[MetHy]

HulkNukem, on 20 September 2014 - 08:07 PM, said:

Kind of weird that it would seemingly be the 3rd floor but its clearly high up based on the other buildings.

If you check the end of development thread we discussed this but no good solution was possible to this. For instance, in some floors it's a prerogative that the player dies if he falls, and that wouldn't have been the case if some floors were at their realistic height. Also, in Construction Destruction Cage used enemies on outdoor platforms that go up after some time, which would have been more of a pain to make if one could see the road. Also, there is the question of the cars and other details that I put in the first floor which you would have to put on at least half of the floors as well. Also, it really wouldn't have fit and looked good if the building was realisticly sized, ESPECIALLY on the rooftop and that would have also mean rethinking the whole 'alien-ships going around' thing in the rooftop map, which would mean re-thinking an important gameplay idea for the sake of a small cosmetic detail for the sake of 'realism'. etc etc etc

There was just too many issues with the matter and it really wasn't worth the trouble especially considering how minor the difference would have been and that it would have only been cosmetic.
Not to mention that we thought players wouldn't expect such degree of realism in Duke Nukem 3D and it's a given you get small things like this when playing the/a game.

[Paul B]

GUYS!!!! I AM VERY EXCITED TO SHARE THIS WITH YOU !!!

I've been in correspondence with THE Level Lord Gray! And I just sent him this letter 10 minutes ago:

Hi there,

So a team of faithful Duke Nukem 3D mappers have gotten together to release a new episode for Duke Nukem. Downloadable from here: http://www.moddb.com/mods/duke-hard I wasn’t sure if I should mention this to you or not. Which is why I have been holding off messaging you. Anyway, the MOD is really only playable using a ported version of Duke Nukem called Eduke downloadable from here: http://dukeworld.duk...ke32/synthesis/ and extracted to the Duke3d Install directory.

After all these years this game still holds a substantial fan base thanks to your inspiration and vision mapping. On a rainy day in Russia, if you feel yourself reminiscing about previous game engines fire this mod up and give it a shot. There are quite a few talented mappers still in the community and this is a good single collection. It would be a honour to the mapping community to hear your feedback.

It was your mapping skills that pulled me into a mapping marathon many years ago and I still play around with it to this day always trying to achieve your vision and standards while I map.

I know you’re more of a fan of the classic Sin game. Unfortunately, that game I never really played therefore I don’t have any idea of what I am missing. It is cool to have the opportunity to reach out to someone who was so close to the initial action and success of the original game. 15 years ago this would never have been a possibility.

Take care,

-Paul

P.S An another amazing MOD can also be seen here url: http://www.moddb.com...e-nukem-forever with in game video clips.



Here was his reply:

LevelLord "I'm getting ready to leave for a few weeks but I will try to check these soon!!!"


How awesome is that to have YOUR WORK REVIEWED by one of the original mappers of the game! I will share his remarks here once he plays it. This is such an honour!

[MetHy]

Well that's cool I guess (I've always wondered if old 3DR members like him or Broussard still played the DN3D usermaps made these days..) but personally I don't particularly care unless it's a detailed pro in-depth review about my work (like a teaching reviewing a student's essay), but I doubt anyone would have enough time or care enough to do this for every map...

Now, if he made a usermap instead of playing our crap, THAT would be something.

[High Treason]

Not necessarily, I often wonder if the original mappers came back would they be any good by today's standards? Things have changed a lot since 1996, they might also have adapted to more modern gameplay mechanics in a level and struggle to adapt back to the Duke 3D design style . On the other hand, they were born to do this stuff and might make something awesome, we may never know... Still, Levelord potentially playing this mod is cool.

I hate to sound like "one of those people" but, guys, you know what would be totally cool, right? If as many of the original level designers as possible got together and did their own CBP in secret, LDBP (Level Designers Build Project) - then released it as a surprise, imagine that.


Regarding NightFright's request. OK from my standpoint as you wouldn't be tampering with my map, but I don't speak for everyone else on the project. Perhaps you should contact them more directly?

