[High Treason]

I had a feeling your gripes would be overclocking related... Some of us buy things based on the specifications on the box and not our expectations of running them outside of their parameters. The manufacturer set that clock and voltage that way for a reason.

Though proprietary stuff like those VRMs are never a good thing.


-----

The system Forge suggested is similar spec to the suggestions I made, might be attainable.

[Forge]

DukeNukem64, on 22 May 2014 - 02:41 PM, said:

Thanks!
Isn't i-3 outdated soon? I've read about i-5 and i-7....?
As I told you I have no idea..

the i3 is at the bottom of the current chip set, but the board i recommended can be upgraded to an i5 or an i7

[Person of Color]

High Treason, on 22 May 2014 - 02:49 PM, said:

I had a feeling your gripes would be overclocking related... Some of us buy things based on the specifications on the box and not our expectations of running them outside of their parameters. The manufacturer set that clock and voltage that way for a reason.

Though proprietary stuff like those VRMs are never a good thing.

The manufacturer doesn't know shit about the exact potential of each piece of silicon, they just go by whatever is most profitable.

The real issues here are the clock control, which is just straight up fucked, and the locked voltage, which just makes things even more unmanageable.

Proprietary VRM's are usually a really good thing, but you need to be able to control them. It's also really sketchy to stick cheaper RAM on a higher end card, and offer exposed points for multimeters, then lock the chip itself out of any kind of control signal override.

[Forge]

Protected by Viper, on 22 May 2014 - 02:44 PM, said:

I just wanted to add that after finally dabbling in overclocking my 770 today, I can safely say fuck ....and fuck

Also, fuck ... and fuck

fucking... fuck

http://www.overclock...770-owners-club

[Person of Color]

Done been all up in that thread. Like I said, my ASIC quality is only 72% so shit is dicey. Heaven can loop for half an hour with no issues but Blood Dragon will crash at random.

[Gambini]

Protected by Viper, on 21 May 2014 - 08:55 PM, said:

What shitty advice Gambini.

Radeons are only bad for polymost. That's not their fault, it's due to a straight up badly written renderer.

AMD has some good processors. The 8350 and 8320 are great choices if you can't afford an i5.

Nothing shitty about my advice. You get an alternative brand and you have to cross your fingers so it performs almost as good as the real deal. You get the most renowed brand, with better reputation and trayectory and you can relax because you know that thing is never gonna dissapoint you. I´ve owned five Nvidia cards and nine Intel CPUs and never had a single problem with them... I won´t take any chances next time I upgrade.

[Forge]

Protected by Viper, on 22 May 2014 - 02:58 PM, said:

straight up fucked

http://www.overclock...ge-unlock-guide

[DukeNukem64]

Am I one of the persons Steam is targeting with their Steam box?

[Person of Color]

Gambini, on 22 May 2014 - 03:20 PM, said:

Nothing shitty about my advice. You get an alternative brand and you have to cross your fingers so it performs almost as good as the real deal. You get the most renowed brand, with better reputation and trayectory and you can relax because you know that thing is never gonna dissapoint you. I´ve owned five Nvidia cards and nine Intel CPUs and never had a single problem with them... I won´t take any chances next time I upgrade.

How does using less hardware make your opinion more qualified? I've helped assemble and assembled stuff from both brands in the last year alone, CPU and GPU wise. And the year before that. And again before that.

If he's on a budget there's nothing wrong with getting an AMD processor, the 83xx series are great, and the 6xxx do the job if you don't mind overclocking them.

As for being disappointed with the "most renowned brand," see my current posts. I'm not going to flat out say "Don't buy Nvidia," some of their cards, like the 650, are a really good deal. I've seen 650's going for ~$100 at times and nothing will even come close at that price.

As for the high end...blech!

Forge, on 22 May 2014 - 03:32 PM, said:

http://www.overclock...ge-unlock-guide

Doesn't work with the ASP1212 on the Asus cards. Asus has exposed large solder points for hot wiring in pots. You also have to remove a resistor they exposed for you. In theory, someone could manufacture a clip on device that could go right on those pads and you could just knock off the resistor...but fuck that noise. Hopefully someone figures out how to communicate with it on a software level soon. I can up it to 1.212 in Afterburner but that's it. Also I just checked GPU-Z and Asus trickfucked me with Hynix RAM, the 2GB models have Samsung.

