[ck3D]

 Ninety-Six, on 22 March 2023 - 10:34 PM, said:

"Finished" level 10. In quotes because I found the button but haven't pressed it yet. 13/21 secrets found, and this looks like a daunting task, so I took a break. This level definitely had more of that automap issue. Other than that, quite the plot twist(s). Really wonder what's gonna happen next.

Just for the record: level 10 I intended to be the 'confusing layout' level of the pack, as in the one that uses sector-over-sector in disorienting ways and will occasionally play with symmetry but also complete asymmetry depending on whichever section or angle the player might choose to read it from. I specifically wanted the player to be confused when looking at automap (all the while encouraging them to try using it a lot) just like they would be in classic Build levels that feel like mazes the player needs to decipher also from a 2D angle, e.g.. Smithsonian Terror in Duke DC. In a way that is the introduction of the player to a different sort of challenge that is physically illogical spaces in apparently logical contexts, by the means of mind tricks which by design are bound to take several traversals to notice: the 'core' of the map with the control room, vertical black hole/parallaxed piston room and alien corruption is logically impossible to access by normal means in its given state (no doors, only underwater and destruction-based access points), all the while successfully branching out into the different disconnected sections but still feeling like there is something inherently wrong and distressful about that 'heart' of the map. Or the vertical split in the level, whether the player chooses to navigate to the easternmost half of the ship via the black hole or underwater tunnel also will result in a complete different experience within the same settings regarding both gameplay and discovery of the map. That is designed to throw off any early attempt at backtracking and instead keep pushing the player ahead (and to increasingly less comfortable levels) until they hit a specific point of non-return that they then need to return back from... Somehow. Which from the beginning was meant to be sluggish in order to really mark that it's a walk of shame and the start of a lot of deconstruction.

In fact that intent is literally 'signed' with a fourth-wall-teasing marking on the ground somewhere on the take-off/landing stripe near the Nuke Button and Commander Keen ship; a careful player might find it, a curious one might try and use automap there, and a perspicacious one might guess what went on there both conceptually and as a funny 'fuck-up' in the level design.

Everything onwards will be daunting and is where Blast Radius starts showing its true face; good luck.

[Ninety-Six]

Secret hunting is going to put me in an institution isn't it

oh dear...

[ck3D]

Secret hunting in level 10 actually should be fair for the most part. Only way you shouldn't be able to get back to some of them would be if you forgot some on, you know, Earth.

[Ninety-Six]

I might have to thrown in the towel on this one... I'm 3 hours in and not really any closer to completion than I was at the 120 minute mark. I started hunting at about 90 and managed to find 18/21. I know I missed 2 secrets back on Earth. I reloaded the level and managed to find them. There could be more, but I could not find any more than 6 total. Please inform me if I'm wrong.

Of course that doesn't help my in-progress game that much. Even with cheats I don't think I could go back for them. Even if I could find the starting area on the map (which I can't), I can't just noclip over there. I'll be killed by the vacuum of space. I'd have to engage god mode, which would take away my atomic healths. Considering the two secrets in question just have more ammo for guns I'm already maxed out at, I can live with just knowing where they are. It won't be a perfect results screen but I'll cut my losses there.

But for the remaining two, I just got nothing, and I'm running out of inventory that will let me keep exploring the level (boots, scuba, jetpack). Even DNSHOWMAP doesn't help me much here, which means they're probably secrets I've passed by hundreds of times because they have supplies I already have, and I just never would have thought of them as secrets.

[ck3D]

Off the top of my head there are quite a few secrets total back on Earth. Around the destroyed building at the start is a handful of them around different platforms, I want to say 4 or 5; that is a leftover from an era where Duke could only resurface from one precise spot underwater there and so finding this 'layer' of the map felt extra surprising and rewarding, accessing it isn't so hard anymore however and so for a bit I wondered if I should keep them, but reckoned they were still cool. Then inside the EDF Japan building should be a few more; off memory again, one inside the vent after/if reviving the Pig Cop, and one on top of that torn wall. 6 total sounds about right, although I'd need to check the map again to be certain.

Some others that may be easy to miss in the second half I'd imagine could be the three Atomic Healths inside the radioactive symbol-shaped gear, the secret compartment in the control room after pressing use on HAL 9000, or the ventilation shaft that connects the room with the reactor to the one with the black hole/rising platform/underwater tunnel combo. There also is one 'old school' secret behind an invisible masked wall in the first storage room the first crane takes you to, in a corner that's hinted at by a Liztroop emerging from there when you first enter the room that's otherwise very natural and normal to miss, and secret compartments with items on the external sides of both green elevators opposite the yellow key doors.

