[NightFright]

Well, I guess not really. But it felt like that quite a bit. They had a LOT of Duke jokes in these games. And then there's the fact that Sam is quite obviously a Duke knockoff. Especially in the beginning when he was still wearing sunglasses. For Chrissakes, Sam WAS Duke, just with different hair color and shirt.

[johnnythewolf]

Fair point with the character design, although I seem to remember the sunglasses-wearing muscleman type of character being all the rage in the early/mid-90s, thanks to movies like Terminator 2: Judgement's Day. The only Duke jokes I honestly remember from Serious Sam games are the occasional jabs at Duke Nukem Forever in The Second Encounter and Serious Sam 2.

Not sure about Sam being Duke, though: from the very start, Serious Sam has been portrayed as some kind of buffoon, right down to John J. Dick's comically over-the-top delivery, while we are supposed to see Duke Nukem as the coolest dude in the world.

[razgriz]

Silly question but do I need VR to play this?

[Lunick]

razgriz, on 31 March 2019 - 05:39 PM, said:

Silly question but do I need VR to play this?

Nope

[geomancien]

Let's hope Randy does nothing. I made gameplay on this mode come tell me your impression.
https://youtu.be/8dc3ZB9w9Y0

[spessu_sb]

MrFlibble, on 28 March 2019 - 05:24 AM, said:

I watched the video of the first level and while the level design is certainly very interesting (kind of reminded me of HH Rethinked but on a larger scale) the combat feels off and doesn't seem to capture the essence of Duke3D's combat.

Agreed

Visually it is very impressive but audibly not. It seems to have the generic/realistic gun sounds and whatnot and they are very forgettable. Movement speed is slow and maybe it's just me but it feels like it's even slower than Serious Sam 3, why?

Also not based on that video but the earlier one, this seems to have Painkiller/Serious Sam horde thing going. Youre fighting multiple assualt commaners and octabrains among smaller enemies on l2e1, why? Hopefully it's just a testing phase but I'm affraid its not.

I'm not bashing this, I fully appreciate the time and effort that has been spent on this. Its just.. this is now Duke3D we're talking about and since this mod is now getting attention it has to be mentioned. Why is it getting the Painkiller/Serious Sam treatment? Like the new Shadow Warrior focused also on hordes over creative level design and stuff. This just doesn't seem like Duk3D to me aside from the visuals and environments because the gameplay strays too far from original.

[----]

spessu_sb, on 28 April 2019 - 10:29 AM, said:

Why is it getting the Painkiller/Serious Sam treatment?

Because it is a Serious Sam mod???

I mean, otherwise one could "mod" for example the Unreal Engine 4 with DN3D like gameplay and DNF visuals and call it Duke Nukem - Reloaded Rebooted, or so.

[spessu_sb]

fuegerstef, on 30 April 2019 - 05:13 AM, said:

Because it is a Serious Sam mod???

No, because it puts you against hordes as I previously stated.

l2e1 and you are fighting multiple assault troopers, octabrains, enforcers, assault commanders and serioussam light things.

[Mark]

I was pleased with what we did graphically with HH Rethinked. But then I see these videos and it makes HHR look like it was made with an Etch-A-Sketch tablet.

[MusicallyInspired]

spessu_sb, on 01 May 2019 - 03:47 PM, said:

No, because it puts you against hordes as I previously stated.

l2e1 and you are fighting multiple assault troopers, octabrains, enforcers, assault commanders and serioussam light things.

Yes because it's a mod for a Serious Sam game. That's what he's getting at.

[Tea Monster]

fuegerstef, on 30 April 2019 - 05:13 AM, said:

Because it is a Serious Sam mod???

I mean, otherwise one could "mod" for example the Unreal Engine 4 with DN3D like gameplay and DNF visuals and call it Duke Nukem - Reloaded Rebooted, or so.

Now that we know that the 'ban' on modding was never really a thing, then there is nothing stopping people from actually doing this. You need to find a team who can put the time and effort in and know a modern engine.

Or, just tweak Sydroid's port to mimic DN3D or DNF's movement and monster AI.

[Yatta]

This is so cool. I wish Syndroid would post here!

[gemeaux333]

Maybe an inspiration for a new Duke game

[----]

spessu_sb, on 01 May 2019 - 03:47 PM, said:

No, because it puts you against hordes as I previously stated.

*sighs*



Sorry, I forgot I am on the internet, which is now open to everyone ...

[Jimmy]

Tea Monster, on 02 May 2019 - 10:20 AM, said:

Now that we know that the 'ban' on modding was never really a thing, then there is nothing stopping people from actually doing this. You need to find a team who can put the time and effort in and know a modern engine.

Or, just tweak Sydroid's port to mimic DN3D or DNF's movement and monster AI.

Gearbox has always said the ban is on monetization.

Although I still wouldn't fully trust their word.

[Tea Monster]

I've been told that the attitude is "We won't ban you, just don't tell everyone". That doesn't sound very reassuring. Oh well. I'm just annoyed at how much damage the initial wrong information may have done to the modding community. Plus, it would have been cool to be able to play Cataclysm. A lot of people put some good work into that mod.

