[Kodai]

Hi all,

I have to admit, that I cant seem to find the option in the sound setup to enable the playing of the MIDI music. I looked over the forums, and I see threads on MIDI out on Linux, but not the Windows version. I know I can download the Sound Canvas 4.0 pack, and I have. It sounds good, but not quite the same as a real SC-55. Right now I have to play the GoG version to use my SC-55, but I'd like to figure out out to get EDuke32 to do this so I can have the best in audio and video. Could somebody direct me to the thread that explains how to enable this?

[TerminX]

Have you checked out the driver to use BASSMIDI as a system MIDI device, located at http://kode54.net/bassmididrv/? That should do what you need.

That pack you downloaded (assuming you have the one from sc55.duke4.net) was recorded on an actual SC-55, though, so I'm not sure why it would sound different for you.

[Kodai]

Well, BASSMIDI is kinda of a soft driver for a midi port. In reality, its a limited softsynth version of my real hardware synth. The problem I'm having is the game does not have give me the option to select midi. My system already has a working midi port with my USB to midi adapter, so BASSMIDI would do nothing for me unless it unlocks some hidden feature in EDuke32 to allow midi out. Its almost like the windows version of EDuke32 has no ability to support midi music.

As far as the difference in sound quality from the real device vs the sound pack in concerned, I think mainly lies in the fact that the sound pack is compressed where as my real device is of course not. Its not a huge thing, but I can tell that there is a slight loss in tonal quality in the extreme highs and lows of the music when I compare them. Not to mention, I can tweak a few things on the real unit that you just cant do with a recording.

[High Treason]

I think EDuke uses the MIDI Mapper. You'll have to remove the music pack. You need to go to the Start menu, Settings, Control Panel and open Multimedia... It may be a little different if you are using Windows Vista/7 and if you are on Windows 8 I simply can't help you as I've no idea how that one works. The applet might be called Sounds and Audio Devices or something.

There should be a tab for MIDI somewhere in the applet, on that tab you should be able to set MIDI output to your external MIDI device (If you're using one of those USB adaptors I have no idea if it actually will appear in there) and press OK. It appears this tab is just called "Audio" in Windows XP, I only ever really use MIDI in Win98 because XP has a lack of functionality there so I'm a bit rusty on the exact procedure.

If all goes to plan, that should make it work.

[Kodai]

High Treason, on 02 August 2013 - 12:42 AM, said:

I think EDuke uses the MIDI Mapper. You'll have to remove the music pack. You need to go to the Start menu, Settings, Control Panel and open Multimedia... It may be a little different if you are using Windows Vista/7 and if you are on Windows 8 I simply can't help you as I've no idea how that one works. The applet might be called Sounds and Audio Devices or something.

There should be a tab for MIDI somewhere in the applet, on that tab you should be able to set MIDI output to your external MIDI device (If you're using one of those USB adaptors I have no idea if it actually will appear in there) and press OK. It appears this tab is just called "Audio" in Windows XP, I only ever really use MIDI in Win98 because XP has a lack of functionality there so I'm a bit rusty on the exact procedure.

If all goes to plan, that should make it work.

Ummm, I'll try to rewrite the issue. My computer works fine with midi. EDuke32 itself, does not seem to have a option to select any sort of sound. On the setup screen, there are options for Video, and Input. Nothing at all for sound. I was looking to see if there is an option via the .cfg files to enable midi out. I just don't see it. Also the EDuke32 package doesnt seem to have the midi files so I copied them over from the old Duke3d directories. So I just cant figure out how to force EDuke32 to use the midi files instead of the recorded sounds.

For future reference, starting with Vista (and following through with Win 7 and 8) Microsoft removed the midi mixer options from Windows all together. The generic midi drivers are still installed, and Windows still uses the lame Microsoft GS samples, but Windows itself will no longer provide an interface for the user to adjust midi settings. The user now has to use whatever third party software that comes with their midi device to make those adjustments or via a DAW of somesort. Soundfont packages like BASSMIDI also allow those sort of adjustments.

As for the USB to midi cable, all modern versions of Windows have generic HID drivers that work with them and some of the better quality cables provide advanced drivers.


***EDIT***

I just found out on another forum that EDuke32 does not have the ability to chose sound devices, so that means I can't use my SC-55 with it as it can't use midi at all. Oh well, it would have been nice to have great upgrades to the video without taking a loss to overall sound quality. But I guess thats the cost of progress. Thanks for the help anyway.

[High Treason]

Seems that there is no MIDI tab, I was peeved enough in Windows XP with the reduced functionality, increased latancy and other annoyances, seems there is now another thing broken in Windows 7 (I already don't like the lack of a volume mixer outside of the Levels tab which is no good for realtime mixing), bloody brilliant.

In short, EDuke uses whatever the default MIDI device is set to in Windows, but as you can't set those thanks to microsoft, it does indeed appear you won't be able to do what you want.

