[Hank]

Ingenious observations like the Mark of The Beats is what the pharma lobbyists want to deflect their actual drug pushing machine and corruptions in Israel, Australia, US/Canada and the EU. Nothing better than putting religious fantasies against some actual fact about the benefit of vaccines, and thus easily misleading the sheep that any arguments against those miraculous vaccines are just religious/ignorant rhetoric.

[Aristotle Gumball]

I think Forge is just joking, but yeah, the local anti vaxxers are as bad as the "I stand with science!" dumbasses I work with. The center has fallen off a loooong time ago. Any of you seen how Facebook literally profits off of suffering (with proof now)? I mean, beyond free speech, they actively show people content that will cause more outrage because it makes them more money. It's like the literal fucking biblical devil. Playing all sides against each other to cause as much chaos and destruction as possible, while profiting. I'm not religious, but it's hard not to see the parallels.



Site's been "strategically" down for a few hours too.

[Jimmy]

The outages are also quite convenient given that it interrupted mandate protests in NYC. All the chat functions for their apps, including Messenger, were down too.

In other news, I was fired on Friday afternoon because I refused to comply with my state job's vaccine mandate handed down by the governor of Virginia. (Get vaccinated or provide weekly negative test.) I am not vaccinated, but within reason I was not opposed to testing. What I opposed was the system they put in place to track everyone's medical information in some online database. I don't want any of that information online, whether I'm vaxed or taking the tests. It's a gross invasion of privacy. Why can't I just show my supervisor my vax card/test results and be on my way? Why does the government want to put all of this information into a database?

[Aristotle Gumball]

Jimmy, on 04 October 2021 - 09:20 PM, said:

What I opposed was the system they put in place to track everyone's medical information in some online database.

Haha, you're turning into Europe!!!

Respect for not complying btw.

[Jimmy]

The last time they tried to turn us into Europe a lot of bad things happened to some very particular people. In fact I am a descendant of many of those people who did those bad things to those other people. That's quite interesting. Of course I would never advocate or plan for bad things to happen, and disavow those who do... But as the motto of my state goes, "ever thus to tyrants."

Thank God we didn't give up a particular right of ours like Australia.

[Danukem]

You know things have gotten bad out there when Jimmy is choosing his words carefully.

[Jimmy]

"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience. They may be more likely to go to Heaven yet at the same time likelier to make a Hell of earth. This very kindness stings with intolerable insult. To be "cured" against one's will and cured of states which we may not regard as disease is to be put on a level of those who have not yet reached the age of reason or those who never will; to be classed with infants, imbeciles, and domestic animals." - C.S. Lewis

I have become very paranoid, and the main driver of that paranoia is that other people have not become paranoid whatsoever. Totally happy to go along with all of this, with an absolutely misguided belief that this will all blow over and everything goes back to normal. This paranoia is not unfounded or unhealthy. We are at a turning as a society, and I don't believe it's a good one. I am slowly returning to monke. I don't even own a cell phone anymore. I'm seriously thinking about moving to a shack in the middle of nowhere in Wyoming or some shit. Teddy K. was right and it's most likely too late to stop what they are doing to our societies. I just want to be left alone and we are rapidly approaching the point where it will be impossible for anyone to ever be left alone. What to do? The game is over. My job, which I was a great employee for 8 years, has exposed me to the inner workings of the supply chain breakdown. It is absolutely fucked guys. You wouldn't believe it. Prepare your families, buy things you need ahead of time. It's like they're making us all the sonderkommandos of Western Civilization.

[Aristotle Gumball]

I feel everything you're saying, but I don't think there is anywhere you can run to anymore. I mean, maybe you personally do have a place/community, but I'm not willing to give up all my creature comforts just because some "elites" have taken it upon themselves to ruin all our lives. None of this belongs to them. It's our societies, our institutions, our science and technology. The sum total of human knowledge and achievement is our birthright. I'm not willing to live in a shack in the woods (tried; didn't work). They'd just Waco your ass anyway. Isolation and not needing "them" is a threat to "them". The fight is here and now.

Don't know what or how I can fight where I live, though.

I'm also not doing things for myself anymore. I mean, I've got people I care about, which is the main reason I don't try to rock the boat too much in my everyday life. I lived like a bum when I was 18. I don't need money to feel happy. But I've made promises I intend to keep, so I guess the last 2 years have made me realize just how much I actually prioritize other people over my own "principles". Less of a lone wolf than I thought I was.

