Duke Nukem Forever lacked depth
#1 Posted 19 June 2011 - 02:30 AM
This is somewhat annoying because it actually tried to have a story, yet as it turns out, there wasn't really a story at all. The point I'm making is that this time, it was meant to be personal between Duke and the aliens, but it feels a lot less personal than it was in Duke 3D. In the latter game, Duke had conversations with the aliens and the bosses, such as the pigcops' "gotcha now you bastard, and we're going to fry your ass." As well as the Battlelord's hologram where he says "too late Nukem, we're in control now." Not to mention all the dialogue that happens at the end of each episode.
It bugs me that in the start of the game everyone's saying "hey it's the same aliens you fought 12 years ago" and "the choice of venues isn't a coincidence, this time it's personal" yet the aliens never, ever talk to Duke as far as I can see. They look like dumb animals which happen to be invading and shooting everyone for no reason. I would have killed to have one conversation with the Cycloid Emperor or similar over a viewscreen talking about how "this time, you won't be able to stop us, Duke" or soemthing like that. Except for some of the NPC's comments, you'd think it was the first time Duke fought these guys, which makes it much less epic than it could have been, especially since all the dialogue that does happen is with cliched army guys and stuff, and not with the aliens, who are the interesting characters. They missed out on a great opportunity here.
Even the addition of bombshell would have given the story a lot more depth, even if she wasn't a playable character. I know everyone's going to say "It's a Duke Nukem game, it doesn't need a story" and you're exactly right, maybe they shouldn't have tried to put a story in there in the first place, and just have Duke go around killing aliens, solving puzzles and interacting with babes.
This post has been edited by Micky C: 19 June 2011 - 02:32 AM
#2 Posted 19 June 2011 - 02:39 AM
Now that you mention it though, yeah, I would've liked something more direct. Why are they invading again? You think with all the technology they had they would invade other planets first or something, and THEN get Duke. Instead, its like they just tried to repeat the same invasion, except
There was probably a much better story that went more in depth with better pacing, but the game feels like parts were left out to make a deadline and hastily put together to make a somewhat coherent timeline.
This post has been edited by ThePinkus: 19 June 2011 - 02:41 AM
#3 Posted 19 June 2011 - 07:41 AM
#4 Posted 19 June 2011 - 07:55 AM
#5 Posted 19 June 2011 - 09:18 AM
Micky C, on 19 June 2011 - 02:30 AM, said:
This is somewhat annoying because it actually tried to have a story, yet as it turns out, there wasn't really a story at all. The point I'm making is that this time, it was meant to be personal between Duke and the aliens, but it feels a lot less personal than it was in Duke 3D. In the latter game, Duke had conversations with the aliens and the bosses, such as the pigcops' "gotcha now you bastard, and we're going to fry your ass." As well as the Battlelord's hologram where he says "too late Nukem, we're in control now." Not to mention all the dialogue that happens at the end of each episode.
It bugs me that in the start of the game everyone's saying "hey it's the same aliens you fought 12 years ago" and "the choice of venues isn't a coincidence, this time it's personal" yet the aliens never, ever talk to Duke as far as I can see. They look like dumb animals which happen to be invading and shooting everyone for no reason. I would have killed to have one conversation with the Cycloid Emperor or similar over a viewscreen talking about how "this time, you won't be able to stop us, Duke" or soemthing like that. Except for some of the NPC's comments, you'd think it was the first time Duke fought these guys, which makes it much less epic than it could have been, especially since all the dialogue that does happen is with cliched army guys and stuff, and not with the aliens, who are the interesting characters. They missed out on a great opportunity here.
Even the addition of bombshell would have given the story a lot more depth, even if she wasn't a playable character. I know everyone's going to say "It's a Duke Nukem game, it doesn't need a story" and you're exactly right, maybe they shouldn't have tried to put a story in there in the first place, and just have Duke go around killing aliens, solving puzzles and interacting with babes.
