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Duke Map/Mod of the Month Club - February 2022  "Two classic styled episodes for this month"

User is offline   FistMarine 

#1

What's this thing?
We play through a set of maps/mods during the month, and use this thread to discuss it as we're still all fresh with our comments/opinions/feelings about the maps.

What's the purpose?
Basically, there are 4 purposes:
  • Showcasing some of the older mods/maps to wider public - they definitely deserve the attention!
  • Getting more people to actually enjoy and appreciate the user content - because let's be honest, over the past 25 years this was really what kept Duke alive after all.
  • ...and while we're at it - keeping Duke alive by still enjoying it, as there's no new games in the franchise on the horizon (and let's be honest, they wouldn't be as good as some of this stuff!).
  • Having a more structurized discussion on maps than what's going in "Last map you played" thread - which is great, but it's basically a monologue most of the time.

Can I join?

Sure, as long as you find some spare time during the month to play the stuff that's on the table!

Why a month?
Because people have lives, jobs or other stuff to do (like mapping). For smaller maps, this could be shorter time - it's all up to debate in the future!

What port should I use? Are mods allowed? Where to get the maps?
It's entirely up to you how you play the game, so you can use whatever port or mod allowed - it would be cool to state in your posts what you're using too, as there might be some slight differences between the ports! As for the maps, they should be always linked within the first post.

How should I play the maps or post about them?
Again, it's up to you. You can finish them all in one go or play them one by one whenever you feel like. On Doom forums, there's a rule that you should keep the pace by not posting about a map that has a higher number than the day of the month, so e.g. on 6th you shouldn't post about map 7 etc. I think that might be a good practice if there's a large interest in this, but first let's see how active the thread is for a start - so if there's nothing going on, feel free to post about whatever map you want to.

Previous editions:


For this month's choices, after a bit of talking privately to Aleks in regards to choosing a second classic episode to go alongside the chosen winner, we have decided for this month to play through two classic short episodes, in total bringing you 12 exciting classic styled maps!

The first is DaikariN, a classic episode 2 replacement, originally released in 2002 at MSDN (the main files are dated 1999, the readme file is 2002, so I assume it was released in 2002) and then later repacked and re-released in 2008 for source ports. This episode is well known among many Duke fans and I'm sure it will be exciting to revisit this classic, 20 years after its original release!

The second is Operation Blitzkrieg, another classic episode 2 replacement, originally released in 2003-2004 (sadly that version, with the exclusive DM maps, was lost forever), after that the author had to remake the episode from scratch and this remake was eventually released in 2011 (on the forums and various other Duke websites), then later re-released/repacked in 2012 by Deeperthought/TrooperDan/Danukem (though I don't know if there's any differences between these two versions or just a repack for convenience with source ports) and finally, another re-release in 2013, with Polymer support added. The episode originally went unnoticed and to this day, there are people who still haven't heard of this classic. Now this is your chance to experience this episode and see what it is all about!

While 12 maps in total may not sound too much even for such a short month, I will make sure to include all versions into the description and you are free to choose the one to your liking. Or if you are brave enough, play through all versions specified in order to fill this month's quota!

What are you waiting for? Download the episodes right now!

Alternatively, you can check NightFright's Addon Compilation and you can play DaikariN and Operation Blitzkrieg (includes both the classic and polymer versions) respectively!

DaikariN
Classic/Original Version (works in DOS Atomic 1.5)
Repack/Re-Release (for JFDuke3D/EDuke32)

Operation Blitzkrieg
Classic/Original Version (works in JFDuke3D at least, though you need to create a shortcut and specify /gOPBLITZ.grp in the command line parameter, then JFDuke3D will pick it up automatically)
Repacked Version (for EDuke32)
Polymer Edition (for EDuke32)

Note: If you are downloading Operation Blitzkrieg from Fileplanet and for some reason (like my PC does with not being able to access certain websites as of lately) it starts downloading an exe file, then cancel the download and try downloading from a different PC as a workaround, to see if you can download the file normally. Or before clicking the download file button, check the link and see where it leads you. Otherwise, don't bother with the "classic/original version" and just use any of the two EDuke32 versions available. I only included the original version for historical purposes (and for the sake of completeness) and had it downloaded in my PC since a year or so ago (before this nonsense with glitched websites started). I am NOT responsible for any damage caused to your computer, so be sure to look out what you download and where you download files from!!!

If anyone is still interested in downloading the original release of Operation Blitzkrieg and can't download it due to reason mentioned above, let me know so I can attach the zip file or alternatively, just download it from MSDN (I checked and it's the original 2011 release, just with an added Install text file to clarify the confusion how to play the episode, as it seems several people had trouble installing/playing the episode back then).

Have fun!

This post has been edited by FistMarine: 01 February 2022 - 05:10 AM

3

User is offline   Ninety-Six 

#2

Seeing as activity is dead this month, and I haven't been able to participate in the past few due to a variety of issues (ongoing is a harddrive issue, but I figured a five-level DOS-compatible episode that I hadn't played before wouldn't really strain the thing much), I decided to play Operation Blitzkrieg. This is one mapset I actually hadn't heard of before, which is the main draw of this communal map playing for me.


Straight honest, I kind of regret it.


As usual, I played with eduke32 and Darkus' CON fixes (with the drone and pigcop behavior restored to as-released), and newly introduced to the standard settings was reaper's palette (the one with the adjusted blues).

First, the good. The level variety was solid, and three of the maps went for locations not visited in the vanilla game, which is something I always appreciate (2 of them used no new art, with the third only using new art for some basic signage). They were also fairly convincing of it. Another thing I liked were how often the levels exploded; destroying buildings with lightshows to go with them reminded me a lot of the vanilla game, and is something I think is often underutilized.


....Yeah that's about all I can think of, and honestly, both of those positives have their caveats. The visuals were kind of flat in terms of lighting, for one. Not to say there wasn't some shading, but for a mapset trying to go vanilla, the long, dark contrasting shadows of the original game were sorely missed. It would have given a lot more visual variety to some of those corridors, which I did find myself lost in once or twice, forcing me to consult the map. Not a game breaker but it definitely missed the mark in that area. I would also consider the outdoor lighting to be...strange. Almost every map used the starry sky background despite the city locales, and yet the lighting outdoors was bright like the city maps. Sure, in vanilla we had Death Row and Toxic Dump, but even their "bright" outdoors had very lengthy and very dark shadows to match. Here, the outdoor areas are just...bright with no reasonable light source to explain them.

And the explosions...... we'll get to those.


As for the negatives.... well, gonna just rip off the band-aid: this episode is bullshit. Tons of enemies get stuffed into tiny rooms and hallways where there is really no way to not get plugged full of holes (or ripped to shreds because 4 newbeasts in a small bathroom is totally not a problem), constantly, always. The ammo balance is poor unless you find almost every secret in a level, as a lot of essential supplies like explosive weapons are hidden away in there and you need them to deal with the bigger threats.

And the traps, good god the traps. It felt like I was playing a Cacoward-winning Doom wad with how often hordes would teleport in and surround me. Those who are familiar with my many rants on the topic will know that what I just said was condemnation rather than praise. It basically felt like the author was telling me to go fuck myself with every room of every level. Honestly by the time I reached the ground floor of the office building on level 5, emerged from a vent into another cluster of bullshit in a tiny room, tried to dodge only to round a corner and get shredded by a battlelord, my frustration peaked and I just engaged god mode. I was done.

I haven't had to turn on godmode in Duke for years. And even then, even with 100% secrets on every level I barely had enough ammo to kill the boss.


At first, I really tried to look at the good. I did, truly. I wanted to believe that it was just me being bad. I wanted to believe I was just having an off day. But by the third time I died because I walked into a tiny room only for it to instantly explode around me without any warning? That's when I knew beyond the shadow of a doubt that I was playing what might be the most player-hostile Duke mod I've seen in so long I can't even remember the last one.

Yeah the explosions are a major problem, too. So many itty-bitty rooms that explode the instant you step your foot through the door, and there's just flat-out nothing you can do about it. Between those and the enemy spawns I spent half my playtime of every level drinking from fountains and toilets to heal damage that I was forced to take.
4

User is offline   FistMarine 

#3

Thanks for joining in, Ninety-Six! You made a very interesting post! I haven't played Operation Blitzkrieg since back when the episode came out (probably played it once or twice around that time) and back then I played on Let's Rock and don't remember having problems with ammo or health in general, plus I don't remember ever getting all the secrets. So I'm curious how it will play after I revisit it after these years.
Also a minor note is that Operation Blitzkrieg is not really DOS compatible (maybe it is or at least the original unreleased version from 2003-2004), the initial public release version from 2011 is JFDuke3D compatible at least (which I just finished last Friday, AFTER I started writing this message in a text document), so I will make a post about that soon. Right now I will be focusing on reviewing DaikariN (repacked version), which I played on JFDuke3D (October 2005 release) on CGS skill.

I was considering to reply earlier but was busy with other games/mods and left Duke3D for a week or so. So let's leave aside Operation Blitzkrieg for now and let's write about Daikarin. Who knows? Maybe it plays better than Operation Blitzkrieg. And I hope the topic will be a bit more active in the following days. Don't want to see this topic dead so quickly, although I understand everyone was busy, so I hope next month's topic will be a bit more active. Either way, let's begin with reviewing Daikarin!

