[MajorTom 2417]

Looks.....mildly interesting. A "World Tour" is something that fan-made mods have already covered, but I'm willing to give this one a shot---as long as Randy the pussboy isn't in charge of the whole project.

Honestly, I'm more intrigued by the flamethrower---will the other scrapped weapons from Duke 3D make a return as well? It'd be interesting to finally see the laser chainsaw in action....

[necroslut]

Major Tom, on 27 August 2016 - 05:30 AM, said:

Looks.....mildly interesting. A "World Tour" is something that fan-made mods have already covered, but I'm willing to give this one a shot---as long as Randy the pussboy isn't in charge of the whole project.

Honestly, I'm more intrigued by the flamethrower---will the other scrapped weapons from Duke 3D make a return as well? It'd be interesting to finally see the laser chainsaw in action....

I don't think the laser chainsaw would have functioned much different from the freezer with shorter range (and no freeze effect). The freezer is pretty much a short-range gun already because of its slow projectiles.

[HiPolyBash]

For those hoping for a return to the classic style alien ass kicking hero Duke looks like you're shit outta luck. He's still a douche here too!

[MetHy]

PsychoGoatee, on 26 August 2016 - 10:49 AM, said:

But as mentioned, they made an excellent and very well received by fans add-on for Doom 2, No Rest For The Living. If you want to get a sneak peak at critiquing this developer's skill at oldschool level design, you could always play it. I agree with the aesthetic critiques everybody is making, but I think the levels will be a lot of fun to play, and probably have well done architecture as well.

I haven't criticized the level design, as in layout, architecture, etc because we don't really see anything of that.

But the lighting, the lighting is terrible. And the skyboxes. And the sprites. Well, it's all been mentioned already.

But if you want to talk level design, when looking at the screenshots of the british street, and also the red bridge, I've very scared of the issue of sprites getting in the way of gameplay. This is something that many usermaps are guilty of, and which have no place in a professional add-on.

Also, for the Battlelord picture in what looks like an arena taken straight out of Redneck Rampage, there doesn't seem to be any cover for the player. But it may be a mock-up screenshot anyway, so I won't bother.

I honestly have a hard time to believe these screenshots are "leaked". This is viral marketing. One week before release, just when the website is up, the screens have no HUD, and they conveniently show new stuff while showing their "improvement" over the most iconic places of the original game too.
If an unfinished flamethrower is what they want to show for advertisement, allow me to be very skeptical at the state of the final product.

[Fox]

MetHy, on 26 August 2016 - 02:16 AM, said:

Earlier I had a theory that modern devs are not skilled for retro 2.5D FPS because it's a completely different way of making a game. This only comforts me in my opinion.

I don't think that's true. Modern developers underestimate the amount of work it takes to make a game like this. The original authors created 3D models and everything to make the textures. It feels like Gearbox asked if some intern wanted to try MS Paint in exchange for some pocket change.

[necroslut]

Maybe I'm reading too much info this, but doesn't all this hypebuilding seem a bit excessive for what would amount to yet another Duke 3d re-release/expansion? That "hidden" wordpress page had headers for pre-order among other things, with just one tab among others being "World Tour"... Is there a possibility that World Tour isn't all that's going to be announced next week?

[PsychoGoatee]

necroslut, on 27 August 2016 - 10:50 AM, said:

Maybe I'm reading too much info this, but doesn't all this hypebuilding seem a bit excessive for what would amount to yet another Duke 3d re-release/expansion? That "hidden" wordpress page had headers for pre-order among other things, with just one tab among others being "World Tour"... Is there a possibility that World Tour isn't all that's going to be announced next week?

I don't wanna get my hopes up, but that would be very cool. If they announce a new game it'll still be years away though I think.

[Mr. Tibbs]

If releasing Duke 3D on digital platforms with a new episode is the only thing Gearbox are doing with the Duke licence, then I would be both unsurprised and disappointed. Given Nerve's history, I think they'll do a good job, but it's crazy to think that in 2016, Shadow Warrior is receiving a relatively big-budget sequel but Duke's truly stuck in the past.

As long as they don't announce Duke as a Battleborn character then there's still hope!

[Robman]

because Shadow Warrior is awesome, that's why.

[Mr. Tibbs]

Robman, on 27 August 2016 - 02:03 PM, said:

because Shadow Warrior is awesome, that's why.