Nvidia doesn't want board partners going above 1.212v, period. Fuck 'em. They're scared of 0.5% of customers overclocking these cards to 780 levels on water cooling...it's been done.

[Jeff]

Intel has better IPC (instructions per clock cycle) than AMD, AFAIK. For me, Intel blows AMD out of the water for the types of things I use my system for. I have used AMD in the past (2002-2005). Just saying, it totally depends what kinds of applications you are going to be using. Certain apps perform vastly better on Intel, while not as much on AMD, it totally depends on the situation. General gaming, probably a tie. However, not for my situation.

[Striker]

Protected by Viper, on 21 May 2014 - 08:55 PM, said:

Radeons are only bad for polymost. That's not their fault, it's due to a straight up badly written renderer.

I would disagree, AMD's drivers especially have been notorious for having issues in OpenGL 2.1 and beyond. The issues people are having with AMD/ATI GPUs in RAGE and W:NO right now, are all OpenGL-related driver issues that they've had to fix on their end with a new catalyst driver. Rinse and repeat the cycle with every new game, or open-source game/port/renderer/whatever.

I remember even further back, I ended up ditching an older Radeon card because the damn thing kept turning Doom 3 into tutti fruity colors everywhere, and even after a driver patch, there were sudden white blotches on everything as if the lighting only allowed two extremes: Full Bright, and Full Dark. Skulltag/Zandronum/GZDoom's OpenGL renderer would have occasional visual anomalies (depth issues mainly.) and constant slowdown, and Doomday's OpenGL rendering produced massive HOMs for me. UT2004's OpenGL renderer used to refuse running at all on the card too. I never looked back.

[Person of Color]

StrikerMan780, on 24 May 2014 - 05:25 AM, said:

I would disagree, AMD's drivers especially have been notorious for having issues in OpenGL 2.1 and beyond. The issues people are having with AMD/ATI GPUs in RAGE and W:NO right now, are all OpenGL-related driver issues that they've had to fix on their end with a new catalyst driver. Rinse and repeat the cycle with every new game, or open-source game/port/renderer/whatever.

Yeah but id Software hasn't been very diligent with testing their PC games upon release. Rage was nearly unplayable on Nvidia cards when released, as well. W:NO doesn't just have issues with Radeons at the moment, once again, it's both brands, because id didn't test it. There are all kinds of problems with SLi and Crossfire as well.

After Rage and W:NO id Software would be the absolute last thing I'd use to test OpenGL driver quality. Their code flat out sucks now. There's a reason no one is licensing id Tech 5.

Quote

I remember even further back, I ended up ditching an older Radeon card because the damn thing kept turning Doom 3 into tutti fruity colors everywhere, and even after a driver patch, there were sudden white blotches on everything as if the lighting only allowed two extremes: Full Bright, and Full Dark. Skulltag/Zandronum/GZDoom's OpenGL renderer would have occasional visual anomalies (depth issues mainly.) and constant slowdown, and Doomday's OpenGL rendering produced massive HOMs for me. UT2004's OpenGL renderer used to refuse running at all on the card too. I never looked back.

Radeons sucked for a while after AMD bought them out. The drivers weren't really on par until the 6xxx cards, which is quite a few generations. Yet another causality of "old AMD's" horrible management.

[Hank]

Here are the system specs for Wolfenstein from Steam,

Recommended System Requirements for Wolfenstein: The New Order

OS: Win 7 64
Processor: Core 2 Duo E8400 3.0GHz,Phenom II X2 560
Memory: 4 Gb
Hard Drive: 6 Gb free
Video Card: GeForce GTS 450, Radeon HD 4870
DirectX: DX 10

not one word from OpenGL/CL

As for AMD, Cinema 4D is OpenGL based. I use this software now for the last three years. I thought I will pamper myself and get a nVidia card and intell machine, since it is supposed to run with a quieter and cooler operation. I loaded Cinema 4D R15 Studio on it. It literally gave me a black screen. Not sure what the problem was, Maxon is looking at this, but after three days I exchanged the comp with AMD system. Cinema 4D and The Gimp run like smooth from the get go.

Bottom line for me, AMD is a bit cheaper, and a valid alternative based on my experience. Now there is the hype with nVidia and Watch Dogs, so I expect some issues with my AMD machine, but there too, it usually will get solved by a patch or two.

