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Doom 3: BFG Edition  "PC, 360, and PS3."

User is offline   Martin 

#151

Just found out that the PS3 retail version has load times that are between 45-50 seconds long. To me, this is completely unacceptable. Regardless of the fact that it's an old game. I wouldn't even play Crysis 3 if it had load times that long. Factoring in the "it's an old game" thing - what the fuck, id? There's a video going about whereby if you've bought the game off PSN, it has much better load times of 10-12 seconds. However, I don't like buying digitally-distributed stuff when there's a physical copy available. Apparently the PS3 version has no mandatory or optional install. This would be fine if load times where acceptable. COD doesn't install anything, but load times are near-instantaneous. Not sure if the 360 version has such bad load times. There are glitches pertaining to blood splatters not appearing after loading a save (all versions), and bullet holes/smoke/particles being lessened/not appearing while using the heart in RoE (all versions).

Thank god for the internet! I really wanted to get this, and I wanted to get it on PS3. Those load times are totally inexcusable, and I don't think being redirected to the digitally-distributed version via PSN is an acceptable alternative. 1) I like my games to be physical products where possible, and 2) most people shy away from PSN copies since they cost more than physical ones in store. Thus, most PS3 Doom 3-ers will have the game on disc. Therefore most of them are being presented with insufferable load times. I'm hearing that there's no options to remap controls, which is another drag.

All-in-all, I'm very disappointed in this. As I say, thank fuck for the internet! Where it not for that, I'd have bought it by now. For me to buy this, id will need to patch the game up to the following standard;

- Vastly-improve loading times on the PS3 retail version. Slow BD read-times are not an excuse. This game is old as the hills. MW3 from a year back loads in an instant from the Blu-ray whilst installing nothing to the HDD. Why can't Doom 3? Most embarrassingly for id - Vicarious Visions delivered much shorter load times in Doom 3 on the original Xbox.

- If this means including an install option, so be it.

- Fix the blood glitches and stuff. Can't be having issues with blood splatters not appearing in a game like Doom 3.

Colour me disappointed.
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User is offline   Kathy 

#152

It seems id just can't get a break from Rage and onward. What could have been easier than to make a remaster to an 8 year old game and yet they still blew it. They blew it on PC, blew it on consoles. We just need Doom 4 to seal the deal that id lost it completely.
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User is offline   Commando Nukem 

  • Judge Mental

#153

View PostBurnett, on 19 October 2012 - 04:59 PM, said:

It doesn't.


Actually, it does. See, he was talking about his opinion.

View Posts.b.Newsom, on 19 October 2012 - 07:38 PM, said:

I still think this is the stupidest representation of modern gaming. Really? There are few games like this and they are all first person shooters. First person games that is ether made by EA or....Activision. Yeah trying to think of another publisher. Quake wouldn't be like that if it was made today, why? because it would of been made by ID, not Raven Software which Quake 4 was done by. Doom 3 was by no means like that either. Very indepth game for coming from a very simple game design. If you want dumbed down, Doom would be just that if it was made inch by inch identical. Why? Because all Doom was, was a bunch of monsters with terrible AI, either patrolling a set path or standing alone until it see's the player. The original doom is more like modern gaming than you think. It was simple, easy to play. Only difference was the difficulty. Difficulty, not gameplay.


Wrong. Doom featured exploration, it did not hold your hand. You got hints, and in later levels if you were a freaking idiot the game would kill your ass dead, and i'm not talking monsters closets either. I'm talking literal pits of freaking death. You had to hunt for keys, hunt for secrets, stock up on ammo, deal with ever increasing hordes of monsters both in size, and variation. You weren't just dealing with "random bad dudes with guns." There were strategies to dealing with various enemies based on the weapons that you had. Hell, you even had the option pretty much all the time to backtrack the entire map if you needed to avoid enemies and get ammo. Doom monsters never patrolled paths.

Call of Duty, Duke Forever, Halo, etc. are the genuinely simplistic games. Limited arsenals, virtually no inventory at all. (Not even "rudimentary" keys in most instances), one direction level design all the time, constant interruption by scripted events (Which is NOT progress, it is regression. Taking the control out of the players hands is not a good thing. I'm okay with a script event here and there, as long as it's handled in the Half-Life way, where the player does not lose direct control of the character as the events are unfolding. ).