Down In The Kaos
The first map of the episode is probably the best and most memorable one. The author NAILED the Classic Duke3D feeling, this map could have been part of the original game (or at least part of an expansion) and there wouldn't be any complaints. It plays like a lost level from E3 (or E4 actually, as it might have used some Atomic assets).
The balance is spot on. I haven't been so excited in a while when playing classic maps and I hoped/wished the rest of the episode featured more classic maps like this one.
My ONLY complaint is there are a few "in your face" explosions but since health and armor pickups are so plentiful, I will let this slide. The original game had a few in your face explosions as well. :P
There's 8 secrets to find (most are easy to find and it will take me a while to write where each is found, so I will let people discover the secrets themselves) and a couple of them already contain armor (plus an armor non-secret hidden in a tiny compartiment), not to mention the used armor dropped from two pig cops was more than enough to never run out of armor in this map. There's a few atomic health secrets as well.
You are also given TWO jetpack pickups (just like E1L1: Hollywood Holocaust), allowing for a bit of freedom in movement and searching for secrets. Of course there is a reason why you are given the jetpacks in first place, so try to not waste them for nothing. I would suggest to grab the second one at end, after you finished exploring the level and grabbing all the goodies. The map ends with Duke flying on the roof and activating the nuke button.
Overall, this is my favorite map of the entire episode. It was almost flawless and hoped the rest of episode featured more classic city maps! But what we got wasn't too bad, the maps are all around solid!
Attached Image: Daikarin_E2L1_1.pngAttached Image: Daikarin_E2L1_2.pngAttached Image: Daikarin_E2L1_3.png

A Dark Passage
Continuing from the ending of first map, Duke manages to blow up the nearby building and infiltrate inside the building, eventually leading to a teleporter that will send him to a different place.
The difficulty slightly ramps up, as there will be trickier monster placement and you will also have surprise trip mines at some points.
There are also two secrets to be found, on that platform where you will grab the two access cards, go through the walls on both sides and collect the goodies.
The electricity hurts you when you walk through it, even when crouched. Interestingly, if you jump over it, you will take no damage, so I recommend just jumping over it to avoid damage. I'm guessing the floor was actually electrified, due to engine limitations.
When you are done with the map, use the cards to unlock the exit teleporter. Watch out for the Protector Drone that spawns when doing so! Once you kill him and collect all the goodies, you can exit.
Note that the next two maps LACK armor pickups (and they don't contain pig cops either), so make sure you grab a fresh armor pickup (assuming you saved the one from the secret area) before exiting.
Overall, this map was nicely designed! But it might seem a bit disappointing if you expected the rest of the episode to be similar to the first map!
Attached Image: Daikarin_E2L2_1.pngAttached Image: Daikarin_E2L2_2.png

Noldor's Castle
It appears that Duke is now at a medieval castle. While the medieval theme may be a bit out of place from vanilla Duke3D, I think the design was overall great. You will fight mostly against troopers and enforcers, with a Mini Battlelord appearing at one point later.
This map felt a bit shorter and had a few parts that might seem confusing, such as the ending where you end up in a graveyard and you must blow up the grave with a pipebomb (look at screenshot to see the exact location) to unlock the exit. Hope you still have some armor left for the next map!
There are no secrets to find, so don't bother looking for them.
Overall, still a great map but it might seem disappointing compared to the previous two maps! Don't worry because there's another medieval map coming!
Attached Image: Daikarin_E2L3_1.pngAttached Image: Daikarin_E2L3_2.png

From The Heart To The Moon
As with the previous map, this is yet another medieval themed map. This is also where you will find the secret exit in the episode and I have good news for those who missed the secret map the first time around! I will tell you where it is found!
With that said, the map seems a bit shorter and has a few nasty surprises, such as a Mini Battlelord that almost killed me while I was being careless and rushed in front of him (the portable medkit saved me, though that meant no more medkit for a while).
The 3 atomic health pickups can be gotten by throwing a pipebomb near those stairs and you should be able to access them! They were much needed, considering the armor eventually ran out and Duke is so fragile without armor, that I needed to grab them and make sure I don't die or something!
Eventually, you will access a teleporter. But wait, DON'T GO IN THERE YET! Make a separate save and now you can go into the teleporter. There is NO WAY BACK once you enter, so kill the last 5 enemies and go for the normal exit. Now load your save before that teleporter and look for the secret exit! You should find it before the entrance of the castle! The problem is you will end up with 5 missing enemies (4 in my case as one enemy corpse got crushed by a door and added an extra kill)
There were also no secrets to find and I feel like the secret exit (and perhaps those 3 atomic healths) should have counted as a secret, although since the episode was made for the original DOS version, there wouldn't be any way to see the in-game level stats until the player finishes the map.
Still, I feel like there should have been an actual secret somewhere. Maybe even a portable medkit or armor or something.
Because of these minor nitpicks, the map was slightly disappointing to me, considering all these could have been easily fixed (a secret area added somewhere containing armor/medkit and allow backtracking from the teleporter leading to normal exit) but the design was still solid overall!
Attached Image: Daikarin_E2L4_1.pngAttached Image: Daikarin_E2L4_2.pngAttached Image: Daikarin_E2L4_3.png

Doom Nukem
This place looks very familiar! As you may have already noticed from the title, this is a conversion of DOOM E1M1 (Hangar). You are still fighting against original Duke3D monsters (troopers and pig cops), so you don't get the opportunity to fight against DOOM monsters or anything like that. However, this might be the best Doom E1M1 conversion in Duke3D so far. Other attempts didn't impress me much but this one is pretty faithful, using actual Doom textures and even a few decorations (columns, pillars, DoomGuy corpses, etc).
Not much else to say. You can grab the much needed armor at beginning and then proceed with killing the aliens. The map can be finished in less than 3 minutes if you have played the original Doom levels to death (especially the first episode!) and know every secret, you should breeze through this map!
Besides the armor, I feel like there should have been a reward for going the outside area secret, where you would find the BLUE ARMOR in original Doom sitting inside the acid, but here there was nothing in its place. Would have expected an atomic health or something similar. Still, I HIGHLY recommend getting to this secret map, for the armor alone at least. It's an experience you don't want to miss!
Attached Image: Daikarin_E2L8_1.pngAttached Image: Daikarin_E2L8_2.png

Polaris Outpost
The penultimate map, this takes place in a station and you will have to get through more obstacles before you reach the final boss. The map isn't very difficult overall and there are even 3 armor pickups included, as well as an atomic health at beginning (try to save it for latter if you can, if you are higher than 150 health when you begin the map, as you can still return to beginning much later to avoid wasting extra health, though most players will probably finish the map with just 100 health) and a portable medkit (I think inside a secret area).
There is a single secret to find, just dive in acid and choose the other path (the one that isn't locked behind bars). It contains a couple of goodies that you don't want to miss!
Attached Image: Daikarin_E2L5_1.pngAttached Image: Daikarin_E2L5_2.png

Daikarin
A somewhat short and disappointing (though nicely designed) boss map. It is a fight against an Overlord, surrounded by a bunch of slimer eggs (about 50 or so). To get to the spaceship, you have to get through the unavoidable purple lava and since you aren't given boots in the episode at all, you will have to endure the unavoidable damage! There is an atomic health provided, but to get it, you have to platform over the purple lava, losing health in the process and hoping the atomic health will heal up all the damage caused so far, meaning in a lucky case, you should have around 100 health. No, the armor won't help you against the purple lava but hopefully you should still have a medkit in inventory because it is pretty much vital for your survival!
Important to note is that all you are given in the map is a jetpack at beginning and the optional atomic health pickup. This proves that the episode was made for continuous play. Not that pistol start is considered in general in Duke3D episodes, maps usually flow better when you carry over your arsenal from the previous maps and there are also times when a mapper can make you lose your weapons by implementing a "weaponless" start similar to E1L3: Death Row from the original game.
Anyway, when you get to the boss arena, while dropping down, I recommend activating the jetpack as soon as possible and hiding in a corner (hopefully the boss didn't see you), then destroy all slimer eggs and the slimers. Once you are done with them (and no more things to distract you from), use the devastator against the boss. Dodge the attacks and you should be fine!
The first time I did this fight was flying the jetpack and ignoring the eggs/slimers, which wasn't terribly difficult and I was lucky my jetpack fuel didn't run out but I had to use the medkit as I would constantly take damage from the purple lava in the middle while I would dodge Overlord's rockets. It was quite tricky to do but not impossible. I highly suggest to follow my advice and get rid of eggs/slimers first, to make the battle much easier.
While the cutscene is the same as the original E2, there is a new ending picture based off original E2 ending and it is much better done than the one from The Army of Death (which was also based off E2 ending but in that case Duke wasn't cut off correctly or something like that, not sure how to exactly explain). Sure there's a few grammar mistakes but nothing too much to nitpick about. I forgot to take a screenshot of the ending picture, so when I will revisit the episode in DOSBox, I will take a couple extra pictures.
Attached Image: Daikarin_E2L6_1.pngAttached Image: Daikarin_E2L6_2.png

Interestingly, the maps are named E2L1-E2L6 and E2L8 (secret level), there is no E2L7 replacement. I'm not exactly sure why it was done like this. I feel like the episode was planned to be a bit bigger (maybe 8-9 maps in total), which also explains the rushed final map.

