Is the Duke IP dead?
#211 Posted 03 April 2020 - 12:02 PM
#212 Posted 03 April 2020 - 12:32 PM
#213 Posted 03 April 2020 - 01:30 PM
gemeaux333, on 03 April 2020 - 12:02 PM, said:
SW2 is a mess.
#214 Posted 03 April 2020 - 01:34 PM
The opposite of GTA is Postal 2. And Postal 2 was NOT ignored.
#215 Posted 04 April 2020 - 01:13 AM
RADAЯ, on 03 April 2020 - 12:32 PM, said:
Agreed. Doom Eternal already has some Duke-ish vibes (like breakable walls, urban environments). id software is definitely capable of making a great Duke game.
#216 Posted 04 April 2020 - 07:00 PM
#217 Posted 04 April 2020 - 11:21 PM
edit: think I found the tweet I even posted a message there.
This post has been edited by Duke Legacy: 04 April 2020 - 11:42 PM
#218 Posted 05 April 2020 - 07:07 AM
I don't like the drama but hopefully something good can come out of this. Jon has been a gentleman regarding Gearbox/Randy for so long with little result. Maybe this anger will translate to something productive, maybe with a different company stepping in to revive Duke. I have no idea what someone would have to pay to buy the rights at this point. Outsourcing seems to be the only way. Just why hasn't it happened?
#219 Posted 05 April 2020 - 09:58 AM
On the other hand, I hardly see how Randy could disown JSJ, he loves his work (like the covid lines he did recently)... JSJ cannot be compared to the dubber of Captain CLAP-TRAP !
This post has been edited by gemeaux333: 05 April 2020 - 10:08 AM
#220 Posted 05 April 2020 - 10:18 AM
gemeaux333, on 05 April 2020 - 09:58 AM, said:
Would a Duke Nukem not voiced by Jon St. John be Duke Nukem at all?
#221 Posted 05 April 2020 - 10:21 AM
Or like Master "Black" Smith would say it SW2 : "The rock doesn't choose the river, nor the river the rock, but none of them would exist without the other !"
But when it comes to the french dubbing of Duke Nukem it have only been Daniel Beretta since DNF...
This post has been edited by gemeaux333: 05 April 2020 - 10:27 AM
#222 Posted 05 April 2020 - 01:16 PM
Randy has this kind of crap coming.Yet people will keep on defending the fuck nut.
Also I have to disagree STRONGLY with the people upthread saying id Software should take over on Duke. No, thank you.
Duke needs to maintain his separate identity and having id hold the keys to Duke would very rapidly destroy that identity. I want Duke back in the hands of 3D Realms so that at the very least Scott Miller might be able to look in on the project. Even if he is a bit of a PC pussy himself these days.
#223 Posted 05 April 2020 - 05:20 PM
This post has been edited by MusicallyInspired: 05 April 2020 - 05:21 PM
#225 Posted 06 April 2020 - 06:11 AM
I went back and started reading Nintendo Power issue #123. The Duke Nukem Zero Hour review and walkthrough. Maannn...
Then I came back on here went into the Duke Nukem Forever section and was reading through the December 2007 threads. My God... So many people convinced we would see something big in 2008, even the games' release. Little did we all know it was a year away from total disaster.
Yeah, I think dead is better. As much as I love JSJ and want to hear him put on Duke's voice with some enthusiasm again. As much as I want to see a new Duke game and hear some great new Duke tunes and beat some alien asses...
I just think he didn't make it, in the end.
#226 Posted 06 April 2020 - 07:32 AM
What made Duke edgy in 1996 doesn't make him edgy in 2020. In 1996, Duke was edgy because he visited a strip club. In 2020, he would be edgy if he went to church and voted libertarian.
#227 Posted 06 April 2020 - 08:55 AM
RADAЯ, on 06 April 2020 - 07:32 AM, said:
What made Duke edgy in 1996 doesn't make him edgy in 2020. In 1996, Duke was edgy because he visited a strip club. In 2020, he would be edgy if he went to church and voted libertarian.