I respect the grind!

[Ninety-Six]

 ck3D, on 23 March 2023 - 09:26 AM, said:

Some others that may be easy to miss in the second half I'd imagine could be the three Atomic Healths inside the radioactive symbol-shaped gear

Got that one

 ck3D, on 23 March 2023 - 09:26 AM, said:

the ventilation shaft that connects the room with the reactor to the one with the black hole/rising platform/underwater tunnel combo

If you mean the one that's an extremely long fall, got that one

 ck3D, on 23 March 2023 - 09:26 AM, said:

There also is one 'old school' secret behind an invisible masked wall in the first storage room the first crane takes you to, in a corner that's hinted at by a Liztroop emerging from there when you first enter the room that's otherwise very natural and normal to miss,

That one took me quite a while to find but I eventually did (I must shamefully admit that was one of the ones I couldn't find until after using the SHOWMAP cheat. Though even then it took me quite a bit to figure it out, so the discovery wasn't completely lost. It was something of a puzzle to figure out, since it didn't dawn on me to try jumping at it from the box; I had it set in my mind that it must be something on the lower level).

 ck3D, on 23 March 2023 - 09:26 AM, said:

and secret compartments with items on the external sides of both green elevators opposite the yellow key doors.

Got those

 ck3D, on 23 March 2023 - 09:26 AM, said:

the secret compartment in the control room after pressing use on HAL 9000

Do you mean this one?

Spoiler

Spoiler for spoiler's sake.

If so, yeah I got that one, too.


I even got the one in the repair station on top of that narrow pillar that, as far as I was able to tell, had nothing on it.

[ck3D]

Yes that was the secret I was talking about. Re: the one with the extremely long fall, one can actually access that ventilation shaft from the reactor room already, there is a hidden switch somewhere behind a computer which will lower the computers from that side. I'll go check what's going on with that empty secret too, either something is off with my item there (e.g.. it has a palette and so doesn't appear) or I downright forgot to place it; that reminds me I need to check on that one level 9 secret you were saying didn't open for you, too.

Still off memory, I'm trying to remember the secrets that are left in 10; I know the cockpit/control room with the Big Red Button has a few ledges with items high up alongside the windows, but am not sure those places are marked. I know the middle section of the ventilation shaft between the two yellow key doors, with two Atomic Healths, also is tagged; one ventilation shaft near the HAL 9000 room is, too (the one that allows easy getting around of the forcefield while it's still there). In the first room inside the space station (with the desk and crane), pressing the sign on the desk will trigger an elevator platform to a high ledge, but maybe you already flew up there; next room just past the blue key door also has items on some higher ledges that may or may not be marked. Ventilation system you get inside of after blowing up the reactor and killing the Permafrost Battlelord (big ice dude) also has a secret compartment, but if you destroyed the fire extinguishers on the outer wall in the repair station you probably found that one too.

I might give that map a run myself in a bit just to check, will let you know when I do.

[Ninety-Six]

 ck3D, on 23 March 2023 - 10:32 AM, said:

Re: the one with the extremely long fall, one can actually access that ventilation shaft from the reactor room already, there is a hidden switch somewhere behind a computer which will lower the computers from that side.

Yeah I actually first discovered it from that end. I flew up to see where it went, decided I didn't want to go there early, and dropped back down.

 ck3D, on 23 March 2023 - 10:32 AM, said:

I know the cockpit/control room with the Big Red Button has a few ledges with items high up alongside the windows, but am not sure those places are marked.

If they were, I've been all over those ledges already anyway to save on jetpack fuel.

 ck3D, on 23 March 2023 - 10:32 AM, said:

I know the middle section of the ventilation shaft between the two yellow key doors, with two Atomic Healths, also is tagged;

Got that one

 ck3D, on 23 March 2023 - 10:32 AM, said:

one ventilation shaft near the HAL 9000 room is, too (the one that allows easy getting around of the forcefield while it's still there).

Got that too.

 ck3D, on 23 March 2023 - 10:32 AM, said:

In the first room inside the space station (with the desk and crane), pressing the sign on the desk will trigger an elevator platform to a high ledge, but maybe you already flew up there

Yep

 ck3D, on 23 March 2023 - 10:32 AM, said:

next room just past the blue key door also has items on some higher ledges that may or may not be marked.

Got them either way

 ck3D, on 23 March 2023 - 10:32 AM, said:

Ventilation system you get inside of after blowing up the reactor and killing the Permafrost Battlelord (big ice dude) also has a secret compartment, but if you destroyed the fire extinguishers on the outer wall in the repair station you probably found that one too.

