter' key was your gateway to a new universe.

[Master O]

Tea Monster, on 19 July 2019 - 10:24 AM, said:

Duke 3D started off with a WYSIWYG editor from shipping. Doom only got one later through the work of community coders.
Although you had to learn a ton of arcane key commands, placing sprites and moving sectors around was relatively child's play and you got immediate feedback as to what your level looked like and if it was usable by the player.
If you printed out Mr. Bishop's Build Guide, then the 'Enter' key was your gateway to a new universe.

It sounds like the Build Engine needs an open-source editor like that...

[Mark]

Maybe in another 5-10 years when this current crop of modders have moved on and the community almost dies. Then someone can spark interest for a whole new generation of modders with their latest and greatest new editor. I can't see myself ever trying to learn a new editor after so many years on Mapster32.

I would prefer to keep patching on small tidbits of features and more importantly, get caught up on all the documentation.