Hey, I love Shadow Warrior! It's just licence-wise and in terms of brand awareness, I would think Duke would have much more appeal, and at least receive a mid-size budget for a comparable product.

Maybe the endless litigation put all future efforts on hold?

[Robman]

Mr. Tibbs, on 27 August 2016 - 02:08 PM, said:

Maybe the endless litigation put all future efforts on hold?

It would seem so.

[PsychoGoatee]

It's just timing, gotta look more long term. I have no idea why a Duke re-release happening currently makes people think a new Duke game won't come. Technically speaking, the gap between Shadow Warrior and the reboot was longer than the gap between Duke 3D and DNF. The previous ligitation stuff may have delayed things, but we have no reason to currently think all future Duke efforts are on hold.

[Sledgehammer]

Fox, on 27 August 2016 - 06:48 AM, said:

I don't think that's true. Modern developers underestimate the amount of work it takes to make a game like this. The original authors created 3D models and everything to make the textures. It feels like Gearbox asked if some intern wanted to try MS Paint in exchange for some pocket change.

Considering that modern Sonic Team can't make classic physics in Sonic game (they proved it by their poor Sonic 1 GBA port attempt which ironically was done right by a fan who is working now on Sonic Mania), I have exactly the same thoughts as MetHy.

Seriously, the same EDuke32 has way better lighting and EDuke32 is non-commercial product. Talented people of duke4 could make a better job because they love Duke and don't treat him like shit or some cheap cashgrab garbage. Gearbox could easily use sprites from alphas/betas, for example. They have all DN3D data which they can use in the new episode, why not to use old data no one saw if you're too cheap or lazy to bother with new 3D models? You have to agree that it would take less time and money just to reuse already existed sprites, even if improving is necessary, it still wouldn't take too much effort. Moreover, Gearbox have DNF and a lot of other data which they could use for sprites too and I think people wouldn't complain. That was pretty good idea to make better qality sprites as well what was already mentioned in this thread, no need to make 3D models of the already existing enemies.

[TerminX]

I gave them some limited beta stuff to use for this but I don't know where they went with it.

The maps are clearly the best part of what new content there is.

BTW, last I saw their episode and port you could still use the software renderer. All the levels have sector shading and lights compatible with Polymer parameters as far as I know.

I do think there are some reasons for hardcore Duke3d fans to pick this up, though I would probably violate some agreement or another by saying what those reasons are just yet. There is definitely one aspect to the new episode that anyone posting in this thread has yet to even come close to touching on.

[Sledgehammer]

Well, it sounds interesting. Maybe that's about music? I can see people getting it solely for music.

And does it mean that you have nothing to do with this anymore? That's too bad if so, Gearbox need some direction to make Duke 3D episode on the level of the rest if not above.

[Hank]

If it comes with an up-to-date (spell) reliable Build Editor, I'll get the upgraded Duke Nukem game, because this (mapping) is my main draw towards Duke.

[xMobilemux]

The reason could be anything, from a Duke 5 tease to some segments & content referencing the cut DNF builds.

[Loke]

Hank, on 27 August 2016 - 03:30 PM, said:

If it comes with an up-to-date (spell) reliable Build Editor, I'll get the upgraded Duke Nukem game, because this (mapping) is my main draw towards Duke.

Something similar to Doom Builder and I could see the mapping scene exploding with new mappers.

[xMobilemux]

Oh god the meme writing is already affecting him!!

[PsychoGoatee]

Luckily, I don't think that oddball twitter promotional account is a reflection of what Duke will be like ingame. It's kind of like that weird Sonic the Hedgehog twitter account. Can be funny though.

I gotta say, I'm pretty excited about this Duke news, the internet is useless without Duke news. Why else do I use this thing? (Don't speculate on that )

[Micky C]

Loke, on 27 August 2016 - 04:07 PM, said:

Something similar to Doom Builder and I could see the mapping scene exploding with new mappers.

What's so special about Doom Builder? I just had a super quick search and it looks insanely similar to mapster32.

Then again I didn't pay much attention to the interface, which now that I think about it needs to be brought into the 21st century.

[Hank]

Loke, on 27 August 2016 - 04:07 PM, said:

Something similar to Doom Builder and I could see the mapping scene exploding with new mappers.

A lot of people worked on that one.

For now I would be quite happy to know Gearbox is supportive towards the modding community. We'll see soon enough.

[Daedolon]

Doombuilder is great, but it has nothing on M32.