Yep. I also got the one nearby in the San Fran/Tokyo monitors (by the way both switches are bad. The first I struggled with really hard before it finally pressed, the second (inside it) would not flip no matter what angle I pressed it at. I had to noclip to escape).


Trying to remember the other ones I got...

Spoiler

The atomic health windowsill by said ventilation system (this was another of those "I saw it and skipped past it because I already had 200 health and it was so obvious it never occurred to me it could be a secret" secrets)

The RPG/ammo ledge in the room with the psychedelic death pit (is that the black hole generator? I'm not sure. It's the room with the "forbidden" elevator)

The secret compartment in the room unlocked by the mapster monitor with the two switches

The red room you surface from the airlock in, with the switch that opens the green monitor


I know I'm forgetting a few others, but we're near the 18 count I currently have.

[ck3D]

 Ninety-Six, on 23 March 2023 - 11:16 AM, said:

The secret compartment in the room unlocked by the mapster monitor with the two switches

Oh yeah, those; I figure you've found what the switches do, right? They each lower one of the columns in the middle of the computers/work station that conceal an item each, and I'm pretty sure both are marked as individual secrets.

Good to know about those switches, thanks for reporting. Honestly I forgot that secret behind the screens even existed, probably a long time ago too and so am not too surprised it's a bit raw, I'll be looking into that as well.

[Ninety-Six]

 ck3D, on 23 March 2023 - 11:36 AM, said:

They each lower one of the columns in the middle of the computers/work station that conceal an item each, and I'm pretty sure both are marked as individual secrets.

Yeah, I needed the items at the time. But, just to be sure because this game can be finicky about secrets at times, I just now went back and double-checked them both. And yeah, I have them marked already.

[ck3D]

Right, cool. Hmm, there also is that antenna thing you can lower by shooting a switch in the room just before the non two-way 'train' that I think is marked as a secret, without the jetpack Duke can only get all the items on top by doing that. Another windowsill in the reactor room (I think with Devastator ammo and a view on said train) may be marked too. I'm struggling to think of any other we wouldn't have listed yet, but then again I had forgotten about a few myself until you mentioned them and so would really need to replay the map to check. If ever inclined to check in Mapster directly yourself before I get to do that, please feel free to use the lotag sector search function with 32767 as input, at this point I'd say that's not exactly giving up anymore.

This is the only map in Blast Radius that has pre-point of no return secrets, by the way, but here I think the context justifies it and also can add to the bitterness in a funny meta way where the stakes feel all the more real and personal to the player for as much as they themselves are now directly missing something. Only makes sense there would be no way to ever get back to those, too so might as well just say they're gone.

[Ninety-Six]

 ck3D, on 23 March 2023 - 04:45 PM, said:

there also is that antenna thing you can lower by shooting a switch in the room just before the non two-way 'train' that I think is marked as a secret, without the jetpack Duke can only get all the items on top by doing that.

This?

Spoiler

I danced on top of it to see if it was a secret, but it didn't tag as far as I can tell. I wondered if it was the tiny sector problem, and it possibly still could be, but I've done the cossack dance on it on four different occasions and couldn't draw anything out of it. My dance skills were insufficient.

 ck3D, on 23 March 2023 - 04:45 PM, said:

Another windowsill in the reactor room (I think with Devastator ammo and a view on said train) may be marked too. I'm struggling to think of any other we wouldn't have listed yet, but then again I had forgotten about a few myself until you mentioned them and so would really need to replay the map to check.

Is it this one?

Spoiler

If so, got that too.

 ck3D, on 23 March 2023 - 04:45 PM, said:

If ever inclined to check in Mapster directly yourself before I get to do that, please feel free to use the lotag sector search function with 32767 as input, at this point I'd say that's not exactly giving up anymore.

I learned that trick from RunningDuke/FistMarine actually, and I do employ it as an absolute last resort. Trouble is, I've tried that already, both with this and also earlier with the Croatian map. But mapster only lets me look at half the map. The other half is inaccessible. I can see it in the little 3D view, but I can't move the camera there at all. Even if I use the sector search, it will get the correct X/Y coordinate but it will fail to reach the other, stopping once again on that wall line.

[ck3D]

Yeah those are the two I meant; pretty sure the antenna was tagged at least at some point (if it isn't now then maybe I did end up removing that because of the tiny sector thing in fact). Re: your Mapster issue, if it's grid size that's the problem then that can be adjusted by changing editorgridextent to 524288 in mapster32.cfg since that's how I roll. I'm really struggling to think of any other secrets otherwise; this might be stupid but did you try looking directly behind the Nuke Button? (provided that one too is still marked)

[Ninety-Six]

 ck3D, on 23 March 2023 - 06:20 PM, said:

Re: your Mapster issue, if it's grid size that's the problem then that can be adjusted by changing editorgridextent to 524288 in mapster32.cfg since that's how I roll.

