[Zaxtor]

They added a (more detailed) picture of the star at close view.

[Sangman]

Mr.Flibble, on Jul 24 2010, 06:38 PM, said:

There is more to the universe than our little pathetic planet, unfortunately, none of us will ever leave it.

So like nevermind that exploration of the universe have given us an insight in our own history, helped physics and chemistry research,...

What doesn't make sense is you claiming that researching the universe is "useless, it just looks cool but that's it"

[underTaker]

In case of universe and such things... I've always been wondering how the hell did they know how many years ago Big Bang happened, and actually how do they know how it all has started etc. x.X

[blackharted]

underTaker, on Jul 25 2010, 10:58 AM, said:

In case of universe and such things... I've always been wondering how the hell did they know how many years ago Big Bang happened, and actually how do they know how it all has started etc. x.X

When did it happen? MILLIONS & MILLIONS of years ago, and why well according to my old science teacher, all matter in the universe was in a big ball and thanks to unsable gases: BANG!

[Sangman]

blackharted, on Jul 25 2010, 10:26 PM, said:

thanks to unsable gases: BANG!

Nobody knows why the bang occurred, so to blame "unstable gases" is weird. I've heard the theory that gases would actually be impossible because there was quite literally nothing, so no gases either. But... that doesn't make sense. How can nothing explode into something?

As for how they figure out how long ago it happened, even today the universe is still expanding at a certain speed. Then it's not that far-fetched to reverse that and see how long it would take for everything to get back to one central point.

But yeah I do wonder about the Big Bang.. something's just not right If there's one way I'd be willing to accept a deity of some sort, it's the thing that created whatever it was that exploded.

[Master Fibbles]

The Universe is 14 billion years old because we can only see 14 billion light years out.

In the beginning there was nothing. Then there was something and it exploded. Gas did not exist until much later and what did exist first was hydrogen, which fused into helium, and then there were super novae that created the rest of the elements through fusion. For the first part of the life of the universe, there was just a bunch of super giant stars (probably much like the one they just discovered) that lived short lives of fusing hydrogen into helium and then exploded in super hot super novae that fused to make the heavier elements.

Sangman said:

So like nevermind that exploration of the universe have given us an insight in our own history, helped physics and chemistry research,...

Such as?

As far as physics and chemistry, I can see that because it has inspired fusion which would be nice to have as an energy source. But these things take lifetimes...ah, I shouldn't be listened to right now. RealLife is fucking with my head so I'm frustrated and kind of defeatist etc right now. We'll come back to this though. If I wasn't "distracted" I'd probably agree with you, Sangman.

[Sangman]

Mr.Flibble, on Jul 26 2010, 05:11 AM, said:

Such as?

Like how our world came to be, why certain species went extinct, etc.

[blackharted]

Sangman, on Jul 25 2010, 04:16 PM, said:

Nobody knows why the bang occurred, so to blame "unstable gases" is weird. I've heard the theory that gases would actually be impossible because there was quite literally nothing, so no gases either. But... that doesn't make sense. How can nothing explode into something?

As for how they figure out how long ago it happened, even today the universe is still expanding at a certain speed. Then it's not that far-fetched to reverse that and see how long it would take for everything to get back to one central point.

But yeah I do wonder about the Big Bang.. something's just not right If there's one way I'd be willing to accept a deity of some sort, it's the thing that created whatever it was that exploded.

No No. According to my Science teacher everything was in a tiny ball or something and then gases started to seep out or something and then: BOOM!

[Zaxtor]

Each times a star explode a new material, gas etc is form.

Like iron didn't exist billions of year ago and when a supermassive star blew up, iron was form.

[Master Fibbles]

blackharted, on Jul 27 2010, 07:09 AM, said:

No No. According to my Science teacher everything was in a tiny ball or something and then gases started to seep out or something and then: BOOM!

Your teacher is fucking retarded. That is some sad attempt to combine New Earth Creationism and Big Bang Theory...it doesn't work because the former is flat out ludicrous and the latter is fine the way it is, if somewhat incomplete.

[blackharted]

Mr.Flibble, on Jul 27 2010, 08:32 AM, said:

Your teacher is fucking retarded. That is some sad attempt to combine New Earth Creationism and Big Bang Theory...it doesn't work because the former is flat out ludicrous and the latter is fine the way it is, if somewhat incomplete.

Right you confused the hell of of me. Whats ludicrous or whatever? Plus what my teacher said must hold some water because EVERY teacher I've had says the same and can't all be wrong.

[Sangman]

Yeah and many people I know sadly believe Behind Blue Eyes was originally written by Limp Bizkit. That doesn't automatically mean it's true..

[blackharted]

Sangman, on Jul 27 2010, 10:14 AM, said:

Yeah and many people I know sadly believe Behind Blue Eyes was originally written by Limp Bizkit. That doesn't automatically mean it's true..