[Striker]

Protected by Viper, on 24 May 2014 - 06:06 AM, said:

Yeah but id Software hasn't been very diligent with testing their PC games upon release. Rage was nearly unplayable on Nvidia cards when released, as well. W:NO doesn't just have issues with Radeons at the moment, once again, it's both brands, because id didn't test it. There are all kinds of problems with SLi and Crossfire as well.

After Rage and W:NO id Software would be the absolute last thing I'd use to test OpenGL driver quality. Their code flat out sucks now. There's a reason no one is licensing id Tech 5.

The SLI problem was something NVidia had a problem with in lacking an SLI profile for the game from posts I've been reading on the Steam forums... Beta drivers solved the issue I do believe. Still has issues if you enable CUDA transcoding, but that's understandable with how it uses the cards for it (one GPU for transcoding, the other for rendering.)... It's great for single GPUs however. Almost completely removes texture pop-in if you have a good HDD.).

As far as RAGE and W:NO, never had any issue really, both at release. I'm Running a GTX 560, if that helps for specifics. The biggest issue that's going on is people are cranking certain settings thinking they shouldn't hurt performance. (Such as setting shadow resolution to ridiculous values like 8192+, or using full-quality Screen Space Reflections on high screen resolutions when half-quality usually suffices with no noticeable quality drop. Hell, turning it off hardly sacrifices any graphical fidelity in exchange for a huge FPS boost.) Both games seem to be heavily limited by HDD speed however, so there's that too, since there's constant texture reading/writing going on.

While I love NVidia, and usually buy from them, they aren't without faults. My main gripe about NVidia right now is their lack of open-source drivers, and that there's too much proprietary tech like PhysX/CUDA and their own OGL extensions (while they d give them an edge in that department)... but that's being solved by the userbase in the form of the Nouveau drivers (Linux only), so that's something I guess.

[Forge]

yay!!!! another ati vs. nvidia (or intel vs. amd) discussion that has no winners.

i don't know if it's because people aren't old enough to remember, or they intentionally choose to forget - this back and forth has been going on from pretty much day one when personal computers became affordable.

one company puts out a kick-ass product then sits on their thumb until the competitor catches up and surpasses them with their own kick-ass product. This in turn causes the competitor to sit on their thumb until the first company can catch up and surpass them. wash-rinse-repeat x infinity.

who's on top now? doesn't matter. they won't stay there for more than a couple generations of products.

[Person of Color]

Forge, on 24 May 2014 - 06:34 AM, said:

yay!!!! another ati vs. nvidia (or intel vs. amd) discussion that has no winners.

i don't know if it's because people aren't old enough to remember, or they intentionally choose to forget - this back and forth has been going on from pretty much day one when personal computers became affordable.

one company puts out a kick-ass product then sits on their thumb until the competitor catches up and surpasses them with their own kick-ass product. This in turn causes the competitor to sit on their thumb until the first company can catch up and surpass them. wash-rinse-repeat x infinity.

who's on top now? doesn't matter. they won't stay there for more than a couple generations of products.

FUCK YOU YOU FUCKING FAGGOT EVERYONE KNOWS S3 AND TSENG LABS ARE THE SHIT

StrikerMan780, on 24 May 2014 - 06:32 AM, said:

While I love NVidia, and usually buy from them, they aren't without faults. My main gripe about NVidia right now is their lack of open-source drivers, and that there's too much proprietary tech like PhysX/CUDA and their own OGL extensions (while they d give them an edge in that department)... but that's being solved by the userbase in the form of the Nouveau drivers (Linux only), so that's something I guess.

The Nouveau drivers are so fucking bad. The 6150 Go in my crappy Presario V6000 laptop is almost unusable with them and slow as hell using the official drivers. Nvidia basically fucked the 6150 HW acceleration wise in Linux. Implying Fedora 20 and Cinnamon Desktop are too heavy for a 6150...Not gonna lie though I have the GPU overclocked by 130MHz in Windows to help with Aero, the heat increase is only like 3c so fuck it. When the going really gets tough I push that fucker to 2.4GHz and the RAM goes to 800 and the whole machine sings.