That did the trick! Many thanks! But now...

 ck3D, on 23 March 2023 - 06:20 PM, said:

I'm really struggling to think of any other secrets otherwise;

Yeah, I can see why, now. I did find all of them. But for some reason, two of them didn't tag. And I can't even begin to guess which two, because I've visited all of them at least a dozen times each. So something's gone screwy and 50% of my playtime on this map has been literally for nothing. Oi.

Damnit, Build.


EDIT: It's one secret. I'm bad at math. Still correct otherwise though.

 ck3D, on 23 March 2023 - 06:20 PM, said:

this might be stupid but did you try looking directly behind the Nuke Button? (provided that one too is still marked)

It wasn't marked, but it was one of the first places I checked once I began the hunt. BR has had a long-standing tradition of hiding a secret directly behind the nuke button.

[ck3D]

Oh no yeah that sucks. My next run through that map I'll make sure is a 100% secrets one just to make sure things can only exceptionally bug out like that and it's nothing consistent level design can't fix. Pretty sure I've achieved that before however, 100% run with everything registering so no real idea what could have gone loose unless it was introduced later, or if something like a save conflict could do this. Another secret place related bug in Blast Radius that's weird is (at least in some old versions of EDuke) if directly tagged as a secret place, the room behind the 'Gap' sign in level 2/Embarco's Most Blasted would downright end the level. Ended up working that out by tagging the next sector instead, which would work.

And yeah I always liked technically 'post-game +' secrets, cue the talk in the Dod of the Month/Metropolitan Mayhem thread where it was brought up again how level 2 there also used to have a secret jetpack behind the Nuke Button even all the way back then, until someone else on the team got scared of skips and deleted it.

At least from this point onwards secret hunting shouldn't be too problematic anymore.

[Ninety-Six]

It shouldn't be a save conflict, since I didn't update it since starting, afraid of specifically that. I waited until this was v1.1 or 1.2 (maybe even 1.3, I'm not sure) before starting a playthrough, which I usually do because even after beta testing, 1.0s tend to still have a good few bugs once vastly different playstyles start jumping into the mix.

It could be an error from that, but honestly I have no idea. Build jank gonna jank.



I'm going to be hearing that midi in my sleep

[ck3D]

Cool. For what that's worth, level 12 is forced weaponless start and so I would recommend updating when you get there (which should be rather imminent) seeing as that one in particular kept receiving rather important updates until quite late which consequently impacted readability and gameplay. Something you could do would be download the newest version of the archive and just replace BRL12.map in your folder with the one from there before you get there, I know that works since Mikko's done it. Probably should replace BRL13.map too if you're at it. Should save you a lot of unnecessary headaches, it really was some rather crucial pointers which were added (and bugs which were fixed) last minute in those maps.

[Aleks]

 Ninety-Six, on 23 March 2023 - 07:59 PM, said:

It shouldn't be a save conflict, since I didn't update it since starting, afraid of specifically that. I waited until this was v1.1 or 1.2 (maybe even 1.3, I'm not sure) before starting a playthrough, which I usually do because even after beta testing, 1.0s tend to still have a good few bugs once vastly different playstyles start jumping into the mix.

It could be an error from that, but honestly I have no idea. Build jank gonna jank.

I'm going to be hearing that midi in my sleep

One more thing you could do to check which secret you're missing, type DNDEBUG in your game with 20/21 secrets found, then open the "debug.map" that was created in Mapster. Now do a lotag search for 32767, the lotag won't be present on any other secret places that you've already found, so it will just point you to the exact one that's missing.

[Ninety-Six]

 ck3D, on 23 March 2023 - 08:18 PM, said:

Cool. For what that's worth, level 12 is forced weaponless start and so I would recommend updating when you get there (which should be rather imminent) seeing as that one in particular kept receiving rather important updates until quite late which consequently impacted readability and gameplay. Something you could do would be download the newest version of the archive and just replace BRL12.map in your folder with the one from there before you get there, I know that works since Mikko's done it. Probably should replace BRL13.map too if you're at it. Should save you a lot of unnecessary headaches, it really was some rather crucial pointers which were added (and bugs which were fixed) last minute in those maps.

Fair enough. I've now done so.

Hopefully I can get to it relatively soon. Just got back from having wrist surgery so it definitely ain't today.