Yeah it also doesn't mean a God made everything....
BTW Behind Blue Eyes by Limp Bizkit was FANTASTIC!

[Master Fibbles]

blackharted, on Jul 27 2010, 11:54 AM, said:

Right you confused the hell of of me. Whats ludicrous or whatever?

Do you own a dictionary? Anytime I use a word you don't understand, look it up.

blackharted, on Jul 27 2010, 11:54 AM, said:

Plus what my teacher said must hold some water because EVERY teacher I've had says the same and can't all be wrong.

"A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it. Fifteen hundred years ago everybody knew the Earth was the center of the universe. Five hundred years ago, everybody knew the Earth was flat, and fifteen minutes ago, you knew that humans were alone on this planet. Imagine what you'll know tomorrow."
-Agent K

[blackharted]

Mr.Flibble, on Jul 27 2010, 12:40 PM, said:

Do you own a dictionary? Anytime I use a word you don't understand, look it up.

"A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it. Fifteen hundred years ago everybody knew the Earth was the center of the universe. Five hundred years ago, everybody knew the Earth was flat, and fifteen minutes ago, you knew that humans were alone on this planet. Imagine what you'll know tomorrow."
-Agent K

But your overlooking that fact there's proof of the big bang.

[Master Fibbles]

The Big Bang Theory is not that the entire universe was in a small ball and it just expanded out rapidly. The Big Bang Theory is that all the energy in the universe was once at a single point and then it exploded eventually over the course of millenia created hydrogen which eventually created massive stars that lived for a short period of time and fused H into He and then went supernova to create other heavier elements. This process repeated over the millenia until heavier objects such as planets formed.
Your teacher(s) don't know what they are talking about and are wrong because everyone else has proof to the contrary.

[Sangman]

Couldn't have put that better myself. The Big Bang theory is about... The bang. Whatever was there before the bang, we don't know, but I doubt it was a ball of gas (because after all gas wouldn't have existed)

[blackharted]

Sangman, on Jul 28 2010, 10:03 AM, said:

Couldn't have put that better myself. The Big Bang theory is about... The bang. Whatever was there before the bang, we don't know, but I doubt it was a ball of gas (because after all gas wouldn't have existed)

Well the teacher said EVERYTHING was in a ball or some shit not just gases.

[Master Fibbles]

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[blackharted]

Mr.Flibble, on Jul 28 2010, 12:10 PM, said:

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A trekkie eh?

[Radar]

blackharted, on Jul 28 2010, 02:32 AM, said:

But your overlooking that fact there's proof of the big bang.

Mr.Flibble, on Jul 28 2010, 06:26 AM, said:

The Big Bang Theory is not that the entire universe was in a small ball and it just expanded out rapidly. The Big Bang Theory is that all the energy in the universe was once at a single point and then it exploded eventually over the course of millenia created hydrogen which eventually created massive stars that lived for a short period of time and fused H into He and then went supernova to create other heavier elements. This process repeated over the millenia until heavier objects such as planets formed.
Your teacher(s) don't know what they are talking about and are wrong because everyone else has proof to the contrary.

How about you guys actually explain this proof? All I'm hearing is just a theory of what the big bang was, but I don't actually see any proof. No matter how many people say "Oh yes the world blew up from a little ball and slowly got bigger over the course of a billion years", where's the rock-solid end-all and be-all proof?

The supernova went to create other heavier elements you say? Right, I always found it funny how we have a whole table of elements yet the only thing that is ever mentioned to be at the beginning of the universe was hydrogen and helium. Where did all the other elements come from? Oh yeah, evolution. Though I still don't get it, I imagine it would be hard as heck to get passed ones like iron.

I also thought matter cannot be created or destroyed, but only changes forms or moves energy. The big bang theory sounds a lot like matter being created as it started to move farther away, not just the transfer of energy. I know an older guy who is studying thermodynamics in college, and believes the whole big bang theory is bullocks. He said when they were teaching him this law they said "yes we know this sort of goes against the big bang theory but look at these pretty formulas on the wall they prove whatever..."

The big bang theory just needs to be revised. Or better yet, scraped all together since it doesn't seem like any hardcore proof is going to be coming any time soon.

I hope I don't sound like a blowhard or anything, I'm just trying to throw something new on the table. And I understand that I am young and may need some enlightening so please enlighten me if you will on this subject how you see fit.

[Master Fibbles]

Radar1013, on Jul 30 2010, 01:35 PM, said:

I hope I don't sound like a blowhard or anything, I'm just trying to throw something new on the table. And I understand that I am young and may need some enlightening so please enlighten me if you will on this subject how you see fit.

OK, I didn't want to make this too scientific, but you asked...

Radar1013, on Jul 30 2010, 01:35 PM, said:

How about you guys actually explain this proof? All I'm hearing is just a theory of what the big bang was, but I don't actually see any proof. No matter how many people say "Oh yes the world blew up from a little ball and slowly got bigger over the course of a billion years", where's the rock-solid end-all and be-all proof?