On those terms, Doom is and always will be the better game. It is 100% game. It demands your full attention. Pay attention to my level design damnit. I'm hiding weapons and ammo. Pay attention when you open new doors, lord knows what might be ahead. I'm glad that more people see the genius of older games, see beyond the limited pixels and the simple AI and see onto the complexity that comes from direct-connect gameplay. There is no bullshit getting between you and the action. Sometimes, yeah, I like a nice story. Sometimes, yeah, having all those scripted events, uber-detailed environments, and conversations is a lot of fun. But you know what? Sometimes I want to be a space marine, one of Earth's toughest, hardened in combat and trained for action. Zdoom, FTW. Eduke32, FTW. Darkplaces, FTW. KMQuake2, FTW.

The FPS games that deserve far more celebration? The original Far Cry, Serious Sam 3, Deus Ex Human Revolution, and Wrack. Games that embrace the slogan that some of the old school 3DR guys used to use "Making the player a real agent for change in the world."




This post has been edited by Commando Nukem: 20 October 2012 - 02:38 PM

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User is offline   Inspector Lagomorf 

  • Glory To Motherland!

#154

View PostCommando Nukem, on 20 October 2012 - 02:37 PM, said:

On those terms, Doom is and always will be the better game.



I can't emphasize this strongly enough. Making a great experience is one thing, but having a game with gameplay so great that it has replay value is, I think, what elevates a game to legendary status. There are games that I play over and over again, and then there are games that I simply do not return to after the first playthrough.

I just played DooM again yesterday.
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User is online   Micky C 

  • Honored Donor

#155

Yeah, just because newer games have "more advanced IA" does NOT mean they are more fun to fight. For example, I found the AI in DNF really annoying: Troopers teleport in for half a second, shoot you, then disappear for 5 seconds (only to repeat over and over..), octabrains can redirect all the half decent weapons you fire at them back at you IN ADDITION to having a very hard to dodge attack (these aren't too bad by themselves but make a bad combination), and the pigcops can jump at you from really far away and do an incredible amount of melee damage in one hit.

I haven't played Doom 3 but I tried Quake 4 and the enemies weren't that fun either.

View Posts.b.Newsom, on 20 October 2012 - 11:55 AM, said:

I thought the game was $29.99 on steam? *facepalm*

EDIT: Confirmed. Its 29.99 not 39.99.


Like Lunick confirmed, in Australia it is $40, which is retarded and fucking pisses me off. The Australian dollar is STRONGER than the US dollar so it should be cheaper. Hell I'd be happy to pay $30 US dollars for a decent game if that's what the US people were paying, but that's not the case. I had to pay $100 for DNF when it first came out... in future I'll be a lot more careful with my money.
1

User is offline   Kathy 

#156

View PostCommando Nukem, on 20 October 2012 - 02:37 PM, said:

Actually, it does. See, he was talking about his opinion.

Yeah, no shit. And in my opinion linking to this video was pretty idiotic since there were no changes made in BFG edition that were being ridiculed in this video(except maybe graphics option). So I can't really say what point of his "what if Doom3 was done today" opinion this video was going to get across.

This post has been edited by Burnett: 20 October 2012 - 04:46 PM

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User is offline   Bloodshot 

#157

I think good AI can make enemies more fun to fight, but it depends on what type of gameplay you want. Some of the most enjoyable firefights I've had in games besides doom were against say, the soldiers in Half-Life and in FEAR, and how they would constantly try to trick and outwit you, or the Skaarj in Unreal, how they would dodge your projectiles, get help from others nearby, and fake their death to try and trick the player and then attack him later on. Hell, even in the Quake mod Nehahra, the AI was redesigned to be able to navigate multiple vertical levels of any user map to track the player down rather then being confined to one area because they normally can't use buttons/lifts/etc.

It really depends on what I'm in the mood for. If i'm in the mood to gib the fuck out of things, Doom (and brutal doom), Quake 1, and Duke3D never get old, but sometimes I'm in the mood for a completely different gameplay experience, and good AI can sometimes satisfy that, especially in atmospheric and scary games.