[MetHy]

High Treason, on 21 September 2014 - 11:21 AM, said:

Not necessarily, I often wonder if the original mappers came back would they be any good by today's standards? Things have changed a lot since 1996, they might also have adapted to more modern gameplay mechanics in a level and struggle to adapt back to the Duke 3D design style . On the other hand, they were born to do this stuff and might make something awesome, we may never know... Still, Levelord potentially playing this mod is cool.

I am sure that Levellord could make in one day a map on par with the best maps of the original game (=a map that blows away most of the user-crap we make). I think most maps in the original game were made pretty quickly (we might know for sure soon with the alphas and betas)

[HulkNukem]

MetHy, on 21 September 2014 - 09:16 AM, said:

If you check the end of development thread we discussed this but no good solution was possible to this. For instance, in some floors it's a prerogative that the player dies if he falls, and that wouldn't have been the case if some floors were at their realistic height. Also, in Construction Destruction Cage used enemies on outdoor platforms that go up after some time, which would have been more of a pain to make if one could see the road. Also, there is the question of the cars and other details that I put in the first floor which you would have to put on at least half of the floors as well. Also, it really wouldn't have fit and looked good if the building was realisticly sized, ESPECIALLY on the rooftop and that would have also mean rethinking the whole 'alien-ships going around' thing in the rooftop map, which would mean re-thinking an important gameplay idea for the sake of a small cosmetic detail for the sake of 'realism'. etc etc etc

There was just too many issues with the matter and it really wasn't worth the trouble especially considering how minor the difference would have been and that it would have only been cosmetic.
Not to mention that we thought players wouldn't expect such degree of realism in Duke Nukem 3D and it's a given you get small things like this when playing the/a game.

It was totally fine to me honestly; if you ignore the floor number on the stairwell, you could just think of it as Duke walks up the stairwell until he gets to a locked gate; so while it may seem he was walking up just to the next floor, he actually made it about 4 or 5 floors before finally facing a locked gate.
If it was suppose to be a more realistic and actual structurally sound building, the maps wouldn't have their own unique themes.
I just had a chuckle the first time I noticed the floor level height. =)

[TheDragonLiner]

Hi everyone !!

I'm having a weird problem with the mod :/

I've arrived at the end of the 7th level in Come Get Some difficulty for my very first playthrough and when I end the level it sends me back to the title screen o_O
And nothing has unlocked
I've downloaded the mod from DukeWorld and I have the r4593 version of Eduke32.
First I thought it was because the mod was still being built but I've seen HighTreason's let's play and he went further than me meaning my first thought was wrong ...

Any idea how I could solve this problem ?
Thanks in advance for replying ^^

[MetHy]

Hey, though your comment on MODDB is still waiting admin approval, I answered you :

Quote

That's really weird, that has never happened to anyone, and I just tested it using the latest EDuke32 and a fresh install and it works with no problem.

Did you use a cheat or something to go level07? That could explain it.

If you're still getting the issue, the only workaround I can think for you atm is to use a cheat to go to map08. While in game, type "DNSCOTTY108" and it will send you to level08.

I did test with r4593 as well.
Maybe you have custom con files in your root EDuke32 folder?

[TheDragonLiner]

What ? I don't have any account on ModB O_o

Anyway wouldn't cheating for going to the next level annul the unlocking process or something ?

And as for the folder I don't have any CON files, all I have are some .CFG files and some other but I used a fresh EDuke install, I didn't add it to my original EDuke folder (I always do that everytime I get a new mod) and so when I first launched it I chose to use the internal default as it asked me :/

[MetHy]

Damn. If two people report this problem, that means this is actually a common issue.... and I have no idea what is causing it and I can't reproduce it.

... Internal defaults? That must be what is causing the problem then, it shouldn't be asking that. Try saying 'no' when it's asking that.

[TheDragonLiner]

If the previous people wasn't asked to use internal defaults then I'm pretty sure it's not necessarily the origin of the problem, you should ask that person about that just in case ...

And I'll try what you said but I think that if I say "no" it will either launch DN3D but in pure vanilla AKA ignoring the mod but since it asks that only the first time you try launching it with a mod I'll have to re-install it but that won't be troublesome. I'll report back once I'm done testing this solution ^_-

[MetHy]

I just tried again using a fresh intall in a new folder with r4593 and it's not asking me whether I want to use internal defaults or not and it works perfectly.

