[MrFlibble]

Duke of Hazzard, on 16 April 2014 - 10:43 PM, said:

Monsters have dozens of frames so they're really very hard to create from scratch.

Hmm, isn't making a 3D model first and then creating sprite animation frames from its snapshots at different angles a solution? I understand that 3D modelling isn't easy either but I guess one could find some free 3D models in free/open source gaming resources archives.

[Duke of Hazzard]

MrFlibble, on 18 April 2014 - 04:45 AM, said:

Hmm, isn't making a 3D model first and then creating sprite animation frames from its snapshots at different angles a solution? I understand that 3D modelling isn't easy either but I guess one could find some free 3D models in free/open source gaming resources archives.

Actually, you're right. Wasn't it what id and 3DR did anyway? Though they might still need some touching up to look good on screen.

[Cage]

Duke of Hazzard, on 18 April 2014 - 09:34 PM, said:

Actually, you're right. Wasn't it what id and 3DR did anyway? Though they might still need some touching up to look good on screen.

3DR used 3d models while ID used real life clay and latex models.



Same deal with Blood, you can read about the process here.

[Duke of Hazzard]

Thanks, that was a good read.

[MetHy]

I'm trying to learn mapping for Doom (I'd like to make a small map), but the problem is I can't find a GOOD written tutorial. I'm using doombuilder2 and all I found are some silly youtube videos tutorial, which you will understand is really not convenient, you're not going to watch an hour of video in the chance that it MAY or MAY NOT have the answer to the one thing you're looking for.... and the few written tutorials I found had dead links for screenshots... oh well

If anybody knows, my questions are simple so far : is it possible to shrink/enlarge textures like in Build ? is it possible to align your floor/ceiling textures? Because I can't find out how to do that in Doombuiler2 but now that I think of it, it might not be possible at all? Is there a better mapping program than doombuilder2?

[DustFalcon85]

Scariest. Doom. 64. Track. Ever!


Sleep tight bitches!

[Lunick]

Higher(highest) quality: http://aubreyhodges....level-breakdown

[Duke of Hazzard]

The Doom 64 soundtrack was fantastic. I loved that game, despite missing Revenants and Arch-viles, but they made Arachnotrons more dangerous to compensate (dual cannons), and added Nightmare Imps. Never owned it on actual cart, though (I played the TC for jDoom). The TC was a bit different, it had some extra levels and the first pentagram was in a different level. Took me a while to figure out how to get it.

[TheZombieKiller]

MetHy, on 20 April 2014 - 02:10 AM, said:

I'm trying to learn mapping for Doom (I'd like to make a small map), but the problem is I can't find a GOOD written tutorial. I'm using doombuilder2 and all I found are some silly youtube videos tutorial, which you will understand is really not convenient, you're not going to watch an hour of video in the chance that it MAY or MAY NOT have the answer to the one thing you're looking for.... and the few written tutorials I found had dead links for screenshots... oh well

If anybody knows, my questions are simple so far : is it possible to shrink/enlarge textures like in Build ? is it possible to align your floor/ceiling textures? Because I can't find out how to do that in Doombuiler2 but now that I think of it, it might not be possible at all? Is there a better mapping program than doombuilder2?

Yes, there is a better program than Doom Builder 2, it's called GZDoom Builder, and you can find it here. It's constantly updated and it even has a feature that lets you convert a 3d model to a Doom map.
All Doom Builder 2 tutorials apply to GZDoom Builder because GZDB is built upon Doom Builder 2. Another advantage of GZDB as you can tell from the name, is it's designed for use with GZDoom (a GL version of one of the most popular and the most moddable Doom port, ZDoom)

You can find a bunch of video tutorials on Doom Builder 2 on its website

[MetHy]

Okay thanks; more noob questions if I make a map with gzdoom builder, will it automatically be incompatible with vanilla doom? or only if i use gzdoom only features? here it says "more complete textures support" does that mean I can move ceiling/floor textures around unlike in doombuilder2 and if so will that alone make the incompatible with vanilla doom?

Here is a screenshot of the map I've started making to show that the noob questions and answers won't be for nothing

Attached thumbnail(s)

• 

[TheZombieKiller]

It depends on the format you use. UDMF is not vanilla compatible. UDMF was a standardized text-based format created by a few well-known members of the Doom community. They were well known for the source ports they had created.
If I remember right, GZDoom Builder doesn't ship with configurations for vanilla Doom, however you might get them if you install it over a copy of Doom Builder 2. It will probably give you a bunch of errors or crash if you do it though.

[Striker]

GZDoom Builder does have configs for Vanilla Doom, but they need to be copied over from a subfolder in GZDoom Builder's installation directory.

[Cage]

MetHy, on 20 April 2014 - 06:46 AM, said:

Okay thanks; more noob questions if I make a map with gzdoom builder, will it automatically be incompatible with vanilla doom?

Depends on which map format you use - there are preset configs you can choose (you have to select the IWAD first), at least in the standard Doom builder. Vanilla format is very limiting, so if you're aiming for compatibility with most source ports, use Boom format. I think it's possible to use this map format and still use GZDoom's lights (They will be ignored in other ports), but you can forget about 3d floors for example.