On topic, I really do like Doom 3. I hated it after my first time playing it but in subsequent playthroughs I liked it a lot.

This post has been edited by Bloodshot: 20 October 2012 - 04:51 PM

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User is online   Lunick 

  • Snazzy Ex Tazzy

#158

Yay my decision was idiotic :)

I mainly wanted to get the Graphics On/Off part of that video and wanted to sort of say that I think id Software are never going to be the same with all their decisions lately.

I'm not sure if I want Doom 4 now unless they really listen to the response and criticism of this 'port' 'hd remastered' whatever you want to call it.
2

User is offline   Kathy 

#159

Well, they are surely going down that path. Rage with its graphics settings(and eventual problems because of that) was a disgrace.

This post has been edited by Burnett: 20 October 2012 - 05:00 PM

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User is offline   Bloodshot 

#160

I want Doom 4 to be good.

But with Id's design choices lately, and with Zenimax/Bethesda owning them I seriously doubt Doom 4 will even be remotely reminiscent of the early Dooms and Quakes.

Though I still have hope that they could at least make the gunplay fun, do something like brutal Doom just with modern tech and no reliance on gimmicky cover mechanics (or mechanics that force you into cover). Oh well, I guess I'll just have to wait and see.
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User is offline   thatguy 

#161

View PostCommando Nukem, on 20 October 2012 - 02:37 PM, said:


The FPS games that deserve far more celebration? The original Far Cry, Serious Sam 3, Deus Ex Human Revolution, and Wrack. Games that embrace the slogan that some of the old school 3DR guys used to use "Making the player a real agent for change in the world."




Nice you said I was wrong and just listed out games that are modern but don't fall into the Call of Duty realm. http://forums.duke4.net/public/style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif

Please ignore Portal 2, Left 4 Dead, STALKER, Metro 2033, etc. Also it seams First Person Shooters define a generation of gaming....hmmm, no third person? Rpgs? Sims? Oh, more bias. Hmmmm, smart argument. I still stand by my strong argument on how stupid that video was.

Wah wah wah. The game has a tutorial. For a lot of games after the tutorial, they no longer hold your hand. Oh, please ignore that because TUTORIALS SUCK. /sarcasm

This post has been edited by s.b.Newsom: 20 October 2012 - 07:44 PM

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User is offline   Martin 

#162

For reference, I just loaded up Xbox1 Doom 3 on my 360. Emulated on 360, loading a save from the main menu takes bang-on 15 seconds (timed it with a stopwatch!). How can this be? I've been doing further reading on the PS3 loading times problem, and apparently a patch (1.01) has been issued. I see one guy posting that since the patch, his load times are 15-20 seconds. So on a par with Xbox1 Doom 3 emulated on 360. I'll take it over minute-long ones.
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User is online   Lunick 

  • Snazzy Ex Tazzy

#163

The loading times on PC are better than the original Doom 3 for me which I like a lot.

EDIT: Oh dear...


This post has been edited by Lunick: 20 October 2012 - 11:07 PM

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User is offline   Mikko 

  • Honored Donor

#164

View PostCommando Nukem, on 20 October 2012 - 02:37 PM, said:

Call of Duty, Duke Forever, Halo, etc. are the genuinely simplistic games.


So is Doom. Even the much-applauded maps are generic.

Call of Duty will be considered a classic just as Doom is considered a classic.
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User is offline   Fox 

  • Fraka kaka kaka kaka-kow!

#165

Frankly I don't think that is the case. Games like Call of Duty are just a fashion, and every year there is a new game that will replace it. Which is the opposite of a classic, something that lasts.
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User is offline   Mikko 

  • Honored Donor

#166

Call of Duty is not just fashion. It's a very influential franchise that has set new standards throughout the industry, which is exactly what Doom did back in the days. Its influence will be felt for many years to come but in time it will seem as distant as Doom does today.
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User is offline   Engel220 

#167

View PostFox, on 21 October 2012 - 05:31 AM, said:

Frankly I don't think that is the case. Games like Call of Duty are just a fashion, and every year there is a new game that will replace it. Which is the opposite of a classic, something that lasts.


