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Duke Map/Mod of the Month Club - February 2024  "Duke's Fantastic Shovelware Adventure"

User is offline   Quacken 

#31

It's time for the rest of Episode 2.

Turn About
Spoiler


Waterslide

Spoiler


Landing Bay

Spoiler


Big Man

Spoiler

3

User is online   Aleks 

#32

View PostNightFright, on 17 February 2024 - 04:39 AM, said:

What would be interesting feedback from you guys for my DZ2-Fixed project: Are there any softlocks you'd still like to see fixed? (For example stuff like adding a jetpack, even if it's just a partially fueled one, in "Spelunking".) Or should everything stay the way it is now, for the sake of preserving the way vanilla maps worked? (To some degree this has already been altered, so...)

I think the only potential softlocks are in Cop City, Graveyard Shift and Spelunking.

Graveyard Shift honestly looks like a deliberate trap, the level is relatively short and pretty good anyway (also the first level in the episode, so you can't screw up your save game if using only one file), so I would leave this one out.

Spelunking is a mess of a level and I wouldn't mind providing a jetpack there, can be one with full fuel, probably as soon as falling down the pit in the Z part. Don't think it would "break" any further maps and even if so, it's a secret level so at least the player would get something out of finding this one.

Cop City has the sewers with no way out and softlocking if you don't find the keycards beforehand. However, a jetpack is provided in the previous level, so only pistol starting (or running out of fuel before) may lead to a softlock. Would probably leave this one as is, but a jetpack in the sewer wouldn't hurt either.

This post has been edited by Aleks: 19 February 2024 - 06:38 AM

4

User is offline   NightFright 

  • The Truth is in here

#33

Each map should be beatable without items from previous levels. At least if you follow standard design philosophy. So if a jetpack is required in a map and there isn't one - that's bad. So I would tend towards placing jetpacks in "Spelunking" and "Cop City". Great would be to have screenshots of suggested locations where to ideally place them (normal scenery + automap).

My suggestions:
- Cop City: There are three floor grates one can drop into. To me it looks as if one could get stuck in any of them. Maybe it's best to place one on the surface, right next to the first grate you see?
- Spelunking: Directly in front of the switch in the "Z" area, on the pedestal surrounded by lava (guess that's more or less the spot you meant)
3

User is offline   FistMarine 

#34

Thanks everyone for the comments so far and thanks slacker1 for joining in. Also glad to see NightFright posting here, considering his fixed version of Duke!Zone II was featured this month.

I'm somewhat familiar with Duke Zone II, having played it 2-3 times in past decade or so, though this is the first time I played it in DOSBox. In fact, back in 2011 or so, when I first heard about it and played it in eduke32, I kept confusing Duke Zone II and The Lost Duke Episodes 2.0, like mixing up the levels between the addons or something like that because I used to think The Lost Duke Episodes was a long lost commercial addon like The Lost Episodes of Doom.

If I'd like anything changed in the Fixed Version, I'd like all the softlocks to be fixed by providing one Jetpack in the area the player might get softlocked. As for the barrels in E2L1, maybe something could be done for that. Maybe adding an object that Duke can jump on top of it and reach the vent safely. Don't worry, that vent is closed initially and both exits are revealed much later. I will describe it in detail in next few days when I review the second episode.

And sorry for taking forever for replying, been quite a busy month for me. Anyway, I'm surprised to see people are enjoying Duke Zone II, despite what its reputation suggests. My map reviews will probably sound harsher in comparison.

To clarify a couple things asked earlier and other important things:
-Holoduke is much more useful in deathmatch, as it can fool other players. It has very limited use in Single Player, the monsters can get temporary distracted by it (assuming Duke is not staying too close to the aliens/hologram) and will attempt to get closer but the monsters will NEVER attack the Holoduke. I imagine it is useful to gather a bunch of enemies and blow them with a pipebomb or something. It would have been more useful if it created a Duke clone that fought alongside the player (like in DukePlus and Attrition) or even the way DNF did it by making Duke invisible while the Holoduke distracts the monsters.
-I don't think there are credits listed anywhere for who did which map.
-Some maps abuse the paletted enemies. For people playing Duke3D 1.3D in DOSBox, this means the paletted enemies have twice as much health.
-Some maps abuse the traps everywhere, so make sure to save often.
-There are various softlocks found in certain maps. I should have mentioned this earlier but I will attempt to describe them in my review when they come up, even if they have been already mentioned by others.

Also, only a couple levels contain secrets, so I will only write secret guides for those levels. If I don't state anything about secrets, then those levels don't have any. I will also mention secret exits locations, as well as the following facts (some were already mentioned):
-E1 only has one secret exit, found on E1L3, which leads to E1L6. The fixed version adds a second secret exit inside a secret area in E1L4, which leads to E1L7. Completing E1L7 in fixed version will also lead correctly to E1L5 instead of E1L8 (User Map).
-E2 has THREE secret exits found in the first three levels, with both E2L1 and E2L3 having the secret exit leading to E2L6 (the infamous level filled with softlocks). If you are playing continuously, it is recommended to take the secret exit early to get rewarded with Devastator. Then ignore the secret exit in E2L3.
-E3 has two secret exits but the secret level order is switched, with the first secret exit sending you to E3L7 and the second secret exit sending you to E3L6. I don't know if this is an oversight but it seems strange, especially if you play in DOS version where it shows the level number on the save/load menus, you will notice that.

And as I already stated, I have played the original version of addon in DOSBox 0.74-3 (Duke3D 1.3D on CGS difficulty) since the end of past month. All kills and secrets were found, except for two levels in E1 where I couldn't get 100% kills due to random bugs/glitches that have occurred in my playthrough.

The review below will focus on the original version of the addon, which also includes misspelled episode/level names. I will do the fixed release (and maybe Demo Version) later this month because it seems a new version of it got uploaded recently by NightFright, just shortly after the topic went up. The download link appears to be the same though, so you can use the same link provided in the OP to download the new version. I also forgot to mention that the Demo Version of the addon is only compatible with the ATOMIC EDITION (same goes to the Fixed Version) but the original CD version of the addon is for all Duke3d versions.

Let's begin!

ARTIC ASSAULT

Outskirts

Kills: 22
Secrets: 1

Duke must grab the shotgun and jump out of the helicopter but also make sure he lands in water. If you don't know where the water is located, Duke will fall to his death by landing on the hard icy surface. Happened to me twice, don't laugh. I expected the water to be nearby like every other user map out there that starts Duke like that.

Afterwards, Duke must swim through a tunnel, killing sharks on his way before resurfacing. But don't worry, it gets worse. The tunnel with electrified floors and sentry drones is apparently the worst part of the map and what brought the last/third death. It's not as bad as it sounds, the player just has to collect the Boots beforehand, kill the drones carefully, grab a pipebomb, destroy the tripmines (make sure they all get activated before you throw the bomb) and activate the switch that turns off the forcefield, so you can continue with the map. You get another pair of boots, so you don't lose health on the way back, though you still need to be quick to not have the old boots run out, since you might be low on health at this point. The rest of the level is not that bad. And as Quacken pointed out, you don't need the Red Card to finish the level, you can just reach that ledge by jumping.

Secret: When you reach the second part of the map, there are a bunch of barrels. Destroy them and go check out the wall at the end on the left side. Inside, you can find Scuba Gear and Atomic Health.

The only difference between the skill settings here is an extra shark present only on CGS and above. I wish I was kidding, that's how poorly implemented the difficulties are in this addon, as you will also see in many other levels.

Oh and I realized (though not fully confirmed) the sharks don't credit you with any kills in the original 1.3D release, considering I only had 22 enemies killed when I finished the level but I also had no enemies missed. I know that in the Atomic Edition and source ports, they are made bigger, less aggressive and they credit you with one kill but still not count as actual enemies.

