Duke4.net Forums: PSX Slightly Higher Quality Sound Pack - Duke4.net Forums

Jump to content

  • 2 Pages +
  • 1
  • 2
  • You cannot start a new topic
  • You cannot reply to this topic

PSX Slightly Higher Quality Sound Pack  "Ported from Total Meltdown"

User is online   Marphy Black 

#1 Posted 15 October 2012 - 10:39 AM

Greetings, Duke4.net forums! I'd like to share with you all the preliminary release of a small project I've been working on. As I'm sure many of you already know, the PlayStation port of Duke 3D, Total Meltdown, features slightly higher quality voice clips for Duke compared to the original PC sounds. This is due to the fact they were only downsampled to 11,025 Hz while the PC's were downgraded to 8,000 Hz. While the difference isn't huge, these PSX voice clips are still a genuine improvement that I believe were more than worth porting over to the PC as an EDuke32 mod.

However, just to be thorough, I ported not only Duke's voice clips, but a total of 150 PSX sounds that I was able to conclusively identify as having a matching analogue in the PC version. Unfortunately, this doesn't mean all 150 sounds are of greater quality as several do match the PC's sample rates. Nonetheless, I can guarantee the quality is at least of equal or greater value. There's still quite plenty of subtle improvements to be heard, particularly noticeable in things like the Pig Cop's recog sound and the squish effect. So for now, here's the download:

http://www.mediafire...SXSoundPack.rar (1.85 MB)

This sound pack is currently packaged to run as an independent EDuke32 mod, but you'll probably want to implement it with something like HRP or DukePlus as it complements them well and is compatible. Simply follow the appropriate installation instructions found in the included text file. Also, if you're interested in some of the technical findings, I left a few comments in sounds_psx.def for the curious to allow the enabling/disabling of certain sounds to achieve a more/less accurate emulation of the PSX experience.

This post has been edited by RinyRed: 16 October 2012 - 04:15 AM

11

User is offline   Fox 

  • Fraka kaka kaka kaka-kow!

#2 Posted 15 October 2012 - 11:02 AM

How did you managed to get the proper sampling rate? With the program I am using right now I am forced to set it manually for each sound.
0

User is online   Marphy Black 

#3 Posted 15 October 2012 - 02:49 PM

Unfortunately, with the tools we have (I used PSound, in particular), we don't have any precise way of knowing what the exact sample rates are supposed to be. PSound scans for the audio data without that information, so forcing a sample rate is necessary. However, I played Total Meltdown quite a bit before I began ripping the files to figure out how everything actually sounds in-game. Most everything in the port sounds identical in speed and pitch to the PC version, so it was mainly trial and error trying to guess what the intended sample rate of each sound was supposed to be. Thankfully, most of the PSX sounds simply used the typical 8,000 or 11,250 kHz sampling rates, so it was just a matter of checking between those two values. To be absolutely certain my selected rates were correct, I compared the PSX sound lengths with the PC originals and found them to be virtually identical.

The two exceptions to this were GLASHEVY and SQUISH as they play much slower and at a lower pitch in this port. Apparently the developers didn't properly resample these sounds, but their error works in our favor as we can now play them back at the proper, higher quality sample rate which is closer to 22,500 kHz.
0

User is offline   LeoD 

  • Duke4.net topic/3513

#4 Posted 15 October 2012 - 03:02 PM

38kbps is very low, even for 11KHz IMO. Would you mind providing us a WAV version, too?
Btw, your OGG encoder es pretty old. Try this one or LamXP if you don't like command line tools.

This post has been edited by LeoD: 15 October 2012 - 03:04 PM

1

User is online   Marphy Black 

#5 Posted 15 October 2012 - 03:54 PM

Thanks for that encoder. I used Audacity to convert the files to ogg, which wasn't my first choice, but my original program failed to open the wave files. This worked like a charm.

