[Ninety-Six]

in defense of the BFG edition's ports, they had a much better quickswitch mapping on console than the unity ones.

Otherwise yeah it's inferior to just about everything (and that was the first time I played Doom, incidentally).

[NightFright]

My condolences. That's not how it's meant to be played. I was lucky enough to experience the original versions under DOS still, with a Pentium 60, 8 MB RAM, a VGA monitor and a Soundblaster with OPL synthesis. One should try to get as close to that setup as possible, ideally with Chocolate or Crispy Doom. After that, it doesn't really matter what you use.

[Ninety-Six]

Eh...

I had an original Doom 2 CD growing up. I also had Duke Nukem 3D. One was infinitely more playable than the other.


I suppose I should clarify: the BFG Edition was the first time I actually bothered to play Doom past the first two minutes.

[NightFright]

I tried the Doom 2 Unity port today. Downloaded TNT Evilution, launched it and... crashed to desktop.

Yeah, this thing ain't quite finished yet. It's probably good enough for the regular campaigns, but that's it. I'll stay with GZDoom/Crispy Doom.

[MusicallyInspired]

It doesn't crash on consoles. Least not in my experience.

[NightFright]

Well, I gotta add it worked the second time I tried, so it was probably some kind of glitch that couldn't be reproduced.

BTW I made a small patch for (G)ZDoom which adds most of the Unity assets (widescreen menu gfx, medpacks with green cross, changed Wolfenstein textures, edited WolfSS sound and secret found sound). Like this you can have most of the visual changes (except for the weapon wheel and autoaim crosshair, even though it could be possible with some ZScript coding) while using original (non-Unity) IWADs. If there is any interest in it, I guess I can upload it here (size is under 1MB). It would work for all Doom-based games (Doom 1+2, Plutonia, TNT).

[MusicallyInspired]

That's pretty neat!

[NightFright]

Patch is attached. You may rename the ending to .pk3 if you wish, but it's not necessary. It should load fine in GZDoom the way it is.

What's included:

Quote

1) Widescreen menu graphics
[ALL] STBAR (statusbar), DMENUPIC (BFG Edition menu background, unused)
[DOOM] CREDIT, ENDPIC, HELP1, INTERPIC, PFUB2, TITLEPIC, VICTORY2, WIMAP0, WIMAP1, WIMAP2
[DOOM2] BOSSBACK, CREDIT, HELP, INTERPIC, TITLEPIC
[PLUT/TNT] BOSSBACK, INTERPIC, TITLEPIC

2) Textures
[DOOM2] WOLF2, WOLF3, WOLF4, WOLF6, WOLF7, WOLF17 (Wolfenstein swastika replacements)

3) Sprites
[ALL] MEDIA0, PSTRA0, STIMA0 (Health packs with green cross)

4) Sounds
[ALL] DSSECRET ("Secret found" sound)
[DOOM2] DSSSSIT (Censorship for WolfSS "Schutzstaffel!" sighting sound)

If you don't want the Wolfenstein censorship, feel free to remove the following dirs and their content:
- filter\doom.id.doom2\patches
- filter\doom.id.doom2\sounds

Attached File(s)

•  doom_unity.zip (960.22K)
  Number of downloads: 85

[NightFright]

Small update for the pack. I had used graphics taken from the ZDoom forums for TNT and Plutonia before since I was unable to find the downloaded wads from the Steam release. Now the proper widescreen images are included (which are slightly better).

Attached File(s)

•  doom_unity.zip (933.72K)
  Number of downloads: 103

[NightFright]

So guys, what do you think about Microsoft buying Bethesda? Future Doom games maybe also via MS Store on PC, Doom/Wolfenstein might go XBox exclusive on console? What could this mean?

Especially PS5 fans won't be happy with this. On PC however it could mean that the Bethesda launcher finally dies, which can only be a good thing.

[jkas789]

NightFright, on 21 September 2020 - 07:52 AM, said:

So guys, what do you think about Microsoft buying Bethesda? Future Doom games maybe also via MS Store on PC, Doom/Wolfenstein might go XBox exclusive on console? What could this mean?

Especially PS5 fans won't be happy with this. On PC however it could mean that the Bethesda launcher finally dies, which can only be a good thing.

I don't like it. More and more we are starting to see console companies acquiring high profile studios, and that can't end well. I think it could lead to the scummy practices that Disney uses to "protect" their IP and the way they release their games (the famous Disney Vault). Also I can see Microsoft cannibalizing devs from Bethesda/iD/whoever to help develop their own first party games like Halo, Fable, etc.