Overall, this was an average starting level.
Attached Image: DZ2_E1L1.png

Slime Station

Kills: 56 (1 missed)
Secrets: 3

Although I appreciate the concept of this level, I felt like this one was really damn annoying. Not only it was easy to get smashed by the trains but also the pig cops were really annoying here with their constant sniping and high damage output. They were really hard to hit, yet they had no problem hitting Duke back. Despite starting with 150 health and 90 armor, I got killed twice by those fucking pig cops on the trains but also a couple deaths caused by getting smashed by the trains when I attempted to jump inside and get the cards.

And if that wasn't enough, I even managed to miss an enemy somewhere in the map but that enemy either disappeared into the walls or it got smashed by the trains and then it got deleted from the game. If that happens, goodbye 100% kills, at least in the DOS version. Though this is fixed in eduke32 (2017 and newer builds), so you get credited the kill if the enemies get smashed by the trains. And considering the enemies are everywhere, it's almost impossible to kill them quickly to prevent such catastrophe from occurring.

Here is another notable thing about the map: the blue & red cards are on the trains but usually you can't grab them without getting smashed by them. Sometimes it works, other times it doesn't. But what usually works is jumping from a specific spot. You should see a colored arrow (blue or red) at two points in the map. These show you where you have to jump and what card type you need to collect from the spot.

Once you got the keycards, you can reach the exit guarded by several enemies. And if you want to explore further for getting various goodies and fighting more enemies, go ahead. Make sure to also get the Jetpack, as it is the ONLY ONE in the entire episode!

Secrets:
1) Near the Red Arrow, blow up the crack to collect Devastator and 2x ammo for it, but watch out for the Sentry Drone waiting inside the secret place.
2) Blow up one of the cracks to collect 3x Atomic Health. It is located at few meters away from the Shrinker weapon pickup.
3) Inside the room with a switch in middle guarded by Octabrains and Commanders, check any of the sides. The right side counts as the secret area but you can go any way you want, just explore the whole vent. Inside the vent, you can find 5x Small Medkit but also a bunch of ammo packs and Steroids.

The only difference between difficulty settings is a few extra enemies on CGS and the Jetpack is only available if you are playing on LR and above.

Overall, this level was quite frustrating with cheap instant-deaths but the concept was great, even if its execution wasn't the best.
Attached Image: DZ2_E1L2.png

Cop City

Kills: 100
Secrets: 3

Finally a level that seems decent enough, at least the city part of the level. The sewer sections aren't anything special and they are quite dark, making navigation confusing. Gets extra points for including exactly 100 enemies in the level.

It is even possible to get softlocked but if you are playing continuously, you don't have to worry because the Jetpack you have acquired in the previous level will help you to get unstuck and even reach one secret area, as Aleks pointed out.

There are some pretty good fights in this level, such as the part inside the Police Station where you get to fight THREE Mini Battlelords waiting outside but also a bunch of pig cops for good measure. On top of that, there are some enemy spawns, mostly involving troopers and other surprises awaiting. But for the most part, you get to fight Pig Cops, as you can expect from a level named like that.

Secrets:
1) Near the police station, there is a crack. Blow it up and go near it to activate a hidden elevator or just fly directly with the Jetpack acquired from previous level to collect 2x Atomic Health.
2) Inside the cinema, press on the blue poster SISTER ACT III and jump inside to collect an Atomic Health.
3) Near the police station, look for a big window. Use the Jetpack acquired from the previous level to fly at the window and go through to collect an RPG. Note that this will spawn two troopers nearby.

Secret Exit: Located inside the dark sewers, there is a path you can go through. Watch out for two sentry drones guarding a Portable Medkit. Afterwards, climb and you should find the secret exit of the episode.

The only difference between difficulty levels is that there is an extra Pig Cop and Mini Battlelord present on CGS and above, while one Mini Battlelord is present on LR and above. In other words, difficulty mostly decides how many Mini Battlelords you face in this level.

Overall, this level was challenging and interesting without being too frustrating. Probably one of the highlights of E1 and the entire Duke Zone II package.
Attached Image: DZ2_E1L3.png

A Quicky

Kills: 33
Secrets: 1

A somewhat short secret map. Interestingly, I don't remember this map at all. I don't know if back then I missed the secret exit or something but this one was a bit of a surprise because I simply could not remember this map at all.

This map feels bland and dark at times but it provides some good action. The commanders on the moon can be taken out carefully with the Shrinker. Just look around the corners to not get surprise attacked.

Secret: Right behind the Armor at start of level, open the window where the Armor is sitting and jump inside to collect Night Vision Goggles.

Note: If you are playing continuously and have full armor from the previous level and don't get hit, you can collect the NVG secret without picking up the armor. But if you get hit, then ignore the secret and come back later when you have cleared the whole level and backtracked, so the armor pickup isn't wasted in the process. Pistol starters obviously want the armor and secret as soon as possible.

The only difference between difficulty settings is that there are a few extra Commanders and one extra Trooper present on CGS and above.

Overall, the level was okay I guess and provided some decent challenge too. I only wish the first half of the level was less confusing with the progression.
Attached Image: DZ2_E1L6.png

Opening Night

Kills: 68
Secrets: 5

Although this looks like it could have been another highlight of the package, this is a potentially fun map that is dragged down by some absolute bullshit design choices. And no I'm not talking about those ROTT flame traps (unused in original Duke3D levels), I didn't mind seeing them used here, even if their active sound can get annoying after a while.

The first thing to note is the random bullshit ambushes, ranging from enemies silently spawning behind you to the random explosions in your face. Like that Atomic Health trap, the explosions are already bad enough and if you survive, those tripmines will surely kill you. Even remembering this section from past playthroughs, I still managed to die at least once at this stupid trap.

And then I got killed a few more times inside that building because I was down to about 30 health and constantly starving for some health packs. Unlike Cop City, which had a few water fountains and was also generous with health, there are no water fountains anywhere in this map and the health is already scarce as well, plus only one armor pickup because the other armor was marked as Multiplayer-Only. Same applies to the map's only Portable Medkit, it was marked as MP only, so you will have to suffer in SP mode.

I pushed through and managed to do the map with some save-scumming and even ended up with 200 health and full armor at the end thanks to keeping those essential supplies. That's why I prefer finishing levels with as much health/armor as possible, to compensate for the lack of supplies in the next map.

As I'm reviewing the original version of the addon, I am not talking about the newly added secret exit. I will go through the EDuke32 fixed version in the next couple days while giving my final thoughts on this addon when the month is nearing end.

Secrets:
1) Before leaving the first area and entering the middle part of the level with the cross-shaped pool, there is some Shotgun ammo you can find inside a box.
2) In the lava area with the Mini Battlelord, there is one hidden spot that contains Atomic Health and Boots.
3) In the middle part of the level with the cross-shaped pool, on the left side, there is a very well hidden switch behind the tree in the corner. The switch may be glitchy and require multiple presses. It will temporary open a platform nearby that leads to a RPG and a teleporter.
4) In the middle part of the level with the cross-shaped pool, just next to the Yellow card slot, go to right side and jump through the wall to collect a Chaingun. This may be where the new secret exit was added in the Fixed Version of the addon.
5) At the end of the level, right behind the normal exit, there is an Atomic Health and Shotgun ammo to collect.

After taking a quick look in Mapster, there seems to be no difference between the skill levels. None of the enemies have any tags present on them, so you get the same enemy count on every skill.

Overall, this was another map that could have been great due to the excellent design but ended up frustrating due to the annoying gameplay. Let's hope the final map doesn't end up disappointing.
Attached Image: DZ2_E1L4.png

Showdown

Kills: 167 (2 missed)
Secrets: 2

This level is also available in the demo version, with the only difference being the boss replaced with a sign that tells you to go to the store and buy the full game. The same would happen with Duke Nuclear Winter later that year where Simply Silly Software made a free demo version with just first level that tells you to buy the game when you reach the end.