I don't think Duke is about being edgy anymore, except for DNF where they forcefully tried to make him that way. Sure, he was back then but edginess doesn't have to be the end all, be all. Everyone thinks of Duke their own way, but as long as the gameplay and direction is good, that's all we need. Just called it "Duke" and make it fun as hell.
#228 Posted 06 April 2020 - 09:04 AM
#230 Posted 06 April 2020 - 09:41 AM
hismasterplan, on 06 April 2020 - 08:55 AM, said:
The problem is that Duke Nukem 3D had mature content without turning juvenile
DNF has scatological humor, and is a more fit sequel to Dookie Nukem TC
#231 Posted 06 April 2020 - 09:41 AM
When it comes to the movie, I just wait to see how John Cena will handle the Duke.
This post has been edited by gemeaux333: 06 April 2020 - 09:43 AM
#232 Posted 06 April 2020 - 10:27 AM
gemeaux333, on 06 April 2020 - 09:41 AM, said:
It was cancelled, at 34:07. It would have sucked anyways.
This post has been edited by Lazy Dog: 06 April 2020 - 10:27 AM
#233 Posted 06 April 2020 - 10:42 AM
Lazy Dog, on 06 April 2020 - 10:27 AM, said:
So Randy, JSJ and John Cena weren't pleased the way the project was evolving ? Were there an official statement about this cancellation ?
This post has been edited by gemeaux333: 06 April 2020 - 11:14 AM
#234 Posted 06 April 2020 - 03:34 PM
RADAЯ, on 06 April 2020 - 07:32 AM, said:
What stops it from materializing is that the IP is owned by Gearbox, specifically Randy Pitchford, and if he can't find a way to cut himself a BIG OL FAT SLICE OF FUCKIN' CASH PIE he's not interested.
RADAЯ, on 06 April 2020 - 07:32 AM, said:
Duke wasn't good because he was edgy. Duke was good because he was a badass fun exciting character in a badass fun exciting series of games. From Duke 1 through Zero Hour and Manhattan Project. I didn't play Duke for titties. That was just a bonus. Even in my adolescence, that wasn't the appeal to me. The sex and the "edge" were a sprinkling on top of solid gameplay, great atmosphere, music, level design, and memorable moments.
What needs to happen, won't happen, but here's what would need to happen with things as they currently are:
Duke needs a really great, lovingly crafted First Person Shooter experience that draws from the stone those things that made the game and character great from 1991 to 1999.
(In no particular order)
1. Jon St. John has to be willingly not to phone in the performance.
2. Gearbox has to be willing to put a solid team and a decent budget behind the game.
3. The creative direction of the game needs to be almost nothing at all like what Duke Nukem Forever, Critical Mass, Land of the Babes, or World Tour was.
4. The game needs to focus on making you feel like a badass hero.
5. Needs to exude brevity when it comes to narrative/scripted events.
Jon needs to perform Duke like he used to. Speak his lines through gritted teeth. With a suave, smooth tone. The meme-level human needs to be dropped. The gameplay needs to be front and center. I'd set a rule that from the time you start a new game to actually playing within the core loop should be no more than 30 seconds. Same amount of time the N64 intro lasts. Duke needs to be a literal savior of women. In the 1999 Nintendo Power magazine review of Zero Hour, Duke is referred to as not sexist, not chauvinistic... But Chivalrous. That's what Duke Nukem needs to return to being. His line isn't that he's all out of gum. It's Nobody Steals Our Chicks... And Lives!
See, the thing so many people have gotten wrong since the turn of the century is that Duke Nukem is a hero above all else. an action hero. He steps up and braves alien invasions and cybernetic despots single handedly. He's about that life. Whatever game he would be born into now, should rightfully be targeting that aspect of his character.