MetHy, on 20 April 2014 - 02:10 AM, said:

If anybody knows, my questions are simple so far : is it possible to shrink/enlarge textures like in Build ? is it possible to align your floor/ceiling textures? Because I can't find out how to do that in Doombuiler2 but now that I think of it, it might not be possible at all? Is there a better mapping program than doombuilder2?

One thing that you have to get used to, is that opposite to Build, in Doom, your textures will most likely stay in 1:1 scale. From what I know, you can't scale textures and align floors in Boom(Unless you place an offset version of the floor texture/"flat" in your wad), Zdoom does though. Not sure how it looks in UDMF, but in the older Zdoom format (Doom in Hexen) aligning floor & ceiling textures was done through scripts. Scaling textures might be possible too, but I'm not sure about that - it's been a while since I've did some actual mapping, but I don't recall such a feature. One thing that I'm sure of, is that you can define a texture with a specific scale in the textures lump, much like defining textures in the .def file.

[MetHy]

Okay thanks.
I've decided to make a map using all the limits of the original engine though, it's very limiting but at least it sort of makes things simpler and easier, since you don't have much choice

[Nukeaholic]

You may find that Choco Render Limits might be useful to you for testing in the vanilla map making process, if you are planning to make a relatively big map in vanilla doom, just to ensure that it will work correctly within the limits. Hope the map making goes well, I still have to get up off my arse and finish my maps.

[RunningWild]

Good recent article on the original Doom :

http://www.newstates...ing-better-doom

[MrFlibble]

RunningWild, on 23 April 2014 - 10:55 PM, said:

Good recent article on the original Doom :

http://www.newstates...ing-better-doom

That's definitely one well-written article there.

[MrFlibble]

Here's a nice one with custom textures and music (apparently it's vanilla compatible, even):


Doomworld forum thread and download links

[MetHy]

MrFlibble, on 01 May 2014 - 04:45 AM, said:

Here's a nice one with custom textures and music (apparently it's vanilla compatible, even):
*Back To Saturn X*

I played that one and remember enjoying it a lot.
Aren't the new textures actually created from scratch by the makers of the wad, too ? (Not sure...)

[Cage]

MetHy, on 01 May 2014 - 05:04 AM, said:

I played that one and remember enjoying it a lot.
Aren't the new textures actually created from scratch by the makers of the wad, too ? (Not sure...)

The textures were made mostly by a single guy IIRC.

And yes, you can run BTSX with vanilla Doom2.exe Pretty cool, one of the team members told me that vanilla compatibility really prolonged they're development though.

No idea how's the progress on Episode 2 and 3, the released version is only the first part.

[Tea Monster]

Duke of Hazzard, on 18 April 2014 - 09:34 PM, said:

Actually, you're right. Wasn't it what id and 3DR did anyway? Though they might still need some touching up to look good on screen.

If it's good enough for Id and 3D Realms, it's good enough for you.

[Cage]

I'm not the first one to notice that enemy sprites in Total Meltdown are different to those in Duke, I suspect those are the actual, raw rendered frames without cleanup. Not sure why they did this, maybe the monster frames were cleaned up already in 256 colors and they wanted them true color - the actual sprites are still color reduced but I think that each monster just uses it's own palette.

Comparison:


Take note the recon car is scaled differently in Duke3d sprite - I suspect those sprites were rendered in standard 4:3 resultion and this one was scaled to work better in 320x200 which isn't 4:3

Also, a cleanup/paint over example out from my own yard

[Lunick]

I like most of the Total Meltdown sprites but the Octabrain looks just terrible in that port.

[Daedolon]

I never even realized everything looks that much better, makes me more excited for a full TM mod.

[Tea Monster]

I did the body and CG Phantom did the head. The Mech bits haven't been done yet.

[Fox]

Cage, on 03 May 2014 - 12:17 AM, said:

I'm not the first one to notice that enemy sprites in Total Meltdown are different to those in Duke, I suspect those are the actual, raw rendered frames without cleanup. Not sure why they did this, maybe the monster frames were cleaned up already in 256 colors and they wanted them true color - the actual sprites are still color reduced but I think that each monster just uses it's own palette.

Comparison:


Take note the recon car is scaled differently in Duke3d sprite - I suspect those sprites were rendered in standard 4:3 resultion and this one was scaled to work better in 320x200 which isn't 4:3

They just re-rendered the sprites using the original models. Also the resolution has been decreased in the Sentry Drone and Battlelord sprites.

Compare the Octabrain colors to this image:

[Lunick]

http://www.doomworld...usdoom-revival/

Hocus Pocus Doom

[MusicallyInspired]

Sooooooo awesome!!

[Cage]

For those interested in using Doom engine for their own games:
http://vectorpoem.com/deck/

[MetHy]

I've been playing the 2nd episode of Going Down, the wad that gave me the idea for Duke Hard.

I have to say I'm pretty disappointed by the 2Nd episode so far. The 'going down a building' feeling is completely lost, and it's basically just a collection of conceptual slaughtermaps all based on the same square-sized map limit. There are some nice ideas but I'm just too tired of fighting 200 to 300 enemies per map in such cramped space.

The 'gladiator' map was a lot of fun though. Basically you're thrown in an arena with demons as spectators and have to fight wave after wave of enemies.