Anyway, here we have the finale of the first episode, with plenty of amazing action that involves jumping from building to building while fighting swarms of spawning monsters. As epic as that sounds, there are a couple problems:
1) The jetpack doesn't exist in this level, so if you are pistol starting, you must not fall down or else you die. On a continuous run, you have to use the Jetpack that you got back in E1L2 and hope you still have plenty of fuel left! Usually, the original Duke3D levels were fairly generous with the jetpacks but here they were quite stingy with them, only supplying like one for each episode.

2) Due to being surrounded by monsters from multiple sides, it is easy to lose health quickly if you are not careful or not killing the enemies quickly before they have a chance to attack.

3) The enemies can fall off the buildings, preventing 100% completion. No, they are unaffected by fall damage (unless they are nearly dead) and most likely the Commanders will descend and become unreachable. Even after I tried going down with the Jetpack and sacrifice 25% of fuel going up while killing some hidden monsters, I still had TWO enemies missed somewhere. Most likely they disappeared off the map or whatever, which was the second and last time in Duke Zone II where I couldn't get 100% kills.

Anyway, to fight the boss, you just need the three cards in order to unlock the last door. Kill a couple turrets and drones waiting you, then the Cycloid is now revealed. Kill him with the Devastator and watch the original E1 cutscene because the devs couldn't be bothered to implement new cutscenes. And while I also find using Cycloid here as an odd choice (he also appears in the next episodes), it's important to remember he can't move out of the spot he is placed in (he can only move on certain type of sectors), this ensures he doesn't fall off the building. Other bosses would have most likely fell out of the building if they chased Duke around. But as side effect, this makes the Cycloid easy to kill, since you can stay behind the wall and he won't hit you.

Secrets:
1) Blow up a crack to find inside 2x Troopers, 2X Boxes of Pipebombs, 2x Atomic Healths.
2) Blow up a crack to find 2x Atomic Healths (only available for Let's Rock and above).

The only difference between the difficulty settings is the second secret has stuff available on LR and above, while a couple extra enemies are only present on CGS and above. But considering the spawns are unaffected by skill settings, there is not too much of a difference. But hey, at least they tried to do something, much better than the levels where they didn't put any effort in implementing difficulty settings.

Overall, this was a fine way to end the first episode and it ended up being a somewhat memorable experience, even if some parts could have been better designed. I only wish there was a Jetpack added at least at the end and maybe some more polish in some areas.
Attached Image: DZ2_E1L5.png

4 Way Stop

Kills: 83
Secrets: 0

This level is not accessible in the original version of the addon unless you use the command line parameters and it has to be done within DUKE3D.EXE, not from the launcher D!Z2.EXE.

Here are the parameters for those interested: DUKE3D.EXE /GDUKE!ZON.GRP /XDZ-GAME.CON /V1 /L7 /S3

In the fixed release for EDuke32, the level is accessed from E1L4.

Anyway, when you start the level, you will see two ladies in the starting room, their size varying depending on whether you play the original or fixed version. And then as soon as you will step out of building, it will all start to become familiar...if you have played Duke Nuclear Winter before...and explored the hidden level.

That's because this level was later repurposed in Duke: Nuclear Winter as E2L8: Santamatch. Funnily enough, it was also only accessible from the command line parameters. But the level was covered in snow and featured no monsters, as it was a Deathmatch only level.

This time, you get to see what it was like originally as a Single Player level. And it is quite painful I must say, especially with the swarms of aliens at start, Mini Battlelords lurking in the corners, paletted enemies (Gray Pig Cops and Shadow Enforcers being the most notable ones) and the lack of Atomic Health pickups, you are guaranteed to die a few times.

Though the regular health pickups are plentiful (including many water fountains), it is still somewhat difficult to survive due to the tougher enemies swarming this place. And the armor is only found in one spot (surrounded by many pig cops/enforcers inside a building) or you can get lucky with an early drop from a pig cop, which will make things slightly easier.

Once you activate the four switches scattered around, go to the outside area and the exit is now open. And of course finishing 4 Way Stop will send you to the next level, which doesn't exist. It was fixed in the EDuke32 release to send you to E1L5 instead of E1L8, so you can finish the episode.

I'm still not sure why this wasn't made available as a secret level in the original release. I know the original Duke3D had some hardcoded behavior regarding E1L7 and later on the E1 slot but I'm pretty sure secret exits still worked fine if they were tagged properly, that's also how other mod makers got around when making E1 replacements with more than 6-7 levels.

The only difference between the difficulty levels is an extra commander present on LR and above, as well as a bunch of enemies present on CGS and above.

Overall, this level was okay, if not somewhat bland at times. Leaving aside some odd design choices. I think it would have worked well as a secret level if it was added from the beginning but it wouldn't have hurt to place some Atomic Health somewhere (maybe in the exit room?) to reward you if you have found this level during the game.
Attached Image: DZ2_E1L7.png

Episode 1 overall: A mixed bag with some beautiful and decent levels but also some really annoying and painfully designed ones. For better or for worse, these levels appear to be the most consistent and polished from the entire package, as you will see what awaits next in E2 and E3.

This post has been edited by FistMarine: 19 February 2024 - 08:22 AM

3

User is offline   NightFright 

  • The Truth is in here

#35

I took a look at the exit setup of "Graveyard Shift" in Mapster32 again, to refresh my memory. It really looks to me as if the author almost even intended the player to break the trashcans required to jump up to the exit shaft. Main reason: The secret exit is in the same room, very close nearby.

Normally it'd make more sense if the exits were switched, but hey, this is D!Zone, anything goes. So I'd actually really rather not touch this setup and just go for adding jetpacks in the other two maps.
4

User is offline   FistMarine 

#36

Quote

I took a look at the exit setup of "Graveyard Shift" in Mapster32 again, to refresh my memory. It really looks to me as if the author almost even intended the player to break the trashcans required to jump up to the exit shaft. Main reason: The secret exit is in the same room, very close nearby.


The problem is if you break the trash cans, you can no longer reach ANY of the exits. The reason is the secret exit only opens as soon as you approach the regular exit. And to reveal the regular exit, you need to press that one switch in the area but also make sure the trash cans aren't broken when you come back. See below for more details. Also the gameplay screenshot provided below in E2L1 is for the area with the switch that unlocks the exit, so I hope this will clear some confusion. :)

Anyway, today is time to review Episode 2!

ALIEN ABBY

Graveyard Shift

Kills: 43
Secrets: 1

Although the starting area is interesting, this level is plagued with many annoyances, as you will see below.

After clearing the opening section with just 50 health remaining, I'm immediately greeted with a pig cop in the dark. Barely survived and had to deal with underwater parts with low health remaining. It was very easy to drown or get killed by the sharks or even by the turret when surfacing (yes it happened to me once), which by the way, you want to get there to collect that much needed Portable Medkit!

After flipping some switches underwater, there is a gate that opens temporary. Note that when you get past the gate, there is no way back to the first part of the level! Afterwards, you will find a much needed toilet. It is up to you if you want to use the Medkit or save it for the upcoming level. If you are playing continuously, you want to think twice, so you don't regret your decision. If you are desperate for health, just break the toilet and drink the water.

Remember this location, as you need to come back later. In the meantime, make sure to NOT break the trash cans or else you get softlocked! The vent can be accessed early but none of the exits are available yet. You need to visit the other rooms, which feature more cheap traps, like a death pit, a crusher, monsters lurking in the darkness, etc.

Anyway, after pressing a switch on that large bright room, you have to go all the way back to the toilet and the trash cans. The NORMAL exit is now reachable. Go inside the dark vent and approach the normal exit.

If you go back to the previous room, you will notice the SECRET exit is now available behind the toilet! You get rewarded with TWO Atomic Healths. One of the trash cans also contains an Atomic Health inside, while the other trash cans contain shotgun ammo and RPG. Yes, it is now safe to break the trash cans and collect the goodies inside. Make sure to also have 100 health before grabbing the TWO Atomic Healths, so you can start the next level with 200 health. You need the extra health because of what awaits next.