Frankly the entire self-concious need to ask "what year are we in?" Is ridiculous. Games back in the 90s never bothered to ask those questions. Now we're all so afraid of either offending someone or making it clear that WE DON'T GIVE A SHIT if we offend someone that things get naffed. Honestly i'd love a Duke Nukem that has no knowledge of internet culture at all.
That'd be kinda fuckin' refreshing, actually.
gemeaux333, on 06 April 2020 - 09:41 AM, said:
Would you stop with this VR shit? No. That wouldn't be the right way to do it.
You have an IP that is, right now, a big risk,.. And your solution is to put it onto a hardware platform that is fighting to get out of the NICHE market? No. VR is more expensive to develop for, has a smaller install base than PC and consoles, and it requires much more sophisticated gameplay to make it worth while.
gemeaux333, on 06 April 2020 - 09:41 AM, said:
The Duke Nukem movie project has been aborted on four separate occasions since 1999 because Hollywood doesn't have a clue and thankfully the people in charge of the IP have at least had enough sense to know a pile of shit when they've seen it.
The first time they tried to make a Duke Nukem movie was when The Rock was still in his 20s back in 1999. As a PG-13 "Men in Black meets James Bond" flick about Duke being sent into space to stop an alien ship on a, and I quote "Collision Course with Earth." Why do I bring up The Rock? Because he was gonna be the guy. He was the only actor they ever seriously talked with about playing the part. Everything else was rumor-mill bullshit. The Rock was actually interested, incidentally.
Actually, I partially retract that. Back in 2008, around the time the Max Payne movie was in the works, they did have someone in mind to play Duke on that attempt. Some no-name young guy. They were working on a really ridiculous, silly, concept with that one. "What if aliens were really really real."
The only way it would work now is as a completely animated or computer generated affair with Jon St John in the title role.
Gearbox needs to:
1. Reinstate Megaton Edition at a lower or freeware value on Steam.
2. Reduce WT to 9.99, and include the other expansion packs.
3. Release the 2001 E3 version of DNF as-is to the public via GitHUB or some other similar venue, keeping in spirit with LameDuke.
4. Co-produce with 3D Realms a throwback "Manhattan Project" budget title for wide release on all platforms, while going into pre-production on a new Duke Nukem game.in-house.
5. Set up a deal to get a Duke Nukem movie animated and released on Netflix with a script that is sent through the B.S. filter of George Broussard.
6. Release a new Triple A level Duke Nukem game for PC and Current-Gen consoles.
Absolutely none of that will happen, though.
This post has been edited by Commando Nukem: 06 April 2020 - 04:04 PM
#235 Posted 06 April 2020 - 10:47 PM
If doing these things were that easy to do, it would already have been done if it was only depending on Randy, but there is a plethoric amount of factors that either simply delay or litterally contradict these decisions to be taken, but I am aware that the middle class player need a scapegoat for all his frustration, hate and anger in utter despise of common sense (the only thing that either save things and person or simply make them progress). Would you release animals in cage into the wild just because it is "bad" without bothering about thinking if they will make it at all in the end, and suffer even more in the process ?
Besides, experience prove that ressurections of IPs happens mostly in the most improbable ways.
For the movie, I would take whaterver attemp is serious, makes sense and doesn't go into the SJWs/feminazis downsides !
This post has been edited by gemeaux333: 06 April 2020 - 10:53 PM
#236 Posted 07 April 2020 - 07:04 AM
gemeaux333, on 06 April 2020 - 10:47 PM, said:
I will continue to down vote your posts when I find them to be so utterly void of substance, and are just flat wrong. We get it. You want the next Duke game to be a VR game, even though that's completely ridiculous for the reasons I have made abundantly clear to you, and your rebuttal to that was 'bUt MuH VRRRRRRRRRRRRR.' We get it. We get it. VR is cool. It's also niche.