[TerminX]

I did some further consulting on the product after mending relations with Gearbox but didn't actively develop or test the product further at that time.

I don't know if this comes with a new map editor. I know that if it does, it didn't exist a few months ago and wasn't used to create the new maps. Mapster32 works.

Gearbox is showing me a deep desire to improve relations with the community here.

BTW, if my posts seem shorter or non-existent lately, it's because I'm attempting to get over a very unfortunate illness at the moment.

[MusicallyInspired]

If Gearbox (specifically Randy) wants to mend relationships with Duke's fans they've really got to stop with all the fluff and "look how awesome we are, guys!" nonsense. Just be real. Talk real. I don't know if he knows how to do that or not (unless he's flaming somebody on Twitter), but that's what bugs me about him the most. He seems too slimy and just....fake. I think I can believe that some where deep down he wants to do good by everyone and he knows it. But he's just not showing that. I don't know if that's just business getting in the way or what but he's just not been forthcoming at all. Starting right from when DNF was about to launch. They kept showing off the game showing off the game and whenever hard questions were asked like "will there be fully-featured dedicated servers?" or "will we have the console?" or "will we have mod tools?" they just kept skirting around the issue. Just tell us outright. Stop trying to protect our feelings. This is why we hate Gearbox.

I'm willing to accept that DNF is not entirely Gearbox's fault and that 3DR/Broussard/Triptych were to blame for the bizarre and inconsistent tone. They had a big chance with DNF (and HTTKC, too) to prove to fans that they had their best interests at heart and they blew it. Basically they have just one more with this. And that's only because of your comments and opinion in speaking up for their benefit, TX. That's literally it. If you weren't on good terms with them I'd be having nothing to do with them. So this is what they need to do. 1) Stop being fake. Be direct and upfront. We can take it. We're adults. 2) Bring back what was cool about Duke. The tone of the original game, not bizzaro-land DNF whose tone was way off and seemed more like a parody comedy game with action rather than an action game with parody comedy in it.

[HiPolyBash]

PsychoGoatee, on 27 August 2016 - 04:21 PM, said:

Luckily, I don't think that oddball twitter promotional account is a reflection of what Duke will be like ingame.

I do. Did you play Duke Nukem Forever or Borderlands 2? Randy and Gearbox just don't get Duke - there's a difference between being cool and having the occasional tongue in cheek witty line (come get some, eat shit and die) and spouting shit like 'porkchop sandwiches' and 'bazinga'. The Twitter posts so far reinforce this 'I think I felt it move', 'my nuts blocked out the explosion', are you fucking kidding me? There's the difference between elements of sexuality and humor and rampantly throwing shit against the wall and making that the selling point of what you're doing.

This is who you're dealing with:


I'll probably get downvoted for this but I honestly thing they should consult George Broussard and Scott Miller when it comes to the character of Duke himself. They should be attached at some sort of producer level in addition to Pitchford and the Gearbox guys. I doubt it'll ever happen but the direction for Duke in all the past games that we loved came significantly from George and Scott and at the very least acting as advisers or low level producers could help direct the character in the right way. They know the franchise best, Duke Forever was unfortunate but from all accounts it was the rushed effort between Gearbox and Triptych that resulted in what was delivered.

I don't dismiss that this re-release could include some cool new maps or have interesting elements to it but stop throwing the character and the style of the franchise away in favor of 'meme' humor and just plain stupid shit. Duke has always had lines in reference to films but they were cool. There's a difference between referencing Terminator and Army of Darkness v. Team America, or some dumb shit you saw online once upon a time. Duke as a character is a bad-ass, some of what he says can be humorous or tongue in cheek. Bolting around spouting nonsense is against the established character though Randy and Gearbox seem to believe otherwise as apparently their only exposure to the character was the ventrilo harassment Balls of Steel video.

this: https://www.youtube....h?v=q-02TbygSAc and this: https://www.youtube....h?v=TDlB2P1leRM

compared to Gearbox who delivered this:
https://www.youtube....h?v=m7gkn6WQ44M and this : https://www.youtube....h?v=AUUNxniYm5o

This: http://img14.deviant...nkd-d7ofzzn.jpg and this: http://guidelive.img...ke-nukem-3d.png

compared to this: https://upload.wikim...ukemForever.jpg

[PsychoGoatee]

HiPolyBash, on 27 August 2016 - 07:26 PM, said:

