[Malgon]

I was just about to post that video here Lunick! It's pretty nice work.

[Doom64hunter]

Lunick, on 17 April 2016 - 11:38 PM, said:

UH OH...


This actually makes it the second lowest rated Bethesda published product on Steam

Funnily enough, now that the initial rage period is over, the more positive, more well-thought through reviews are rising to the top of the list.

[Inspector Lagomorf]

Doom64hunter, on 18 April 2016 - 05:02 AM, said:

Funnily enough, now that the initial rage period is over, the more positive, more well-thought through reviews are rising to the top of the list.

It's a well-shaped, sweet-smelling piece of shit as opposed to just shit?

This is inevitable. If you make a sequel to the Doom franchise, you are carrying all of the baggage, all of the expectations, all of its rabid old-school fans into present day who are expecting to relive that same Doom experience they had back in 95, and to a lesser extent, the justice done to the series with Doom 3. As a standalone game it's probably great. As a Doom sequel, well, that's a horse of a different colour.

You will never never never live up to that hype. Publishers realize it. In the short run it's great because it gets them immediate sales from the name brand value, like Star Wars: Force Awakens. In the long run, it's not so good if your product is mediocre, like Batman vs. Superman.

[icecoldduke]

I always wanted to know how the door sound was made for the original doom. I know ID grabbed Foley effects from some generic sound effects package, but does anyone know how the door sound was actually made?

[Bloodshot]

 HulkNukem, on 17 April 2016 - 03:51 PM, said:

Pretty sure that was just used as an example for Snapmap custom game modes.

It was listed as a gamemode with its own configs in the alpha leak

[leilei]

 icecoldduke, on 18 April 2016 - 06:48 AM, said:

I always wanted to know how the door sound was made for the original doom. I know ID grabbed Foley effects from some generic sound effects package, but does anyone know how the door sound was actually made?

By clipping off Sound Ideas #6039.26's "SPACE MOTOR, MALFUNCTIONING" sound. That's how Bobby Prince "made" the sound, just by taking Mike McDonough's work.

[Inspector Lagomorf]

 leilei, on 18 April 2016 - 09:20 AM, said:

By clipping off Sound Ideas #6039.26's "SPACE MOTOR, MALFUNCTIONING" sound. That's how Bobby Prince "made" the sound, just by taking Mike McDonough's work.

That sound was also in an episode of Rugrats.

[icecoldduke]

 leilei, on 18 April 2016 - 09:20 AM, said:

By clipping off Sound Ideas #6039.26's "SPACE MOTOR, MALFUNCTIONING" sound. That's how Bobby Prince "made" the sound, just by taking Mike McDonough's work.

My question is how that sound was made, what was the process at the time for making that sound?

[Mr. Tibbs]

Man, everyone hates this! Top-rated review on Steam:

Quote

DOOM (2016) feels like "Bruce Lee with a shotgun on a skateboard" says Id.
DOOM (2016) feels like "Master Chief with a squirtgun on a shopping cart" says me.

Eurogamer

Quote

Rather than feeling like a throwback to days of old, the sad fact is Doom feels like a generic first-person shooter wearing a Doom skin. id has tried its best to appeal to two markets by adding modern mechanics to an arena shooter, but by doing so its alienated its core audience and produced a shooter modern gamers will find mediocre at best.

Total Biscuit says that Doom is suffering from an identity crisis. It has no idea what it is anymore. Just an unwieldy of COD, Blacklight Retribution, and Halo, lacking any identifiable personality of its own.

[Micky C]

 Mr. Tibbs, on 18 April 2016 - 12:52 PM, said:

Man, everyone hates this! Top-rated review on Steam:

Eurogamer

Total Biscuit says that Doom is suffering from an identity crisis. It has no idea what it is anymore. Just an unwieldy of COD, Blacklight Retribution, and Halo, lacking any identifiable personality of its own.
http://www.youtube.c...h?v=ztdKziK_aAs

Doesn't sound unlike what people were saying about DNF. At the very least this doesn't have regen health and a two weapon limit, and at least claims (but we'll see) to have some degree of non-linear level design. It'll be interesting to see how the campaign turns out. Although the campaign trailer is essentially all about quicktime event-like takedowns and stuff which doesn't tell us much about the gameplay as a whole.

[Mark]

After watching the multiplayer video I yawned and thought to myself " just another Quake 3 or Unreal Tournament 2003 but with better graphics". No excitement for me. I had a blast playing those online against friends and family years ago but it does nothing for me. I prefer the single player game now.

[Micky C]

Well it's worse than that. Apparently you can't pick up new weapons (except one) and there's universal ammo which are odd choices. And then the weapon balancing is quite poor.