Quoting Randy Pitchford on Twitter:
"Comment RE: looking at DNF for narrative depth: "It's like Rolling Stone magazine trying to find a deep meaningful message in a Ke$ha song." "
http://twitter.com/#!/duvalmagic
This post has been edited by 3rdmillhouse: 19 June 2011 - 09:18 AM
#6 Posted 19 June 2011 - 10:16 AM
Helel, on 19 June 2011 - 07:55 AM, said:
He responds to some characters. Off the top of my head:
General Graves before exiting the casino
EDF soldier near the Halo armor
Holsom twins in the apartment, and later in the Hive
Stripper in Titty City
This post has been edited by randir14: 19 June 2011 - 10:17 AM
#7 Posted 19 June 2011 - 10:45 AM
3rdmillhouse, on 19 June 2011 - 09:18 AM, said:
"Comment RE: looking at DNF for narrative depth: "It's like Rolling Stone magazine trying to find a deep meaningful message in a Ke$ha song." "
http://twitter.com/#!/duvalmagic
I think that's a little disingenuous of Pitchford, considering that the game actually spends its first chapter or two attempting to lay down a narrative basis for the game. No one's looking for meaning, deep or otherwise, in a Duke Nukem title, but the game seems to make an attempt at an actual meaningful narrative, and that attempt should be owned up to. 3DR attempted something there, and came up a bit wanting. Being told not to criticize the outcome because it's supposedly not worth criticizing is kinda sad. If it's not worth criticizing, it wasn't worth doing in the first place, after all.
Personally, I found that the "story" elements, regardless whether they were meant to be as shallow as a puddle or not, pulled me out of the game. I would have been happy - happier, even - with "Damnit, there goes my [insert person/object/whatever here]." I appreciate the attempt, when someone does something (or in this case, invests in something), and people tell them that there's room for improvement, a reply of"Yeah, whatever. It doesn't matter anyway. Who gives a shit?" just makes one seem butt-hurt.
#8 Posted 19 June 2011 - 12:31 PM
I believe 3DR set out to make DNF a heavy story driven FPS, maybe the upcoming DLC would make some of the pieces fit togather.
#9 Posted 19 June 2011 - 01:54 PM
And shouldn't be cycloid dead? Like he was killed in 3d or something...
#10 Posted 19 June 2011 - 02:32 PM
#11 Posted 19 June 2011 - 02:36 PM
3rdmillhouse, on 19 June 2011 - 09:18 AM, said:
"Comment RE: looking at DNF for narrative depth: "It's like Rolling Stone magazine trying to find a deep meaningful message in a Ke$ha song." "
http://twitter.com/#!/duvalmagic
Amen to Randy - that quote in picture format
[attachment=2974:criticism hamburger.jpg]
#12 Posted 19 June 2011 - 04:15 PM
#13 Posted 19 June 2011 - 05:40 PM
ThePinkus, on 19 June 2011 - 02:39 AM, said:
Now that you mention it though, yeah, I would've liked something more direct. Why are they invading again? You think with all the technology they had they would invade other planets first or something, and THEN get Duke. Instead, its like they just tried to repeat the same invasion, except
There was probably a much better story that went more in depth with better pacing, but the game feels like parts were left out to make a deadline and hastily put together to make a somewhat coherent timeline.
#14 Posted 20 June 2011 - 06:03 AM
Kichae, on 19 June 2011 - 10:45 AM, said:
That seems to be his standard reply to criticism of the game, even when it hasn't been made yet - i.e. the "review scores don't matter" comments.
#15 Posted 20 June 2011 - 06:51 AM
#17 Posted 21 June 2011 - 11:59 AM
#18 Posted 21 June 2011 - 12:54 PM
SavagE, on 19 June 2011 - 01:54 PM, said:
And shouldn't be cycloid dead? Like he was killed in 3d or something...
I think there's an entire race of "cycloids" and at any given time one of them is the emperor.
#19 Posted 21 June 2011 - 01:25 PM
Also we really do need a Zero Hour remake or Graphic update like the Hrp for DN3D