Genuinely trying times.

Like I mean, take two people:
1) someone who agrees with all your conspiracy theories, but is a shit person in every other way vs
2) someone who is a good person regardless of what they say they believe.

I might have fun talking to person in category 1, but the ones I keep in my life are firmly in category 2. There just aren't that many people out there who get what world they're really living in, who are also nice.

I am having to re-evaluate what "nice" really means to me, though. Is it better to positively contribute to your small group of family and friends who don't "get you", or live in relative isolation, but by your own rules? I guess it depends on what kind of person you are.

The local anti establishment types who would agree with some of my views feel to me genuinely compromised in other ways to where I would not accept them as friends. They're also sort of stupid, on average. I prefer being friendly IRL with mainstream normies who have STEM degrees.

There doesn't appear to be much of a middle ground between the two groups anymore (believe me I've looked), so I've had to choose. It's always a massive mindfuck meeting coworkers who seem to live in an alternate fantasy universe from everyone else. And working in an IT company, they force you to interact with everyone and pretend like you're this big happy family.

So tired of having to compartmentalize. It's like self induced split personality disorder. Slowly losing touch of who I am.

Dude, my views expressed publicly would literally get me fired from anywhere I could feasibly work. They check your socials.

If I really lay it out like this, thinking or writing it all out, I'll get these intermittent suicidal thoughts flash into my mind, but then I distract myself and am fine again. Mad fucking world.

Basically I can't make all the "pieces" of who I am and what I care about fit into a coherent picture. There are too many compromises having to be made. And most people just live with that cognitive dissonance. They don't even notice that they're hypocrites, or only for a moment, before distracting themselves with a cat video. Normal life forces you into this. When decency and moral fortitude results in misery and chaos, hedonistic psychopathy becomes desirable, because you only have one rule to live by: do, say and think whatever will maximize your personal success. Be a chameleon.

Easy to see why we have so many of those...

[Forge]

practice your slight of hand for when the Merc pill is approved. Pretty sure the brown-shirts are going to make you take it in front of them before they give you your concentration camp hall pass

[Jimmy]

The main reason I mentioned moving away is because currently I am in the worst sort of place to be when shit pops off: A city that is already savaged by crime. When things get bad all the police will abandon their post and it will become a free for all, guaranteed. As such, a middle of nowhere location is much better for weathering any storm where there isn't, or at least doesn't seem to be, any order. Right now I only have supplies stocked up (and bills paid in advance) because I planned on the likely event of being fired. But in a shit hits the fan situation, my best plan is to flee the area. Mentally I would feel more prepared if I had "already fled" so to speak. Living in a city is a major disadvantage, no matter how you cut it.

As for friendship and such, I don't mean this as an insult or anything like that, but you sound a lot like my significant other. She is going through all of that because while she realizes shit is fucked up, there is this fantasy world that all of her friends and coworkers are living in, and she is living there part time. She's always been a light conspiracy theory enjoyer, not really taking too much of it without a grain of salt. She had an ET experience as a teenager that she can't explain or figure out (her best friend from then corroborates it and neither of them are particularly wacky.) So that got her into Coast to Coast AM and Alex Jones and whatever else was on the radio and early internet. She knows in general that there is something going on, she can see the government manipulating people. But kind of like in a zombie movie, or perhaps even regular real people before the great wars that dismantled society, you see people get hysterical because they can't accept that it's over. You are under siege. It is war time now. Things don't go "back to normal." It's quite painful for her. I try not to talk about it anymore. She acts like she doesn't want to talk about it but is constantly bringing it up. Women, hehehe. She gets it though. We worked for the same agency, she quit two weeks before I got fired because she disagreed with it too. As for me, I have accepted since the 2008 financial collapse that we are in a war and things will probably never get better. I've always dealt with the pain of a collapsing society that offers me nothing. The only close friend I have nearby is about ten years older than me and he's pretty much in the same boat.

I feel much like the great Patrick Henry at this point. I recommend you read the entire speech if you haven't, but most relevant;

"If we were base enough to desire it, it is now too late to retire from the contest. There is no retreat but in submission and slavery! Our chains are forged! Their clanking may be heard on the plains of Boston! The war is inevitable — and let it come! I repeat it, sir, let it come.