[xMobilemux]

I guess when it comes to the real Doom multiplayer we'll just have to allow the Snap Mappers to build us the Classic Doom multiplayer modes & maps if what that SnapMap announcement video tells us is true, we can modify game logic to make those kinds of matches.
I mean if we can create Single Player levels then surely we'll get to create Multiplayer levels where we can have access to all weapons at once, specific ammo and what not.
I'm guessing the Multiplayer that Certain Affinity made was just for the Halo/CoD casuals while SnapMap was made so the Hardcore Doom fans can make the multiplayer matches they've always wanted cause buggered if the devs do.

 deuxsonic, on 16 April 2016 - 09:09 PM, said:

I downloaded that mod last night and love it, though it has made me love this mods version of the Doom 2016 Shotgun a lot so I hope the actual Doom 2016 shotgun can live up to it.

I can not for the life of me figure out how to work that damn HUD mod, nor combine this with the Brutal Doom gore mod.

[deuxsonic]

 Micky C, on 18 April 2016 - 03:05 PM, said:

Well it's worse than that. Apparently you can't pick up new weapons (except one) and there's universal ammo which are odd choices. And then the weapon balancing is quite poor.

The gauss is the only new weapon in single player? Also, universal ammo? In the same way that Deus Ex: Invisible War did it?

[Balls of Steel Forever]

 deuxsonic, on 18 April 2016 - 05:56 PM, said:

The gauss is the only new weapon in single player? Also, universal ammo? In the same way that Deus Ex: Invisible War did it?

It's more like quake live,
(infact alot like quake live)
Which I really like, I'm more excited for the single player though.
I've played multiplayer games way more then ever deemed necessary,
and the single player might actually offer a new experience.
Or just refresh my nostalgia, which would slightly disappoint me, but also be absolutely fine.

[deuxsonic]

 Balls Of Steel Forever, on 18 April 2016 - 07:36 PM, said:

It's more like quake live,
(infact alot like quake live)
Which I really like, I'm more excited for the single player though.
I've played multiplayer games way more then ever deemed necessary,
and the single player might actually offer a new experience.
Or just refresh my nostalgia, which would slightly disappoint me, but also be absolutely fine.

I mean for single player though.

[xMobilemux]

 deuxsonic, on 18 April 2016 - 05:56 PM, said:

The gauss is the only new weapon in single player? Also, universal ammo? In the same way that Deus Ex: Invisible War did it?

I don't think universal ammo is in Single Player, I watched the E3 demo and noticed that once Doomguy gets the double barrel shotgun and he kills those demons upstairs, he goes to collect 2 of those Yellow Ammo boxes, it's easy to miss, but you'll notice on the boxes that one has an image of 3 Shotgun shells and the other has 4 Bullets, it's further evident by the notification texts that show up on the right side of the screen.



I think they should change the color of the boxes to suit the ammo for the guns.

[Tea Monster]

Why have we seen unending hours of MP, but only 3 or so singleplayer vids, to the point where everyone thinks that the MP *IS* the game?

[Inspector Lagomorf]

 Tea Monster, on 19 April 2016 - 02:15 AM, said:

Why have we seen unending hours of MP, but only 3 or so singleplayer vids, to the point where everyone thinks that the MP *IS* the game?

Probably because the developers think the MP is more fun to design. And the MP is much, much more likely to outlast the SP aspect of the game.

Kind of ironic considering DooM's immortal level editing community.

 icecoldduke, on 18 April 2016 - 10:19 AM, said:

My question is how that sound was made, what was the process at the time for making that sound?

Sound engineers are very resourceful. It could have been anything. It could even have been a slide whistle played into a hollow container like a bottle.

[Kathy]

 xMobilemux, on 18 April 2016 - 03:44 PM, said:

I'm guessing the Multiplayer that Certain Affinity made was just for the Halo/CoD casuals while SnapMap was made so the Hardcore Doom fans can make the multiplayer matches they've always wanted cause buggered if the devs do.

Except SnapMap is extremely limited compared to proper modding, which propelled Doom to immortality. If it's true and the game won't have proper mod tools, it's a failure from the get go. Although, I'm not sure Zenimax/id is that stupid.

[Tea Monster]

As has been pointed out numerous times before, the id we grew up with and what carries the logo today are completly different beasts.

[icecoldduke]

 Kathy, on 19 April 2016 - 04:47 AM, said:

Except SnapMap is extremely limited compared to proper modding, which propelled Doom to immortality. If it's true and the game won't have proper mod tools, it's a failure from the get go. Although, I'm not sure Zenimax/id is that stupid.

While true I think it will open the doors for new modders to join the doom community(depending on how well its designed).

[Kathy]

 Tea Monster, on 19 April 2016 - 04:52 AM, said:

As has been pointed out numerous times before, the id we grew up with and what carries the logo today are completly different beasts.