Anyway, I wanted to release this pack using the original uncompressed wave files, but I just couldn't get them to function in EDuke32. The wave files work, the file paths are correct, and the definitions are set. However, they simply didn't play in-game when I run the content in EDuke32. It seemed like the program was totally ignoring my files. No errors show up in the log either. It was only when I converted the wave files to ogg and replaced all instances of ".wav" with ".ogg" in the def file did the sounds begin to work. Does EDuke32 not support uncompressed wave files? Oddly enough, if I copy the ogg versions to the same directory as the wave file versions (i.e. both ogg and wave files are in the same folder), the sounds suddenly work even though the def file is explicitly pointing to the wave files. Is this a bug? If anyone could help solve this issue, I'd be grateful. This is the non-functioning wave file version:

http://www.mediafire...undPack_wav.rar (3.77 MB)

This post has been edited by RinyRed: 15 October 2012 - 03:55 PM

1

User is offline   LeoD 

  • Duke4.net topic/3513

#6 Posted 15 October 2012 - 04:24 PM

Concerning the bitrate I wasn't quite right it seems. 11KHz mono yields no more than 38-43kbps at OGG quality 7, indeed.
I can't tell for sure if Audacity's (2.0.2) built-in OGG encoder is really that old but the tag they put into the OGG implies it.
About the WAVs: Maybe they still have some inconvenient headers. You could try Foobar2000's convert function to 'convert' them to 16bit stereo and see what happens ingame then.

This post has been edited by LeoD: 16 October 2012 - 07:26 AM

0

User is offline   TerminX 

  • el fundador

  #7 Posted 15 October 2012 - 04:27 PM

View PostRinyRed, on 15 October 2012 - 03:54 PM, said:

Thanks for that encoder. I used Audacity to convert the files to ogg, which wasn't my first choice, but my original program failed to open the wave files. This worked like a charm.

Anyway, I wanted to release this pack using the original uncompressed wave files, but I just couldn't get them to function in EDuke32. The wave files work, the file paths are correct, and the definitions are set. However, they simply didn't play in-game when I run the content in EDuke32. It seemed like the program was totally ignoring my files. No errors show up in the log either. It was only when I converted the wave files to ogg and replaced all instances of ".wav" with ".ogg" in the def file did the sounds begin to work. Does EDuke32 not support uncompressed wave files? Oddly enough, if I copy the ogg versions to the same directory as the wave file versions (i.e. both ogg and wave files are in the same folder), the sounds suddenly work even though the def file is explicitly pointing to the wave files. Is this a bug? If anyone could help solve this issue, I'd be grateful. This is the non-functioning wave file version:

http://www.mediafire...undPack_wav.rar (3.77 MB)

There are a few different types of .WAV files... make sure you're not using anything ADPCM.
0

User is offline   Fox 

  • Fraka kaka kaka kaka-kow!

#8 Posted 15 October 2012 - 06:19 PM

If anyone is interested, I have listed all the sounds ripped from the PMP files. It shows the first map they appeared on.

Spoiler

1

User is online   Marphy Black 

#9 Posted 16 October 2012 - 04:38 AM

View PostTerminX, on 15 October 2012 - 04:27 PM, said:

There are a few different types of .WAV files... make sure you're not using anything ADPCM.
My sounds are 16-bit mono uncompressed PCM wave files with sample rates of 8,000, 11,025, or 22,050 Hz. I've checked and double checked. You can also confirm this for yourself with the rar file I posted. EDuke32 doesn't acknowledge them in any way and doesn't produce any errors in the log. It's not an issue with my definitions as the def files for my ogg and wave versions are completely identical aside from the respective use of ".ogg" and ".wav" extensions. I just can't see anything wrong on my end.
0

User is offline   LeoD 

  • Duke4.net topic/3513

#10 Posted 16 October 2012 - 06:44 AM

View PostRinyRed, on 16 October 2012 - 04:38 AM, said:

My sounds are 16-bit mono uncompressed PCM wave files with sample rates of 8,000, 11,025, or 22,050 Hz. I've checked and double checked. You can also confirm this for yourself with the rar file I posted.
Confirmed, the files are OK.

View PostRinyRed, on 15 October 2012 - 03:54 PM, said:

Oddly enough, if I copy the ogg versions to the same directory as the wave file versions (i.e. both ogg and wave files are in the same folder), the sounds suddenly work even though the def file is explicitly pointing to the wave files. Is this a bug? If anyone could help solve this issue, I'd be grateful.
Actually, the OGGs are played instead of the WAVs. You can check this by using different sounds with the same basename. This might be EDuke32's intended behaviour instead of a bug which just doesn't take this type of usage into account.