[Merlijn]

I'm currently at level 7, since it may take while before I finish everything I'll throw in my reviews for the first 6 maps right now.

Sunset Suicide

This is a great introduction map to the episode, starting off in a familiar setting (yet the skyline is blood red now, which does tell you something) and keeping things fairly simple and straight forward. The design of the street area and the surrounding buildings is consistently great. While it mostly serves as an intro, some important elements are already being subtly introduced here. Those who stray from the beaten path will quickly learn how rewarding exploration is, and this will remain so for the rest of the episode. The RPG is just a few jumps away, the car wash has tons of elevated areas that can be reached by the observant player, the shotgun is in a completely optional building. There's also a hidden jetpack which can be used to bypass a large portion of the map. This is a gameplay feature that will return in almost every map. Opposition almost completely consists of low tier assault troopers, and as such the gameplay isn't too challenging (yet). The ending introduces the scorpion tank and gives you a little taste of what's to come. Overall a very enjoyable map with great urban design, the multi-leveled building was my favorite part. So far the gameplay doesn't seem to be too hard..


Embarco's most blasted

..And just like that, you're thrown in the deep end. This map represents a radical shift in both scale and difficulty. The map itself is absolutely massive and will surely intimidate first time players. There's an open world with seemingly endless possibilities, cityscapes and destruction as far as the eye can see unfold in every direction. I must admit this map was quite overwhelming the first time (it didn't help that the beta version had more cryptic level progression, I'm glad this was fixed for the final release). At the same time, it's also very impressive. The city is massive but also full of little details and neat touches. I especially liked the kiosks that act as ammo/health caches. Other highlights include the flooded subway and both parks. It's clear that many areas are inspired by real life locations and ck3d did a great job translating them to build/mapster. Add to that the sense of large scale destruction and we have an epic setting on our hands. Also really enjoyed the secret area in the FTC building, which has you scaling the building.

Gameplay also escalates dramatically here. The scorpion tanks are immediately re-introduced and it's clear that they will be a common foe from now on. These guys can be really dangerous, especially when they're combined with the regular tanks. Then there's the minibosses and their variants. The sunburnt battlelord is the one you want to watch out for, this is an absolute bastard who can quickly fry you with his expander gun (!). Also it took me a while to adjust to a battlelord shooting rockets at me, it really threw me off at first. These bastards are the most dangerous enemies you'll encounter (for now), so take them out as quickly as you can. The massive size of the city also makes the steriods a very valuable item, both for traversing the map and quickly getting out of a fight if things go south. Also, better get used to the sight of enemy clouds approaching from very far away.

Overall this one really sets the tone for the rest of the mapset. I think Alex is right, this is one of the more difficult maps (at least until the REALLY dangerous variants are introduced).

Big apple smoke toke

After a 3000 mile, 45-hour drive (yes I googled it ), Duke ends up in New York. Here we get introduced to some more brand new variants, my favorite being the taxi trooper. It's such a zany idea but they also serve a good gameplay function as the asshole snipers they are (and will teach you to take a close look at your surroundings). This is easily one of my favorite maps, I just love the aesthetic and the way this map loops around on itself. It also has some of the best urban indoor sections of the episode. I especially love the punkrock bar (Ramones secret included!), the police station and of course the nod to Mario bro's. CK3D's cultural background really shows here, which adds a ton of personality to the map. The manhattan skyline also makes for a great backdrop (we even get the silhouette of the statue of liberty in the distance!).

After the sprawling open world of San Fransisco, the more confined nature of this map is a nice breather. Gameplay is perhaps even a bit easier, although it's by no way pushover. The map will open up the further you progress, which is always nice. I did not find the yellow keycard during beta testing, which did confuse me a bit. But since it's only for an optional route it's not a big deal. As with map 1, being observant for vertical detours will lead you to many rewarding secrets. The copium battlelords are introduced here, and although they spam you with their shrink rays I didn't find them all that dangerous. There's always plenty of steriods lying around and the size of the area's makes it easy to dodge their projectiles. Sunburnt guy remains priority no 1.

Overall one of my favorite urban maps, I can see myself coming back to this one quite often.