Secret: Secret Exit counts as the only secret in the level.

The only difference between difficulty settings is a couple extra enemies present on CGS and above, such as a bunch of sentry drones at starting area, some Octabrains and Sharks underwater, etc.

Overall, despite the interesting starting area, this was a pretty awful level with some shitty design choices in it: bullshit traps, darkness, no armor and softlocks. The only thing that saved it from being a disaster is the interesting starting area, as well as the decent ammo and generous health.
Attached Image: DZ2_E2L1.png

Spelunking

Kills: 116
Secrets: 0

Oh boy, we are in for what seems like the lowest point of the addon. Bullshit design, bullshit enemy placement, bullshit traps, no armor, points of no return, softlocks and the list can continue.

Even though everyone already stated earlier, I will mention it again: you MUST press A switch before dropping down the lava room with switch Z, which is the first point of no return! Just watch out for those monsters spawning, they are everywhere and can hurt you good. Even with the generous health supplies provided early on, I got killed a few times but I will blame the lack of armor here. As weak as the armor is in duke3d, it is better than nothing but the mappers either forgot to put armor or didn't care about it.

I will only focus on the worst and most confusing part: the three elevators near the end of the level. These are what will get most people stuck. And no, you don't get ANY Jetpack until the end of the episode, unless you used cheats like DNKROZ and DNSTUFF. I haven't played the Fixed Version yet to see how the elevators work but in the original version of the addon, there is only ONE way to make them work. Make sure to save your game before attempting to use the elevator and use a few backup slots in case you screw it up and saved the game on the current slot. After banging my head for 10-15 minutes trying to complete this miserable section and blowing myself up with RPG in the process, I found a way that works, no cheats involved.

You have to approach the middle section, which is the only one side that works, and somehow press on it while crouching and going forward, then that part will move up quickly. If you didn't hit the right sector, then you end up lowering/raising the other parts or even the lava sector (as stupid as that sounds) and then you get softlocked.

If everything worked right, you will appear at the top of the current elevator. I recommend saving here on another slot, then jump to the next elevator and repeat the process until you reach the last part of the level. Kill the remaining alien bastards and then you can reach the exit.

The only saving grace of this level is getting an early Devastator with some decent ammo. But other than that, there is no point in visiting this level, since you will end up with only 100 or less health if you finish it, which is much less than what you entered if playing continuous. Because all the extra health supplies are left behind in starting areas and you can't go back to get them.

You get another chance later in the episode to visit this secret level but there is no point to revisit this if you already got through it.

The only difference between difficulty settings is a couple extra drones and troopers present on CGS and above.

Overall, this map was garbage. Hopefully the next one is better.
Attached Image: DZ2_E2L6.png

The Abby

Kills: 124
Secrets: 2

Yes, it has been mentioned before but this map definitely feels like a DOOM map. It's incredibly average in terms of design, though much better than the previous levels, as it gives you plenty of resources to fight the hordes of monsters. All types of health pickups and Shotgun ammo are abundant. Even the armor makes two appearances here, so this time you are well prepared for what awaits next. Of course, the map still has a few annoying parts, like the Red Key ambush with the commanders spawning around.

The FOUR Mini Battlelords at the end actually killed me twice due to being a bit overprotective with my ammo, I had a few RPG shots missed and then I wanted to finish them off with the Shotgun but it didn't always go well.

Secrets:
1) At the very beginning, press on the wall right ahead of you. Inside, you can find a Small Medkit and a Portable Medkit.
2) At the very beginning, go to left side where you see a Portable Medkit. Jump through the curtains at the opposite side to fight two troopers and collect a box of Pipebombs.

Secret Exit: Climb up the vents (watch out for a tripmine) and eventually you will get to a small room with the secret exit, as well as Large Medkit, Portable Medkit and Armor.

Oh and while the map does make an attempt to implement difficulty settings (even some items are affected), I don't understand why all the monsters at beginning and those four Mini Battlelords at end have NO difficulty tags applied to them.

Overall, this map was somewhat average but when you compare to the rest of the episode, it seems actually decent and a massive improvement to the previous two shitty levels.
Attached Image: DZ2_E2L2.png

Turn About

Kills: 60
Secrets: 0

It's time for another shitty secret level! It's better and far more creative than Spelunking but it has plenty of frustrations that drag down the level.

This level wasn't fun at all. There are many dickish traps, such as the Commanders spawning on the conveyor (I had to retry this part several times just to make sure I got all kills, considering commanders can descend into pit and there is no way to get them anymore) and even the hitscanners were annoying to deal with their constant sniping. I wasn't even out of the first area with rotating gears and my health had dropped (from 200) to 85 thanks to them.

And of course the last parts of the level with the lava, Commanders and Mini Battlelords hiding in the dark are awful, killed me a couple times as well. And the Octabrains encountered earlier are paletted for some reason, so they had twice as much health, which meant they were as strong as the commanders, making them a chore to kill.

I was running low on health that I had to drink from the lava fountain (while jumping to minimize boots usage) because I must have exhausted all the little health that was present in the level.

There are no secrets to find but there is one hidden Atomic Health (the only one in the entire map) that is near beginning, behind a window, as Aleks mentioned earlier. Be sure to also grab the early armor when pistol starting or save it for the end if playing continously.

Overall, this secret level was terrible and somewhat miserable at times. As a final insult, it doesn't even implement difficulty settings, so the enemy count is the same on all skills.
Attached Image: DZ2_E2L7.png

Waterslide

Kills: 79
Secrets: 4

The first decent level of the episode. There are some good fights and even a couple interesting parts, like the yellow room with tripbombs and the acid area towards the end offers some interesting fights.

Just note that when you insert the three keys, it doesn't open the nearby door, it instead opens a nearby compartment where you activate switches to unlock the exit door and spawns a few nearby enforcers.

Secrets:
1) Inside the alien corridor, there is one big gray door you can open. You can find a bunch of goodies: 3x Small Health, 2x RPG Ammo, 2x Shrinker Ammo and Boots.
2) Inside the yellow room where you had to avoid tripmines, there are two fans you can destroy. Inside the vent, you can find a Sentry Drone and 2x Shotgun Ammo. It also lets you backtrack to the beginning of the level.
3) Behind the Yellow Card, press on the misaligned wall to collect an Atomic Health sitting inside the sky.
4) In the acid area, where you collect the Red Card, there is one corner where you can find a Portable Medkit and Secret Exit in the acid.

Secret Exit: See Secret #4. If you have already completed E2L6, then ignore the secret exit and move on to the episode, unless you really want to replay E2L6.

Notes:
-There is an Atomic Health found at the level start, hidden in the left upper corner of the water sector.
-While there are a couple enemies tagged to appear on CGS and above, many enemies are weirdly tagged: instead of 0,3 they are tagged 0,3,0. Not sure why but I imagine this is a mistake.

Overall, this level was decent.
Attached Image: DZ2_E2L3.png

Landing Bay

Kills: 137
Secrets: 2

Another decent level, featuring more interesting combat pieces and there are even functional cranes! You don't get any shrinking puzzles in the entire addon but you get a few crane puzzles only in this map.

You may have to watch out for the many hitscanners present but also a few Mini Battlelords lurking around. It is easy to lose health quickly but the level is very generous with health (there's almost 20 large medkits) and even armor pickups. In fact, this is probably the most generous level out of the entire DZ2, as it gives you SIX armor pickups!

Oh and remember that there is no way back to the starting area, so grab everything before dropping down.

Secrets:
1) Get picked up by one of the cranes (or just jump), collect the RPG and go inside the vents. You can then collect Devastator, Large Medkit and Chaingun Ammo. Then you will arrive into a room containing Boots and Portable Medkit, while two troopers will spawn behind you.
2) After using the Red Card and going through the door, go to right side and press on the blue wall to find a teleporter inside, which will send you on the bridge earlier where you can collect 2x Atomic Health. It will also cause a few enemies to spawn.