It could be good to PC gamers but on the whole I don't think Console makers should have more power than they already do.

Also I'll take this moment to thank you for the Fullscreen Statusbar Mod. That mod is the tits.

[NightFright]

They are not going to sever the connections to Sony right away, anyway. Doom Eternal for the PS5 is going to happen. The whole announcement is strategically placed before the XBox Series X pre-orders start on Sep 22.

Glad that you like the statusbar mod. Lately it's mostly due to 3saster that the whole project became so versatile and flexible. We will still implement that system clock and Strife support, then it's probably just about getting it to work with as many pwads out there as possible.

[jkas789]

I'm more worried about the effect being a first party developer will have on Bethesda in matters of game design. As a skyrim/fallout NV/4 modder it was already difficult wrangling with the Creation Kit, never mind that the appearance of the Creation Club looms like an ugly shadow of what could become in regard to modding for ES6. Not that I think modders being able to gain money of their hard work is a bad thing. But the community has always benefitted of Bethesda being as hands off as it has always being. There has being some involvement over the years and it is clear that they have taken a lot of inspiration from mods the community has made over the years. However I fear that the current parlor like mod community will become even more closed off in regarding to sharing knowledge/innovation and assets as monetization enters the fray.

In regards to Doom my fears lie with microsoft turning it into a "life service". Fuck that. Destiny 1 & 2 were broken because of that idea.

Also very excited for future updates to all the mods you are involved with.

[Ninety-Six]

RIP Id software 1991-2020

[ImmanuelCunt]

John Carmack: "I think Microsoft has been a good parent company for gaming IPs, and they don’t have a grudge against me, so maybe I will be able to re engage with some of my old titles."

[ck3D]

jkas789, on 21 September 2020 - 08:06 AM, said:

I don't like it. More and more we are starting to see console companies acquiring high profile studios, and that can't end well. I think it could lead to the scummy practices that Disney uses to "protect" their IP and the way they release their games (the famous Disney Vault). Also I can see Microsoft cannibalizing devs from Bethesda/iD/whoever to help develop their own first party games like Halo, Fable, etc.

Most often, in other creative fields than gaming, when that type of behavior manifests itself (a handful of entities enforcing a monopoly of sorts on a market by purchasing every recognizable, established productive outlet), the direct consequence is the independent scene blowing up to the point of becoming a legit parallel industry (while on their end, the old timers fossilize), eventually resulting in a renewal of the scene, as though such situations allow some leeway for the passing of the torch. Hopefully, I guess in the relatively long term, that means more shine for indie developers with new games good enough for their quality to do all the talking.

[Ninety-Six]

I'm just waiting for the AAA market crash at this point. Call me a pessimist but I don't see id or Bethesda remaining successful under Microsoft. Bethesda already has a lot of baggage and, quite honestly, that Zenimax or Bethesda let id get this far without meddling in their affairs is a miracle. I don't know where Carmack's been sleeping but Microsoft has been extremely consumer-hostile for the past decade and a half, to the point of trying to kill their own OS as a gaming platform in favor of Xbox. The very same platform that id themselves proved were an untapped and lucrative market back in the 90s (granted it was DOS but still: id proved PCs were able to not only match consoles of the time, but later to also completely outperform them).

I don't see good things in this future, and probably after the two Eternal DLCs come out I expect id, its super pro-consumer attitude and lack of fear to experiment with their games to be stamped out in favor of the usual focus group bullshit and live service crap, so I hope everyone liked Doom 4's multiplayer because that's probably going to be Doom's future from now on.


hip hip hooray

[NightFright]

Well, I certainly dislike how id decided to handle the Quake franchise. Turning it into a multiplayer only series was the worst decision ever. Such a waste, especially when looking at Quake Champions. Didn't turn into a big hit and isn't even finished yet, after all these years.

Hard to tell if Doom will thrive under MS supervision, but things for Quake can only improve. Even if they just kill it off and put it out of its misery.

[Ninety-Six]

I think part of the problem is that the Quake "series" is not a series at all, but a name given to essentially three different games and their sequels. Champions is just the sequel to Arena.

I can't comment on Champions itself, but as far as the brand being a confused mess, that was a mistake id made long before Bethesda bought them.

[Morpheus Kitami]

Funny thing is, I can't really think of a good reason for Microsoft to buy Bethesda. Sure, TES6 is going to be hyped up and Skyrim is probably the biggest selling RPG of all time, but that's probably not going to increase their sales by more than a couple of million for the Xbox whatever. I feel like they're just getting a bit of redundancy in their line-up. Most of Bethesda's bread and butter isn't terribly different than the usual dudebro stuff Microsoft has...or had, I haven't touched an Xbox that wasn't the original. They already have Halo, they already have Obsidian (and Inxile!), and any other games from Bethesda aren't really going to matter, unless I'm forgetting something.
I legitimately don't see this working out in anyone's favor, except for the people who'll get a nice paycheck out of this.