You think people who have been around this community for decades longer than you need to be more positive. Okay RockMan 2.0. We already had people like you who came and went, and they came and went because reality took a sledge to their collective faces and showed them the facts.
gemeaux333, on 06 April 2020 - 10:47 PM, said:
No shit. I didn't say it would be easy. I said this is what needs to happen to ensure the most successful outcome for the character to come back from being completely dead. That's what he is right now. He's dead. He's been reduced to cameos in other games. Jon St John is so fumed from this franchise being sidelined that he went on Twitter and went nuclear. Do you know how much you have to push Jon St John to get him to go public like that and call someone out? Takes a lot. Contrary to his Duke Nukem persona, he's actually a pretty laid back dude who just wants to have a good time. So to see him on Twitter literally saying "Fuck Borderlands" is... Nothing more need be said about that.
Duke Nukem isn't the Doom or Half-Life franchises. Contrary to this little bubble world here and on the very small Duke community sites that still exist, nobody cares about Duke Nukem anymore. The press? Nope. Hollywood? Nope. The wider gaming public? "Who's Duke Nukem?" A goddamn decade has already gone by since the biggest moment in the characters entire history. People who were kids when DNF came out are now going into middle and high school. Do you really fucking think that a VR game is going to turn him around? No.
Even with all that being said do you think the Doom revival was EASY? You want to imply that I think it's easy. So I just want to be clear; You do understand what happened to get Doom 2016 to be the success that it was, right? People look at Doom 2016 and go "Oh, well yeah, that' makes sense." But it took some radical retrograde and some heavy analysis on the part of Hugo Martin, Marty Stratton, and the other leads at id Software to really break the original games down and turn it into the success it has become... It also took the incredibly ballsy move of, essentially, scrapping a heavily worked on game to start with something wholly new. And that's with a franchise that ISN'T COMPLETELY IN THE SHITTER. Doom's reputation was still strong. It's community was still big and healthy thanks to the source ports and mods keeping it alive.
Oh, and id did release a DOOM VR title in between Doom 2016 and Doom Eternal. It was okay. Nothing amazing. Nobody really talks about it. It's there, though. I guess.
gemeaux333, on 06 April 2020 - 10:47 PM, said:
it would already have been done if it was only depending on Randy, but there is a plethoric amount of factors that either simply delay or litterally contradict these decisions
You don't know what you are talking about.
Randy Pitchford is the top of the chain at Gearbox. His company already had renegotiated the publishing rights for DNF. So what exactly is the hold up? Money, like always. Randy has deliberately derailed progress because he wasn't going to get his big cash in. Which he has yet again proven with Borderlands 3. The only thing that matters to him is money.
Yet people want to act like he doesn't have power. He. Took. Bonuses. Away. From. His. People. People who undoubtedly got their asses handed to them in a crunch to get the game done.
Don't talk to me about Gearbox, or Randy. You turn a blind eye to everything he's publicly done, and you have no idea of the things that have gone on behind the scenes. I and people I know have had conversations and email correspondence with him. He's a prick. He repeats the same habits with the Duke community over and over. Do you not understand he now has two voice actors who have turned against him for various reasons? Jon St John going on twitter and literally saying "Fuck Borderlands" Is bridge burning shit.
The only people standing in Randy's way are not keeping him from releasing the 2001 build of DNF. They aren't keeping him from allocating members of his company to develop a new Duke game. The only person who has chosen NOT to do those things is Randy Pitchford, because he really doesn't like Duke Nukem. He's made that abundantly clear with his remarks over the years. If he had any love for the character, he wouldn't have made it clear he thinks owning the franchise is a joke to him, and he would have done something in the last nine years other than plonk Duke in cameo roles. Nine years. That's enough time to develop two games with a year of breathing time.
#237 Posted 07 April 2020 - 08:10 AM
Commando Nukem, on 07 April 2020 - 07:04 AM, said:
You think people who have been around this community for decades longer than you need to be more positive. Okay RockMan 2.0. We already had people like you who came and went, and they came and went because reality took a sledge to their collective faces and showed them the facts.