It is in vain, sir, to extenuate the matter. Gentlemen may cry, Peace, Peace — but there is no peace. The war is actually begun! The next gale that sweeps from the north will bring to our ears the clash of resounding arms! Our brethren are already in the field! Why stand we here idle? What is it that gentlemen wish? What would they have? Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!"

[Danukem]

Relocating isn't enough by itself but it may be a necessary step for people who want to preserve a way of life. Simply relocating isn't enough though, because at some point (sooner rather than later) you still have to be willing to fight when the inevitable invasion occurs. And for that fight to be winnable there have to be enough other people around you who are also willing to fight. I sometimes think about Israel and lessons that can be learned.

So to Futa's point: yes we want to preserve our institutions, but if the battle to preserve them is going to be winnable you have to fight from a defensible position. And to be clear, I'm not out to destroy anyone -- all I want is for like-minded people to have self-determination and be left alone. The people whom I regard as my enemies, when left to their own devices, will destroy themselves in ways far more awful than anything I would wish on them.

[Danukem]

Jimmy, on 05 October 2021 - 10:37 AM, said:

The main reason I mentioned moving away is because currently I am in the worst sort of place to be when shit pops off: A city that is already savaged by crime. When things get bad all the police will abandon their post and it will become a free for all, guaranteed. As such, a middle of nowhere location is much better for weathering any storm where there isn't, or at least doesn't seem to be, any order. Right now I only have supplies stocked up (and bills paid in advance) because I planned on the likely event of being fired. But in a shit hits the fan situation, my best plan is to flee the area. Mentally I would feel more prepared if I had "already fled" so to speak. Living in a city is a major disadvantage, no matter how you cut it.

But unless you are super-rich, you will never be able to stock up enough supplies to last long-term, so ultimately survival depends on finding a self-sustaining community that has the ability to grow its own food and defend itself. If we are talking about the shit truly hitting the fan, that "middle of nowhere" better have farms and guns and people ready to use them.

[Jimmy]

I would be more likely to find like-minded people in a rural area. I go to the largest libertarian meet up in my area once a month or so. Very few people actually come from Richmond, they come from all rural parts of the state and other states even sometimes. My friend I talked about, he's been a major organizer in the Virginia libertarian community for ten years at least. The Libertarian Party, locally and nationally, has been largely co-opted by leftists. This city is a bad defensive position because you're behind enemy lines.

[Avenger]

Futa Orc, on 05 October 2021 - 02:19 AM, said:

I feel everything you're saying, but I don't think there is anywhere you can run to anymore. I mean, maybe you personally do have a place/community, but I'm not willing to give up all my creature comforts just because some "elites" have taken it upon themselves to ruin all our lives. None of this belongs to them. It's our societies, our institutions, our science and technology. The sum total of human knowledge and achievement is our birthright. I'm not willing to live in a shack in the woods (tried; didn't work). They'd just Waco your ass anyway. Isolation and not needing "them" is a threat to "them". The fight is here and now.

Don't know what or how I can fight where I live, though.

I'm also not doing things for myself anymore. I mean, I've got people I care about, which is the main reason I don't try to rock the boat too much in my everyday life. I lived like a bum when I was 18. I don't need money to feel happy. But I've made promises I intend to keep, so I guess the last 2 years have made me realize just how much I actually prioritize other people over my own "principles". Less of a lone wolf than I thought I was.

Genuinely trying times.

Like I mean, take two people:
1) someone who agrees with all your conspiracy theories, but is a shit person in every other way vs
2) someone who is a good person regardless of what they say they believe.

I might have fun talking to person in category 1, but the ones I keep in my life are firmly in category 2. There just aren't that many people out there who get what world they're really living in, who are also nice.

I am having to re-evaluate what "nice" really means to me, though. Is it better to positively contribute to your small group of family and friends who don't "get you", or live in relative isolation, but by your own rules? I guess it depends on what kind of person you are.

The local anti establishment types who would agree with some of my views feel to me genuinely compromised in other ways to where I would not accept them as friends. They're also sort of stupid, on average. I prefer being friendly IRL with mainstream normies who have STEM degrees.

There doesn't appear to be much of a middle ground between the two groups anymore (believe me I've looked), so I've had to choose. It's always a massive mindfuck meeting coworkers who seem to live in an alternate fantasy universe from everyone else. And working in an IT company, they force you to interact with everyone and pretend like you're this big happy family.