[NightFright]

It's gonna sell XBox's once future Doom/Quake/Wolfenstein/etc titles won't appear on any other console any more. PC users might profit from the death of the Bethesda launcher, but other than that, it should be business as usual. More interesting is whether Bethesda will be allowed to continue existing as a "brand"/studio or they will put the MS logo everywhere from now on.

[Danukem]

NightFright, on 21 September 2020 - 10:00 PM, said:

It's gonna sell XBox's once future Doom/Quake/Wolfenstein/etc titles won't appear on any other console any more.

It's more likely that there will be a console exclusivity window, which will still help XBox sales a lot but not deprive ID of all other console revenue.

[Malgon]

I have to admit that I am genuinely suprised by this announcement. I really have no idea how this will pan out and whether it will be a benefit or a detriment to the franchises and players across consoles and PC. Just wow.

[Balls of Steel Forever]

Danukem, on 21 September 2020 - 10:13 PM, said:

It's more likely that there will be a console exclusivity window, which will still help XBox sales a lot but not deprive ID of all other console revenue.

Square Enix typically does this because console sales usually yield alot more profit for them then pc due to playerbase (jrpg gamers are mainly console gamers)
and also pc sells decrease naturally due to pirating.

Square has proven itself more then capable of releasing pc games on time if they choose to but for their main titles almost never.

I could very well see microhard-on doing the very same with timed exclusivity deals and not give the time and release it two years later for money
as that somehow works for square enix.

[Ninety-Six]

Apparently REKKR was added as an official add-on. That's neat.


I don't know how I feel about REKKR quality-wise as I haven't played it yet, but in my experience the TCs of the Doom community have a slightly better track record when it comes to being fair.

[NightFright]

I played REKKER twice and it is truly magnificient. A must-play.

[jkas789]

ck3D, on 21 September 2020 - 12:35 PM, said:

Most often, in other creative fields than gaming, when that type of behavior manifests itself (a handful of entities enforcing a monopoly of sorts on a market by purchasing every recognizable, established productive outlet), the direct consequence is the independent scene blowing up to the point of becoming a legit parallel industry (while on their end, the old timers fossilize), eventually resulting in a renewal of the scene, as though such situations allow some leeway for the passing of the torch. Hopefully, I guess in the relatively long term, that means more shine for indie developers with new games good enough for their quality to do all the talking.

Counter argument: The only industry that has happened successfully is the comics industry.

[ck3D]

jkas789, on 23 September 2020 - 02:59 AM, said:

Counter argument: The only industry that has happened successfully is the comics industry.

I don't think that's true, I can think of several examples in music, cinematography and several more niche art forms I dabble in, some professionally (just to say it's something I've actually studied). It just takes different forms, but the process is the same, I think it's a general pattern. Shop windows are only so attractive to people looking for something sincere, they'll make do with it for the lack of anything else under their radar but as soon as something actually substantial comes up that resonates with their needs, most often they will go that way. Regardless of context, the key is getting their attention, something damn near impossible in a world clouded with commercial bullshit but that tends to be made easier in times of deep cultural crisis.

[Jimmy]

jkas789, on 23 September 2020 - 02:59 AM, said:

Counter argument: The only industry that has happened successfully is the comics industry.

>comics
>successful

I mean maybe 30 years ago. The movies have all but killed comics.

[jkas789]

NightFright, on 18 September 2020 - 01:18 AM, said:

Small update for the pack. I had used graphics taken from the ZDoom forums for TNT and Plutonia before since I was unable to find the downloaded wads from the Steam release. Now the proper widescreen images are included (which are slightly better).

I have been using the mod in vanilla doom on LZDoom and there seems to be a weird graphical glitch in the level end slides. Got no ideea whats going on there but the widescreen pictures looks so good compared to the ones in vanilla Doom.

Quote

I mean maybe 30 years ago. The movies have all but killed comics.

The movies didn't killed comics. I don't want to get political but woke comic writers killed comics. The amount of thrash they have produced over the years has being incredible to watch. EG: Gotham High.

It's come to the point thata all my favourite comic book heroes have been neutered, and the art is something that you only saw on tumblr some 10 years ago.

Truly manga is the spiritual successor to the comic industry. Now if only twitter could keep their dirty hands off it that would be nice.