Overall, DaikariN still remains one of the best classic episodes ever released for Duke3D. I only wish that most of the episode consisted of classic city themed maps (at least 3 or so), before moving on to the rest maps and I wish the boss map was slightly bigger and better designed. I'm not going to sound too harsh on it, the bottom line is I had fun with the episode and that's all that matters!

I have already finished Operation Blitzkrieg (all 3 versions) last Friday and expect a review written soon (I already have half written in a text document). After that (on 25th February most likely), I will begin voting for the next month's choices. Hope to see more activity until then. :)

This post has been edited by FistMarine: 15 February 2022 - 03:00 AM

2

User is offline   Aleks 

#4

Finished Operation Blitzkrieg. I've had some concerns after reading Ninety-Six' pretty critical review, but had quite a completely different experience myself here.

The combat was the best thing about this episode - it did feel challenging with a lot of larger battles against hordes of enemies, but in a fun way. Didn't struggle for ammo too much as well, maybe besides the first level before I packed on more weapons. Also it was nice that ammo for shotgun and chaingun was moderately scarce, so I often had to use other guns (especially at the beginning), even stuff like expander. Sure there's been some unfortunate enemy placement like unavoidable pig cops in 512 width corridors or spawning monsters right behind you (especially enforcers or insta-shooting ducking pig cops). There's been some nice placement of battlelords or pig cop tanks. One thing I found a little annoying were damn turrets (as usually) which the author liked to place in every other corner of a room and overusing new beasts in the 2nd map, were it indeed got a little tedious with how bullet-spongy they feel with limited chaingun ammo.

As for the design, it was just barely enough to sell the theme/location, but a bit bland for my taste. There was hardly any details or spriteworks, but then it didn't really feel classic due to some mediocre or lazy choices. The layouts were usually simple, although sometimes the navigation/backtracking was unnecessarily tedious due to overusing similar textures. Also the visuals felt too dark IMO for the most part of the episode. One thing I definitely enjoyed was the little puzzles thrown in there, whether it was some creative use of mirror-shrinking or button-hunting in the secrets in 3rd map.

In fact, this episode somehow reminded me of a Doom wad. The design was simple with little details and the combat heavily relied on fighting groups of enemies rather than single one. Explosive weapons were more fun to use this way than originally as well, so really can't complain and combat was definitely the strongest point of this episode for me. The final battle against the Queen was a treat as well, the area for it was perfectly shaped to fight her there and the supplies were cleverly distributed (of course if we turn a blind eye over the notion that her electric attacks were designed to work underwater). Gotta admit that throughout the episode I've usually applied more direct strategy than usually, so going headfirst into a battle rather than more methodic/ice cold killer approach.

As for particular maps, I'd say the 2 last ones were my favourite - especially Motel Mayhem which looked the best. My least favourite one was probably Warehouse and it's mostly due to these newbeasts, but I admit it probably had some of the funnier secrets/puzzles. Each of the levels consistently took about 12-15 minutes.

All in all, it's a positive surprise with really strong and entertaining combat.

Not sure if I'll have time/motivation to play Daikarin. I definitely played it long time ago and the screens from the final level definitely bring some memories, but then I can't remember absolutely anything about the other levels it seems, so might be a good idea to re-play it. Still hoping to see more activity in this thread!
2

User is offline   Forge 

  • Speaker of the Outhouse

#5

tbh, I don't remember a whole lot of details about the Op Blitz episode itself. Just some of the convo with the author during beta-testing.

I do recall that there's a significant difference between Let's Rock and Come Get Some.
I did mention that the behind-your-back spawns were annoying, and more ammo should have been added to CGS. The response was something like, "Yup. Those behind-your-back spawns are annoying', and, 'I want there to be a noticeable difference between the difficulty levels and when you chose a higher difficulty level it's supposed to be difficult'.

As for the aesthetics I also mentioned it looking a bit bland. The response was, 'I want to make it look as close to the original one as possible'

I enjoyed playing through it, but if you choose CGS and expect vanilla episode CGS, you're in for a bad time (or a good time if you're that kind of person).

This post has been edited by Forge: 16 February 2022 - 08:26 AM

2

User is offline   FistMarine 

#6

Time to write the review for Operation Blitzkrieg. I played the classic version (from Fileplanet) in JFDuke3D (October 2005 build), as well as the other two versions in EDuke32 r5498 (the latest 2015 EDuke32 build) on CGS skill and got 100% everything. I haven't found a single difference between the versions, in terms of level design and item/enemy placement (sometimes I had an extra enemy or two caused by slimer eggs or pig cop tanks spawning the enemy in question). Screenshots are from all 3 versions. The Polymer edition adds polymer lights in the maps, as well as new sky textures which are pretty nice! Especially the sky textures from levels 4 and 5!

I feel like the EDuke32 version would have worked on the Episode 5 slot, considering EDuke32 supports more episodes and the maps are also already named E5M1-E5M5. In fact, when the episode got initially repacked by Danukem, it was on slot 5 but then later moved back to E2 slot (after people pointed out the change), despite the fact you fight the Alien Queen at the end of episode and not the Overlord! Yes, I remember lurking on the forums back then and I got to download and play the version with the episode on 5th slot (probably the first playthrough of the episode I've done back then), which made me happy I got to download it in time before the episode was restored to E2 slot. If anyone is wondering, no, I no longer have that version saved anywhere and it's not like it changed much, other than the intermission screen and maybe a different selection of songs.
While it is incredibly easy to change the episode slot, level name and stuff like that, I would have preferred the original author to do that, so that it feels like an "official" change rather than modifying stuff myself.

Now, after reading Ninety-Six's post (when it was originally posted, half of message I'm writing now is a whole week after I already played/finished the episode!), I got a bit discouraged and expected this episode to be really difficult, at least on CGS skill. When I played and finished the episode back then, I played it on LR and didn't find it difficult at all, maybe slightly challenging at times. This time I did on CGS and got 100% everything. Turns out, the episode was slightly harder but still, nowhere near as difficult as Ninety-Six implied. Secrets were mostly found with help of Mapster (obviously, you can't expect me to search for hours for the secrets I missed!) and many of them offer substantial rewards, so there is no reason to miss most of them. They should give you the much needed supplies to finish the entire episode. On top of that, ALL 5 levels offer water fountains to refill your health, so you are never in a hopeless situation with low health, although you should still carefully manage your ammo! And the 5th level, has only a room containing a water fountain (broken toilet) to refill health, so you shouldn't always rely on drinking water to refill health, except rarely.

Anyway, yeah, I didn't find the episode as difficult. Sure, I found a few points annoying with explosions in your face (like in last 3 maps) or monsters suddenly spawned in your face (or worse, in your back!) when doing something. But remember that even the original Duke3D levels spawned enemies occasionally (sometimes in your face, though very rarely), as well as the explosions in your face. It was rare to happen but it definitely happened. I agree that a FEW parts were kinda bullshit and they were nothing more than cheap tricks to surprise or even kill an unprepared player (thankfully wasn't my case but there were a few parts I had to use the medkit to heal the damage I received).
And then there is a secret that can only be reached if you let yourself shrunk from a protector drone, which is at the end of second map (more on that below). I had to spoil this part, to help other completionists out there! You don't want to lock yourself out of getting 100%! As always, save often and use several save slots! Preferably have a backup save made at end of each level and you should be fine! Now time to write about the maps:

Nut Case

An interesting opening map, which starts you already under thunderstorm (like in original E4L1), so don't stay around at the start too much! Be sure to grab the nearby RPG secret by jumping through the window. I recommend saving the RPG for later when you encounter the Pig Cop Tanks (though you can also use the self-destruct button on their backs but here, the safer approach is spending some rockets for them). Destroy those turrets, be sure to grab the nearby pistol pickup (near the blue key door) and then prepare to kill a couple enemies with the pistol early on. And hope that the pig cop drops a shotgun for you!
Something to note regarding explosions in the episode is that many explosions happen by just blowing up the fire extinguisher. To have an easier time, whenever you see one, just blow it up, so later you don't get surprised by an enemy blow it up for you. It happened to me once in second level (in one of EDuke32 playthroughs) but thankfully wasn't much of an issue because I had extra health (though it sucked losing most of the extra health early on).
The map has a couple tricks, such as enemies spawning when collecting a card, as well as enemy placement in general being quite tricky at times. When facing rooms that feature multiple enemies in it, example newbeasts (aka Protector Drones), it's best to pick them off one by one instead of entering the room and facing all of them at the same time. In general you are better off fighting while taking cover around a corner of the wall, so you are not fully exposed to the enemy fire. This strategy (something I've been doing a lot of as of lately, even in other games/mods, such as many Doom wads) can save you precious health and armor that you may need later on when it's time for unavoidable damage. At least the maps are generous with including water fountains, so you will not have trouble with running out of health. Even then, ammo, armor and health management is still very important!