So tired of having to compartmentalize. It's like self induced split personality disorder. Slowly losing touch of who I am.

Dude, my views expressed publicly would literally get me fired from anywhere I could feasibly work. They check your socials.

If I really lay it out like this, thinking or writing it all out, I'll get these intermittent suicidal thoughts flash into my mind, but then I distract myself and am fine again. Mad fucking world.

Basically I can't make all the "pieces" of who I am and what I care about fit into a coherent picture. There are too many compromises having to be made. And most people just live with that cognitive dissonance. They don't even notice that they're hypocrites, or only for a moment, before distracting themselves with a cat video. Normal life forces you into this. When decency and moral fortitude results in misery and chaos, hedonistic psychopathy becomes desirable, because you only have one rule to live by: do, say and think whatever will maximize your personal success. Be a chameleon.

Easy to see why we have so many of those...

This was quite the long winded response to basically say that you've given up, bent over and are now contributing to the problem because you lack the balls to stand up for what’s right. It's the same old tired song and dance many use as an excuse because they’re not willing to be temporarily uncomfortable and instead take it on the chin by pretentiously carrying the dogmatic narrative being forced upon us even if only in certain circumstances.

I don’t agree with a lot of what jimmy says most of the time for various reasons but despite the clear divide, I have a new found respect for the sacrifice he’s made to fight for civil liberties. Luckily I’m self employed so I have more flexibility in my ability to earn a living but I have had to sever ties on multiple contracts over the last couple of years because I refuse to have anyone I do business with force me into their nazi-esque control scheme under the guise of “public safety” at the expense of my right to choose what I do with my body.

[Hank]

@ Forge
Merck simply used their Ivermectin and made it into Molnupiravir so it can sell it at $700 / life saving pill.
But only those who actually have this mysterious Covid will get it. All others will be vaccinated, including those who had an older version of Covid. Here in Toronto, they are starting to thoroughly brainwash parents to accept this vaccine for their pre-schoolers and above. And much more.
Thus, don’t worry, dividends from Pfizer will be awesome for years to come.

And Brown Shirts are not needed. They are using peeps in white coats now for the enforcement.

[Jimmy]

We'd probably get along better in person than you would think. I am naturally very friendly and polite despite my acerbic personality. Being able to assess me in my entirety, see my shit eating grin, you are more likely to go "Oh, he's just being an ass again" and brush it aside. It's hard to encapsulate your entire persona in text.

[Aristotle Gumball]

Avenger, on 05 October 2021 - 11:48 AM, said:

This was quite the long winded response to basically say that you've given up, bent over and are now contributing to the problem because you lack the balls to stand up for what’s right.

Yeah it was long winded. I was working it out in my head while typing, and I don't respect you all enough to spare the details while I get to the point. It's just my pseudo-sociopathy. But the point is "right for who?"

There are multiple rights and wrongs because life is complicated. I'm glad if it isn't for you, dude.

Jimmy, on 05 October 2021 - 10:37 AM, said:

As for friendship and such, I don't mean this as an insult or anything like that, but you sound a lot like my significant other. She is going through all of that because while she realizes shit is fucked up, there is this fantasy world that all of her friends and coworkers are living in, and she is living there part time.

Nah I get told I talk/think like a woman sometimes by people who don't hate me. It's fine and something I already know about myself. Prob explains why I still cling to socialism. And I get what you're saying (the rest of your post) - it makes perfect sense.

It's hard to see a real civil war happening in the EU because to an extent we've already lost. That's kinda what I was getting at, too. The first part of my message was in direct response to you, and the other stuff was me working out what I should do as an Estonian/what issues I face.

But basically, you guys still have a chance, and the world is watching. For real. Things that happen in the US actually matter and end up influencing other countries all the time.

[Aristotle Gumball]

I'll tack this on here too as it's a realization I just had and is somewhat relevant (can ignore if you dislike me, but no need to make a separate "curated collection" thread). I probably am far less loyal in a general sense (except to a select few), less patriotic and less "noble" because "my people" (even though I'm mixed) are basically losers. They lost nearly every war they were ever in, and spent 700 years in slavery. They still have this slave mentality to a large extent and have let the society go to shit, so I have never felt a pull to protect anything here, and have had to develop fierce independence almost since the day I was born in order to not be sucked down by the same mediocre filth I see around me every day.