I don't necessarily want a VR game to be the next Duke game (even if the niche part of VR will soon enough be a thing of the past) but seams a good opportunity to me, a classic fps would be great enough to me, as long as it is not a Critical Mass like disaster it can't be that bad !
RockMan 2.0 ? I promise I won't go no matter what happen (even if there is disappointment) ! After all if I had to go everytime a disappointment arrive, where would I be ?
Commando Nukem, on 07 April 2020 - 07:04 AM, said:
Duke Nukem isn't the Doom or Half-Life franchises. Contrary to this little bubble world here and on the very small Duke community sites that still exist, nobody cares about Duke Nukem anymore. The press? Nope. Hollywood? Nope. The wider gaming public? "Who's Duke Nukem?" A goddamn decade has already gone by since the biggest moment in the characters entire history. People who were kids when DNF came out are now going into middle and high school. Do you really fucking think that a VR game is going to turn him around? No.
Even with all that being said do you think the Doom revival was EASY? You want to imply that I think it's easy. So I just want to be clear; You do understand what happened to get Doom 2016 to be the success that it was, right? People look at Doom 2016 and go "Oh, well yeah, that' makes sense." But it took some radical retrograde and some heavy analysis on the part of Hugo Martin, Marty Stratton, and the other leads at id Software to really break the original games down and turn it into the success it has become... It also took the incredibly ballsy move of, essentially, scrapping a heavily worked on game to start with something wholly new. And that's with a franchise that ISN'T COMPLETELY IN THE SHITTER. Doom's reputation was still strong. It's community was still big and healthy thanks to the source ports and mods keeping it alive.
Oh, and id did release a DOOM VR title in between Doom 2016 and Doom Eternal. It was okay. Nothing amazing. Nobody really talks about it. It's there, though. I guess.
I especially reallize that everyone have his own idea of how ressurecting the Duke but in the end simply don't know what they want ! Duke Nukem Forever arrive, not what they want ! 20th anniversary taking back the best of Duke 3D and adding some content made with love (although not completely exempt of weaknesses, not great enough ! So someday peoples will have to make up their minds !
JSJ strangely always gushes over Randy, or simply never attacks him like many others are doing compulsively, although it is understandable about Borderlands who don't need much attention actually as it have nothing to prove !
How do you know peoples don't car about the Duke anymore ? On my side I only see peoples having good memories of the good days and/or have no particular grievements against DNF, even if a lot loves (or simply accepts) DNF for its caricatural side but it is no worst than the Super Mario Bros movie in the way they say it in the end...
DOOM 2016 at least was an amazing display of common sense, especially when we think about the fact a disaster have been avoider (Call of Dooty would have been a feeting name), wishes the same amount of common sense could prevail everywhere anytime !
Commando Nukem, on 07 April 2020 - 07:04 AM, said:
Randy Pitchford is the top of the chain at Gearbox. His company already had renegotiated the publishing rights for DNF. So what exactly is the hold up? Money, like always. Randy has deliberately derailed progress because he wasn't going to get his big cash in. Which he has yet again proven with Borderlands 3. The only thing that matters to him is money.
Yet people want to act like he doesn't have power. He. Took. Bonuses. Away. From. His. People. People who undoubtedly got their asses handed to them in a crunch to get the game done.
Don't talk to me about Gearbox, or Randy. You turn a blind eye to everything he's publicly done, and you have no idea of the things that have gone on behind the scenes. I and people I know have had conversations and email correspondence with him. He's a prick. He repeats the same habits with the Duke community over and over. Do you not understand he now has two voice actors who have turned against him for various reasons? Jon St John going on twitter and literally saying "Fuck Borderlands" Is bridge burning shit.