EDIT1: For your convenience I have attached tagged quality 10 OGGs to use for the time being, plus a log that shows the sometimes weird sampling rates of the VOCs contained in DUKE3D.GRP.

EDIT2: TX, please add me to the list of guys who wish for FLAC support in EDuke32. :D

Attached File(s)



This post has been edited by LeoD: 16 October 2012 - 07:24 AM

0

User is offline   LeoD 

  • Duke4.net topic/3513

#11 Posted 19 October 2012 - 03:31 PM

View PostRinyRed, on 15 October 2012 - 10:39 AM, said:

This sound pack is currently packaged to run as an independent EDuke32 mod, but you'll probably want to implement it with something like HRP or DukePlus as it complements them well and is compatible.
Added to my Z-Pack. :D (EDIT: see next post)
After some playing I decided to disable a couple of PSX sounds as can be seen in the attached DEF.
The 8/11KHz cutoff, especially on Duke's voice, adds to the original atmosphere of the game. Therefore, higher quality does not necessarily sound better ingame.

Attached File(s)



This post has been edited by LeoD: 21 October 2012 - 10:59 AM

0

User is offline   LeoD 

  • Duke4.net topic/3513

#12 Posted 21 October 2012 - 10:58 AM

The use of DEF files in the pack breaks many user maps which bring their own replacement VOC sounds. The solution is to have the PSX sounds converted to VOC and put into an autoload ZIP without hierarchy. The only drawback is that disabling certain sounds now means to [re]move or rename them instead of simply editing a DEF file. I have attached an autoload-ready VOC version without any HRP/DEF prerequisite.

EDIT: Download link moved to "my" thread, Other Stuff section.

This post has been edited by LeoD: 27 June 2014 - 10:33 AM

0

User is offline   Hendricks266 

  • Weaponized Autism

  #13 Posted 21 October 2012 - 05:06 PM

I think this is a good solution. IIRC, as long as the wav files are already 8-bit (which they should be if you extracted them from the PS1 iso), then wav to voc conversion should be lossless.

LeoD, as long as you sourced the vocs from PSXSoundPack_wav.rar, then you should be good to go.
0

User is offline   LeoD 

  • Duke4.net topic/3513

#14 Posted 22 October 2012 - 08:52 AM

View PostHendricks266, on 21 October 2012 - 05:06 PM, said:

I think this is a good solution. IIRC, as long as the wav files are already 8-bit (which they should be if you extracted them from the PS1 iso), then wav to voc conversion should be lossless.

LeoD, as long as you sourced the vocs from PSXSoundPack_wav.rar, then you should be good to go.
I did.
0

User is offline   MrFlibble 

#15 Posted 23 July 2020 - 02:01 AM

Apologies for bumping this, recently I got the latest version of the pack off the HRP website. I put the zip in the autoload folder and the console at startup suggests that the sounds are being loaded, but I honestly cannot notice any difference. (I turned off music and listened to weapon sounds with and without the autoload folder enabled). Am I doing something wrong, or is the difference actually not that big?

UPD: I think I'm hearing the difference with Pig Cop alert sounds, but otherwise the sound effects seem pretty much the same overall.

This post has been edited by MrFlibble: 23 July 2020 - 03:46 AM

0

User is offline   Doom64hunter 

#16 Posted 23 July 2020 - 04:21 AM

Works for me. Try putting the `unused/pistol.voc` sound in the base directory. If you can't hear that one, then it's not working.
1

User is offline   Ninety-Six 

#17 Posted 25 July 2020 - 04:45 AM

I had a similar issue when installing this. It didn't actually work with the oggs, only the vocs.
0

User is offline   Hendricks266 

  • Weaponized Autism

  #18 Posted 25 July 2020 - 10:19 AM

The oggs and flacs may need to be renamed to work correctly. For example pistol.voc would be replaced by pistol_voc.ogg, but not pistol.ogg.
0

User is offline   Jimmy 

  • Let's go Brandon!