Overall, this was another decent level, probably made by the same person who made the previous level, as I can tell some enemies are tagged the same way as in the previous map.
Attached Image: DZ2_E2L4.png

Big Man

Kills: 93
Secrets: 0

The last level of this episode is unique in that it makes you fight ALL THREE BOSSES at once! Unlike the Doom/Quake games, there is no infighting in Duke3D, though the bosses can hurt each other by their attacks and only one needs to die to end the episode. But before you get to them, you need to kill a bunch of enemies and solve some underwater puzzles while fighting Octabrains.

When you get to the room containing the bosses, you can choose to kill any of them to end the episode or you can do the hard way and kill all THREE at same time! The Cycloid is stationary, while the Battlelord and Overlord will move and try to reach you.

The episode's only jetpack is found inside that place surrounded by bosses, good luck trying to grab it without dying. It's not impossible to grab it but I can't imagine it will be much use here, you can just use the wall for cover and hope the Cycloid's rocket doesn't clip through the walls or something.

The bosses can hurt each other and it is easy to make Cycloid damage himself, although be sure to not get hit by a rocket, as you can get one shot'd by a rocket even at 200 health. Yes, I got instantly killed twice by the Cycloid at 200 health but even though I had no armor (there is no armor in this level), it wouldn't have made a difference, as the armor doesn't do anything if you take a hit that is equal or higher than your current health due to a stupid glitch that wasn't fixed in any Duke3d version or source port.

Anyway, it is possible to kill all three bosses at once but you need to hurt all bosses and then finish them off quickly with the Devastator before the screen starts fading. I recommend saving on a few slots and you should be able to do it.

Fun fact: the map features about a third enemies tagged to appear for CGS and above but what got my attention is that one of the tagged enemies (a commander) is mistakenly tagged as 0,3,0. We can deduce that the author of this map is the same as the author of the previous two maps. But then why did the previous level had so many armor pickups, while this one has none? Weird decision I must say.

Overall, this level was average. Not as good as the previous two maps but still better than the secret levels. Still no new cutscene at the end, just the original E2 ending.
Attached Image: DZ2_E2L5.png

Episode 2 overall: A lesser quality mixed bag. It's weaker than the first episode with a few less impressive levels and some truly awful ones.

None of the secret levels are any good or worth playing, while the first and last level are bad in their own ways, though I'm giving E2L5 some credit because you don't often get to fight ALL THREE BOSSES at once in user maps/mods, so I think this was an interesting experiment, plus the map wasn't that bad, it just average. I just think it would have worked better if you fought them all at the end of the third episode.

If it wasn't for the middle maps in the episode (most notably E2L3 and E2L4), this would have been a crappy episode. Though kinda funny that there wasn't much to write about the good levels (they felt somewhat forgettable), while there was a lot to be said about the bad levels.

Luckily, E2 is the lowest point of Duke Zone II, as you will see next time when E3 gets reviewed. ;)

This post has been edited by FistMarine: 21 February 2024 - 08:30 AM

3

User is offline   NightFright 

  • The Truth is in here

#37

If anybody feels up to it:
Try replaying E1L3, E2L1 and E2L6 with latest Duke!Zone v2.2 and see how it is.

Screw up on purpose:
- E1L3: Well, if you don't see the jetpack and pick it up, I guess it's your own fault... ;)
- E2L1: Shoot all the trashcans in the restroom with the level exits
- E2L6: Take the "Z" lift first.

All of these preferrably via pistol start, i.e. no inventory items. Should flow much better now.
3

User is offline   FistMarine 

#38

Thanks NightFright. I will try the updated Duke!Zone II later today and report next week when I give my overall thoughts about D!Z2, since I plan to go through the updated version soon, if only for the sake of completeness and to try getting those missing kills in E1L2 and E1L5. Anyway, today is the long awaited time for reviewing E3, just in time for the weekend! Grab the popcorn and enjoy reading this long post. :)

MONKEY SHINES

Dining Out

Kills: 39
Secrets: 2

Probably the best starting level of any of the D!Z2 episodes. This level won't give you much trouble, besides the somewhat scarce ammo in the beginning, even with finding the hidden Chaingun. Luckily, I didn't have any problem with the Health. Afterwards, the level picks up and offers a good challenge without being frustrating, though it's mostly on the easier side. As you are given plenty of goodies, like two armor pickups and two portable medkits. The enemy placement is also quite good and even has difficulty settings implemented, so that a few enemies are present on LR and above, while others are present on CGS and above.

Secrets:
1) At the very beginning, jump through the TONIGHT poster and swim through the water tunnel until you surface into the secret room that contains RPG, Shotgun ammo and Large medkit.
2) Near the beginning, just after going through the left door, blow up the fire hydrant. Inside the destroyed wall, you can find Shotgun ammo and a box of Pipebombs.

Bonus:
-Don't miss the Atomic Health in the corner of the kitchen.
-When you reach the roof with the commanders and exit sector, check behind those walls at both sides. You can find a Portable Medkit and Steroids.

Overall, this level was good. Gets bonus points for including Simpsons references.
Attached Image: DZ2_E3L1.png

The Company

Kills: 28
Secrets: 2

Another good level, probably made by the same person who did the previous level. It is a bit on the short side and can be made even shorter if you find the secret exit, though more on that below.

The funny thing is this level goes even further to implement difficulty settings. You get enemies tagged for ALL four skills! But unfortunately, you can't play on a difficulty easier than Piece of Cake to get even less enemies, unless you use command line parameters to set the difficulty to the unused Skill 0.

This may sound surprising for some but during development, Duke Nukem 3D was meant to have FIVE difficulty settings available! And it can be seen in the leaked Beta 0.99 build but in the final game, they cut the easiest skill which featured even less enemies than POC. Most original levels still have some enemies tagged to appear for POC and above and this information is available for reading on TCRF as well if you don't believe me.

Secrets:
1) After using the Blue Card, there is a room filled with canisters. Destroy the canisters carefully and when the room is clear, look for a Portable Medkit inside a cracked wall.
2) Near the end of level, there is a Fire Extinguisher. Destroy it to find Atomic Health and a box of Pipebombs inside the wall.

Secret Exit: Inside the acid, you can find the secret nuke button, which will send you to E3L7. Don't forget to also pick up the Shrinker inside the acid.

Overall, this was another good level. It was slightly shorter than expected but I'd take a short and easy/fun level over a frustrating one any day.
Attached Image: DZ2_E3L2.png

Banzai

Kills: 67
Secrets: 0

As already mentioned by Aleks and Slacker1, the level can be skipped immediately since the exit is directly behind you. Duke can jump through the cracks and reach the exit just fine. But why would you do this if you bothered to find the secret exit in first place?

Anyway, the thing that didn't get mentioned so far is that you get to fight TWO Mini Cycloids! But wait, you don't have to worry because they might as well not exist. They die in a single hit from anything. How? The explanation is that Mini Overlord and Mini Cycloid exist in the final game and can be placed in maps by giving the regular bosses a non-zero PAL value (usually 21) and they turn into mini bosses but they only have 1 HP each. Some mods implement mini bosses properly. Duke Nukem 64 also has a working Mini Overlord that appears twice towards the end of E3.

And finally, Duke Nukem 3D: 20th Anniversary World Tour Edition, implements mini bosses (and even full sized bosses that don't end the episode) in the game, as they are used throughout the fifth episode. Unfortunately, Mini Alien Queen is unused but she is still coded in the game and can be placed in custom levels.

Back to this level, there is not much to say about it, other than there being plenty of paletted enemies and you should be careful when swimming and using the elevators to always stay in the middle of the sectors. I didn't get squished this time but I think in a previous playthrough I fell victim to the mismatched sector and over the years I learned to usually just stay in the middle when submerging/surfacing from water. Difficulty settings aren't implemented in this level.

