[The Kins]

Trooper Dan, on 26 September 2016 - 11:28 AM, said:

My only quibble is that "Abort" should say "Abort Mission"...otherwise the player will think it means you commit suicide and abort the whole game. Abort Mission just allows you to skip the level in the random missions mode in case you don't like that particular map.

I'm aware of that. I used a frame from the E4 ending because I'm a cheeky sort...

Palleted:


Unpalleted:

[Danukem]

Excellent. If you want to try your hand at creating 8-bit sprite pigcop jibs, that's something that I and probably other modders would use.

[The Kins]

And some smaller buttons.



I'm also toying around with some sounds and other sprites and such, but I haven't properly tested them in-game yet and, you know, I don't want to be too pushy about shoving stuff at you. :V I'll let you know how it goes.

Trooper Dan, on 26 September 2016 - 09:11 PM, said:

Excellent. If you want to try your hand at creating 8-bit sprite pigcop jibs, that's something that I and probably other modders would use.

I can't make any promises, but it's something I might twiddle around with over the next couple of days.

[Danukem]

Here's what the menu looks like with your new icons in place:

[Jblade]

looks pretty damn sweet!

[TheDragonLiner]

Jblade, on 27 September 2016 - 01:20 AM, said:

looks pretty damn sweet!

Thou hath said it noble man !

[Shadow Reborn]

Jblade, on 27 September 2016 - 01:20 AM, said:

looks pretty damn sweet!

Oh yeah! Kudos to The Kins!

[Micky C]

Trooper Dan, on 26 September 2016 - 10:36 AM, said:

That didn't exist when I started this mod back in 2010. Can you link me to the documentation on per-map art loading? That could potentially enable the inclusion of many more maps, in a future update.

I'm the wrong person to ask about that.

Wow, "buy perks"? Since when did WoA get microtransactions?

[Jblade]

All you got to do is rename the map's art file to *MAPNAME*_00 (it can go up to 15 IIRC, so for example you'd rename WHOME.MAP's art tiles to WHOME_00 and WHOME_01 - they have to go in ascending order though)

[Shadow Reborn]

Some feedback: the Mortal Shock map is glitchy and some sectors are not properly connected. Crouching and moving forward through certain door-frames (the bathroom entrances) will cause the player to go through model. I could sometimes make it back with noclip but mostly I had to load.
Also, when the level was finally done, the Score Screen displayed: "The Abyss completed". I must mention the fact that when I finished this level, I had 600.000+ score so the next level was the final boss level.

[TheDragonLiner]

Speaking of which What are the levels intended as final levels ?

I know "WG Space End" and "Suburban Hive" are but are there other levels intended as final levels ?

I'm asking because last time I had my run end with "Demolition Plant" and I recall it not being a final level :/ Also I remember on former installments of the mod having my runs end prematurely but when I reloaded my save and completed the level again it would carry on like normal :\

Oh and lastly is it really 600 000 points for the final level to load ? I thought it was 700 000 ?

[Danukem]

Jblade, on 27 September 2016 - 03:24 AM, said:

All you got to do is rename the map's art file to *MAPNAME*_00 (it can go up to 15 IIRC, so for example you'd rename WHOME.MAP's art tiles to WHOME_00 and WHOME_01 - they have to go in ascending order though)

Thanks. I will try this out!

Shadow Reborn, on 27 September 2016 - 08:05 AM, said:

Some feedback: the Mortal Shock map is glitchy and some sectors are not properly connected. Crouching and moving forward through certain door-frames (the bathroom entrances) will cause the player to go through model. I could sometimes make it back with noclip but mostly I had to load.
Also, when the level was finally done, the Score Screen displayed: "The Abyss completed". I must mention the fact that when I finished this level, I had 600.000+ score so the next level was the final boss level.

Yeah I have known for a long time that there are issues with that map, but if you don't do certain things then you can complete it without glitches. I would fix it if I knew how. The glitched name on the score screen only happens right before the final map and is also a long known bug that I don't know how to fix.