With that said, the map early on does have scarce supplies and that's why you want an early armor/shotgun from a pig cop. Although the resources are given relatively early, you have to guess the correct path, so you don't end up going the wrong path and fighting more enemies without having armor, shotgun and chaingun. Once again you may be lucky with pig cops and enforcers dropping these essentials for you, that is at least a minute or so before the time you finally acquire the weapons in question (and if you get an used armor early on, then save the actual armor pick up for the end of map).
The level design is decent, not much to complain about. I only wish there was a bit more verticality, maybe slightly better balance and that's all I can find to nitpick at this map.
There are 6 secrets to find and some of them are easy to find, with others being trickier. Some contain the atomic health, which shouldn't be missed! At least if you manage to survive with just 100 health the entire time and save these atomic health pickups for the end of map, you should have a much easier time throughout the episode. That is as long as you repeat the step with saving certain goodies for the end of map and not grab them blindly early on! Though in general, it's better to grab the atomic health if you don't have any extra health, so that you will not get surprise killed by an explosion or an ambush or something.
Not a bad starting map! The Polymer sky texture (as part of Polymer edition) is fairly cool, as you will see in some screenshots (I took screenshots of all 3 versions).
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Warehouse

This map starts you on the roof of a house and you have to blow up a crack to access a Shrinker in the bathroom (and kill some troopers while you are it, also the pig cop waiting below the building). You should already guess what you need to do next but BEFORE doing that, first open that big door, kill the two enforcers from below the door (you should be able to kill them by just shooting in their feet while crouched), then shrink yourself and wait until you return to normal size.
While the design is a bit bland at times, the map overall is alright, I again wish there was more verticality to it. I liked that there are shrinking puzzles involved (and it's not the only map with shrinking involved), at beginning and at end! As I mentioned above, at the end of the map, you need to save one protector drone and allow yourself to get shrunk and enter that vent (though first destroy its grate, to enter it) to access the 5th secret. Most of the time the drone wouldn't cooperate, so this took me a few attempts to pull it right, otherwise I just killed the drone, then loaded save and try again.
Even on my first playthrough, I remember I noticed this small vent but I never bothered shrinking because of the risks involved, so that's where saving comes handy. Make a backup save before you kill the last protector drone. Once successful in accessing the vent, wait until you return to normal size (you will not die if you stand in the place with enough room to contain Duke in a crouched position, see screenshot where I stayed exactly) and grab the atomic health as a reward! Go back, kill the drone, collect other goodies you saved and then prepare for the next map!

The only thing I found annoying are those monsters that spawn as soon as you unlock a door with your card! Example two protectors spawned behind you while you use the red card! And the drones that spawn when you use the yellow card (just before the final room)! This is something that happens often in the episode.
Also the fact on one of EDuke32 runs, one trooper decided to blow up that fire extinguisher near me (after shrinking myself to get below the door at start) and cost me all the extra health! This is why I mentioned earlier to blow up the fire extinguishers in advance, so monsters won't blow them up when you least expect!
Oh yeah and something very shitty happened in one of EDuke32 playthroughs. After I used the blue card and entered the next room, I somehow warped into a mirror and got stuck. I had to load the saved game and replay 1-2 minutes (good thing I save often!). I have no idea how this happened but I guess the mirror sector overlapped with the sector I was standing or something similar. I couldn't replicate this glitch after, so thankfully it rarely happens. This stuff happened even in the original game, example in E4L2: Duke-Burger, there was a rare time I would get warped into a mirror. If anyone knows a better explanation, please let me know! For now I recommend saving often to avoid shit like this happening.
Overall, the map wasn't bad, just could have been much better, in terms of design and maybe balance (and fixing those various annoyances). Did I mention that the Devastator, while available in the map (on top of crates before the final room), is marked as a multiplayer-only item? Meaning in SP, you don't get the DEVASTATOR until a secret in next map (and normally in levels 4 and 5). Shame the map is plagued by so many annoyances, let's hope the next map will be better!
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Pork Roll

The interesting thing about this map are the secrets. 4/5 secrets contain a button that when all pressed, will unlock the 5th secret (Devastator, Medkit and other goodies) which is located at the beginning of the map. Once you unlock the secret, go back to the beginning, destroy the tripmines carefully, then collect the reward (and also fight a spawned Mini Battlelord waiting you outside).
There is also a switch puzzle in the offices, the solution is 2/4 switches are correct, press them in the diagonal, the first room in right (guarded by an assault captain) and second room in left (guarded by an assault trooper, where you can also find the RPG secret behind the picture). These two rooms have the switches you have to press to advance the map. Then later after you get the jetpack, fly through the vent on the ceiling of the central room.
The only annoying thing at this map is the explosion towards end that nearly killed me. I had 35% health left (and almost 50 armor) and got saved by the portable medkit. If I didn't have some extra health and a lot of armor earlier, I don't think I would have survived the explosion, even though I backed off in last second and remembered something about an explosion trap at end of one of maps! I learnt my lesson and then in subsequent playthroughs, I stepped off in time, which avoided a lot of damage.
Other than that, I don't have much else to say other than, once again, the map could have used more verticality. The map was alright and while I didn't mind the puzzles, some people may get stuck at that particular puzzle, so I made sure to explain the correct combination. Rarely user maps have button combinations scattered around the place...
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Motel Mayhem

As with the second map, at beginning you have to shrink yourself to access the next room. To do so, go to the bathroom, kill a few troopers, grab the shrinker, continue with the vents, kill an enforcer and activate a switch. Then go back to where you started, move that furniture, shrink yourself and run through the tiny vent (make sure the troopers inside that room didn't see you! one of them saw me in one of eduke32 playthroughs somehow, so I loaded the save when this happened, so I wouldn't risk an unfair death, even if I went back to starting room). Stand behind couch until you return to normal size and then...well, you should figure out the rest yourself.
The only problem I had with the map is towards end where you place that red card to open the garage door, first it spawns two pig cops behind you (which I forgot about that during one of eduke32 playthroughs, so I almost died and had to use medkit), second there is a Mini Battlelord behind that door and if you don't kill him before door shuts, you will have to endure some damage while you open the door because he will attack as soon as he is near you. If that happens, make sure you step back as fast as you can, to minimize the damage taken, then finish him off. There is also that nearby room that contains the first non-secret devastator and an explosion in your face at the same time.
These cheap tricks are what drag down the episode for me and while I don't think these constant ambushes and explosions kill the episode entirely for me, they do drag down the experience quite a bit. I wouldn't have minded if it happened once in a while. But seeing this happen in every level, sometimes multiple times in same level, gets old fast.
There's 5 secrets once again to find and I believe one (where you find the yellow card, just after the Mini Battlelord mentioned earlier) can be accessed both by jumping on trash cans or just using the jetpack to fly here directly. It is up to you to decide how to reach it. I mention this in case you destroyed the trash cans, though you should still have jetpack fuel from the previous maps. One of the other secrets (an atomic health in a vent) also requires the jetpack, I think.
Again, there isn't much else to say. It was fine, perhaps the best map in the episode so far. Some rooms were competently designed enough. Again I will point the lack of verticality that plagued the episode (alongside the cheap explosions/spawns). Let's move on to the last map before the conclusion of the episode!
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Metropocalypse

Not too bad of a final map. There are some tough fights, some involving Mini Battlelords in cramped spaces (like the one in the office and the other at the ground floor level) and then there's a few cheap explosions in your face, as expected. And of course a couple spawns behind your back (when placing the last blue card) because why not? In that case was an enforcer and a pig cop in a crouched position, both of which can take down half of your health if you aren't prepared.
There's two atomic health secrets to be found, one is behind a picture (in the room with the vent leading down to ground floor level), other is in the ground floor mentioned (where you encounter many enemies and Mini Battlelord), fly through the wall to reach it, near where the vent is positioned.
The final battle against the Alien Queen is interesting. You just kill the 3 commanders guarding her, then kill her and the spawned protector drones. If you have enough ammo, you should also kill the protectors she spawns and then finish her off. I recommend getting closer (but not too close!) to the Alien Queen to make sure the attacks hit her, as she has a habit of dodging rockets.
On my first revisited playthrough (in JFDuke3D), I missed an enemy somewhere and had to use cheats (DNKROZ & DNCLIP) to find it. Turns out it was a slimer in a vent somewhere (no idea how it survived earlier). After loading an earlier save (but not before quitting the game to reset the cheats), killing that slimer and redoing the Queen battle, I completed the episode 100%. Then I decided to redo the episode quickly, by doing the two EDuke32 playthroughs/versions, which were done much quicker, as I memorized most enemy placements and secrets. I took a bunch of screenshots from these versions as well, to go alongside the regular classic JFDuke3D pictures (although I only have a single JFDuke3D picture per each level, rest are EDuke32 pictures). I personally think the Polymer edition is interesting enough to warrant an extra playthrough, to compare with the regular edition.
Now if only the original unreleased version of OPBLITZ (from 2003-2004, with DM maps) was still available somewhere, I'm sure it would have been interesting enough to check it out, as there would be various differences.
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Overall, Operation Blitzkrieg is a pretty good classic episode that is somewhat dragged down by some odd design choices, such as the following:
-there doesn't seem to be much height variation (aka verticality) in the maps, making the maps feel a lot more cramped than they should be
-there are a couple cheap ambushes that can surprise the player, such as enemies spawned BEHIND you as soon as you activate a card or enter a room (if this happens, try to listen carefully to enemies suddenly spawning or to look at the level stats if you have them enabled and notice the total amount of monsters has suddenly increased)
-there are a few times where explosions happen in your face (in most cases, fire hydrants cause these explosions and if you see one in advance, try shooting it, so you don't have an enemy accidentally hitting it)
-there are a couple times where monsters are "stuffed" into a small room, which may seem overwhelming if you engage monsters directly without taking cover, therefore it is better to not rush into a room and try taking enemies from behind cover, one by one. Example the rooms that feature multiple protectors (like the last parts of first two levels, also the warehouse in level 2 that had plenty of them placed close one to another), it's best to not be seen by all of them at same time, just kill them one by one and you should be fine.

