[Lunick]

Steam / GOG

October 15th

Old front post:

Quote

Randomly on Twitter, the Apogee Software account has announced Crystal Caves HD with redrawn graphics and a forth episode https://twitter.com/...702463972241410
Apparently this was also announced/shown at Realms Deep 2020?

Here's some screenshots shared by the account:




Episode 4:

[MusicallyInspired]

That looks good! Though I would have preferred if they had gotten the Deluxe Paint VGA paintover treatment that VGA versions of EGA LucasArts adventure games got. But this is also good.

[NightFright]

OK, this one wasn't necessarily on top of my remake wishlist, but I guess it's something. A pity they don't have the Duke license any more, otherwise DN1+2 could have been an option. Jill of the Jungle would also be cool, but that one's from Epic.

Nice to see that poor Mylo doesn't need to have that ugly grey skin any more. Could have been dirt from all the mining, though.

[Lunick]

Looks like the Twitter account is just gonna post screenshots every few hours:

[juvenite]

Gotta say that the colors are looking much better and smoother. So good not to have such limitations in games anymore.

[Morpheus Kitami]

Am I just having wishful thinking or did they only upgrade it to VGA? Not that I mind that, I like VGA graphics, but HD seems strong.

[NightFright]

It's indeed a rather subtle upgrade. I can't see any change in screen resolution here, just more colors. It probably goes along with their philosophy to let pixels "live". Either love it or hate it, I guess.

[Master O]

Does this mean the new episode will be included alongside the Crystal Caves version already on GOG?

[Fantinaikos]

More than HD, it can be said they created the VGA version nineteen years later. At this point I would expect a remaster of Secret Agent too.

I also remember a third game in the same style which I don't recall the name, probably not even by Apogee, were you were an infant/underage that have to save the world from aliens (I guess), I don't remeber much details but one of the enemy/obstacoles, unless I'm mistaking, was farmers that rolls giant forms of cheese.

EDIT: Found it, it was "Little Willy in: Where Is My Mama?" from 1993 by I.Mustun at evidently short lived M.B.Soft in Switzerland. I think it's just a guy who did a sorta of Secret Agent ripoff than an former Apogee pixel artist who left the software house after 1992 trying to go on his own. Downloadable here.

[NightFright]

I think all platformers published by Apogee will receive this treatment eventually, Duke Nukem 1+2 excluded, sadly. It's not exactly my favorite kind of games, but I guess it's 3DR's idea of preserving their legacy/roots, so it's OK.

[Kristian Joensen]

NightFright, on 08 September 2020 - 07:58 AM, said:

I think all platformers published by Apogee will receive this treatment eventually, Duke Nukem 1+2 excluded, sadly. It's not exactly my favorite kind of games, but I guess it's 3DR's idea of preserving their legacy/roots, so it's OK.

I think 3DR are completely uninvolved in Crystal Caves HD. I the stream Fred basically mentioned in passing as something ciming from Apogee. 3DR don't have a channel for it in Discord, meanwhile it is Apogee and not 3DR are promoting/teasing it on Twitter.

[NightFright]

I am sometimes getting confused with Apogee and 3DR, not quite sure I am aware of the correct current status. I think Apogee became 3DR back in the days, then it died down and now both studios exist seperately again or what?

[Kristian Joensen]

NightFright, on 08 September 2020 - 11:23 AM, said:

I am sometimes getting confused with Apogee and 3DR, not quite sure I am aware of the correct current status. I think Apogee became 3DR back in the days, then it died down and now both studios exist seperately again or what?

3D Realms was founded as Apogee Software originally, first Apogee Software Productions and then Apogee Software Ltd. Later they adopted the "3D Realms" brand. Originally as something to exist in parralel with the "Apogee" brand but eventually they stopped using the "Apogee" brand. But they were still "Apogee Software Ltd" legally. Then in 2008 or so, some friends of the 3DR guys set up a new company that licensed the "Apogee" name and logo from 3DR. They also acquired the ROTT IP. They were the publisher of ROTT2013. Legally they are an LLC. Actually I think two LLCs have been inolved, "Apogee Games LLC" and "Apogee Enteretainment LLC". They are the ones behind Crystal Caves HD. We have no idea who they have partnered with for development on that. 3DR was acquired in 2014 or by a company wholly owned by Mike Nielsen, a Danish guy. Now his company owns I think 80% of 3DR. But "Apogee Software Ltd" still exists as a subisidiary of that Danish company. Nowadays 3DR shares an office and some employees with Slipgate Ironworks, Frederik Schreiber's company(IIRC Fred owns the remaining 20% of 3DR). They have also worked on some games together, but 3DR has also published game that have not involved Slipgate and Slipgate in turn have worked on games for other publishers. See these links for the games:

http://www.slipgate-ironworks.com/
https://en.m.wikiped...3D_Realms_games
https://en.m.wikiped...pgate_Ironworks
https://3drealms.com/catalog/

[KaijuTurtle]

Looking real good! Wish there was a release date

[NightFright]

Well, the game might experience its second spring with this. It was pretty much forgotten since decades and now people will soon even be able to make levels for it. If they do, this could be something that lasts a lot longer than the first time.