TheDragonLiner, on 27 September 2016 - 10:20 AM, said:

Speaking of which What are the levels intended as final levels ?

I know "WG Space End" and "Suburban Hive" are but are there other levels intended as final levels ?

I'm asking because last time I had my run end with "Demolition Plant" and I recall it not being a final level :/ Also I remember on former installments of the mod having my runs end prematurely but when I reloaded my save and completed the level again it would carry on like normal :\

Oh and lastly is it really 600 000 points for the final level to load ? I thought it was 700 000 ?

Besides WG Space End by WG and Suburban Hive by community, it can also be Moon Base by Iggy. Demolition Plant is definitely not one of them, so that's a bug. And yes, the cutoff is 600000. The code responsible for launching the final map is pretty straightforward, so I don't understand how that happened.

[Shadow Reborn]

Trooper Dan, on 27 September 2016 - 11:00 AM, said:

Yeah I have known for a long time that there are issues with that map, but if you don't do certain things then you can complete it without glitches. I would fix it if I knew how.

I see. Well you could replace it since there are so many good maps waiting on Duke Nukem Repository...

Trooper Dan, on 27 September 2016 - 11:00 AM, said:

The glitched name on the score screen only happens right before the final map and is also a long known bug that I don't know how to fix.

Yeah, I noticed that before but forgot about it since I always assumed that the problem was related to something among the lines of the explanation you provided.

[TheDragonLiner]

I see ... If the bug happens again do you think it will be worth keeping my save and give it to you in case you could figure out a fix from there ?
I did that twice on AMC so I'll prepare my current save just in case the bug happens again ...

BTW I've just tested the saw and it works mighty fine for the time being, though I didn't know you needed to soften an enemy down before you can actually use it but I suppose that's a balance mechanism ... Also I don't know if it's already the case but I may suggest that you can make it so that the probabilities of ammo kind dropped varies depending on the enemy you killed with it ... As in if you kill a Battlelord with the saw then you would have higher chances of dropping RPG/Devastator ammo than with a Trooper .... OR at least make it more probable to loot more ammo than with smaller enemies ... see what I mean ?

BTW I'd also like to suggest another perk idea (I don't know if it had already been suggested though ... Why not make it so that the player can decide to convert ammo he cannot pick into XP ? Obviously he can chose to do so or not like pressing "use" when close to said ammo. And obviously the ammo type would have different values, pistol ammo would grant less than RPG ammo and so on ...

I thought it would be a good idea and a relatively feasible one don't you think ? especially for people who never ever get XP bonus in their runs (happens quite often for me) or reach 600 000 too fast because of too many pick ups in comparison to kills.

[DarkEvilous]

I found this mod a year ago on ModD. When I played it, I couldn't even find the right words to describe how I loved it.
Default levels with weapon and gadget upgrades, alien AI upgrades, perk system, a lot of random high quality fan made maps from cool guys, some excellent game mods and more.
THIS. IS. AMAZING. Definitely the best mod in the world, IMO (no kidding, DN3D is my favorite game of all time).

The only thing I REALLY don't like in War of Attrition is that there are imps from DOOM games. Or just similar ones.
Don't get me wrong: I like the original DOOMs, but I still think there should NOT be any Doom monsters in Duke Nukem games, even if they are changed somehow.
They just don't fit for DN3D. Don't mix them, because Duke looks old and awful with Doom sprites. Maybe, there are people who love those "alien" imps in this mod, but I don't. And I'm sure some guys here will agree with me.

SOLUTION: I am not good at EDuke32, but I suppose it wouldn't be TOO difficult to change those pseudo imps with some sprites of new crafted enemies (I saw some users here making new cool monster sprites) or just use sprites from other Duke games.
You can leave former imps's behavior as it is. I'm 100% sure you don't need to rebuild the whole engine for this small change.