The only people standing in Randy's way are not keeping him from releasing the 2001 build of DNF. They aren't keeping him from allocating members of his company to develop a new Duke game. The only person who has chosen NOT to do those things is Randy Pitchford, because he really doesn't like Duke Nukem. He's made that abundantly clear with his remarks over the years. If he had any love for the character, he wouldn't have made it clear he thinks owning the franchise is a joke to him, and he would have done something in the last nine years other than plonk Duke in cameo roles. Nine years. That's enough time to develop two games with a year of breathing time.
This one will mean more than words : https://www.linkedin...am-maxime-babin
How does it happen that when you actually confront the employees of Gearbox you actually get the opposite of what is said in the external bubbles (especially the press) ?
And I pay no heed to the other allegations like the mockup of a squirter in a medieval evening and else...
Randi have become conscient he is at yellings and arrows ranges, but it is always that when you have responsibilities in this world !
If everybody is/was so convinced he is guilty, why is he still there ?
At least, all the cameos of lately honours the Duke instead of degrading him like DNF did (at least the Bulletstorm remaster make him justice) ! In the end, no one can presume of what Randi really thinks about the Duke Nukem franchise... Perhaps it is time for a new video-conference with him to say all the good you think of him, or simply to make a statement of the state of the Duke Nukem franchise, seems its a much needed exercise for now !
This post has been edited by gemeaux333: 07 April 2020 - 09:15 AM
#238 Posted 07 April 2020 - 08:27 AM
gemeaux333, on 07 April 2020 - 08:10 AM, said:
VR will always be niche, the fact that you need extra hardware ensures that. And don't even bring the "but the mouse" crap argument. the mouse was a "natural" evolution, it made everything , not only gaming, easier, vr doesn't.
This post has been edited by Lazy Dog: 07 April 2020 - 08:30 AM
#239 Posted 07 April 2020 - 09:00 AM
Lazy Dog, on 07 April 2020 - 08:27 AM, said:
Nope, I will rather use the READY PLAYER ONE example : in this timeline/universe VR have become the hobby and social life of everyone ! (I won't mention the professionnal life part as it seems to be the most controversial part depicted by the movie) Or do you consider that a book means nothing (seems peoples prefer the book to the movie) ?
The reallity even seems to have gone further than READY PLAYER ONE on many aspects of the VR...
This post has been edited by gemeaux333: 07 April 2020 - 09:20 AM
#240 Posted 07 April 2020 - 09:12 AM
Lazy Dog, on 07 April 2020 - 08:27 AM, said:
Also a mouse is a couple bucks, and always was a low-cost peripheral. Computers often come bundled with a mouse and keyboard.
VR by comparison is unto itself an entire expensive apparatus. It will never be on that level, it will always cost as much as a computer or console.
gemeaux333, on 07 April 2020 - 08:10 AM, said:
No.
gemeaux333, on 07 April 2020 - 08:10 AM, said:
How does it happen that when you actually confront the employees of Gearbox you actually get the opposite of what is said in the external bubbles (especially the press) ?
You actually don't.
gemeaux333, on 07 April 2020 - 08:10 AM, said:
You should.
gemeaux333, on 07 April 2020 - 08:10 AM, said:
Randi have become conscient he is at yellings and arrows ranges, but it is always that when you have responsibilities in this world !
If everybody is/was so convinced he is guilty, why is he still there ?
What do you mean why is he still there? Do you think the people who work at Gearbox are going to... fire their boss?
Current employees are under NDA. Those that have worked with him and walked away have had plenty different to say. Two people in particular I can think of.
So, no.
gemeaux333, on 07 April 2020 - 08:10 AM, said:
We don't need to presume. We know what he thinks.
"I love a good joke. I mean for fucks sake I own the Duke Nukem franchise."
Everything he said in the previous video conference was a lie.
No.
The man thinks that Aliens Colonial Marines was a "7 out of 10." Which should tell you all you need to know. ...You don't put out a game that you think is anything less than amazing. This is your best foot forward. Do you think the guys who made Ion Fury went "Yeah, this is okay, I guess." ??? Or do you think maybe they put in the hours to really polish the shit out of that thing until it was the best it could absolutely be?