[Morpheus Kitami]

NightFright, on 11 September 2020 - 12:39 PM, said:

Well, the game might experience its second spring with this. It was pretty much forgotten since decades and now people will soon even be able to make levels for it. If they do, this could be something that lasts a lot longer than the first time.

I don't entirely disagree with that assessment, but Secret Agent functioned pretty similarly. I remember finally playing Crystal Caves some years ago and thinking, "Oh, its just like Secret Agent". Secret Agent has keys and weird enemies though.

[NightFright]

They made quite a few games back then that were very similar, with different scenarios but basically identical gameplay mechanics. In general these were quite generic titles that didn't get much attention. Nobody expects Secret Agent or Crystal Caves to turn into smashing hits now all of a sudden. For those that played those games back then it's a nice thing.

However, the question needs to be raised whether remaking everything really makes sense. My guess is this is a test to see how big the demand is for bringing these games back.

[gemeaux333]

That's odd, I have been thinking about Crystal Caves lately...

[Rellik]

[NightFright]

God, I hated those snakes already in the original version. If you killed them in the wrong place you would be forced to take damage from the corpse. Looks like they didn't change that.

But well, in general it looks pretty good. Not that they pimped the visuals much, but I guess this is considered careful restauration and preservation. It's done in a consequent and compelling way apparently, so yeah... it's OK.

[Lunick]

Ultimately for me it depends what price they decide to launch at.

[NightFright]

Indeed. I still own the original on a floppy. Back then I think it cost like 10 bucks or so. Not sure if I was willing to invest the same amount again. It's not a big title and not a famous franchise.

[VGA]

The heck is this?

Bring out a remastered version of the Dangerous Dave in the Haunted Mention, damnit!

[necroslut]

That's an odd definition of "HD" they're using there... Not that I'm complaning, most "HD-ed" versions of old games tend to look worse than the original versions IMO, or at the very least fail to capture the style of the originals.

VGA, on 10 October 2020 - 02:00 AM, said:

Bring out a remastered version of the Dangerous Dave in the Haunted Mention, damnit!

If that's owned by id/Bethesda/Microsoft, I can't see that happening any time soon. They haven't even bothered to touch Commander Keen (apart from that horrible-looking cancelled mobile game), and that's a significantly more important game.

[Sanek]

The original DOS version looks better imo, but I appreciate the effort. Apogee lives!
Console-like music really sounds out of place. I'll turn it off asap.
I'm not a huge fan of the original game tbh, I never finished it but I enjoyed it despite everything.
I'll buy it when it's on sale.

P.S. What I really want to see is the HD versions of earlier Apogee titles, such as Pharaoh's Tomb, Arctic Adventure and Monuments of Mars. They have fewer colors than Crystal Caves, and it'll be very interesting to see how it'll look with full spectrum.

[MusicallyInspired]

I'd love to see Monuments of Mars, Pharoah's Tomb, and Arctic Adventure remastered in VGA with optional display modes for EGA as well as the original CGA.

[NightFright]

They should do this for Duke Nukem 1+2, but we all know it ain't gonna happen. And also why.

[K1n9_Duk3]

VGA, on 10 October 2020 - 02:00 AM, said:

Bring out a remastered version of the Dangerous Dave in the Haunted Mention, damnit!

necroslut, on 12 October 2020 - 11:11 AM, said:

If that's owned by id/Bethesda/Microsoft, I can't see that happening any time soon.

As far as I know, John Romero owns the rights to all of the Dangerous Dave games now. Didn't he release an HD remake of the first Dangerous Dave for iOS or something like that?

I don't think id Software ever owned the Dangerous Dave IP (or any of the other IPs they created for Softdisk). I remember reading about a project called "Save Spot!" on Tom Hall's blog/website that had the comment "Rescue Rover! but we would own the IP" next to it. This is listed among other canceled ID GAMES, so it's safe to say that id Software didn't own the Rescue Rover IP.

[necroslut]

K1n9_Duk3, on 12 October 2020 - 01:06 PM, said:

As far as I know, John Romero owns the rights to all of the Dangerous Dave games now. Didn't he release an HD remake of the first Dangerous Dave for iOS or something like that?

I don't think id Software ever owned the Dangerous Dave IP (or any of the other IPs they created for Softdisk).

Yeah, I think you're right. It appears Softdisk published Dangerous Dave 2-4 (only 2 which was done by id) on GOG, so they probably own the rights to those still. Dangerous Dave 1 predates Softdisk I believe, as it was an Apple II game originally, and might be why it's not on GOG with the others. Well, if they're owned by Softdisk then it's still not very likely to happen.

Yeah, I had forgotten about the Dangerous Dave iPhone remake -- so it does appear he still owns the rights to that one. It's a bit of a shame it's only on iPhone; I would check it out if it was on PC.

[Lunick]

necroslut, on 13 October 2020 - 12:40 PM, said:

I would check it out if it was on PC.

Romero mentioned that it would come to PC but that was like, months ago now I think...