If this episode was longer (7-8 maps would have been the perfect length) and the maps were slightly better balanced and designed, I'm sure the episode would have been more well known and better received. I feel like it would have been a very nice E4 replacement.
I wasn't disappointed much compared to some people but there is always room for improvement. I was also lucky I never died once, as if I did, I'm sure I would have complained more about a particular part. However I still did my best to be fair and to nitpick all the negatives without repeating myself (at least not too much). Other than what was said previously, the episode nailed the classic Duke (The Birth) feeling for me and I enjoyed my time revisiting the episode (all 3 versions), even with all its faults.

On 25th, I will do the nominations and voting for the next month, as well as my final/overall thoughts of this month and perhaps, uploading a couple of screenshots of Daikarin (original version from MSDN) being played in DOSBox. Hopefully the next month's choices will be a bit more interesting. ;)

This post has been edited by FistMarine: 18 February 2022 - 03:40 AM

2

User is offline   NNC 

#7

Honestly, Daikarin doesn't make sense. The first map is a bit of Levelord style city level, with some Hotel Hell vibes. Then the next, which is easily the best one (albeit short) is a well designed techbase. Then you go medieval, and you visit two okay levels with uninspired monster placement. The next one is even more uninspiring, a Doom style techbase with more liztroop and enforcer fest. Then the boss level, which looks awesome, but it's very short. In fact, after the first level, all levels felt a bit incomplete and short. And the thematic connection is just weird.
0

User is offline   Ninety-Six 

#8

View PostFistMarine, on 18 February 2022 - 03:22 AM, said:

I agree that a FEW parts were kinda bullshit and they were nothing more than cheap tricks to ... even kill an unprepared player

As always, save often and use several save slots!


This was exactly the problem.


I've said many times that the entire reason I play these old FPSes is for the combat. I love having my combat abilities tested in new arenas, and one of those abilities is making split-second decisions and being able to execute those decisions. This is why I play saveless; I like to have my decisions matter and be the difference between life and death. When I die, I want to analyze what went wrong so that I know better next time. And I clarify that I mean I analyze what I knew in the moment and what was possible of me.

Bullshit traps rob the player of that agency. Your decision doesn't matter because you're going to die anyway, or elsewise take a metric shitton of damage. Like I said I spent half of every fucking level drinking water because I wasn't going to waste a precious resource (medkit) on damage that wasn't my fault. The only thing to "learn" from those traps are the levels themselves, which has no value. It doesn't carry lasting knowledge because these traps don't magically make you psychic.

Same goes for secrets that contain essential supplies. Hiding an RPG in a secret when you're up against enemies that can't be survived without one is on the same caliber as hiding a keycard in one.


The fact that no one else had as much trouble proves that it's not actually that hard. And that's exactly my point. It's not hard. Because being bullshit and being difficult aren't the same thing, despite what doomworld and its poisonous mindset thinks. It's artificial difficulty in its purest form.

I want to once again be clear: I love hard games and hard fights. But this kind of fake difficulty, this kind of "challenge" that is purely trial-and-error can screw right off.

This post has been edited by Ninety-Six: 18 February 2022 - 08:17 AM

0

User is offline   Forge 

  • Speaker of the Outhouse

#9

View PostFistMarine, on 18 February 2022 - 03:22 AM, said:

This time I did on CGS and got 100% everything. Turns out, the episode was slightly harder but still, nowhere near as difficult as Ninety-Six implied.

Secrets were mostly found with help of Mapster
many of them offer substantial rewards
They should give you the much needed supplies to finish the entire episode
ALL 5 levels offer water fountains to refill your health

bruh.
previewing the maps with mapster so you know where all the secrets & stashes are & then claiming the maps aren't that hard is sus.

You also implied that they are needed to have a fair chance at completing the levels on cgs & you still had to rely on drinking fountains in order to get by.
You basically confirmed what ninety-six posted.


you do you fam, but if you're using mapster to preview all the maps just so you can breeze through them, I'm not sure you're getting the proper perspective during your playthroughs

This post has been edited by Forge: 18 February 2022 - 09:43 AM

0

#10

Hey, bruhs.
Decided to drop my two cents about the maps in question, so I blasted through both DaikariN and Operation Blitzkreig. I played DaikariN some time ago, but Operation Blitzkreig was mostly new for me, because I droped it after the first level.

OB is definitely not as hard as Ninety Six says, I can't really see the "overwhelming hostility". It may be my playstyle or something, but I found playing the episode on CGS difficulty more annoying than hard really. I was rarely hurting for medkits, never had to resort to drinking toilet water, never was low on ammo except pistol rounds (I did find a lot of secrets including that super secret in level 3 with a big stash of weapons). Died two times - one was due to bullshit trap in level 4 (the battlelord one), the other was also due to the shrinker malfunction: I tried to rush the battlelord spawning after accessing the aforementioned secret stash in level 3.

There were a couple of bullshit traps indeed, though not as evil as I imagined them. The aforementioned battlelord (mostly due to pigcops spawning behind your back blocking the escape route - this is how I died there), a couple of explosions in your face, yes, thoung I can't recall any instances when this really hurt me; the battlelord behind the corner in level 5 Ninety-Six mentioned earlier, though in this particular caseit wasn't evil for me: I got out of the vent, saw all of the enemies, ran back into the vent and threw a couple of rockets their way killing most of the enemies, crawled out, saw the battlelord and only then I realized what was Ninety Six talking about.

The first level was perhaps the most challenging of them all mainly due to taking the wrong turn and missing the chaingun in the second room. Had to pistol a lot of enemies, I was always low on pistol ammo, and pistol's DPS is really not suited for continuous close range combat. I eventually found shotgun (I think one of the pig cops dropped it since I don't remember where exactly I found it), then chaingun, then I found shrinker, RPG and etc., so the level became much, much easier.

The fatal flaw of the episode is crampedness, which is very pronounced on CGS difficulty. Yes, I am aware that I bitch about it every time.

I can't agree with Aleks statement how this episode feels like a Doom Wad - it doesn't. I would even argue that this episode is very characteristic of the late 00s and early 10s of DN3D dominant mapping style: a scaled down, more realistic approach to architecture, a lot of cramped areas, light detaling. Looks neat and organised - no major complaints in terms of visual design from me (though while we're at it I hated the overbearing darkness of the 5th level).
On the contrary, combat heavy Doom maps (and even ID inspired maps) are a lot more open and spacious, cramped areas in these maps are done with a lot more precision, spice and taste, yet OB just crams shitload of enemies in small rooms and corridors where there's barely any space to maneuver and calls it a day. Most of the action takes place indoors and these levels were not built around having this much enemies per square metre of space. A lot more thoughtful approach is to built the architecture of the levels around the maximum number of enemies you plan to fit in there and then scale it down based on difficulty, I think.
The levels feel overcrowded because of this despite enemy count never really reaching 100 monsters. Also for me this was detrimental to using exotic weapons: small overcrowded rooms don't exactly call for shrinker or freezethrower since you'll have to waste time and rush under enemy fire to actually kill anybody unless it's one-on-one situation.

I didn't bother to check out Let's Rock difficulty, but I assume it is much less crowded affair, so to maximize the fun factor I would recommend sticking to LR.
The maps mostly took me 10 to 15 minutes, which is like 3-5 minutes more than what the actual layouts call for once again due to levels packing monsters like sardines in a can.
What surprises me is that despite all that shit I still had fun - I will attribute this more to core gunplay of DN3D and my own playstyle than the actual the levels themselves.

DaikariN, on the other hand, is pretty great, especially the first level, Down in the Kaos, which was peak Duke: 3DR classic visual design, interconnected layout, fun and action packed, very intuitive progression, good secrets. Just a great level overall. I didn't really enjoy the hi-tech levels, mostly because those are long grey/orange linear corridors. Not too much to talk about there, really, they take less than 10 minutes to complete and I basically sleepwalked through them. I had fun, but in a very passive way.
The castle levels were fun, beatiful and atmospheric, but a little uneventful - enviroments like that just call for some interaction and a few scripted sequences here and there to really cap off the atmosphere. Maybe it's the lack of bigger overarching concept that bothers me, but these maps are still fun to play. The boss level is meh. The pyramide looks cool, the boss itself was a complete pushover and kinda anticlimatic.

IIRC, the shitty explosion usage can be tracked down to DaikariN, I distinctly remember once or twice after some explosion set-up the author put a few little explosions way after the fireworks were over.

I have a suspicion that Down in the Kaos was made first and burned through most of the ideas the author had, and because of that the dots didn't really connect later on.
The episode was easy-peasy for me, there's no real challenge to be had here, but it was still lots of fun just blasting through it. DaikariN definitely gets a recommendation from me.
3

User is offline   Aleks 

#11

View PostMister Sinister, on 18 February 2022 - 10:59 AM, said:

I can't agree with Aleks statement how this episode feels like a Doom Wad - it doesn't.