Incapernaum

Duke takes a helicopter with enough fuel to take him to South America (gotta love game logic ) but of course the alien bastards shot it down. Well this is it. One of the biggest maps ever made and the one that will leave an impact on anyone who plays it. IMO this map is a masterpiece, plain and simple. I could try to explain why, but one has to play it to fully understand. I will say that the beta version took me 3 hours, the second playthrough took me 45 minutes (I took an alternative route that completely skipped the town section) and I just managed a speedrun under 3 minutes from a pistol start:

Spoiler

could probably be even faster if I did a better job of grabbing steroids

Weirdly enough, playing it a second time already gave me a sense of nostalgia, that's how much impact the first playtrough had. I would recommend anyone to at least try the regular path through town at least once. In terms of combat and level progression, the town section is the best and most creative. Especially loved the nod to Stadium. As others have noted, the map is huge but also has very distinct zones and a clear sense of direction so the 'beaten path' is always clear. Which makes exploration even better. Following the beaten path is fun but breaking it is equally satisfying. Again, it's hard to explain. But it's awesome.

High high high

After such a massive open world map, it only makes sense to have a bit of a breather. High high high takes place on a plane, which simultaniously serves for a more straight forward experience and explains how Duke gets to Europe. It really helps out the flow of the episode.The plane itself is larger than life, like Duke himself. Not much to say, design is good as always.Tthe lightning stands out here and it's fun to get outside the plane at one point (I'm glad you added a ton of ambient sounds here). Although battling sunburnt battlelords on the wings with zero cover is a bit mean. I really enjoyed the final fight, which is surprisingly tense and can suddenly escalate if too many babes get blown up. This is a cool gameplay mechanic that isn't used all that much (on top of my head I can only think of Crimson Moon).


Koj Stil Borag
Another favorite of mine. I've been to Croatia myself and this map actually captures the Istrian vibe quite well. I don't know how you did it without any custom art, but here we are. Purely in terms of design, this is one of the best in the set. Favorites include the big arena, the church (both inside and outside) and the building that leads to the shotgun. This is another map that's a lot of fun traverse and offers you a lot of freedom. Hell, the fight inside the big arena is completely optional! Underneath the city is a massive alien structure, which is always a great theme. I like how it can be reached through 3 different entry points. During beta, I entered through the rakija factory (another creative location). I somehow managed to miss the jetpack in the beginning. The alien hive is crawling with high tier enemies, and you'll have to head back to the surface a couple of times for re-supply. Or alternatively, quickly get in there for the key and get out again.

By this point I was completely used to the new enemy variants, but of course there are worse things to come..

I'm running out of words so that's it for now.

[NNC]

Great stuff, Merlijn, I couldn't have said it better. Map2 was a wake up call for my lazy ass, it quickly reminded me how much skills I have lost. Especially the sunburnt guy on elevated sectors (particularly the one with open shoot at the harbor). The liztroop cloud was notoriously bad in the FTC rooftop, I literally begged for ck3d to change it, but he didn't.

I actually disagree you on one point: Incapernaum's city part is easily the map's weakest part for me. Basically loved the whole shebang, except that part, which was a bit tedious (but also frustrating) with constant respawns. The best part for me was the commander fights in the optional hilltops, the water crossing nearby the train, the purple underwater segment (I absolutely loved EVERY coloured underwater segments in this episode, including the ones in Map2 or Map10 too), and of course the ruins.

In the funny titled Map6, my big issue was the lack of weapons and the heavy dependance of your early progression (it's really important where you exit the sea). Missing the shrinker is devastating for example later on. It's also sad the engine doesn't allow you to exit the church and the other buildings, makes a more limited interconnection.

[ck3D]

Thank you for all the comments and the in-depth review so far, Merlijn! Sorry I'm a bit distant and late to reply but I read and appreciate everything. I've been busy with real life stuff but also trying to catch up with everybody's streams, it seems like right now is the time where the average player is making it through the second chapter of the episode (plane / Croatia / France are starting being played, 'wall' of Peru has been vanquished) and so all my online spare time has been spent studying that and fixing bugs accordingly. I want to release an update that fixes a few minor issues at once soon so keeping track of everyone's progress also for that, and I need to keep going with the 'level lore' pages too.

@Merlijn I still want to find the time to replay all of Shaky Grounds and do the same, I even downloaded the latest version and installed it the other day before running out of energy and time again. So I have it ready to go and I really hope to get to share my impressions soon.

@Ninety-Six you'll definitely need a healthy wrist for the next maps to come, your keyboard reflexes will be stressed and put to the test. Get well soon!

[ck3D]

I'm working on the level lore page for level 5 High High High... And having to take the following screenshot got me wondering - @Ninety-Six, after all your recent progress through level 10 all the way to the very start of the end game, would you say your interpretation of the DNII end screen from High High High (since you've mentioned it before) still is the same? Did you develop any new theories yet? Or maybe you downright forgot about it?