I didn't know much about this if I am honest, I never moved from Windows 98 with my MIDI and Audio gear due to the reduced functionality in XP and I certainly haven't used USB cables as they are more latent than my Yamaha and Roland MIDI cards... This works for me because my gear is from the 80's/90's, I even had an SC-55 but as my SCC-1 sounds the same I sold that, was always more of a Yamaha man anyway.

EDuke will play MIDI though, this is why you have to remove the music pack, this is the only way to make it play midi files. It might be wise to try disabling the HRP too as that has a dummy music definition in it, you might be lucky and find it sends to your external device but it'll more than likely use the crappy Microsoft synth - just a little bit of trivia, it only has GM samples and does not respond to a single GS SysEx instruction.

[TerminX]

Kodai, on 02 August 2013 - 03:50 AM, said:

Ummm, I'll try to rewrite the issue. My computer works fine with midi. EDuke32 itself, does not seem to have a option to select any sort of sound. On the setup screen, there are options for Video, and Input. Nothing at all for sound. I was looking to see if there is an option via the .cfg files to enable midi out. I just don't see it. Also the EDuke32 package doesnt seem to have the midi files so I copied them over from the old Duke3d directories. So I just cant figure out how to force EDuke32 to use the midi files instead of the recorded sounds.

For future reference, starting with Vista (and following through with Win 7 and 8) Microsoft removed the midi mixer options from Windows all together. The generic midi drivers are still installed, and Windows still uses the lame Microsoft GS samples, but Windows itself will no longer provide an interface for the user to adjust midi settings. The user now has to use whatever third party software that comes with their midi device to make those adjustments or via a DAW of somesort. Soundfont packages like BASSMIDI also allow those sort of adjustments.

As for the USB to midi cable, all modern versions of Windows have generic HID drivers that work with them and some of the better quality cables provide advanced drivers.


***EDIT***

I just found out on another forum that EDuke32 does not have the ability to chose sound devices, so that means I can't use my SC-55 with it as it can't use midi at all. Oh well, it would have been nice to have great upgrades to the video without taking a loss to overall sound quality. But I guess thats the cost of progress. Thanks for the help anyway.

What? All of the MIDI files are in DUKE3D.GRP and they are the only music played unless you explicitly install some kind of digitized music pack. Whoever told you anything otherwise is smoking crack. That's like claiming DOOM doesn't support MIDI/MUS because they exist as lumps in the WAD instead of as files on disk. Makes zero sense whatsoever.

Anyway, it looks like Vista and up removed the dialog to select the default MIDI device, but you can try using this thing to specify which device Windows uses to play the MIDI: http://www.benryves....ducts/vistamidi

[Hendricks266]

High Treason, on 02 August 2013 - 04:35 AM, said:

In short, EDuke uses whatever the default MIDI device is set to in Windows, but as you can't set those thanks to microsoft, it does indeed appear you won't be able to do what you want.

It's definitely possible to select which MIDI device you want from C even up to Windows 8. The issue is programming that into EDuke32.

[Kodai]

Well, I found out how to set my default windows device using regedit. Tested it after the edit and it works fine no matter what midi module I've hooked up to the other end of the usb to midi cable. Still no go. And TerminX, I used Dragon UnPACKe to unpack my GRP and extract the midi's from there. I knew that if they were in there, then taking them out and dumping them in with the music files wouldn't work, but it was worth a shot. I dropped a fresh copy of EDuke32 Latest without any extras (no autoload folder, no HRP, no sound packs, etc), and it is still a no go. I know the GRP is a good one, as its the GOG version and in dosbox it outputs just fine to my SC-55. It just doesn't want to do it with EDuke32. I think I'll just have to deal with it and use the dosbox version when I just really want that cleaner sound vs the HRP, extras, and good keyboard and mouse support of EDuke32. If nothing else comes of this, then I at least have at least made Windows take whatever module I'm running on the usb to midi cable as my default, so thats something.



On a sidenote to High Treason, I'm very much a Yamaha guy. I love my MU2000EX. That and my MT-32 (gen1 aka old) are my goto game modules. I also like to toss in the TG100 and SC-55 from time to time. The reason I wanted to use the SC-55 with Duke is because its pretty much the only major game that was ever published that strictly used the original first gen SC-55 by the composers. Yeah, the midi's are plain jane GM's, but the 2nd and 3rd gen of the SC-55 (not to be confused with the MkII) had some very minor tweaks to make them fully GM compliant. This has been reported to have the slightest difference in playing back the Duke midi's, and thats why the very first gen SC-55 is the preferred module of choice for Duke. The very first version of the SC-55 came out at almost the exact same time as the GM1 standard. Roland had been working on the SC-55 while working on the GM standard with the rest of the industry leaders, and launched the production weeks before the GM1 standard went into play. So after that first batch was finished they tweaked it a bit to meat the final specs of GM1. You can tell which gen the SC-55 is by looking at the front. If it just says SoundCanvas and GS on the bottom center its gen1. If its has a GM next to the GS and its still in the bottom center its gen2 and if its got the GS and GM symbols to the right under the ALL and MUTE buttons its gen3. Mine is a gen1, so thats why I wanted to use it with EDuke32. Like I said before its a wee bit better sounding than the recordings.