If you're talking about modding, then I don't see any reasoning in shallow modding other that corporate need of control.

 icecoldduke, on 19 April 2016 - 04:52 AM, said:

While true I think it will open the doors for new modders to join the doom community(depending on how well its designed).

SnapMap is not the issue, lack of alternative is.

[OpenMaw]

 Kathy, on 19 April 2016 - 05:08 AM, said:

If you're talking about modding, then I don't see any reasoning in shallow modding other that corporate need of control.

He's talking about if you're expecting old school id's attitude regarding modding and modding support, than you're barking up the wrong tree, because none of those people are there anymore. NONE of the old guard. Notta one.

So yes, it is now a corporation concerned with profit and keeping things in tight control.

[Tea Monster]

^ This.

Carmack shepherded the RAGE tools through and the BFG source code release.

He's now working for Facebook

[Bloodshot]

I don't really think modding was a focus even during RAGE's development.

ID Tech 5's pipeline (and megatexture) is not at all something you would create if user accessibility was the goal. And considering Carmack had come up with snapmap originally, it seems like he was looking for an alternative way to create something for users to produce content with.

Especially with how powerful engines need to be this day and age to be on the bleeding edge, if you aren't using an existing engine and you want proper mods you better be sure from day one everything is designed from the ground up to facilitate that ease of use and user friendliness. Corporate lockdown is not the only factor.

On top of that, I sincerely doubt every software engineer at ID working right now is sitting there going FUCK CLASSIC ID DEVS AND THEIR LEGACY HEHE LETS PURPOSELY LOCK PEOPLE OUT OF EVERYTHING HEHEHEH. Some of these people have been there since doom 3/quake 3. Hell the marketing guy has been at ID since 97.

[Doom64hunter]

I really don't think Snapmap is some diabolical attempt at controlling modding for future games. I'm more leaning on the view that it's an experiment to see how a more accessible yet restrictive level editor will fare against a more traditional one with the general public. ( The restrictiveness being the tradeoff for accessibility). Part of that experiment is to see if it's a viable feature to attract potential customers of course, and they're probably going to measure that through the amount of map submissions on their servers.

The fact of the matter is that offering traditional modding tools to the public is extra work without much in terms of compensation, and due to the complexity of today's engines, they are rarely even used by anyone. (As was the case with Rage)
People would rather just go back to the original Doom than to hassle with an unknown and complex level editor, since the tools for the original games are both open and very accessible, have years worth of documentation as well as a plethora of freely available resources and features to choose from.

Now Snapmap could also turn out to be a whole lot of extra work without any sort of compensation (even more so than through the traditional way), but that's pretty much the nature of an experiment. If it flops, I'm sure we won't see it in future Id games.
And because of the overblown negative reception of the Open Beta, I've got a feeling that it indeed will flop. I can already see the horders of comments (on Steam that is) saying that it's not a true level editor and therefore, because of that single reason it's somehow completely 100% shit.
(Even though most people probably wouldn't raise their voice against Forge in the Halo games, for example)

In principle, there's nothing preventing the release of both Snapmap and the traditional tools. But since both cost time, effort and money to prepare, it was probably a choice between either one or the other.
(or neither, as was the case with The New Order)

[Jblade]

Quote

The fact of the matter is that offering traditional modding tools to the public is extra work without much in terms of compensation, and due to the complexity of today's engines, they are rarely even used by anyone. (As was the case with Rage)
People would rather just go back to the original Doom than to hassle with an unknown and complex level editor, since the tools for the original games are both open and very accessible, have years worth of documentation as well as a plethora of freely available resources and features to choose from.

This is a good point and one a lot of people ignore - the reality is that modding nowadays is pretty restricted to older games because if you have the skill level to make stuff for newer games you'd be much better off just joining an indie team and making your own game that you can actually sell. The only real exception to this is games like Skyrim/Fallout because modding is so insanely popular that you can at least reach a wide audience to view your work even if you're not making money from it.

also from what I keep hearing, newer id tech games need a render farm to make the levels which modders don't have access to.

[PsychoGoatee]

I loved the beta for the record, lot of fun! And I'm very optimistic for the single-player by id, that should be good times killing those demon bastards. And I also look forward to messing around with SnapMap. Bring on May 13th!

[Marphy Black]

 Bloodshot, on 19 April 2016 - 09:21 PM, said:

I don't really think modding was a focus even during RAGE's development.

In RAGE's case, id heavily touted the fact that the game "will support modding and level design right out of the box", frequently stating that it would be simple as entering "id studio" in the game console to access the all of their tools that are built in to the engine. Then the game released, and people quickly found console command didn't work, and then they immediately disabled the game console.

Not to disagree with your assertion that id doesn't care about modding, however. Their recent BFG Edition re-release of Doom 3 took a title that was exceptionally accessible and open to modding and managed to fully strip it of these capabilities.