[Ninety-Six]

I promise you I did not forget. I can't talk without spoilers, so:

Spoiler

But level 10 threw everything I thought I knew out the window. Now I really have no idea what the significance of the Rigelatin tech and references in the backstory for level 5 were about, if there even was any significance to begin with. Could have just been foreshadowing Earth's destruction I suppose, but clearly the weapon used completely different technology. I mean, I guess it's theoretically possible it's based on the Rigelatin's supercomputer since they were also trying to harvest Duke's massive ego, but it seemed to be implied that it was the EDF's own tech that dug into spacetime and made the aliens take notice. Given the enemy description in the manual, I'm guessing they found the Cycloid Archangel in there which triggered this latest invasion.

Hell, I have no idea where we're even going now. We just saw the Earth get destroyed. I guess Billy died on the station sometime during the attack, and now Duke is hijacking the BWBMR. But I don't know where he's going, and with the level story texts having ceased, I don't know what's going on in his head, now. Other than fury, of course. So now I'm just with him on this ride, wherever he thinks he's going.

I know Level 11 is a transitionary level that I could probably play one-handed, but I'd rather save that as the prelude for level 12.


I disagree with some of the people saying level 10 should have been the end. It's definitely endgame type stuff, but I agree with the layout so far: this is the beginning of the end, the start of Act 3. There were some big revelations, and I suppose it could be called a climax, in a story with two climaxes (it happens). I mean, I certainly would not be satisfied if it ended here. There were lots of revelations but no resolutions. Not yet. No big boss to fight, no idea where Duke is going, and no payback for those alien bastards shooting up my planet!

Incidentally, the EDF logs talked about this weapon being the crowning achievement of "this nation." I'm not sure if it's referring to America (seeing as everything is in English and DNF showed us that the EDF, despite the name, seems to answer to the President of the United States), or Japan (because the teleporter to this station was in Japan).

[Merlijn]

 The Watchtower, on 28 March 2023 - 04:48 AM, said:

Great stuff, Merlijn, I couldn't have said it better. Map2 was a wake up call for my lazy ass, it quickly reminded me how much skills I have lost. Especially the sunburnt guy on elevated sectors (particularly the one with open shoot at the harbor). The liztroop cloud was notoriously bad in the FTC rooftop, I literally begged for ck3d to change it, but he didn't.

I actually disagree you on one point: Incapernaum's city part is easily the map's weakest part for me. Basically loved the whole shebang, except that part, which was a bit tedious (but also frustrating) with constant respawns. The best part for me was the commander fights in the optional hilltops, the water crossing nearby the train, the purple underwater segment (I absolutely loved EVERY coloured underwater segments in this episode, including the ones in Map2 or Map10 too), and of course the ruins.

In the funny titled Map6, my big issue was the lack of weapons and the heavy dependance of your early progression (it's really important where you exit the sea). Missing the shrinker is devastating for example later on. It's also sad the engine doesn't allow you to exit the church and the other buildings, makes a more limited interconnection.

Thanks! I see your point about Incapernaum, I also complained about that in the beta report actually. But from what I understood, the fights have been toned down a bit so they should be less spammy now. And I do love the vertical progression inside the city (especially the trek across rooftops). But as you said the whole map is a great adventure. And yeah my first time playing map 2 I went to the docks first. That was a pretty brutal awakening

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@Merlijn I still want to find the time to replay all of Shaky Grounds and do the same, I even downloaded the latest version and installed it the other day before running out of energy and time again. So I have it ready to go and I really hope to get to share my impressions soon.

That's cool to hear, I was wondering if you forgot about it haha. Going through Shaky Grounds should take less time than going for 100% in Incapernaum
On that note, I was thinking of an expansion on Shaky Grounds after playing through Blast Radius. It would basically add an alternative ending based on a choise the player can make in the last map. But I don't know, may be too derivative.

[Ninety-Six]

Incidentally, the disco death shaft reminded me a lot of the final area in Deeper Underground. Actually a few parts of that level reminded me of DU. It also reminded me of the final map of WGAbyss in places too.

Not a critique or anything, of course. All three have a strong and dark endgame vibe

[ck3D]

@Ninety-Six I appreciate the thoughtful attention to the story so much. You're onto a lot of things, reading a few of those sentences actually brought a smile to my face because of how spot on you are about this or that without realizing yet, or how justified your questions still are at this point. Hopefully the end game will answer most of those, but I think with your careful approach you will in fact naturally pick up on the whole gist of it and so really get the intended experience, that's pretty great. I appreciate your appreciation for (the existence of) the third act, too, without going too deep into why I think it's an important one and fundamental to grasp the reality of Blast Radius, denying it in a way is 'playing it safe' and choosing to stick to a limited dimension of the game which actually makes sense in a lot of ways and is OK to, just what it is and equally interesting and telling than embracing it all. Just from my perspective levels 1-9 are basically a set-up, but of course I'm happy to hear it's an especially enjoyable one.