As a kid watching American TV shows, playing American video games and listening to American music, I actually would feel an indescribable despair at not being born there. I'd look around in my room and just see wallpaper peeling off the walls. No shower/bath and I'm not joking when I say I had to bathe in a bucket. The TV I had was even this wooden box that you'd have to hit for it to work. Black and white image only. I only had computers because a rich relative would give me and my mom his old junk (and nothing else). Fucking hated being poor and deprived! Hated being bullied for liking metal, having long hair and for dressing differently. For looking like anything other than these bland pieces of shit I had to go to school with. There were no sub cultures, no one to talk to who was different, no one to say "it's gonna be OK". But even then, I never completely nullified my personality. The media your country produced kept me going. No man is an island. You need something outside yourself to signal that you're not completely crazy. Running low on inspiration lately, though.

And I actually have way more balls than most Estonians do, but I do live in Estonia. Generally you can't really be a badass anywhere in the EU. We're all cucked. I could stomach being alone only for so long until I too chose fitting in, to a degree, in order to preserve a modicum of sanity.

The feeling of despair is also still there, but feels more like grief now. It sucks really badly that America isn't as great as it once was. Not to get all emo here (as if), but some time ago I was watching a video of migrants arriving on Ellis Island and you could see the Statue of Liberty. I cried. Because back then, it really was a genuine escape to a better life.



Now even America is falling. That's why I say "stand and fight". Because I hope you do.

It's easier to fight to keep something you have, than to fight for what you've lost, especially when almost all have accepted defeat.

[Avenger]

Futa Orc, on 05 October 2021 - 12:35 PM, said:

Yeah it was long winded. I was working it out in my head while typing, and I don't respect you all enough to spare the details while I get to the point. It's just my pseudo-sociopathy. But the point is "right for who?"

There are multiple rights and wrongs because life is complicated. I'm glad if it isn't for you, dude.

Right for yourself. Since you previously stated that you don’t actually agree but instead simply gave in and did as you were told because you would otherwise be inconvenienced by the restrictions being placed upon you.

Sadly this is a trend I see frequently because a large portion of the populace are bootlickers that seem to care more about what others think or how they might be portrayed rather than standing up for principle while liberties are rescinded and discrimination is now tolerated towards those that don't tow the line.

[Aristotle Gumball]

Great; good luck.

[Forge]

Hank, on 05 October 2021 - 12:20 PM, said:

@ Forge
Merck simply used their Ivermectin and made it into Molnupiravir so it can sell it at $700 / life saving pill.

And Brown Shirts are not needed. They are using peeps in white coats now for the enforcement.

the brown-shirts work in our school systems and for media companies; the people running the ovens 24/7 wear lab coats.

also; update your news feed, several labs are trying to cash in on the new blue pill using various protein compliance formulas

[Hank]

Forge, on 06 October 2021 - 08:02 AM, said:

the brown-shirts work in our school systems and for media companies; the people running the ovens 24/7 wear lab coats.

also; update your news feed, several labs are trying to cash in on the new blue pill using various protein compliance formulas

You where the one singling out Merck. Sure, others want to be beneficial to the Global village, but they do not have the weight. It takes cash to run shit quickly through CDC and FDA.

As for Brown Shirts, is this one of those multi use terms on social media? If yes, forgive me, most social media is too time consuming for an old fart like me, as well as the news media - feel free to enlighten me, because I still don't know what you mean.

The Brown Shirts in the good old days had the task of protecting the Führer and terrorizing his opponents. When Hitler finally ran things, the brown shirts where replaced, with more specialized groups. Pfizer and cohorts are protected by an array of factions, lead by people wearing white coats.

[Forge]

pharma = meth lab cookers, keeping those ovens fired up 24/7
gov that collects pharma lobby monies and enact laws to get more and keep meth prices at a premium= herr Führer
teachers, media, blue checkmarks on twitter = brainwashed brown shirt bullies and terrorists

sad that this is the way it is, but the whore of babylon is well pleased

as for merck, my mistake for singling out the most recognizable meth lab and giving you a well with which to gravitate towards, instead of the entirety of the drug cartel

[Hank]

Cheers Mate. I mean it.

My issue was the world-wide vaccination enforcement, not the entire massive drug cartel, so, as I wrote I did not get your drift.