Proof of the Big Bang won a Nobel. The microwave background in the universe stands as proof of the Big Bang Theory. The remnants of radiation is a sign of the early stages of the universe according to the Big Bang Theory. I don't know enough from my astronomy class last fall to repeat it all, though, so you will have to read up on it yourself.

Radar1013, on Jul 30 2010, 01:35 PM, said:

The supernova went to create other heavier elements you say? Right, I always found it funny how we have a whole table of elements yet the only thing that is ever mentioned to be at the beginning of the universe was hydrogen and helium. Where did all the other elements come from? Oh yeah, evolution. Though I still don't get it, I imagine it would be hard as heck to get passed ones like iron.

Nuclear Fusion. That is the two word answer to this. Hydrogen is a single electron, proton, and neutron. Pressure and the heat caused by that pressure fuses two H molecules together to make Helium. This is only possible in the intense pressure and heat found in stars (for now, we are working on it). Large stars such as this super giant won't live long because there is so much pressure and heat that it converts the H to He in a few million years. Our star will live much longer because it burns slower. Stars can also fuse He to make Carbon. C can be fused to make Neon. Ne can be fused to make Oxygen. O can be fused to make Silicon. Si is fused to make Iron at the end of the life of a star (literally, like in a day). Fe can't be fused in stars because it requires a significant amount of energy to fuse and gravity wins in the end. This is where supernovae come in. Massive stars (in the beginning of the universe) collapse(d) onto their Fe core (gravity) and "bounced" out into massive supernovae. A supernova is so intensely hot that it can fuse Fe into heavier elements. A supernova sends intense amounts of energy at speeds near the speed of light outwards destroying everything in its path. In super massive stars (such as what is believed to be at the beginning of the universe) result in blackholes. A theory is that galaxies orbit around super massive black holes that were the original super giants.

Radar1013, on Jul 30 2010, 01:35 PM, said:

I also thought matter cannot be created or destroyed, but only changes forms or moves energy. The big bang theory sounds a lot like matter being created as it started to move farther away, not just the transfer of energy. I know an older guy who is studying thermodynamics in college, and believes the whole big bang theory is bullocks. He said when they were teaching him this law they said "yes we know this sort of goes against the big bang theory but look at these pretty formulas on the wall they prove whatever..."

This is why I have no problem with the Big Bang Theory and stupid New Earth Creationists are stupid. Yes, the laws of thermodynamics says that matter/energy cannot be created or destroyed. However, this is after the universe has existed. If you stick with that law, you have an eternal universe and there isn't much support for that in science. Our understanding of natural science laws is limited because it is circumstantial. There is an extremely limited amount of data we can collect relative to time and space because we are a young short lived species living on a small insignificant planet in a small insignificant galaxy.

[Radar]

I've always wondered about these things. Thanks for the informative reply.

[Master Fibbles]

No problem. If I ever get bored of teaching religion to unresponsive college students (I'm not a PhD yet, but I'm working on it) I will probably get a MS or something in Astronomy for fun.
I really enjoyed my astronomy class in college...but it was too easy and had no math in it.

[Kathy]

Mr.Flibble, on Jul 30 2010, 11:41 PM, said:

Nuclear Fusion. That is the two word answer to this. Hydrogen is a single electron, proton, and neutron. Pressure and the heat caused by that pressure fuses two H molecules together to make Helium. This is only possible in the intense pressure and heat found in stars (for now, we are working on it). Large stars such as this super giant won't live long because there is so much pressure and heat that it converts the H to He in a few million years. Our star will live much longer because it burns slower. Stars can also fuse He to make Carbon. C can be fused to make Neon. Ne can be fused to make Oxygen. O can be fused to make Silicon. Si is fused to make Iron at the end of the life of a star (literally, like in a day). Fe can't be fused in stars because it requires a significant amount of energy to fuse and gravity wins in the end. This is where supernovae come in. Massive stars (in the beginning of the universe) collapse(d) onto their Fe core (gravity) and "bounced" out into massive supernovae. A supernova is so intensely hot that it can fuse Fe into heavier elements. A supernova sends intense amounts of energy at speeds near the speed of light outwards destroying everything in its path. In super massive stars (such as what is believed to be at the beginning of the universe) result in blackholes. A theory is that galaxies orbit around super massive black holes that were the original super giants.

You pretty much blew my mind.

[Mblackwell]

The big bang wasn't an explosion.

[Sangman]

Mblackwell, on Aug 4 2010, 07:01 AM, said:

The big bang wasn't an explosion.

Then why do they call it the big "bang"?

[Kathy]

Because one guy called it like that and the name sticked.

[blackharted]

Lotan, on Aug 5 2010, 07:01 PM, said:

Because one guy called it like that and the name sticked.

In English?

[Kathy]

Two colliding galaxies.



http://www.youtube.c...h?v=0jpXXVWoSNk