@Merlijn you probably should do it if you can find the time and energy and build off Shaky Grounds, add more content and include extras in a 2.0, at least I know I'm tempted to keep adding to Blast Radius like that over time (also if I can ever manage, spare time is increasingly becoming an absolute luxury again). If you liked some of the monster variants in particular I reckon you could use that code too, in fact I'm looking forward to putting up an extended breakdown of the new enemies, their implementation and their principles sometime on ModDB, seeing people use Blast Radius as a base to make user content for it in the same style (maybe with real world-centric themes too) isn't something I'd ever reasonably expect to see but would be quite fantastic. And yeah, no I rarely seem to forget about things in general (or maybe only the important ones), they just stay in the back of my mind forever until accomplished whether or not I'm trying to look at them. I think Shaky Grounds is a masterpiece and so while I've already played most of it I want to make sure tackling the full thing is a time where I can especially focus and appreciate.

[Aleks]

I don't think level 10 would be a fitting end, as it's more of a cliffhanger that leaves more questions than the answers, but personally I'd probably say Zarathustra would be a perfect (if not too exhausting in itself) way to end the episode. Of course I know you wanted to make it more meta and the last map works great in this aspect (and also has one of my favourite names ).

As for the plot/significance, I might be biased as I was mostly bombarded with the info on the story first-hand by ck3D, however I can now publicly say that I really appreciate the DNII ending screen in Blast Radius, as it's a good way to remind people that from the beginning Duke's character was that of a kind of selfish and narcissistic asshole (also adding his autobiography), just a very good and efficient at his job asshole. So, as for the ending...

Spoiler

...besides ck3D's author's interpretation, I think it's also playing with that - Duke being overconfident and getting too cocky, which leads to Earth's destruction and loops all the way back to his reflections at the end of DNII.

[ck3D]

 Aleks, on 30 March 2023 - 11:11 AM, said:

Spoiler

...besides ck3D's author's interpretation, I think it's also playing with that - Duke being overconfident and getting too cocky, which leads to Earth's destruction and loops all the way back to his reflections at the end of DNII.

Spoiler

Actually that's also intended, what Blast Radius tries to do is blend both the 'first person shooter' concept and Duke's character as established throughout its entire history (or at least the moments of it where it was still remotely interesting) into one medium. Duke's persona and entire trope runs on ego (and yet, paradoxically, he's remarkably altruistic) which denotes perceiving the world from a very personal and instinctual dimension, but also having to fish for existential answers in a limited pool of codes. A lot about taking him to real locations around the world and also map size is but a metaphor for the process of expanding Duke's boundaries, but also of the player's, since it's a first person shooter (and a classic one at that; Blast Radius sort of takes base Duke 3D, the game itself but also how it's typically experienced and remembered, as its own established reality, and the basis for all sensible familiarity). Duke also happens to be such a cliché character (by design), people naturally tend to project so much over him or identify with values that they graciously lend him (when they're the ones who should own them) - there's some rather exceptional feedback between a Duke 3D player, Duke the general character the franchise constructed (with all the constant references and quips) and Duke the in-game Duke 3D character who when directly played becomes its own entity. For as long as one is playing (and immersed), all of those come to constantly overlap and it's probably not too unreasonable to postulate that when especially focused and absorbed, part of the player is Duke. Now that is a lot of comfortable power but also a responsibility, and once that notion slips not just into but also out of the game as notions within the player themselves start shifting, then how will each individual react?

[ck3D]

'Level lore' article page for level 5/plane is up: https://www.moddb.co...-level-5brl5map



Was more interesting to write about than I had anticipated, maybe the technical stuff is cool or funny, I don't know.

I also rather severely updated Blast Radius, now onto 1.0.12 with a bunch of tiny isolated fixes for softlocks, clipping issues, texture slip-ups and progression issues, mostly in levels 1-7 (I don't remember touching anything later than that, shouldn't be significant at all if I did). That one wall in the hive in level 6 now blows up from both sides (will trigger even if the player finds the key first), eliminating possible unnecessary and confusing backtracking, and the switch to unlock the avionics in level 5 as well as the two semi-hidden doors to the porn studio in level 7 are now harder to miss. The alien switches in the ruins in Incapharnaum are easier to reach, now, too (I've seen a few players downright fail to remember they could to jump).

Can snag your update here: https://www.moddb.co...3d-blast-radius