I'm pretty sure that's where the issue comes from somehow, the original game has 7 levels in the first episode (including faces of death) which would explain why it stops after level7.

I don't really understand though, if it uses the internal default, shouldn't the player get nothing at all ? The map filenames aren't named after the original game's filenames after all.

[TheDragonLiner]

Ah yes now you're talking I never thought about that ...

I'm pretty sure the internal default as EDuke calls them must be a rendition of the unmoded DN3D and it adapts it with the new DEF file of DukeHard, I haven't tested your previous suggestion yet but I'll tell you guies whenever I'll be done trying.

[High Treason]

I'm sure I remember Duke3D having some weird code to prevent E1L8 ever being loaded... Because that slot is used for User Maps.

Though I have no idea what's going on here.

[Daedolon]

Whenever EDuke32 suggests using the internal defaults (which are the unmodified 1.5 CON files from 1996), it means it has found an error in the CON files and simply cannot "build" them for gameplay. This is suggesting you're running a version of EDuke32 that doesn't support Duke Hard (anything prior to r4525) or that the download or installation has corrupted in a weird way.

Can you pastebin your eduke32.log file? Just try to launch the game and click no on the internal defaults, then open the file in a text editor and paste the contents.

[TheDragonLiner]

Now that's even weirder O_o

I've tried re-installing Eduke on a freshly created folder and I brought in the RTS and GRP file as usual then I put Duke Hard's folder and unlike my very first attempt it didn't ask me to use internal default !

I tried launching the mod using the 2 methods you have described in its readme and both worked while on my very first attempt trying to launch it via the custom game directory would end up telling me to buy the game on GOG and launching the game by extracting Duke Hard directly into EDuke had worked ...

I'm being confused right now, I did exactly like the very first time I put the mod and none of the problem I had faced (telling me to buy the game or the internal default) occure now and I assure you I used a fresh EDuke from the zip file (I didn't use an Eduke taken from another moded game).
There must be something I have forgotten to do or something :/
I should try playing up to level 7 from that new attempt I made and see if anything weird comes up ...

[MetHy]

You don't have to play the levels again, simply type "DNSCOTTY108" in game and you'll know for sure it works.

[TheDragonLiner]

Sorry for double posting.


I've just tried and cheated to get to level 7, I beat the level normally and it still sends me back to title screen and this time I tried my new installment which didn't ask me to use internal default ...
Do you think the latest version of EDuke can somehow comunicate with any other EDukes of the same version ? Since I now have two different Duke Hard moded game, one that had asked me to use internal default and one that didn't.


Edit : sorry you replied while I was typing XD but I've done what you told me and the result is the same on both installments.


Edit 2: sorry I didn't read your comment correctly I now have tried typing DNSCOTTY108 in order to go to the following level and guess what, it sends me to the title screen again. And before you tell me I've tried typing SCOTTY109 instead in order to go to level 9 and it did work but the problem is that I jump a level which is not our objective here ...

[MetHy]

So only level8 doesn't work then. I'm sorry but I don't think the problem comes from the episode, there is nothing wrong on our side.

Try using another version of EDuke32, like r4525 or above
http://dukeworld.duk...ke32/synthesis/

[TheDragonLiner]

But I am using version 4593, which is above the version that is required

Maybe I should try using precisely the 4525 version but I have no idea how I could find this specific version, and yet it's not sure that it would make things any different :/

I'm going to show you my 2 Eduke logs just in case you might spot something as Daedolon said :

Here's the log from my very first attempt installment (the one where it asked me to use internal default and I said "yes") :