Thing is, though, DOOM became more or less an instant classic, and CoD could go the same way. I mean nobody will forget the name 'Call of Duty' anytime soon, and while I personally don't think it'll ever be a classic series, mainstream reviewers and CoD supporters will basically make it into one. DOOM has lasted because it has a lot going for it, CoD doesn't in comparison, but to use an old quote, "History is written by the victor", and 'Call of Duty' has won many awards and gotten a lot of praise even if it was mostly undeserved.

This post has been edited by Engel220: 21 October 2012 - 05:51 AM

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User is offline   Zagro 

#168

Doom 3 BFG Approved For GPL/Open-Source.
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User is offline   MetHy 

#169

Is there an active mapping/modding community for Doom 3 like there is for Doom 1 & 2 ?
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#170

http://www.doom3worl...wforum.php?f=73
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User is offline   Martin 

#171

View PostEngel220, on 21 October 2012 - 05:49 AM, said:

Thing is, though, DOOM became more or less an instant classic, and CoD could go the same way. I mean nobody will forget the name 'Call of Duty' anytime soon, and while I personally don't think it'll ever be a classic series, mainstream reviewers and CoD supporters will basically make it into one. DOOM has lasted because it has a lot going for it, CoD doesn't in comparison, but to use an old quote, "History is written by the victor", and 'Call of Duty' has won many awards and gotten a lot of praise even if it was mostly undeserved.


Not exactly fair, since Doom was right after the birth of the genre. That's like saying no 3D platformer will ever be a classic like Super Mario 64. You might even be right, but then we haven'tplayed a classic game in many years. I consider COD4 as an absolute classic.

*dons flame jacket
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User is offline   Inspector Lagomorf 

  • Glory To Motherland!

#172

"Classic" is such a stupid word. I ignore any professional critic who ever dares to say "classic" in the course of their review.
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User is offline   Kathy 

#173

Call Of Duty has a misfortune of launching every year. CoD4 would have been revered much more if it didn't have 4 games coming out after it every year. Which ironically happened because CoD4 was simply out of bounds popular(same thing happened with Assassin's Creed).
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User is offline   Mikko 

  • Honored Donor

#174

Funnily enough I think all the sequels to CoD 4 are much superior to it. Even more ironic is the fact that MW2 had a superior multiplayer mode because of a console limitation: the player cap ensured that nade spam and people shooting through walls everywhere were absent.
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#175

View PostAchenar, on 21 October 2012 - 08:30 AM, said:

"Classic" is such a stupid word. I ignore any professional critic who ever dares to say "classic" in the course of their review.


Why is the word classic stupid? It makes good sense to me.
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User is offline   Kathy 

#176

View PostMikko_Sandt, on 21 October 2012 - 09:46 AM, said:

Funnily enough I think all the sequels to CoD 4 are much superior to it.

They might be, but they don't feel much different either. Although, I'm judging just by SP.
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User is offline   Engel220 

#177

The official DOOM page on Facebook posted a comparison video between the original version of 3 and the BFG version, bad idea. Both games look the same, minus the amount of shadows on the BFG version. Definitely not the way to sell a product by showing how unimproved it actually is.

This post has been edited by Engel220: 21 October 2012 - 01:15 PM

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User is offline   thatguy 

#178

View PostBurnett, on 21 October 2012 - 09:02 AM, said:

Call Of Duty has a misfortune of launching every year. CoD4 would have been revered much more if it didn't have 4 games coming out after it every year. Which ironically happened because CoD4 was simply out of bounds popular(same thing happened with Assassin's Creed).


You don't compare AC to CoD. Thats a joke.
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User is offline   Kathy 

#179

I didn't compare them.
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User is offline   thatguy 

#180

View PostBurnett, on 21 October 2012 - 12:18 PM, said:

I didn't compare them.


"(same thing happened with Assassin's Creed)."


Thats comparing if you didn't know.


Which is funny because unlike COD, people look forward to the next release of AC, not dreading it.

This post has been edited by s.b.Newsom: 21 October 2012 - 06:35 PM

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