Not gonna die on that hill, as I have zero experience playing Doom wads really - it was all based on the impression I got from watching some videos from Arzca's maps/playthroughs in Doom and the recent Impie's Day of the Toys episode playthrough video. The interiors might have been quite cramped, but it wasn't because of much details, but just scaling down. The visuals looked quite plain to me - almost like an abstract representation of the place rather than actual take on it. And the monsters, well, there's been larger density of them than in your usual Duke map, but it didn't feel more difficult at all. I actually liked all of the mini-Battlelords in 4th and 5th levels, their placement was good because it didn't feel static, especially the one inside the dark office felt cool, as it was legitimately a scary/dangerous encounter, but still there was enough places to take cover.

The only time I died was getting stomped by and enforcer after the shrinking puzzle in 2nd map, but it didn't feel unfair at all. Also I've had a funny bug with one of the pig cops in that brown/grey marble downstairs area (that also have a battlelord) in 5th map, after shooting him once with a shotgun, he clipped through a wall and teleported all the way to the roof. As for the health, I've mostly had 100+, seems most secrets were quite easy for me to find, also I never rely on waterfountains, feels a bit like cheating to me really (not to mention it's damn tedious) :P Pipebombs and RPG was very useful throughout the episode for the more enemy-dense places. Only 2 first maps felt a bit short on ammo (2nd one mostly for the lack of chaingun/rapid fire guns ammo to easily take on the new beasts). Lots of monsters in a single room doesn't feel so difficult in Duke as you can usually just handle them one by one or throw a grenade, and open spaces here felt really funny because there was tons of aliens but also just enough place to freely move and not have enemies disappear behind the line of sight (DHFC was a bad example at open level design IMO, as you couldn't see most of the enemies. This was probably even more of a problem in Jungle Tour 3, where it was ridiculously dark and open with hitscanners all around, but in this case I think it was Steph's conscious decision to just make the map pure suffering for the player).



2

User is offline   FistMarine 

#12

@Ninety-Six: I completely forgot you were playing saveless, meaning that the whole thing is much harder than what the average user would do when playing the episode. Does that mean you didn't save at all in the entire episode or still saved between levels to retain the inventory just in case you died? If you attempted doing the entire episode without saving once (and pistol start if you died in later levels), then I have to respect for putting through all that! As far as I know, most Duke3D players prefer episodes to be played continuously and I haven't personally tried doing pistol starts in most custom Duke3D episodes with very rare exceptions (such as if an exit was bugged in one of levels and had to pistol start the next one, Lost Highway level 3 comes in mind right now with its last part impossible to complete without cheating).

In fact, a year and half ago I did the original Duke3D 1.3D in DOSBox, pistol start each map of the original 3 episodes on CGS skill without saving (although it was done in COOP mode, which offered extra supplies and respawning inventory items, alongside 3 inactive players at the map start which mostly served as a distraction for the monsters). And currently for the Doomworld megawad club, I recently got into pistol starts and redid the 3 episodes of DTWID (Doom the way id did) 100% on UV without saves while recording demos. I only died once in E2M8, otherwise I had to replay a few maps because either I got softlocked (ironically, inside a secret area in E2M3) or missed an item/secret somewhere or whatever. I used PrBoom+ (for automap stats, better resolution and controls) and I looked YouTube videos in advance to see the secret locations, considering the fact I've finished DTWID before (in Chocolate Doom) and right now I decided to replay it and post my thoughts (I posted my thoughts about E1 and E2 so far, will post about E3 soon) as it was finally chosen for the megawad club. I think I was successful and that makes me want to do more saveless pistol starts in the future, although I prefer to stick to megawads I've already played/finished before and only if their difficulty is overall easy to moderate.

Now in regards to the OPBLITZ episode, I still didn't find it that difficult, even with the issues mentioned so far. Considering Aleks and Mr. Sinister also finished the episode for the first time and they both died very few times overall, I would like to believe that you just simply had bad luck with either enemies not dropping too much stuff or taking too much damage or whatever else happened. As I said before, on my previous playthrough many years ago, I played on LR and I don't think I found many secrets overall (most likely I found like 2 for each level), yet I was able to get through the episode just fine (back then I didn't care for getting 100% everything and I didn't use Mapster at all to progress through the map if I was stuck). This time I upped the difficulty and only the beginning felt a bit challenging due to ammo being somewhat scarce at first. But I admit I also got very lucky (at least on the JFDuke3D playthrough) with enforcers dropping ammo (and even an early chaingun) constantly in the first map. It would be an entirely different story if the enemies didn't drop anything. Sure you have to use the pistol against the first couple of pig cops until you get the shotgun/chaingun but it's not like it's an impossible task. It just depends which path you take, that holds the shotgun/chaingun pickup, otherwise you can get one dropped from pig cops/enforcers. I agree that maybe the RPG shouldn't have been hidden in a secret area when comes to dealing with stronger enemies like Pig Cop Tanks (although you can always just get behind them to press their self-destruct button and then hide from their explosion).

I'm a dedicated Doom/Duke/Quake/etc player and I have played a wide variety of custom maps/mods for Doom and Duke3D (less so for Quake and other games, hope that will change soon) since back in 2007-2008 when I discovered mods for the classic games and that modding communities exist. I know that some mods are well balanced and others are less balanced. It also depends of the RNG, considering things can go wrong at any moment.

@Forge: Let's clarify any misunderstandings right here. I never said that I needed to drink water to make it through the episode to have a fair chance against the enemies. I had my Portable Medkit handy most of the time (there should be one available in each level) and used it whenever I fell below 50 health, which if I'm not mistaken, must have happened only about 2-3 times in the whole episode. The explosion at end of level 3, the two pig cops spawned behind me when unlocking that big garage door in level 4 (though in this case I might have been lucky in the JFDuke3D playthrough to notice them in time, I think I needed to use the medkit in one of the EDuke32 playthroughs when I forgot about this trap) and the office (or ground level floor?) in level 5, due to constantly getting hit by enemies, so I had to use it eventually, plus there was one nearby.

The only times I drank water from fountains, was when I was near one and my health was let's say around 80-99 and didn't want to pick up a +30 medkit (which BTW are the most common health items in original Duke3D and most user maps/episodes) to refill my health, as I tend to be very resourceful and don't want to pick up medkits accidentally when I don't need them (same applies to armor and ammo). These are the only times I had to drink water. I only specified fountains are available in each map because they are very helpful and I don't mind to drink water occasionally to refill health. I never ran out of health to sit there minutes to refill my health. Whenever my health fell around 70 or lower, I would grab the 30+ medkit nearby or just search for one by backtracking. If my health was below 50%, I would use my medkit. Simple as that.

Regarding secrets, I didn't specify that they are NEEDED to complete the episode. I said that they would offer great rewards to make your life much easier. I'm sure I could have done fine even without them, although the episode would have been much harder (and even if you don't look for secrets, you should find at least one or two by accident or just being observant). But the thing is, I needed to look in advance just to have an idea where they are (even if I was still missing one or two at the end of map and then backtrack to find them) and if I didn't know or forgot about that one particular secret at end of level 2 (the one requiring you to shrink to enter the vent), then I would have to replay the whole map. That's why I have a good memory and I remembered this particular part, from the playthrough I did back then (in 2012-2013). In fact, I remembered many level locations and I was simply lucky with the enemies in general, I didn't look in Mapster to see enemy placement or stuff like that, I only looked for secret locations and even then some I didn't find immediately until I backtracked through the whole map. Which can be seen in screenshots I took (looking at the level stats), why in JFDuke3D playthrough the maps took me around 20-25 minutes to finish, whereas the EDuke32 playthroughs I did after that, each took me 10-15 minutes. First time I was careful with advancing the rooms, the next two times I went much faster, after I memorized most enemy placements and secrets. I did all of that to make sure I finish all 3 versions in that day. Otherwise, I would spend a lot more time to find some well hidden secrets, as I specified above. I feel like nothing from the experience was lost. I admit I could have expressed my words better, though I try to be as clear and helpful as possible when reviewing something (even if my reviews overall suck).

As proof, you can see I didn't struggle at all with the health/armor/ammo supplies throughout the episode when I had 150-200 health at end of the levels (along with 100 armor and a decent amount of ammo), even in the JFDuke3D pictures I took. I am an experienced Duke3D player and know exactly what to do in most situations, so I'm careful when grabbing/saving some supplies, what weapon to use in certain situations, etc.

And to end my argument, there was a huge difference between revisiting the episode after many years (in which case I'm allowed to look up for any missed secrets, considering I already beat the episode before and I wanted to get 100% everything anyway) and a first playthrough, the latter is which is what other people experienced. I'm now glad that the episode is more well known and played by more people, even if it appears to have gotten mixed feelings overall. To me I had fun revisiting it. It wasn't as hard as I thought it will be, some parts were indeed bullshit but I could overlook these annoying parts. I would say the episode was 7/10, maybe 8/10 if I'm generous. Not as good as other high quality releases out there, just decent enough to make it worth playing through once at least.