My current gripe with Nvidia is that Kepler just sucks so bad compared to Fermi and GCN. It's really cheap to produce compared to Fermi but the GPGPU performance is awful, the memory buses are too narrow, and they don't ship with enough RAM on the high end.

Their next gen Maxwell architecture is really cool though. Same issues as Kepler but it uses like near zero power. The 750Ti doesn't even need a PCI-E power connector and it is a hair faster than a 560 Ti. They have an identical laptop part called the 860m which is so good it makes me want to repair and sell my dead Asus G51. You can have straight up awesome graphics performance and a quad core processor in a 5lb laptop. It's fucking amazing and hands down the best laptop graphics chip ever made.

[Tea Monster]

Protected by Viper, on 24 May 2014 - 07:16 AM, said:

FUCK YOU YOU FUCKING FAGGOT EVERYONE KNOWS S3 AND TSENG LABS ARE THE SHIT

Arseholes to you sir! Matrox made the most perfect display circuitry known to man.

Protected by Viper, on 24 May 2014 - 07:16 AM, said:

(...) Nvidia basically fucked the 6150 HW acceleration wise in Linux. (...)

Well, you are using a Hippie OS, so what did you expect to happen?

[Forge]

Protected by Viper, on 24 May 2014 - 07:16 AM, said:

FUCK YOU YOU FUCKING FAGGOT EVERYONE KNOWS S3 AND TSENG LABS ARE THE SHIT

no apple II overlay



vs. ibm's 5150 CGA?




probably before your time

[Inspector Lagomorf]

Protected by Viper, on 24 May 2014 - 07:16 AM, said:

FUCK YOU YOU FUCKING FAGGOT EVERYONE KNOWS S3 AND TSENG LABS ARE THE SHIT

Thread Topic said:

pc vs consoles "NOT A FIGHT"

[Forge]

Quote

Thread Topic said:
pc vs consoles "NOT A FIGHT"

ReaperMan, on 22 May 2014 - 09:12 AM, said:

Welcome to the INTERNET!

[Person of Color]

Tea Monster, on 24 May 2014 - 10:19 AM, said:

Well, you are using a Hippie OS, so what did you expect to happen?

I expected it to make me look sexy.

[Tea Monster]

My first, and so far only programming was in basic on an Apple II.

My first PC was a 386 Compaq server.

I was teasing Viper about the Hippy OS (well, mostly...).

[Person of Color]

That's not fair to Linux users, dude. Hippies have sex.

[Tea Monster]

Hmmm, you're right there.

Forge - Did you ever actually own one of them?
I remember the advertising at the time for them.

[Forge]

i never personally owned one
the school computers were apple II - also my first programming experience

affordable home computers had recently became a reality and i remember all the nerd fights and advertisements comparing the ibm vs. apple

the closest i came to touching computers outside of a supervised environment came a little later
one friend owned an atari 800
another friend owned a commodore 64

my first personal computer was a barebones i486 pentium 33 purchased in 1994. it was all i could afford at the time. it was primarily for the purpose of using for the qbasic programming classes i was taking.

[Tea Monster]

My school had Apple II computers.

I remember going into A & S one day and seeing a Macintosh. I fell in love with Mac Paint and Mac Write right then and there.

My first PC was an ancient 386 Compaq server built from the fender of a T-38 tank. I installed a co-pro so it would run Quake at 1FPS. It wouldn't run Duke though due to the hardware limit built into the game :'( It had the unheard of (for when it was built) 11 Mb of memory.

[Jeff]

My first computer I ever used was a Intel 286. It also had one of those big fat 5.25 inch floppy drives in it.

[The Commander]

This is my first HD getting loaded onto a plane, man back in 1956 these 5MB IBM 305 RAMAC HDD that weighed just over a measly ton were all the talk.

What happened to those days...

[Tea Monster]

Progress is a wonderful thing. At the first graphics job I ever had, they had a 5 mb external drive that was the size of a laser printer.

Much lulz was had when it broke down and they found that the council hadn't sent the warranty papers off to the manufacturer.

[Kyanos]

PC vs console or...
http://www.cnet.com/...ing-with-metal/
Apple's new os is 10x as powerful at 3dgaming than iOS 7. That article talks about twisting iPads into mini cheap consoles, add in a controller, mixed with a new Apple TV interface bound to show soon and these guys may give the old console monopolies a good fight.