Anway... Here is a prop I'm working on for Serious Duke 3D at the moment.

[Solais]

In general, most game companies, that don't explicitly say they don't allow their content being used in mods, is with the opinion that using content for modding is okay unless the mod or fanwork is monetized. Of course, the fanwork can also become commercially viable due to its sheer quality and fame even if it's not monetized, so that can also end up with a DMCA (see: what happened to the Another Metroid 2 Remake project).

In general, in the Serious Sam modding community, everything goes and nobody is really worried about copyright, even if using content made by blacklisted companies. In the history of SS modding, only once there was a copyright issue with a Warhammer 40K TC in the works. (BTW, Croteam is also officially on the stance that all content of their games can be used for modding as long it's not monetized.)

[johnnythewolf]

Solais, on 11 May 2019 - 12:50 AM, said:

Of course, the fanwork can also become commercially viable due to its sheer quality and fame even if it's not monetized, so that can also end up with a DMCA (see: what happened to the Another Metroid 2 Remake project).

Oh god, why did you have to remind me of that?

Solais, on 11 May 2019 - 12:50 AM, said:

In general, in the Serious Sam modding community, everything goes and nobody is really worried about copyright, even if using content made by blacklisted companies. In the history of SS modding, only once there was a copyright issue with a Warhammer 40K TC in the works. (BTW, Croteam is also officially on the stance that all content of their games can be used for modding as long it's not monetized.)

I seem to also remember reading about a StarCraft total conversion for Serious Sam 2 meeting the same fate.

EDIT: Yep, I recalled correctly. I am surprised its ModDB page still exists after all these years, though.

[MusicallyInspired]

I recall an interview with Reggie where the interviewer asked about AM2R. Reggie kept saying "we feel that when you monetize..." and the interviewer stated clearly that it wasn't monetized after that and wasn't planned to but Reggie kept repeating that term stubbornly over and over. I don't know what they call "monetization" but it seems to be a more liberal definition for at least Nintendo than what one generally would think. Others might too.

[Solais]

Fun fact: AM2R development is actually well alive. The game was released on the internet at the end, and a group of fans have reverse engineered and finished up the game. It's currently at version 1.4.3, with a huge respriting project in the works to make every piece of sprite and tileset 100% unique and not ripped from any game. (Search for AM2R reddit for more info.)

Also, wow, never knew about a SC TC for TSE. And here I thought I knew about all the SS projects of the past (and present). Though the oldies always talked about a plethora of mods and TCs that were never finished.

[----]

What, Solais is here on Duke4 now? That's cool

Totally missed that.

[johnnythewolf]

Solais, on 12 May 2019 - 12:35 AM, said:

Fun fact: AM2R development is actually well alive. The game was released on the internet at the end, and a group of fans have reverse engineered and finished up the game. It's currently at version 1.4.3, with a huge respriting project in the works to make every piece of sprite and tileset 100% unique and not ripped from any game. (Search for AM2R reddit for more info.)

I did not know that. Thanks!

But what do you mean, they finished up the game? I have yet to beat it myself, but I was under the impression that it was released as a complete product before Nintendo had it taken down.

[MusicallyInspired]

Yeah, it was finished. Was a terrific experience from beginning to end too. There were some planned addons that the original designer was going to put out before Nintendo shut him down, though. I don't know if that's what he meant. Maybe just bug fixing and refining?

[Solais]

Yeah most of those planned addons were added, as one of the devs streamed the unreleased version 1.2, and the current team added those additions. Besides other planned things and indeed fixes.

[johnnythewolf]

Still, you would think that now that Nintendo released its own Metroid II remake and probably made a profit out of it, they would allow AM2R to be distributed again.

[MusicallyInspired]

You underestimate Nintendo's protectiveness of its brands. It rivals that of Disney itself. They've shut down so many fan projects over the years. There was a Zelda Link's Awakening remake a while back, then most recently a Super Mario Bros port to the C64. The C64.

[Tea Monster]

johnnythewolf, on 13 May 2019 - 02:08 AM, said:

Still, you would think that now that Nintendo released its own Metroid II remake and probably made a profit out of it, they would allow AM2R to be distributed again.

It dosen't work like that.

Part of copyright is that the copyright holder is seen to be defending the brand. That is what a lot of this protectionism amongst fan projects is. So that if they get into a legal debate over the IP in the future, they can trot out these examples illustrating that they were actively defending their brand against 'interlopers'. Is a fan-based mod really going to hurt Nintendo? Of course not. If they get into a tussle later on with an actual competitor, Nintendo's opponents could point to the fan project being allowed to exist as Nintendo letting their copyright 'lapse'. Idiotic legalese, yes, but that's how it works.

[johnnythewolf]

I guess it depends on the company; Capcom, for instance, seems to be perfectly fine with fan projects.

[Tea Monster]

Yup, and id used to deliberately write their code with ease of modding in mind.

[OpenMaw]

On the other hand... Sega not only allowed the Sonic community to make their own stuff, but went on to hire at least one person to work on newer old-school outings.

Other examples would of course be the interplay between id, Raven, Valve. Either directly supporting content creators, even cultivating talent to work for them. In a way it's a healthy means of having workshops that cultivate the talent for you.