Showing one of those, I can’t put in words what should be done with.


The chain even shows the New Speak word replacing obedience.

[Danukem]

[Forge]

old
nanobots are more effective, don't require specific biology or dna, and can have an expiration date

[ck3D]

Futa Orc, on 05 October 2021 - 01:28 PM, said:

As a kid watching American TV shows, playing American video games and listening to American music, I actually would feel an indescribable despair at not being born there. I'd look around in my room and just see wallpaper peeling off the walls. No shower/bath and I'm not joking when I say I had to bathe in a bucket. The TV I had was even this wooden box that you'd have to hit for it to work. Black and white image only. I only had computers because a rich relative would give me and my mom his old junk (and nothing else). Fucking hated being poor and deprived! Hated being bullied for liking metal, having long hair and for dressing differently. For looking like anything other than these bland pieces of shit I had to go to school with. There were no sub cultures, no one to talk to who was different, no one to say "it's gonna be OK". But even then, I never completely nullified my personality. The media your country produced kept me going. No man is an island. You need something outside yourself to signal that you're not completely crazy. Running low on inspiration lately, though.

I took a few days to think about this after you posted it because a lot of it resonated with me, except I never developed those frustrations and delusions that you have and I wanted to analyze why. I think it may be because I never conflated U.S.A. the country with U.S.A. the culture if that makes sense? Now of course both are directly intertwined on the same level as any culture being intertwined with local history, but when it comes to inspiring ideals in general I'm realizing I always made sure to disconnect them with their source, as if to make sure they would still be viable in the grand scheme of things without being tied to a particular context. So as a kind of filter and also a way to be able to register those teachings despite my own geographical inability to directly experience them at the time, perhaps. I think those teachings, ideals and values at the bottom of every culture really transcend whatever state their province of origin may be in at any given time, though, if they're really good - you know what I mean? What I suspect you were looking for was a natural, open experience of the world as a whole and perspectives not limited to your narrow surroundings and so you projected that over the U.S. as a whole alternative, when maybe you should have been more selective in order to not be disappointed later. A country without flaws doesn't exist but if you used to believe that, then it's no wonder why you didn't seem to get down with me saying one could be equally happy or unhappy regardless of localization when really shaping your reality into whatever you want it to be is a lot more mental than physical (at least the former will drive the latter, whereas just the latter by itself won't do shit).

Interesting reading about you being low on inspiration when most of mine over the past decade or so has actually come from Eastern Europe, because of the relative authenticity, not because exoticism. Maybe that just means it's time to expand your horizons though because in reality, people do cool, interesting shit worldwide all the time. You just don't see it promoted but if you look it up and go down the right rabbit holes I'm dead certain it's there. At the end of the day, people exist to connect.

[Jimmy]

He isn't and wasn't delusional.

[ck3D]

By being delusional I mean expecting more from a place than the positives it's already offering, if you know what I mean? Cultures everywhere always brought their positives (and I guess their negatives, but the positives are what is to be kept) and over the past decades in particular, the influence of the U.S. has been strong in those regards which is interesting and cool. Everything that brings people hope and broadens their perspective even virtually is cool. That's why I'm saying, everything he saw about the U.S. positively existed; but it's not like that's all there ever was to the U.S., as far as I'm aware there's also always been inner social issues successive generations of residents themselves have always been trying to handle there too which is natural in every country and society and denying that reality to preserve a mental postcard I think is fair to assume would be delusional? Also, in no way am I implying that things have always been as bad as they are now. Situations constantly fluctuate. I'm just wary of the traps of romanticization, but also can't fault people for falling into them as it's natural to be naive and I don't think mistakes should be taboo, or weakness a shame. Just mythifying will always lead to disappointment by definition.

[Aristotle Gumball]

Edit: trying to write something more eloquent here and less acerbic than my initial reply.

I don't think the US is or was ever a utopia. There are certain aspects that just appealed more to me personally. Some of which are objective; others not so much.

All the American media I grew up with was fucked up, expressing aspects of life which exist in most other cultures. They just did it in a way that didn't pull any punches.

The US has until recently cared more about (and protected) freedom of expression than ANY. OTHER. COUNTRY. Celebrities sue private citizens for trolling comments in Estonia and win.

We all have different reasons for wanting certain things. Mine being different from yours doesn't make me naive.