Overall, this level was pretty meh. It's nowhere near as bad as the secret levels in E2, even with some surprise enemy spawns. But it's also not as good as the first two levels in E3. Still, it looked like it could have fit well in the third episode as a regular level and instead have a different level used as a secret level. You probably know which one I'm talking about.
Attached Image: DZ2_E3L7.png

Down And Out

Kills: 62
Secrets: 2

This map appears to be made by the same person who designed the later E2 levels. Mostly because of the enemy tags being mistagged (0,3,0 instead of 0,3) and the design being similar to those maps. Before advancing with the map, be sure to grab everything before you drop down, as you can no longer get back up. This includes the first secret (see below).

There are some issues with the map, such as some water sectors not being properly tagged which will cause fall damage and some platforms being tagged as liquid surfaces, though this was fixed in the EDuke32 version of the addon.

The biggest issue I remember from past playthrough was when falling down the waterfall, you got softlocked with no way out. You don't get the Jetpack until much later and it was impossible to escape, plus you literally got locked underwater, though this glitch might only happen in Atomic/source ports. Water behavior may have worked fine in 1.3D but I just didn't bother checking this time as I haven't managed to die in E3 so far and wanted to see how far I can get.

The combat here is pretty solid and at the end, you fight against a bunch of Enforcers and Commanders, that can even get squished with the doors. I wouldn't have minded seeing a Mini Battlelord in the exit room but I'm okay with what we got.

Secrets:
1) At the very beginning, when you meet the first trooper and collect Shotgun with 2x shells, there is a stained glass window you can jump to. Jump inside to collect Large Medkit, Box of Pipebombs and Devastator Ammo. NOTE THAT THIS SECRET CAN ONLY BE REACHED AT BEGINNING! IF YOU DROP DOWN, YOU CAN'T GO BACK UP!
2) Near the end, after using the Red Card and pressing the switch that raises the stairs, there is another stained glass window you can jump to. Jump inside to collect RPG Ammo and Portable Medkit.

Overall, this level was okay. It showed some potential and even if the random bugs/glitches dragged it down slightly, it's still a much better level compared to the next one.
Attached Image: DZ2_E3L3.png

Fun House

Kills: 53
Secrets: 0

Just when I thought E3 was going to have no bad maps, this level comes along and proves me wrong. Slacker1 is on point with his review and I'm not ashamed to say I save-scummed like crazy in this one. Because it's filled with many instant death sections (crushers, pits, etc) and even a few cheap ambushes like the one involving many spawning Sentry Drones.

In fact, if you want to get all the kills, be careful to not have enemies descend into that pit or else you can say goodbye to 100% kills. I had to throw myself into that pit a few times just to check if I truly got all the kills. I know that one time I had to load an earlier save when I found some enemies were down there.

Those fast crushers were annoying and got me a couple times but I was able to get a couple of goodies hidden underneath, except that I couldn't get that trapped Blue Card. I tried a few times and I gave up when I realized it's pointless because you get another one later.

And as a final insult, difficulty settings are very poorly implemented, as there is one commander with a weird tag and a turret that's tagged to appear on POC and above, everything else is unchanged. Yes, the mapper failed at implementing skill levels properly and only tagged a fucking turret that will appear anyway on every skill setting. Oh and there is no armor in this map and even the health felt scarce at times but luckily you can use the water fountain and toilets to refill the health.

Speaking of which, the only good part of the level is the bathroom. Which is also where you can find the secret exit and will let you finish the level earlier. There are no secrets to find but there is a hidden Atomic Health behind a wall, on the platform you reach after jumping on the spinning fan.

Secret Exit: Check the bathroom stalls. You should find the secret nuke button which will lead to E3L6. Just check the screenshot for the exact location.

Overall, this map sucked ass and it looked like it belonged to the second episode. Easily the shittiest map of the entire episode. Maybe it should have been the secret level of the episode instead of a proper progression map. Let's hope the secret level is worth it.
Attached Image: DZ2_E3L4.png

Dying Time

Kills: 109
Secrets: 0

Another weird gimmicky secret map. It's more similar to the ones from E2 but in terms of balance, it is a lot better because the mapper not only placed an armor pickup but also shitloads of Atomic Healths, so survival is made much easier, even with the enemies ambushing you from various spots. However, just like most other secret levels, difficulty settings are not implemented, so you can expect a lot of angry aliens waiting in this map. I recommend saving just in case you get unlucky with the enemies' damage or get instantly killed by a trap. Watch out for the ambushes towards the end of the level as well.

There are no secrets to find but there is one unofficial secret that must be found. Inside the room with switch C, blow up the crack to collect 5x Devastator ammo and the ONLY Jetpack found in the entire episode. This is also the only map in the entire addon where you can find the Freezethrower (full ammo provided). I bet you wondered long ago where the Freezethrower was in Duke!Zone II. :P

Overall, this level was somewhat interesting, despite some annoying sections and the design being nothing special at times, it still ended up being a somewhat enjoyable experience. It's also much better than Fun House in every way and rewards you with plenty of health and ammo. Worth visiting, if only just to collect the Freezethrower and Jetpack, especially after suffering through the previous map.
Attached Image: DZ2_E3L6.png

No Where To Run

Kills: 79
Secrets: 0

Final level time! Kill all the alien bastards and watch out for more teleporting aliens. Shouldn't a problem because if you played continuously and were a resourceful player like me, you should end up with full everything (except a few inventory items missing) after finishing the secret level. Then all you have to do is simply fight every alien in your way and finally, the Cycloid Emperor who can't move out of his place. For bonus points, kill him while grabbing the Devastator ammo to end in style with full ammo. Congratulations, you have finished Duke!Zone II!

The only difference between difficulty settings is a couple enemies appearing on CGS and above, such as the map's only Mini Battlelord and a few commanders/troopers in some places. Oh and there is no armor in this map and I quickloaded upon getting hit, just to maintain my health/armor at maximum throughout the entire level. I just wanted to finish with full everything like I do in rest Duke3D episodes, that's all.

Overall, this map was okay but I feel like E2L5 would have been better suited as a finale when fighting all three bosses at once. I find it funny that the Cycloid appears in each episode, maybe he was much easier to control when placed in the map (since he can only move on certain types of sectors), otherwise the other bosses would have moved around and fallen down the pit with no way to kill them again. This is the only explanation I have on why E1L5 and E3L5 didn't use the other bosses.
Attached Image: DZ2_E3L5.png

Episode 3 overall: A massive improvement over the second episode. While the maps may not be as memorable as the ones from first episode, it seems like there is a potential to have things better balanced and designed. Leaving aside Fun House, I somehow managed to complete the rest of the episode without dying. Whereas in E1, I only beat E1L3, E1L6 and E1L5 without dying. And in E2, I only beat E2L3 and E2L4 without dying. I also blame the lack of armor in many of those maps that contributed to a harder difficulty, though luckily most E3 maps contain at least one armor pickup.

In terms of gameplay, I think I liked E3 much better. But in terms of design, I'd say E1 had cooler looking maps, while E3 had some pretty ones as well. And as for E2, it had some nice ideas and the middle maps in the episode were decent. But even those couldn't salvage that poor episode to me. The only weird thing about E3 is that most maps lacked secrets, so there wasn't much reason to explore for goodies, besides finding the unofficial secrets that should have been marked as secrets.

I will give my overall thoughts to DZ2 next week when I play through the fixed version. In meantime, here are the nominations for next month. Considering this month is shorter and nominations can begin a little bit earlier. ;)

Merc 2 + Murder: The EDF Conspiracy + Pray Your Prayers
Redneck Rampage Rides Again + Wanton Destruction +
World War II GI + Platoon Leader

Aleks' nomination remains, which includes a couple late 90s TCs for Duke3d. I have added two choices featuring other Build Engine games.

My first nomination includes the official standalone sequel to Redneck Rampage and the freeware expansion to Shadow Warrior, the latter which I have attempted to nominate previously but then I realized it was too much for February, so I thought that pairing Wanton Destruction with Rides Again sounds like a much better decision.