EDuke32 2.0.0devel r4593 (32-bit)
Compiled Sep 7 2014 11:17:13
Using C:/Program Files (x86)/EDuke32 - Duke Hard 1/ for game data
Windows 7 Service Pack 1 (build 6.1.7601)
Initializing SDL system interface (compiled against SDL version 2.0.3, found version 2.0.3)
Using "windows" video driver
Searching for game data...
Using C:/Program Files (x86)/EDuke32 - Duke Hard 1/dukehard/ for game data
Using "DUKE3D.GRP" as main game data file.
Using file "dukehard.dat" as game data.
Compiling: EDUKE.CON (175 bytes)
Including: GAME.CON (151190 bytes)
Including: DEFS.CON (35992 bytes)
Including: USER.CON (45482 bytes)
GAME.CON: In actor `ORGANTIC':
GAME.CON:3967: warning: found `else' with no `if'.
GAME.CON: In state `pigshootenemystate':
GAME.CON:5890: warning: found `else' with no `if'.
Including: bin/dukehard1.con (3146 bytes)
Including: bin/dukehard2.con (10411 bytes)
Including: bin/dukehard3.con (13268 bytes)
Found 2 warning(s), 0 error(s).
Resizing code buffer to 19129*4 bytes
Script compiled in 222ms, 19121*4b, language version 1.4+
2026/11264 labels, 356/2048 variables, 3/512 arrays
142 quotes, 61 strings, 12 events, 207 actors
Initialized 49.2M cache
Loading "duke3d.def"

Definitions file "duke3d.def" loaded.
Using RTS file "DUKE.RTS".
Initializing OSD...
Switching keyboard layout from 0000040C to 00000409
0 joystick(s) found
Executing "settings.cfg"
Disabling desktop composition...
Setting video mode 1024x768 (32-bpp fullscreen)
OpenGL Information:
Version: 2.1.2
Vendor: NVIDIA Corporation
Renderer: GeForce 6150SE nForce 430/PCI/SSE2
Opened "dukehard/textures" as cache file
Initializing music...
Initializing sound... 32 voices, 2 channels, 16-bit 44100 Hz
Cache time: 143ms
Cache time: 217ms
E1L9: COMMERCIAL BREAK

Wrote eduke32.cfg
Wrote settings.cfg
Switching keyboard layout from 00000409 to 0000040C



And here's the log of my new installment (the one in which it didn't ask me to use internal default) :

EDuke32 2.0.0devel r4593 (32-bit)
Compiled Sep 7 2014 11:17:13
Using C:/Program Files (x86)/EDuke32 - Duke Hard 2/ for game data
Windows 7 Service Pack 1 (build 6.1.7601)
Initializing SDL system interface (compiled against SDL version 2.0.3, found version 2.0.3)
Using "windows" video driver
Searching for game data...
Using C:/Program Files (x86)/EDuke32 - Duke Hard 2/dukehard/ for game data
Using "DUKE3D.GRP" as main game data file.
Using file "dukehard.dat" as game data.
Compiling: EDUKE.CON (175 bytes)
Including: GAME.CON (151190 bytes)
Including: DEFS.CON (35992 bytes)
Including: USER.CON (45482 bytes)
GAME.CON: In actor `ORGANTIC':
GAME.CON:3967: warning: found `else' with no `if'.
GAME.CON: In state `pigshootenemystate':
GAME.CON:5890: warning: found `else' with no `if'.
Including: bin/dukehard1.con (3146 bytes)
Including: bin/dukehard2.con (10411 bytes)
Including: bin/dukehard3.con (13268 bytes)
Found 2 warning(s), 0 error(s).
Resizing code buffer to 19129*4 bytes
Script compiled in 216ms, 19121*4b, language version 1.4+
2026/11264 labels, 356/2048 variables, 3/512 arrays
142 quotes, 61 strings, 12 events, 207 actors
Initialized 49.2M cache
Loading "duke3d.def"

Definitions file "duke3d.def" loaded.
Using RTS file "DUKE.RTS".
Initializing OSD...
Switching keyboard layout from 0000040C to 00000409
0 joystick(s) found
Executing "settings.cfg"
Disabling desktop composition...
Setting video mode 1024x768 (32-bpp fullscreen)
OpenGL Information:
Version: 2.1.2
Vendor: NVIDIA Corporation
Renderer: GeForce 6150SE nForce 430/PCI/SSE2
Opened "dukehard/textures" as cache file
Initializing music...
Initializing sound... 32 voices, 2 channels, 16-bit 44100 Hz
Cache time: 154ms
Cache time: 82ms
E1L7: STORAGE WARS
CLIPPING: OFF
Map "" not found or invalid map version!
Cache time: 86ms
CLIPPING: ON
Map "" not found or invalid map version!