I have played many Duke3D maps and mods since back in 2008 or so and in my experience, most of the stuff I play is relatively well balanced, stuff that I can complete without dying once or maybe 1-2 deaths in total if I'm unlucky. Then there are the rare cases where some maps/mods can kill me many times and I have to save scum to complete them. Honestly it depends a lot of the map/mod in question. And how things go with the RNG. Between the enemies hitting you or not (and the amount of damage you take), to the randomized drops of the troopers/pig cops/enforcers, things can either go wrong at any moment or get lucky enough to breeze through the map/mod in question.

I am curious if the author (Dave Billing) of Operation Blitzkrieg is aware of this topic, as I would be interested in getting some "developer commentary" about the episode. Maybe then he will explain the design choices. I will probably send him a PM soon and see what he says.

Anyway, thanks everyone for participating in the topic! Next week voting begins for the next month, so if anyone has nominations/suggestions for the next month, feel free to post them! Stay tuned until then!

EDIT: Sent a PM to Dave_Billing.

This post has been edited by FistMarine: 19 February 2022 - 01:05 AM

1

User is offline   Forge 

  • Speaker of the Outhouse

#13

View PostFistMarine, on 18 February 2022 - 10:36 PM, said:

Regarding secrets, I didn't specify that they are NEEDED to complete the episode.
I'm sure I could have done fine even without them

probably

maybe i misinterpreted your experiences with health. I apologize.

Again, you do you fam. You don't have to justify your playstyle to me, or anyone else. If you need to go back and collect all the rewards before moving on, then go for it. That's why the author put them there.
I'm going to go back to reading and keeping my opinion and observations to myself.

This post has been edited by Forge: 19 February 2022 - 08:15 AM

0

User is offline   ReaperAA 

#14

First time participating in this. I have completed Operation Blitzkrieg on CGS (with pistol start and also saveless) and honestly I didn't find the traps to be as BS as Ninety-Six mentioned. There are some BS teleporting ambushes or explosions here and there, especially on Map 2 and 3, but I had good enough health to survive them. It was only around or slightly above Episode 4 in terms of difficulty. Or maybe I was a bit lucky with shotgun drops (I was lucky to get shotgun from the starting pigcops on map 3)

I only died on Map 5 (2 times), but that was mostly due to the severe lack of ammo on pistol start, which on continuous play would not have been a problem at all. There just isn't enough ammo on the map and on my 3rd attempt, I had to skip 2 of the 3 battle lords (the one on the starting rooftop area and the one in the office rooms area). A shrinker or at the very least more shotgun/ripper ammo would have been nice. The Queen honestly didn't cause much trouble at all.

Map 2 was the 2nd hardest map for me and that was also due to the lack of ammo for the most part. The protector drone trap when you use red keycard and the sentry drone trap when you use yellow keycard are BS, but thankfully I managed to survive them. I was being very cautious on that map.

Map 4 felt like the easiest to me. No lack of ammo whatsoever. Also the 3 battlelords on this map were easy to deal with the shrinker. With that said, I really hated how the small vent was hidden behind a furniture at the start of the map and I was stuck until I came here and read FistMarine's comments on OB.

Stats of how many kills and secrets I got at the end of each map
https://imgur.com/a/cIe52yA

Overall, I didn't find the episode too shabby. I liked the environmental variety and some of the encounters were pretty clever.

This post has been edited by ReaperAA: 19 February 2022 - 10:01 PM

2

User is offline   ReaperAA 

#15

And now I have completed DaikariN. Just as in case of OB, this was also a blind walkthrough on CGS and with pistol starts (except last map). Well, what can I say. I.... found the quality to be a mixed bag. The first map is just awesome. It truly feels 3D Realm-ish. It feels like a Levelord style map, only more refined than anything Levelord himself designed. Unfortunately its goes downhill after that.

The 2nd map is decent. The layout is not as good as the first map, but it is serviceable. The good thing about this map is that the combat was more spicy than the first map. In fact, I actually came close to dying towards the end and I exited the map with 25% health.

The 3rd map is meh. The aesthetics are nice but I found the layout pretty boring with almost no verticality and neither has the spice in combat that 2nd map had.

The 4th map is a bit better than the 3rd map. The layout felt better and it is also probably the hardest map in the set and another map where I came close to dying. I read FistMarine's comment mainly to find the secret exit, but I also ended up reading how to obtain the 3 atomic health. Unfortunately, the map provides no explosive weapon directly. The only way I was able get them is by luckily finding pipebomb ammo from crates. The crates I destroyed to get that was by luring the only assault commander of the map.

The secret map is just Doom's E1M1 ported to Duke. What else can I say.

The 5th map has okay-ish layout, but suffers from lack of aesthetic variety and spice in combat.

The last map has no ammo whatsoever to fight the Overlord, so don't bother pistol starting it. Thankfully I had made a save at the very end of the 5th map and had just enough ammo to take him down. The boss is a zero threat due to how spacious the area is. The purple damaging toxin is far more threatening than the boss himself.

Kills and secret stats I got at the end of each map.
https://imgur.com/a/ScnKf7r

This post has been edited by ReaperAA: 20 February 2022 - 11:38 PM

1

#16

The next step in this conversation would be people listing their picks for maps that are genuinely very challenging but in a fair way.
2

User is offline   NNC 

#17

I like the second map in Daikarin, because it has a really unique look. It doesn't borrow elements from other levels or other games, it"s just something I can see as an unique thing with an identity in the original game with some extensions. The yellowish colours also help the level's feel.

This post has been edited by The Watchtower: 21 February 2022 - 04:47 AM

0

User is offline   Aleks 

#18

View PostMister Sinister, on 21 February 2022 - 12:40 AM, said:

The next step in this conversation would be people listing their picks for maps that are genuinely very challenging but in a fair way.

Hey, I got one: Naked Dash! :P Also Anarchy City X.
2

User is online   ck3D 

#19

I think Anarchy City X is only that fair, a few of those dollar bill stashes are hard to spot and thinking about it that whole gimmick of replacing the keycards only makes so much sense (even as a real-life situation, it's kind of backwards). I did release a version with enhanced visibility and viewscreens everywhere, but I really should go back and turn the things back into visible keycards maybe, and now that map would be leaning towards fair a little better. Disguising a recognizable item into something unfamiliar was a mistake on my end.

What's funny is, upon reading that post the first releases to spring to mind were the first couple of levels in Death Drive and Slaughterfest, although I'm well aware of how enemy spam is typically received as bad taste and a lot of people hate it, but sometimes that can be my thing, I enjoy a challenge where I need to be quick on my toes and reflexes. For one I think that slaughter style can actually work as long as actual thought is being put into the placement and respective monster mechanics (which those maps did), but I can also see how easy it is to slip into reliance on just that and forget about the rest to instead result in more artificial difficulty and that's how one gets Porkchop Sandwiches or Duke's Nightmares (which now are totally not my thing). Bit of a tricky subject.

I think environmental hazards are rather commonly slept on as potential difficulty spikes, possibly due to mappers worrying about the player running out of inventory items and soft locking themselves by 'playing the level wrong', but I wouldn't mind seeing people experiment with those even more (to the point where they have to actually think about their inventory and plan things out, for instance; something akin to what MetHy brilliantly did in Duke Hard's secret level, Parking). There was a Metroid-inspired level someone (forgot who, sorry) dropped a while back that felt a bit like a tech demo of that very point. Platforming in Duke 3D can also be annoying as Duke's jumps aren't exactly consistent always, but in many instances I've seen reported people were really just complaining about bad design there (awkward heights, short ledges that really don't abide to Duke 3D gravity and player momentum well, etc.).

I really, really like how Maarten uses terrain design in some of his latest maps to first block, tease, then reward the player. That's something else I wish I saw more people do in Duke map design.

This post has been edited by ck3D: 21 February 2022 - 09:04 AM

3

User is offline   Aleks 

#20

View Postck3D, on 21 February 2022 - 09:00 AM, said:

I think Anarchy City X is only that fair, a few of those dollar bill stashes are hard to spot and thinking about it that whole gimmick of replacing the keycards only makes so much sense (even as a real-life situation, it's kind of backwards). I did release a version with enhanced visibility and viewscreens everywhere, but I really should go back and turn the things back into visible keycards maybe, and now that map would be leaning towards fair a little better. Disguising a recognizable item into something unfamiliar was a mistake on my end.

Nah, you're too hard on yourself here. I think having these cash stashes was clear enough and really easy to pick up, also it added to the story/lore of the map (it was even mentioned in the .txt file). The map did rely on thinking and moving fast of course, but also I think if someone manages to cope with its unusual type of gameplay and other gimmicks, changing keycards for cash stashes isn't a big deal. Also it adds to the idea of a "scavenger" kind of level. I've had a lot of fun with it, still consider it in my top 3 MRCK maps :D

Anyway, I've started playing DaikariN last night and finished the first 2 levels.