My second nomination includes the obscure Build Engine game known as World War II GI, with its freeware expansion Platoon Leader. WW2GI is another war themed shooter like NAM and I figured I'd nominate this as well, considering it was released in March 1999.

As usual, highlight the choice in bold and add a + next to it. I voted for the second option, just to have a month break from Duke, so that he can come back in full force in April. :D

Have a nice weekend everyone!

This post has been edited by FistMarine: 23 February 2024 - 05:55 AM

4

User is online   Aleks 

#39

Merc 2 + Murder: The EDF Conspiracy + Pray Your Prayers +
Redneck Rampage Rides Again + Wanton Destruction +
World War II GI + Platoon Leader
3

User is offline   slacker1 

#40

Of course the secret exit was in the bathroom. Staying in theme of E2L1. Thanks for the heads up!

Dying Time - E3L6

What's this? A gimmick level that actually works!? It seems to be a combination of what was attempted in Spelunking (E2L6) with the lettered doors and switches, and the turn-y platforms and traps of Turn About (E2L7) and Fun House (E3L4) but actually succeeds at doing it. The level design is very abstract with a somewhat theme of a space station-ish? I'm not really sure but it works for the type of level it is. I didn't realize at first that the big construction yellow-black themed floor in the center of the first room was an elevator until I spamming the space bar looking for a secret door to open or something.

The 'blender' room downstairs with the commanders that spawned in was a neat battle idea. It's sort of a bummer that projectiles get magically thrown off course when going over moving floors so for most of the rooms that use them, I had to resort back to my hit scan weapons. In the final long hallway to the level exit, I ran away from the ambush and somehow made it back through that crusher room. I found it interesting that the pig cops refused to walk into the crusher room but the sentry drones and commanders were happy to enter. Also, I never noticed before but apparently sentry drones are immune to crushing ceilings? I had a few enter that room and get pushed under the floor with no damage.

Anyway, the level has a ton of health and ammo on top of being fun making it worth the trip.

Rating: B+


No Where to Run - E3L5

It's not as bad as I originally thought it was going to be when I loaded up just the first few seconds last time I played but its not great either. Design wise, there's a bunch of pits in the first room and the final battle room. There's a couple of hallways that lead up to the final battle room and a blue key card guarded by a ton of trip mines. The trip mines are easy enough to take care of with a single pipe bomb and the blue door that it leads to, from what I can tell, doesn't really have a purpose except a few 'meh' pick ups and an enforcer trap.

Besides the main battle room, the other thing of note was the octobrain trap when you pick up the atomic health in the first room. Because I wasn't pistol starting, the devastator took them out in seconds. I could image if you tried pistol starting this map it could get really hard, really fast.

The final battle room was good. I triggered the extra commanders by tripping the devastator trap. When this happens, you're swarmed with commanders flying rockets at you from every direction. The best way to handle this is with the RPG but because you're surrounded by a lava death pit on all sides, it makes it a little tricky, but not too bad.

The battle with the cycloid emperor is basically a joke though. It's literally shooting a fish in a barrel. They give you a ton of devastator ammo and then pin him up in this little cubby and let you just spam mini rockets at him for a few seconds before he's dead and the episode is over.

One random thing I found 'interesting' (if you call it that...) is the level is shaped like a smiley face/ jack o lantern.

Commander battle was decent, level design is pretty meh. Overall a 'meh' end to an okay episode (if you exclude Fun House).

Rating: C-


Final Thoughts
Overall, Duke Zone II wasn't nearly as bad as I was fearing that it would be. There's some definite stinkers in the mix and nothing is really great overall but it's in no way an unplayable mess (except for Fun House and those E2 secret levels). Would I play through this add-on again? Probably not... and if I did, I would most likely just be a few levels from E1 or E3.

It is what it is, a shovelware add on from 1997, and playing it with that in mind, there's fun to be had even if its never very pretty to look at. That said, had I paid money for this back in the day, I think my ratings of it would be a bit harsher.

Overall Rating: D+ (Not an average)

I'm glad I took part in this month's map/mod of the month. It was a fun to try something I missed out on back in the day and read everyone else's reviews of the levels. I'm hoping I have time next month to continue!
3

User is offline   Quacken 

#41

Hi! Here's half of E3.

Dining Out
Spoiler


The Company
Spoiler


Banzai!
Spoiler


Here's my vote for next month:

Merc 2 + Murder: The EDF Conspiracy + Pray Your Prayers +
Redneck Rampage Rides Again + Wanton Destruction ++
World War II GI + Platoon Leader

I am God's strongest Redneck Rampage defender. Shadow Warrior is an objectively better game, but I like playing Redneck Rampage more.
3

User is offline   Quacken 

#42

Hi! Here's the other half of E3.

Down and Out

Spoiler


Fun House

Spoiler


Dying Time

Spoiler


Nowhere to Run

Spoiler


Closing Thoughts

Duke!ZONE II is less a comprehensive selection of maps and more like a thought experiment to see just how little effort you can put into a mapset while still being able to charge an extremely dubious $20 for it. Put to shame by both Nuclear Winter in terms of both its comedy value and the actual quality of its maps, as well as its borderline illegal Doom brethren over the hedge known as Hell to Pay and Perdition's Gate, DZ2 is sleep-inducing at best, and an affront to God at worst. I struggled to push out more than two lines worth of comments for some of these maps owing to their shortness, lack of combat at all, as well as their lack of visual fidelity, with most having hideous texturing and/or eccentric map elements that do nothing except to draw out playtime. It's not my least favourite mapset by a wide margin, but unless MIDI packs catch on and someone decides to bless DZ2 with a new set of music tracks, steer clear of this one. My final rating for Duke!ZONE II is a 3.5/10.
3

User is offline   Forge 

  • Speaker of the Outhouse

#43

after that trainwreck you need to immediately start playing my maps so they seem good in comparison :lol:
3

User is offline   NightFright 

  • The Truth is in here

#44

Play some of the amateurish test maps in "Duke Assault" and DZ2 is a masterpiece of level design.
3

User is offline   slacker1 

#45

View PostNightFright, on 26 February 2024 - 10:49 AM, said:

Play some of the amateurish test maps in "Duke Assault" and DZ2 is a masterpiece of level design.


I feel like Duke Assault with its 1500 maps is sort of an example of the infinite monkey theorem... give enough mappers access to build and someone's bound to create something decent. (Dark Gate, Jenn's Apartment, and a few others come to mind)... but man is it a mess for 99% of those maps. A good portion aren't even finished.


A sadistic Map/Mod of the month idea - Duke Assault maps A through F, G through L, M though... etc :lol:
5

User is offline   NightFright 

  • The Truth is in here

#46

Funny thing: I'm currently going through the Assault maps to filter out the worst trash. Just by looking at level layouts in Mapster, roughly 1.300 entries got eliminated directly. What's left isn't great, far from it. But at least playable. I also had to realize that it was forgotten to provide the custom art which came with quite a few maps, making them look wrong or at least weird. Those two art files they included absolutely don't cover everything. EDuke32's per-map art loading is a godsent here.

Sadly this compilation (and any other afaik) were made in 1996 when most mappers were merely toying around with the editors. A lot more quality emerged 1-2y later. Sadly, shovelware sellers couldn't wait that long.

But hey, I've spotted one map from "The Gate" among all those shitmaps. An unexpected find.
4

User is offline   FistMarine 

#47

Quote

Near the beginning, just after going through the left door, blow up the fire hydrant.

I just noticed a typo. I meant Fire Extinguisher, not Fire Hydrant.

Quote

Of course the secret exit was in the bathroom. Staying in theme of E2L1. Thanks for the heads up!

Interesting observation. I noticed that both maps feature the same textured bathroom but didn't realize the connection that both also feature a secret exit. Maybe this means that Fun House should have been an E2 level after all. Also on that note, I think some E2 maps (E2L3 and E2L4) could have been put into E3 and I wouldn't have minded that at all. To me it looks like the maps may have been switched during development or something similar.