Wrote eduke32.cfg
Wrote settings.cfg
Switching keyboard layout from 00000409 to 0000040C



I think I already saw the problem as I'm typing this, I'm pretty sure you have as well after reading these but I'll wait to see you're opinion first, I don't want to risk saying something silly since I'm not as tough as you guies in informatics ^^

[MetHy]

thedrawliner, on 30 September 2014 - 02:42 AM, said:

But I am using version 4593, which is above the version that is required

Maybe I should try using precisely the 4525 version but I have no idea how I could find this specific version, and yet it's not sure that it would make things any different :/

Yes please try r4525, that's what I meant. This issue has only been reported recently so I have a feeling there is something wrong with EDuke32's version r4593. Though I can't reproduce the issue myself even when using r4593...

[TheDragonLiner]

Okay I'll try, I think I've managed to get my hands on the 4525 version from dukeworld somehow, I'll report back when I'm done trying.


What I'm going to do is that I'll install the mod with this Eduke on another new folder and I'll show you the EDuke log if I encounter the same problem as with my other 2 attempts, in the mean time be sure to check out my logs from my previous comment ^^

[TheDragonLiner]

I've tried and IT FREAKING WORKED !!!

I've cheated for level 7, 8 and 9 and also tried cheating for level 7 then beat it with dnclip and it also worked I'll show you my log at the end of my comment still just in case, it might help you found a problem by comparing it with the previous ones.

You were right it looks like it's a problem with the latest version and BTW 4525 didn't ask me to use internal default.
Yet again my scepticism has failed me ...


So here's the log with 4525 :

EDuke32 2.0.0devel r4525 (32-bit)
Compiled Jun 22 2014 19:36:47
Using C:/Program Files (x86)/EDuke32 - Duke Hard 3/ for game data
Checking for updates...
Connecting to http://eduke32.sourceforge.net
Current version is 0... no updates available
Windows 7 Service Pack 1 (build 6.1.7601)
Initializing SDL system interface (compiled against SDL version 2.0.3, found version 2.0.3)
Using "windows" video driver
Searching for game data...
Using C:/Program Files (x86)/EDuke32 - Duke Hard 3/dukehard/ for game data
Using "DUKE3D.GRP" as main game data file.
Using file "dukehard.dat" as game data.
Compiling: EDUKE.CON (175 bytes)
Including: GAME.CON (151190 bytes)
Including: DEFS.CON (35992 bytes)
Including: USER.CON (45482 bytes)
GAME.CON: In actor `ORGANTIC':
GAME.CON:3967: warning: found `else' with no `if'.
GAME.CON: In state `pigshootenemystate':
GAME.CON:5890: warning: found `else' with no `if'.
Including: bin/dukehard1.con (3146 bytes)
Including: bin/dukehard2.con (10411 bytes)
Including: bin/dukehard3.con (13268 bytes)
Found 2 warning(s), 0 error(s).
Resizing code buffer to 19129*4 bytes
Script compiled in 216ms, 19121*4b, language version 1.4+
2026/11264 labels, 356/2048 variables, 3/512 arrays
142 quotes, 61 strings, 12 events, 207 actors
Initialized 49.2M cache
Loading "duke3d.def"

Definitions file "duke3d.def" loaded.
Using RTS file "DUKE.RTS".
Initializing OSD...
Switching keyboard layout from 0000040C to 00000409
0 joystick(s) found
Disabling desktop composition...
Setting video mode 1024x768 (32-bpp fullscreen)
OpenGL Information:
Version: 2.1.2
Vendor: NVIDIA Corporation
Renderer: GeForce 6150SE nForce 430/PCI/SSE2
Opened "dukehard/textures" as cache file
Initializing music...
Initializing sound... 32 voices, 2 channels, 16-bit 44100 Hz
animvpx: rate is 30 frames / 1 seconds (30.000 fps).
VP8 timing stats (mean, max) [ms] for 3 frames:
read and decode frame: 2.33, 3
3 planes -> packed conversion: 2.33, 3
upload and display: 5.00, 5
Cache time: 148ms
E1L1: LOBBY
JETPACK NOT FOUND YET!
Cache time: 89ms
E1L8: EAT THE RICH
/music/cars.mid. Use SHIFT-F5 to change.
Cache time: 82ms
E1L7: STORAGE WARS
CLIPPING: OFF
Cache time: 80ms
E1L8: EAT THE RICH
Cache time: 109ms
E1L9: COMMERCIAL BREAK