[Danukem]

TheDragonLiner, on 27 September 2016 - 01:32 PM, said:

BTW I'd also like to suggest another perk idea (I don't know if it had already been suggested though ... Why not make it so that the player can decide to convert ammo he cannot pick into XP ? Obviously he can chose to do so or not like pressing "use" when close to said ammo. And obviously the ammo type would have different values, pistol ammo would grant less than RPG ammo and so on ...

The problem with that is that levels with a lot of ammo (such as the original 3DR levels) are already giving the player a big advantage, and that perk would only amplify that advantage, unbalancing the game. Also if the player is "deciding" whether to convert the ammo, that implies he has to make a choice every time he walks over an ammo pickup, which I could see being extremely annoying after a while.

DarkEvilous, on 27 September 2016 - 01:59 PM, said:

I found this mod a year ago on ModD. When I played it, I couldn't even find the right words to describe how I loved it.
Default levels with weapon and gadget upgrades, alien AI upgrades, perk system, a lot of random high quality fan made maps from cool guys, some excellent game mods and more.
THIS. IS. AMAZING. Definitely the best mod in the world, IMO (no kidding, DN3D is my favorite game of all time).

The only thing I REALLY don't like in War of Attrition is that there are imps from DOOM games. Or just similar ones.
Don't get me wrong: I like the original DOOMs, but I still think there should NOT be any Doom monsters in Duke Nukem games, even if they are changed somehow.
They just don't fit for DN3D. Don't mix them, because Duke looks old and awful with Doom sprites. Maybe, there are people who love those "alien" imps in this mod, but I don't. And I'm sure some guys here will agree with me.

SOLUTION: I am not good at EDuke32, but I suppose it wouldn't be TOO difficult to change those pseudo imps with some sprites of new crafted enemies (I saw some users here making new cool monster sprites) or just use sprites from other Duke games.
You can leave former imps's behavior as it is. I'm 100% sure you don't need to rebuild the whole engine for this small change.

Thank you for your kind words, I do appreciate it! As for the cyber-imp: I already have a Duke-styled enemy that I could replace them with. It's not a straight sprite replacement; the new enemy would have different functionality so it would take some work and it would mean throwing away the work done on the imp, but it's probably for the best.

[The Kins]

Trooper Dan, on 27 September 2016 - 05:57 PM, said:

As for the cyber-imp: I already have a Duke-styled enemy that I could replace them with. It's not a straight sprite replacement; the new enemy would have different functionality so it would take some work and it would mean throwing away the work done on the imp, but it's probably for the best.

Another possibility would be to keep the existing Cyber-Imp code, replace the art and sounds with something more appropriate, and put the effort into a new foe.

As for what that "more appropriate" could be, I throw my vote behind Cage's cleaned up Lameduke Trooper.

EDIT: Also from the stockpile thread: Jimmy's 8-bit Pigcop arm gib.

[Danukem]

The Kins, on 28 September 2016 - 12:12 AM, said:

Another possibility would be to keep the existing Cyber-Imp code, replace the art and sounds with something more appropriate, and put the effort into a new foe.

As for what that "more appropriate" could be, I throw my vote behind Cage's cleaned up Lameduke Trooper.

Nah, that trooper prototype that Cage revived looks like it belongs on the cover of a 1950's science fiction novel, not in Duke Nukem. I would be trading one type of out-of-place badguy with another. My plan is to use one of the enemies from Duke Nukem Advance, the two-headed dude seen at 0:50 of this video:


I wrote some basic code for him already, so I would need to add all the Attrition stuff with alt-pals and attack variations etc. I see him as a weak miniboss, a little tougher than a fat commander but weaker than a battlelord.

[FistMarine]

Dan, what do you think of the suggestion I made on previous page, regarding the kamikaze trooper? Is it going to be added in next version or not?