#19 Posted 25 July 2020 - 12:21 PM

Has anyone done an analysis on the sounds to confirm they're actually of a higher quality? And also, maybe someone should organize a newer pack.
1

User is offline   MusicallyInspired 

  • The Sarien Encounter

#20 Posted 25 July 2020 - 12:33 PM

I'd love to do a thorough analysis of the raw files if I could get ahold of the originals.
0

User is offline   Ninety-Six 

#21 Posted 26 July 2020 - 05:04 AM

View Post/Defiatron\, on 25 July 2020 - 12:21 PM, said:

Has anyone done an analysis on the sounds to confirm they're actually of a higher quality? And also, maybe someone should organize a newer pack.


At least to me, I noticed that at least the chaingun firing sound was less chunky with this pack. However, I do not claim to be an expert so probably take my word with a few generous helpings of salt.

I am in full support of the second point though. Considering the sheer number of files that would need to be renamed to fit the apparent new naming scheme, it's probably necessary. If the audio quality could be verified I might even be willing to do it myself if Marphy isn't.
0

User is online   Marphy Black 

#22 Posted 26 July 2020 - 04:23 PM

Just about every Duke line in the PSX port is slightly higher quality than the original PC versions (the exceptions being a couple of Duke's pain screams). The PC VOCs are sampled at 8,000 Hz, while the PSX lines are sampled at 11,025 Hz. It's a minor quality increase, but that's what's on offer. For a visual confirmation of this slightly higher quality, here's a spectrogram comparison of Duke's "Come get some!" line:

Posted Image

PC line is on the left, and PSX line is on the right. You can tell by the empty black space on the left that the PSX line contains higher frequencies that were lost in the PC's downsampling. Aside from these Duke voice clips, most of the other PSX sounds are either not higher quality or are entirely different compared to their PC counterparts. For these other sound effects, this pack has been superseded by Perkristian's Hi-res Duke Nukem 3D sound effects pack. (Download Hendricks' repacked version down in the replies.)

That said, since the higher quality Duke lines are of most interest here, I've compiled a new version of this PSX Higher Quality Sound Pack that only includes the HQ Duke lines. Download here:

PSXHQSounds_DukeVoiceOnly.zip (1.61 MB)

Installation instructions are also much simpler and less intrusive this time: Just extract these sound files to your root EDuke32 folder. They'll automatically take effect and override the default PC sounds.

This post has been edited by Marphy Black: 26 July 2020 - 04:54 PM

6

User is offline   Jimmy 

  • Let's go Brandon!

#23 Posted 26 July 2020 - 04:44 PM

That's pretty conclusive. Without looking at them myself I was worried they could have just been upsampled from the PC version's original files. But there's definitely some more data there.

EDIT: Also, whats up with the FLYBY and BOMBEXPL sound effects in the Perkristian pack. Are those actually the right sounds? I know the SQUISH sound effect is a little jarring to me because it's so less crunchy, but BOMBEXPL specifically sounds like an entirely different sound to me. Did they really crunch it up that much with the downsampling?

This post has been edited by /Defiatron\: 26 July 2020 - 05:37 PM

0

User is online   Marphy Black 

#24 Posted 26 July 2020 - 06:05 PM

Perkristian has included some constructed soundalikes in his packs for sounds he wasn't able to source the original samples to. If it seems really different, it's likely because it isn't the same sound. This may work for those who can get by with something sounding "close enough," but for my own use, I personally modify his packs to omit the sounds that are glaringly different from the originals.
2

User is offline   Ninety-Six 

#25 Posted 26 July 2020 - 07:03 PM

View PostMarphy Black, on 26 July 2020 - 06:05 PM, said:

Perkristian has included some constructed soundalikes in his packs for sounds he wasn't able to source the original samples to. If it seems really different, it's likely because it isn't the same sound. This may work for those who can get by with something sounding "close enough," but for my own use, I personally modify his packs to omit the sounds that are glaringly different from the originals.