Down in the Kaos:
I concur with what most people said about the 1st level, it indeed did feel very classic and the combat was generally pretty well balanced and fun all over. Everything looked very good, it did have a twist with a lot more spriteworks and sprite structures in general than original Duke maps, which was a great idea. The secrets were pretty intuitional and I managed to find all 8 of them without backtracking or trying too hard, also the interconnections opening throughout the level were nice (you could even skip using the red keycard, as a passage behind the door could be found in a place right after you pick up the key). My biggest problem with the map was that at times it looked a bit... too much like E3 levels (mainly LA Rumble and Hotel Hell). Same type of buildings, very similar layout, it could have worked almost like a remake (or maybe... reboot?). That is something I've had a problem with in recent Michael Hunt's episode as well, some areas looking just too inspired on the original (BTW, his episode could also be considered very classic), but then with Michael Hunt's maps the best areas were those where he didn't try to directly imitate anything from the original game and went with his own stuff, like the Penthouse in 2nd map or the city on moon in the last one. Here apparently the best ideas are the "Levelord, but expanded" kind of ones. Nevertheless, it's still very good level design. And my 2nd nitpick: the explosions. Why there's always damn sloppy seconds, a C9 or two randomly blowing a few seconds after the whole explosion sequence already dies down? It's like that even with fire extinguishers...

A Dark Passage:
Now this one was something else, and I've also definitely remembered playing this level a couple years ago! While the rooftops part at the beginning is completely forgettable and the first part of the base with "decorative" yellow keycards isn't that great, the fun starts later on. The combat is more challenging than in the first map, but nothing unfair or actually difficult (although at one place I did to about 60 HP after a weirdly set-up tripmine trap). Now the design is quite special here - very clean and made with quite simple geometrical shapes, but nicely detailed (you rarely see people commit so much to ceiling detailing without making it feel "pushed"!) and with super consistent and fitting colour themes. This part of the map almost looked like it was made of Lego and I mean it as a compliment. Also not sure, but it seems like some of the textures were a bit tampered with by the author, but without making them stick out from the original set. The level was basically a very long and linear corridor with a bunch of rooms on the way, but it was just enough visual storytelling to see through its purpose, with some fun combat and great visuals.

One more thing about this episode so far, the viewscreens are used very nicely. At times they can be even used as a neat tactical devices to peek around a corner. Neat stuff.

Gotta play some more levels tonight, not sure it I will finish it already, but this is definitely more fun than Operation Blitzkrieg and I want more of that!
3

User is online   ck3D 

#21

View PostAleks, on 22 February 2022 - 08:03 AM, said:

Nah, you're too hard on yourself here. I think having these cash stashes was clear enough and really easy to pick up, also it added to the story/lore of the map (it was even mentioned in the .txt file). The map did rely on thinking and moving fast of course, but also I think if someone manages to cope with its unusual type of gameplay and other gimmicks, changing keycards for cash stashes isn't a big deal. Also it adds to the idea of a "scavenger" kind of level. I've had a lot of fun with it, still consider it in my top 3 MRCK maps :D


Love to hear it, I mean I still think as a gameplay mechanic the choice was wrong (at least from a theoretical perspective), but it's still my favorite map I've ever released and so I always appreciate whenever (rare) people can also dig it.

Mostly posting because I forgot to bring that up in my earlier post, but I think Death Drive and Slaughterfest may be a good combo for one of those future Dods of the Month. How Death Drive only took a week to make too I also always thought was pretty cool. I think those levels are great (a lot of fun at least) and are slept on for no real reason besides the slaughter map concept being typically unappealing (but those maps do pull it off really well), or maybe coming out at the wrong time (since that's a thing), but they left a strong impression on me to the point where I consider them classics, personally.

This post has been edited by ck3D: 22 February 2022 - 09:17 AM

2

User is offline   FistMarine 

#22

@Forge: No problem, misunderstandings can happen. You are more than welcome to post your thoughts about the maps and contribute on the Map/Mod club topic. I accept the apology. :)

@ReaperAA: Thanks for joining in! You made a couple interesting observations and comments about the maps. I actually didn't think these two episodes were well balanced for pistol start, glad you proved it was possible to beat them (except the final map of Daikarin, for obvious reasons). Hope to see you in the following months as well. :)

@Everyone else: Thank you for participating! It was a pleasure to read all your comments and hope to see you the next month as well!

Final thoughts
It has been a blast to revisit these two classics after all these years. I had a lot of fun playing them and hope to find more underrated gems and have them chosen and played for the map/mod club in the following months.

As today is 25th, I might as well throw in the vote for the next month:

Last Reaction and Water Bases (with Chimera) +

I think LR&WB and Chimera will be another great pair to be revisited after more than 7 years since I last played them. But will they be worth the effort to revisit them or will they be painful? Find out soon!
Of course, other suggestions are welcomed as well. So feel free to nominate anything else if you feel like something else should get played. Once the month ends, I will count the votes and then host the new March topic!

As a bonus, here are the Daikarin (DOS version from MSDN) screenshots that I promised a while ago:
Attached Image: DAIKARIN_E2L1_1.pngAttached Image: DAIKARIN_E2L1_2.pngAttached Image: DAIKARIN_E2L1_3.pngAttached Image: DAIKARIN_E2L1_4.png
Attached Image: DAIKARIN_E2L2_1.pngAttached Image: DAIKARIN_E2L2_2.pngAttached Image: DAIKARIN_E2L2_3.png
Attached Image: DAIKARIN_E2L3_1.pngAttached Image: DAIKARIN_E2L3_2.png
Attached Image: DAIKARIN_E2L4_1.pngAttached Image: DAIKARIN_E2L4_2.pngAttached Image: DAIKARIN_E2L4_3.png
Attached Image: DAIKARIN_E2L8_1.pngAttached Image: DAIKARIN_E2L8_2.pngAttached Image: DAIKARIN_E2L8_3.png
Attached Image: DAIKARIN_E2L5_1.pngAttached Image: DAIKARIN_E2L5_2.png
Attached Image: DAIKARIN_E2L6_1.pngAttached Image: DAIKARIN_E2L6_2.pngAttached Image: DAIKARIN_E2L6_3.png

See you on the next month! Have a nice weekend!
1

User is online   ck3D 

#23

Last Reaction and Water Bases is a great pick, I was just talking with Aleks though and somehow the idea of a Billy Boy Dod of the Month was brought up and that would in fact be really cool sometime, at least I know I would love it and definitely participate in this if/when that happens for once, I've been needing the motivation to actually replay those levels vs. just looking at them. I've observed a lot of people have been curious about his works and sort of rediscovering them recently, so I think that might really work timing-wise. Not going to throw in my vote for those yet as I wouldn't want to singlehandedly make up a new option in the poll, but it may be an idea to consider soon.

This post has been edited by ck3D: 25 February 2022 - 10:42 AM

2

User is offline   jkas789 

#24

What about the KaiseR Land trilogy by KaiseR? I don't know if anyone here has played them but last I played them myself (like...3 years ago?) I remember them not being that shabby.

Another set of maps that I think deserve more attention are the Community Build Projects as well. There were 8 of those and AFAIK they haven't been played yet on the mod of the month?

I have organized my schedule to be able to play Elden Ring and Duke Nukem 3D next month (barring there being an emergency that needs me there) so hopefully I will be able to jump in and review as well.

This post has been edited by jkas789: 25 February 2022 - 08:31 PM

2

User is offline   Aleks 

#25

Finished DaikariN last night (actually I've played levels 3, 4 and secret few days ago), here's some general thoughts:

Noldor's Castle and From the Heart to the Moon:
They're very nicely designed, a castle/medieval theme is not that often used within Duke 3D maps, also a bunch of new textures made by combining the older ones work here well. The castles are nicely designed and detailed, once more showcasing the Author's strength, which is shaping neat geometrical shapes with lots of slopes and strong ceiling structures. The problem is navigation, as the insides rely mostly on the brown and grey marble textures, so the rooms lack some distinctiveness - in fact the 2 maps are quite similar and blend together after playing them one after another. Also the gameplay gets a bit tedious, especially after how well the combat felt in the first 2 maps - here it's pretty much just troopers or enforcers all around, with an occassional battlelord or commander.

Doom Nukem:
This is like 4th version of Doom E1M1 remade into a Duke map I've played, probably one of the more faithful ones, as it uses custom textures. No idea how it fits the episode and all in all, it's just a 2-3 minutes walk in the park.

Polaris Outpost:
This one seems to be a base in space or something. Once again, the design is based on quite original colour/texture themes, with green atomic textures and trusses very nicely accomodated in the design and orange/brown industrial tank walls. The maps theme is sold quite well, it reminds me the visuals of Jeunet's Alien Resurrection a bit, just with less detail and, well... This level kinda lacks the atmosphere of any kind at all. Combat is basically the same as previous 2 levels, which gets even more tedious at this point, but there's some interesting respawns to surprise you every now and then. There's plenty of ammo through all these levels, so that's not a problem at least.

DaikariN:
I think this one works very well for a boss map. The pyramic/diamond structure in the clouded sky makes for quite an epic battle arena. There's lots of purple lava to give it some more distinguished feeling as well. The arena where you fight the boss works pretty good too - the sloped sides of the room where Overlord can climb and lava at the centre turn out well, so the boss fight is quite satisfying and I'd imagine it being challenging playing just with keyboard. No idea what's the final screen text about though - there seems to have been some deeper story, but it just eluded me.

Overall, I think this was funnier than Operation Blitzkrieg and the design was quite unique. Although the 2 first levels kinda elevated my expectations too high, so I did feel a bit of disappointment in the end.

Voting:
Last Reaction and Water Bases (with Chimera) +
BillyBoy's maps +
Community Build Projects
KaiseR's maps
2

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