[Danukem]

Here's some pal variations on the two-headed Cybertrooper that I can play around with:



The first one is regular pal 0. Shoots shotguns at close range, mortars and rockets at medium and long range.
The second one is inverted colors (pal 121 using the CLUT pack). I'm thinking some kind of shock/electric attack.
The third one is pal 17 with purple skin. It could have a plasma based attack.
The fourth is pal 26 with grey skin. He will be able to absorb more damage.
The fifth is reddish pal 50 with a fire based attack.
The sixth is greenish, maybe with a poison based attack.
The seventh is the shadowstalker (pal 127 very dark but not black, notice the fullbright eyes are still red) who can turn invisible and teleport I guess.

Just some initial ideas on coding the variations.

[TheDragonLiner]

I found a small glitch regarding the new chainsaw perk :




Basically when you use the saw to kill and enemy while dual wielding pistols (without the double perk) your magazines are filled with extra bullets, so instead of 24 I have at least 30 or so AND on the second pic you can see that having 0 ammo glitches the display up since it shows I have bullets left but not in reality you see ...

Also I noticed that when you kill an enemy with the saw while using a weapon having the "Piercing" upgrade then the enemy behind the one you're sawing will be sawed as well. I was using the pistols level 6 in MoonBase and so I sawed an enforcer and the other enforcer behind him got killed as well while it was technically out of range of the saw.

Unfortunately the bug I reported with Demolition Plant didn't reproduce on my latest run (didn't get that level) since I finished MoonBase with 837 000 or so (very nice run that was (having RPG/Devastator level 6 and Shrinker/Chaingun level 7 and everything else 6))

[Shadow Reborn]

Trooper Dan, on 27 September 2016 - 05:57 PM, said:

As for the cyber-imp: I already have a Duke-styled enemy that I could replace them with. It's not a straight sprite replacement; the new enemy would have different functionality so it would take some work and it would mean throwing away the work done on the imp, but it's probably for the best.

While I agree that the Imp is not really fitting I also think that it is not that bad and having an alt enemy to those Troopers is awesome. I am now used to them and expect them pretty often to appear. You put a lot of work into them creating those variations so I think removing them is not a good idea.

The Kins, on 28 September 2016 - 12:12 AM, said:

Another possibility would be to keep the existing Cyber-Imp code, replace the art and sounds with something more appropriate, and put the effort into a new foe.

That's what I'm talking about!

Trooper Dan, on 28 September 2016 - 12:36 AM, said:

My plan is to use one of the enemies from Duke Nukem Advance, the two-headed dude seen at 0:50 of this video:


I wrote some basic code for him already, so I would need to add all the Attrition stuff with alt-pals and attack variations etc. I see him as a weak miniboss, a little tougher than a fat commander but weaker than a battlelord.

Sound like a plan, Dan! Especially since you've got the pal variations going already! It should be an extra enemy though, besides the Cyber Imp so that your effort for that monster does not go to waste, really!

TheDragonLiner, on 28 September 2016 - 02:54 AM, said:

I found a small glitch regarding the new chainsaw perk :

duke0000.png
duke0001.png

Basically when you use the saw to kill and enemy while dual wielding pistols (without the double perk) your magazines are filled with extra bullets, so instead of 24 I have at least 30 or so AND on the second pic you can see that having 0 ammo glitches the display up since it shows I have bullets left but not in reality you see ...

Also I noticed that when you kill an enemy with the saw while using a weapon having the "Piercing" upgrade then the enemy behind the one you're sawing will be sawed as well. I was using the pistols level 6 in MoonBase and so I sawed an enforcer and the other enforcer behind him got killed as well while it was technically out of range of the saw.

Good rare bugs you found there, TheDragonLiner. Who knows how long they could have slipped by unnoticed.

[TheDragonLiner]

Shadow Reborn, on 28 September 2016 - 03:49 AM, said:

Good rare bugs you found there, TheDragonLiner. Who knows how long they could have slipped by unnoticed.