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FistMarine didn't mention this, but unlike the Mini Battlelord, the Mini Overlord and Cycloid didn't have their hitboxes adjusted from their boss counterparts, so they will often die to their own projectiles... since that's a thing that happens in this game, for some reason.

Oh yeah, I usually noticed that the Mini Bosses blow themselves up (even in the World Tour Edition) but there are times their rockets can still hit you, as I recall a decade ago when I was playing Duke!Zone II in EDuke32 and got one shot by these Mini Cycloids. What I didn't know until these last few years is that Overlord and Cycloid can one shot you even at 200 Health. I thought that a rocket won't do more than 150-160 damage or so and that you are safe if you are at 200 but apparently I've been mistaken when I've had situations in user maps I got instantly killed by a Cycloid at 180-200 health. Which is kinda bullshit, since you should feel safe at 200 health. :D

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A sadistic Map/Mod of the month idea - Duke Assault maps A through F, G through L, M though... etc

Funny idea, I think it would work if there was a separate edition called Duke Map/Mod of the Year that runs throughout the whole year, which should be reserved for very large projects/releases. Even then, 1500 maps in a year would still be too much. Reminds me that I haven't even played through the entire first Duke!Zone, which I had started back in summer 2020 and only played the first five maps, then I lost interest.

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But hey, I've spotted one map from "The Gate" among all those shitmaps. An unexpected find.

Interesting. I'm curious which is that one map you found?

Anyway, I quickly tested the newest dukezone2 version by NightFright in latest eduke32 build to see the changes with the Jetpack. I'm glad these softlocks are now fixed. If people object about the maps being altered, then they can just play the original version of the addon, possibly in DOSBox to get the authentic experience. Then if playing in a source port, they can play the new version by NightFright. ;)

Though at the moment, I only played through the first episode using EDuke32 r9887 (latest 2021 build) because I had an older version of the addon (version 2.0.5 from 14th June 2021) downloaded from a few years ago and wanted to play through it at some point. Despite the comments in the release topic, this version works fine as long as you carefully read the instructions and delete one file in order to make the addon show up at eduke32 startup window.

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If you have DUKE3D.GRP (Atomic Edition), then delete the file dukezone2_wt.grpinfo from the "dukezone2" folder.
If you have DUKE3D.GRP (World Tour), then delete the file dukezone2.grpinfo from the "dukezone2" folder.


If you don't do this step, then you don't get Duke!Zone II to select at startup. If you did this step correctly, then the addon will show up at startup and will launch when selected.

While replaying through the addon (CGS difficulty, 100% everything), there are a couple notes to clarify:
-Difficulty is much easier in EDuke32 with modern controls, obviously.
-I got 34 kills in the level Outskirts, which confirms that Sharks inflate the kill count in Atomic Edition but in original 1.3D release they don't affect the kill count whether you kill them or not, as they never count as enemies in first place.
-I got 57 kills in the level Slime Station, despite noticing many enemies getting smashed by the trains, it confirms that newer EDuke32 builds fixed this annoyance with uncredited kills. It still doesn't explain how I was missing only ONE enemy and not several when I played in DOSBox. More investigation needs to be done, I guess.
-I only died twice in Slime Station when smashed by the train that held Red Card even when I timed it correctly. And a few more random deaths in Showdown (weird how I did it without dying in DOS version). Compared to the 20-30 deaths I suffered throughout first episode in DOSBox, this made it a much smoother ride.
-In the level Cop City, you DON'T need the Jetpack to reach one of the secret areas. There is a teleporter in the sewer that will teleport you inside the RPG secret room, while the secret containing two Atomic Health can be reached using a hidden elevator (the latter was already mentioned)
-In the level Opening Night, the secret nuke button is found EXACTLY where I expected it to find. It is located inside the Chaingun secret (near Yellow card slot).
-In the level Showdown, it is IMPOSSIBLE to get 100% kills because of Touchplate #107, which contains two Recon spawns (Sprite #1960). This is an issue that exists in original E1L2 Red Light District as well with one RECON spawn. No wonder I was missing two enemies in E1L5. Therefore, only 167 kills are possible due to those two enemies that fail to spawn.
-Playing the level 4-Way Stop with the arsenal gathered from previous levels feels really good but as punishment, you get to start E1L5 with just 100 HP since it is impossible to avoid taking damage in E1L7, even if you enter the secret level with 200 HP.

I will play through E2 & E3 soon but I won't be making a new post as there is no need, so I will just give my overall thoughts on Duke!Zone II as I promised earlier.

Duke!Zone II Overall Thoughts

What is there to say that hasn't been already said? There are some good levels in the package but I also felt like at least half of the levels were really awful and painful at same time, suffering from bad design choices such as: bugs, glitches, poor balance, poor level design, poor enemy placement, excessive difficulty, excessive enemy spawns, lack of armor/health, softlocks, etc.

I get it that the developers behind this addon were masochists and they wanted to have really tough levels in this package. But the level design leaves a lot to be desired, with some nice ideas that weren't always well executed. And I also think the episode/level order could have been much better thought out. Plus I know it's a bit unfair to compare these levels to the original Duke3d levels but also keep in mind that:
-Duke!Zone II was a commercial product
-The addons (DukeDC, NWinter, Vacation) weren't released yet

If D!Z2 was released as a freeware TC back then, it would be mostly compared to various TCs that got released around same time. But as a commercial product, it's not worth buying unless you are a hardcore Duke fan. But even if you aren't a hardcore Duke fan, you can check it out once to see what's about, especially since this was included in various compilations and even available nowadays on Zoom Platform.

If you want to have a somewhat good time, I recommend playing the updated version by NightFright using a recent EDuke32 build. But if you want to torture yourself with the original experience, then play the original addon in DOSBox. For bonus points, use the original 1.3D executable instead of Atomic 1.4/1.5 and you will get to deal with paletted enemies who have twice as much health.

And please, do yourself a favor, DO NOT PLAY ON THE PIECE OF CAKE SKILL LEVEL! Outside of a few levels where you get like one or two less enemies (and maybe a couple less in some E3 maps), most of the time you will get the exact same enemy count as in LR. In some cases, this means ending up with even less supplies available, like some maps in E1 either not containing the Jetpack and empty secrets that would have contained Atomic Health on higher skills.

Besides, Duke takes the same damage on all skills, so contrary to popular belief, there is absolutely no benefit at all on playing on an easier skill. If you want to play on an easier setting, LET'S ROCK seems to be your best bet, as many levels can reduce the enemy count slightly. For experienced players, just play on COME GET SOME skill to get the intended challenge by the Duke!Zone II makers. And for masochists, you can try DAMN I'M GOOD, see how long you can last.

Anyway, looks like the second option has won the votes, which means Duke will take a short break for March in favor of other Build games. Thanks everyone for your comments and participation in this topic! See you on the March 2024 edition of the club and have a nice day! :)

This post has been edited by FistMarine: 29 February 2024 - 10:12 AM

2

User is offline   NightFright 

  • The Truth is in here

#48

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Interesting. I'm curious which is that one map you found?

It was an early variant of Paul Jury's anrctica.map, which ended up in "The Gate" as the fifth map of the first episode. Interestingly, this standalone release comes with x-rated art. At least if you properly download it and ignore the incomplete version from Assault. There are many maps which won't look right because of the same issue. Often, sounds are missing as well, but that's less of a problem.

Regarding DZ2:
You don't have to mess around with choosing the right grpinfo file in newer releases (since v2.0.6) any more. The included batch detects the correct version of duke3d.grp (provided it's in the EDuke32 dir) and takes the necessary steps for you.
4

User is online   Aleks 

#49

I remember Himalayan Hell and The Hive, both by Ryan Icenberg I think, were released as separate, standalone levels - and I thought these were the only ones. Interesting to see Antarctica being released like this as well.
4

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