Wrote eduke32.cfg
Wrote settings.cfg
Switching keyboard layout from 00000409 to 0000040C

[TheDragonLiner]

Oh hell things are starting to get realy weird now ...

I've made some other attempts first with a 4th installment using the latest version 4593 and it worked as well but only if I cheat to get to level 8, if I try by beating level 7 it sends me back to title screen.

Then I've tried again with my very first installment and cheating for level 8 worked while it used not to O_o and beating level 7 still send me to title screen.

My third installment, the one with 4525 still works fine though.


I have absolutely no idea what's going on, I swear that the prolems I had with my first try keep on dissapearing as I'm doing new attempts on my 2dn, 3rd and 4th installments o_o

[MetHy]

A 3rd person reported the same problem on MODDB and a 4th directly asked MrRumbleRoses.

Thanks for letting us know that r4525 works though, that way I can tell people to use that until the issue is fixed. (since I don't get the issue myself I couldn't make sure on my own)

BTW I had anticipated this kind of things :

DukeHard.txt said:

4) FAQ


Q : The episode doesn't work, what do I do ?!
A :
[...]
Perhaps by the time you've downloaded the episode, EDuke32 has gone through an update which create a conflinct with this old episode (that's unlikely, but we never know).
If you're from the future, you can try downloading the version we used to make and test the episode (revision 4525, which you can find from the above link).
[...]

[TheDragonLiner]

I remember seeing this in the ReadMe file but I overlooked it since the episode worked until that 8th level shenanigan, I interpreted your anticipation as in the episode not launching at all or being very glitchy which was not my case on any of my 4 different installments.

[NightFright]

You could move the whole episode to the "Shrapnel City" slot, then such problems definitely shouldn't occur. Even though I gotta say I also had no problems playing the mod, and I was certainly using an EDuke32 build newer than the one recommended.

Might also be something that got broken in more recent EDuke32 snapshots, so maybe that should be investigated.

[MetHy]

NightFright, on 30 September 2014 - 05:39 AM, said:

You could move the whole episode to the "Shrapnel City" slot, then such problems definitely shouldn't occur.

It definitely seems to be something that broke in r4593, or else we would have heard about it before. Also there was no way I could have guessed, so by this logic, we should have sticked to vanilla compatibility to make sure we don't use something that breaks at some point for a while.

I'm sure the issue will be fixed shortly anyway.

[TheDragonLiner]

I believe I'm capable of doing something like that since I had to do something similar for my Nuclear Winter add-on since the instructions I had found didn't work but it needed me to change some CON lines via the notepad and I'm scared of doing something like this again, and I'm too lazy to change the files of the GRP as well. And yet Duke Hard only has a DAT file which is useless for me for doing that since I can't open it :/

I agree with you more on the second half of your comment though ^^


BTW I've played up to level 11 and nothing weird happened with the 4525 EDuke, I think I'll delete my other installments now the problem is solved somehow.
Although I can still keep my other installments in order to test things out and provide more EDuke logs to you guies but thou are so strong in informatics that you'll probably manage to hit the spot nevertheless ^_-

edit : my comment replies to NightFright

[NightFright]

.dat is a zipfile, you can easily open it with programs like 7-Zip. If needed, you can rename its ending to .zip before.

I played Duke Hard around end of August, so I must have used r4575 since I am always running stuff with latest snapshot available (unless I know something's broken with newest versions). It definitely worked with that one still. In general, I can recommend using that build for now especially to those who want to run the game with voxel support in 8-bit because this also stopped working later on.