Thou hath me gratitude ^^

BTW speaking of imps I agree they're still nice to have especially since some of their alternative versions are formidable namely the golden one which shotguns a bunch of duper fast rockets at you it's extremely powerful even if you have 400 APs like I did ! The Green radiation and red hitscan laser variants are also something ...

[Shadow Reborn]

TheDragonLiner, on 28 September 2016 - 04:00 AM, said:

Thou hath me gratitude ^^

BTW speaking of imps I agree they're still nice to have especially since some of their alternative versions are formidable namely the golden one which shotguns a bunch of duper fast rockets at you it's extremely powerful even if you have 400 APs like I did ! The Green radiation and red hitscan laser variants are also something ...

Yeah the radiation Imps are just warm-up for the Super radiation shooting Protector Drones! I just think that the Imps HAVE to stay in the game as they all have unique variations and a lot of work went into them.
The new double-headed monster is certainly a welcome Mini-Boss!
EDIT: A small issue is that the Autosave will never work in levels like Suburban Hive because it is just too full of monsters and Eggs everywhere so the system will never think it is safe to save!

[Danukem]

Shadow Reborn, on 28 September 2016 - 05:04 AM, said:

Yeah the radiation Imps are just warm-up for the Super radiation shooting Protector Drones! I just think that the Imps HAVE to stay in the game as they all have unique variations and a lot of work went into them.

But that's what is known as the "sunk cost fallacy" and it's the reason they have stayed around as long as they have. What I'm actually doing is adding the new monster and removing the code which causes the imps to spawn. They will still exist if I want to bring them back for some reason. EDIT: And yes I saw the report about the pistol/buzzsaw bugs and it should be fixed on my end now.

[TheDragonLiner]

Hey speaking of Imps I remember that back in the days where I was using the HRP along with Attrition the imps were often replaced by a sort of spider which was quite glitchy because autoaim didn't hit it and only explosives were really useful and they were making the same noises as imps, their sprite glitched into Holo-Cycloid head among other things ....


BTW I noticed 4 things in the mod I don't know if they're intentional but 1_ You can use the saw against an enemy behind a forcefield or a transparent that doesn't let attacks go through and even though the saw won't hit the enemy it will still die. 2_ You can saw the holographic enforcer and "kill" it but I think it doesn't give you anything (can't remember accurately) 3_ You can saw a trooper who has cloaked, it looks like nothing happens but he will actually die upon spawning. 4_ Lastly when you have the "Double Damage When Close" perk the sight will turn to a skullhead even when there's no enemy, it looks like it happens especially with steps or when you're close to a place of different height than yours ....

[Danukem]

I got pretty far into adding the new enemy before I left for work today and then I remembered that it doesn't have attack animations for facing any direction other than front. This sucks because in-fighting and converting monsters to allies so that they can fight other monsters (not to mention monsters fighting the player's holoduke bot and allies) is a feature of Attrition. Having him face the wrong way and appear to be attacking the player when fighting other things will look stupid and buggy, so I will be forced to compromise.

[Shadow Reborn]

Trooper Dan, on 28 September 2016 - 05:48 PM, said:

I got pretty far into adding the new enemy before I left for work today and then I remembered that it doesn't have attack animations for facing any direction other than front. This sucks because in-fighting and converting monsters to allies so that they can fight other monsters (not to mention monsters fighting the player's holoduke bot and allies) is a feature of Attrition. Having him face the wrong way and appear to be attacking the player when fighting other things will look stupid and buggy, so I will be forced to compromise.

Oh, creepy to say the least. You could ask jet_nick to work more on the monster if he is willing or simply make him immune to mindgames (no converting to your side by Expander or Perk and ignore DukeBot and still attack you). These are my 2 cents.

[Lunick]

jet_nick didn't make that sprite, it's a Boss monster from Duke Nukem Advance.

[DJHellray]

the pigcop with armor is pretty cool too