Any chance you could put that up? (Or name the files for convenience)
0

User is offline   markanini 

#26 Posted 26 July 2020 - 07:53 PM

View PostNinety-Six, on 26 July 2020 - 07:03 PM, said:

Any chance you could put that up? (Or name the files for convenience)


How do I get the voice only pack to work under Raze?
0

User is offline   MusicallyInspired 

  • The Sarien Encounter

#27 Posted 26 July 2020 - 08:17 PM

View PostMarphy Black, on 26 July 2020 - 04:23 PM, said:

Posted Image


Awesome!
0

User is online   Marphy Black 

#28 Posted 26 July 2020 - 08:28 PM

View PostNinety-Six, on 26 July 2020 - 07:03 PM, said:

Any chance you could put that up? (Or name the files for convenience)

I've personally omitted these sounds from Perkristian's pack:
  • bombexpl - Doesn't sound like the original.
  • bos1rm - Even though this is technically higher quality, the increase is infinitesimally minuscule at best since it's clear the original source sample was pretty low fidelity to begin with. In practice, this higher quality sound actually makes the Battlelord's roar sound muffled compared to the game's original effect. It genuinely sounds like the unpatched World Tour audio (if not a little worse). It's the sharp resampling of the ASS that really makes the Battlelord's audible presence as harsh and imposing as it is.
  • clipin - Accurate, but too high quality for its own good. These crystal clear pistol reload sounds stick out quite drastically against the rest of the soundscape, in my opinion. Others may disagree, but unless we could manage a thorough audio overhaul, I think there's also something to be said for a desire for some consistency with what we have. I'd say it's distracting having these minor and incidental sound effects be so clean and crisp over everything else, including important monster, weapon, and speech cues.
  • clipout - Ditto.
  • flyby - Doesn't sound like the original.
  • squish - Accurate, but again, so clean and crisp that it doesn't mesh well with the other effects. For example, you hear this squish when you gib an enemy with an explosive, but with this high quality sample, the squish completely overpowers the explosion itself.

Aside from bombexpl, bos1rm, and flyby, there's obviously some subjectivity here, but if you're skeptical of my reasonings, I suggest trying out these specific sounds in-game yourself. I'm not of the mindset that higher quality replacements instantly means a better quality game. When it comes to these sounds, there's a particular audio balance that was achieved at the time which was built solely around the original low quality samples. When doing a blanket restoration of all of the higher frequencies that were previously lost, you introduce clashing and overpowering effects that weren't accounted for prior. If they were actually working with pristine CD quality sample rates back then, I would imagine Bobby or Lee doing appropriate EQ work on the effects just as any good audio engineer would do nowadays to achieve a good overall sound mix.

View Postmarkanini, on 26 July 2020 - 07:53 PM, said:

How do I get the voice only pack to work under Raze?

If it doesn't work like EDuke32 does, then I couldn't tell you.

This post has been edited by Marphy Black: 26 July 2020 - 08:40 PM

4

User is offline   Ninety-Six 

#29 Posted 26 July 2020 - 08:30 PM

Thanks, Marph. I at least have a starting point to tweak from.
0

User is offline   MrFlibble 

#30 Posted 28 July 2020 - 06:58 AM

Hey, I didn't realise Per Kristian made a sound pack for Duke3D (I know about his Doom pack of course). I just checked it out and it makes a good impression. Personally I'm fine with some sounds being different from their original counterparts, and as for the squish/explosion combo I think that this might have been the intended effect. I mean, I never noticed the squish sound being played in such circumstances at all.

On thing, I'm testing with the latest SVN build and for some reason, the glass break sound gives me brief framerate drops for no apparent reason. I renamed all FLAC files from Hendricks266's pack by appending _voc at the end so they are used instead of the original VOC files, and then zipped up with max compression, maybe that's what causes the problem? But I did not have the time for a thorough test yet.

On a side note, I think at least some of the new sounds would be at home in Alien Armageddon and/or AMC TC (if they aren't there yet that is).
0

Share this topic:


  • 2 Pages +
  • 1
  • 2
  • You cannot start a new topic
  • You cannot reply to this topic

All copyrights and trademarks not owned by Voidpoint, LLC are the sole property of their respective owners. Play Ion Fury! ;) © Voidpoint, LLC

Enter your sign in name and password

Sign in options