I do. Did you play Duke Nukem Forever or Borderlands 2? Randy and Gearbox just don't get Duke

I guess it's all good since the news doesn't hit for a week, but I wish there was a seperate topic for this. Like I said earlier, we've had years to discuss every aspect of DNF in detail, and we have. I personally like the humor in DNF, I'm sorry, but I like it, and I don't find it un-Duke like either. That said I think another Duke game could/should have a tone less fully comedic than DNF, but comedy is still key. And we've discussed this topic too at length, for years. I think it's odd to lay Duke's evolution after Duke 3D on Gearbox, considering games like Land of the Babes existed in the 90s. Duke went fully campy and comedy right away. The 2001 DNF trailer made it look like they were going to marry some of that Duke humor to a Half-Life esque serious/badass invasion narrative, which appeals to fans, and I could see a new game going for that tone and it working. But campy/comedy Duke games were around long before DNF, and I personally like the comedy in DNF.

Granted, here we're literally talking about Duke 3D, so I could see making sure to want the humor to fit. Though even with the Plutonium Pack (Atomic Edition) episode, Duke got more notably comedic/wacky. So if this episode is a bit more wacky in tone, that's also not unexpected. But of course, there's more to Duke than just comedy, and any of us die hard fans could type up pages on what we'd like to see in a new Duke game. And we have, and will continue to do so of course. Anyways yes I like DNF. I bet I'll like Duke 3D World Tour also. It's all personal taste in entertainment. I also like Borderlands 2 by the way.

As for posting the tweets, like I said, my guess is that nutty weird promotional twitter account isn't representative of how Duke will be in game. Just a hunch, doesn't seem like the tweets are even trying for Duke's voice, it's just an amusing promotional thingy. As for consulting somebody, as mentioned Allen Blum is in that building still as far as we know.

[Jolteon]

TerminX, on 27 August 2016 - 05:21 PM, said:

BTW, if my posts seem shorter or non-existent lately, it's because I'm attempting to get over a very unfortunate illness at the moment.

Sorry to hear about that. I hope you get better soon.

[HiPolyBash]

There's nothing wrong with comedy or being 'wacky' but that has always been a much smaller element of the franchise. Even in Time To Kill and Zero Hour it was never a constant barrage of jokes. Bad-ass first, humor second. Having the entire universe revolve around everyone saying outrageous shit and Duke never shutting his mouth kills any balance between the two. The earlier iterations of Duke Nukem Forever were clearly more serious but the humor was there and that's great, humor is an important part of the franchise but not constantly and not in the way Gearbox and Randy seem to think so. As I said above it feels more as if they saw the Balls of Steel Ventrilo Harassment video and just went on from there as far as character progression goes when it comes to humor..

All that can really be done is attempting to stay mildly optimistic. The maps look interesting at the very least and perhaps if this leads to a hint to the production of a new Duke game the community can have a certain level of influence on it if it steers way too hard into the comedic focus as Duke Forever did.

[PsychoGoatee]

HiPolyBash, on 27 August 2016 - 07:51 PM, said:

There's nothing wrong with comedy or being 'wacky' but that has always been a much smaller element of the franchise. Even in Time To Kill and Zero Hour it was never a constant barrage of jokes. Bad-ass first, humor second. Having the entire universe revolve around everyone saying outrageous shit and Duke never shutting his mouth kills any balance between the two. The earlier iterations of Duke Nukem Forever were clearly more serious but the humor was there and that's great, humor is an important part of the franchise but not constantly and not in the way Gearbox and Randy seem to think so. As I said above it feels more as if they saw the Balls of Steel Ventrilo Harassment video and just went on from there as far as character progression goes when it comes to humor..

All that can really be done is attempting to stay mildly optimistic. The maps look interesting at the very least and perhaps if this leads to a hint to the production of a new Duke game the community can have a certain level of influence on it if it steers way too hard into the comedic focus as Duke Forever did.

Just for the record, are you under the impression Gearbox made the single-player Duke Nukem Forever game? They didn't. I mean who knows how much was re-written or whatever after they got it, but it seemed like Tryptych (the 3DR guys) were finished up that game, while Gearbox got another team to make them multiplayer and port it. But either way, I already agreed with you, I said we'd like to see something like the 2001 trailer, yes. That said I'd rather see a game like DNF than a game like Zero Hour (kind of a generic Duke game though was fun enough), but that's all personal taste.


Definitely feel better soon by the way TerminX!