[Futuretime23]

https://news.bloombe...nges-copyrights

"A remake of “Duke Nukem 3D” uses the composer’s original soundtrack without his permission, a Sept. 27 complaint in the Eastern District of Tennessee says.
Gearbox Software’s “Duke Nukem 3D World Tour” infringes Bobby Prince’s copyrights by using his music without a license, Prince says."

Oh boy.

[NightFright]

Do I understand this correctly? Prince doesn't like that Lee made high quality versions of his tracks? Or it's directed at Gearbox who weren't supposed to use his music in the first place?

Will we see a WT re-release with all-new music? What the heck is wrong with people these days...

[oasiz]

Problem is that he receives no cash for this re-release despite using this work, to which he owns the copyright to, as seen from the in-game files which still have that © text intact.

[NightFright]

Hmmm... how were things handled when Megaton was released? I understand Prince's complaint if money is involved, but I wonder why it wasn't an issue before.

[Radar]

This is coming from the guy who ripped off dozens of songs while writing the soundtrack to Doom.

[MusicallyInspired]

Took him long enough to notice.

I gotta say it's sad to see this. But it's also really great to see Gearbox on the bad end of a legal issue for once with regards to Duke Nukem.

Regarding Megaton, my music packs were and are still available for free. They were just added onto Megaton as a bonus (which still used the MIDIs underneath). I don't know maybe that doesn't mean anything though.

[Marphy Black]

 Spitfire, on 28 September 2019 - 07:08 AM, said:

ripped off dozens of songs

Do you have a single fact to back that up?

[Fox]

 NightFright, on 28 September 2019 - 06:03 AM, said:

Hmmm... how were things handled when Megaton was released? I understand Prince's complaint if money is involved, but I wonder why it wasn't an issue before.

Prince was paid for the Megaton release.

[Radar]

 Marphy Black, on 28 September 2019 - 07:35 AM, said:

Do you have a single fact to back that up?

Don't believe me? It's all in the numbers.

[Phredreeke]

Prince was a lawyer, he knew exactly how close a song could sound without being legally infringing.

Then again you got things like the 2 minutes to midnight riff that shows up in like half a dozen different metal songs. https://youtu.be/eoyEVTN_h9I

[Marphy Black]

 Spitfire, on 28 September 2019 - 07:42 AM, said:

Don't believe me? It's all in the numbers.

You're citing completely unsourced Fandom wiki pages, and literally the first entry for E1M1, which your article cannot decide between seven different possible inspirations, has been flat out denied by Prince himself.

Going by a reliable source with actual verifiable citations, we can conclusively identify roughly thirteen Doom and Doom 2 tracks that were based on existing songs. That's a far cry from "dozens" with the level of inspiration varying per track, and out of 44 tracks total between the two games, it's not even close to half of the entire soundtrack.

[Fox]

 Phredreeke, on 28 September 2019 - 07:52 AM, said:

Prince was a lawyer, he knew exactly how close a song could sound without being legally infringing.

Back in 93, that was fine. He wouldn't get away with it today...

[Marphy Black]

 Fox, on 28 September 2019 - 07:56 AM, said:

Back in 93, that was fine. He wouldn't get away with it today...

He wasn't trying to get away with anything in 1993, either. The tracks he created that were covers based on existing songs were not supposed to be used, and he told id not to, and the music files were named explicitly telling them not to, but id used them anyway. He fully expected them to get sued. Again, this was stated by Prince himself.

[Fox]

 Marphy Black, on 28 September 2019 - 08:06 AM, said:

He wasn't trying to get away with anything in 1993, either. The tracks he created that were covers based on existing songs were not supposed to be used, and he told id not to, and the music files were named explicitly telling them not to, but id used them anyway. He fully expected them to get sued. Again, this was stated by Prince himself.

[Radar]

 Phredreeke, on 28 September 2019 - 07:52 AM, said:

Prince was a lawyer, he knew exactly how close a song could sound without being legally infringing.

That has nothing to do with it. It's because it was 1993.

 Phredreeke, on 28 September 2019 - 07:52 AM, said:

Then again you got things like the 2 minutes to midnight riff that shows up in like half a dozen different metal songs. https://youtu.be/eoyEVTN_h9I

Right, I actually don't think that's plagiarism either. That's just a generic palm muting rhythm on open A or E.

 Marphy Black, on 28 September 2019 - 07:55 AM, said:

You're citing completely unsourced Fandom wiki pages, and literally the first entry for E1M1, which your article cannot decide between seven different possible inspirations, has been flat out denied by Prince himself.

So?

 Marphy Black, on 28 September 2019 - 07:55 AM, said:

Going by a reliable source with actual verifiable citations, we can conclusively identify roughly thirteen Doom and Doom 2 tracks that were based on existing songs. That's a far cry from "dozens" with the level of inspiration varying per track, and out of 44 tracks total between the two games, it's not even close to half of the entire soundtrack.

Ok man, the point is he ripped off multiple artists. If you're upset I used the word "dozens" you could have just said that from the beginning.

[NightFright]

Can they retroactively sue id for copyright infringement for the last 25 years? That could get ugly for Bethesda...

[Mark]

So, Prince gave a bunch of tracks to id saying "Here are some tracks for Doom, Please don't use them" wink wink.

[Morpheus Kitami]

I'm no expert, but those tracks in Doom have been reported enough in the media that any bands that could sue, probably would have. Sure, there are cases like that guy who sued Led Zepplin and that other guy who sued Men at Work, but in those cases they didn't make notes for all to see that they ripped them off.

Besides, if Judas Priest or Iron Maiden never sued Gamma Ray over all the inspirations they took from them, then they're not going to sue some now ancient video game.

[Radar]

Led Zeppelin is a known manic plagiarist.

[themaniacboy]

 NightFright, on 28 September 2019 - 06:03 AM, said:

Hmmm... how were things handled when Megaton was released? I understand Prince's complaint if money is involved, but I wonder why it wasn't an issue before.

Sorry, I accidently down voted you while scrolling this thread.

[Sledgehammer]

 Morpheus Kitami, on 28 September 2019 - 12:24 PM, said:

then they're not going to sue some now ancient video game.

Actually ZeniMax is a quite juicy target to sue, although a powerful one which is why they'll never bother suing ZeniMax. Doesn't even matter how old game is since ZeniMax is still selling Doom games digitally for various platform to this day, hell, Switch version was re-released just recently, would be a perfect opportunity to sue them.

This is of course a bullshit, but this is the fucked up world we live in.

[Morpheus Kitami]

 Sledgehammer, on 29 September 2019 - 10:58 AM, said:

Actually ZeniMax is a quite juicy target to sue, although a powerful one which is why they'll never bother suing ZeniMax. Doesn't even matter how old game is since ZeniMax is still selling Doom games digitally for various platform to this day, hell, Switch version was re-released just recently, would be a perfect opportunity to sue them.

This is of course a bullshit, but this is the fucked up world we live in.

I'm not saying that its too old to be sued over, since by the time its too old we'll all be dead. I'm saying if the ones we know for certain like Slayer and Pantera probably already know about it to some degree. Slayer's certainly got the dosh to have a lawyer or too on staff. I'm sure they've had some fan or tourmate over the years tell them their music is in Doom. ZeniMax is big and they've got some dosh. Why would ZeniMax waste money trying to protect the music of a nearly 30 year old game that wouldn't be worth the money it takes to defend against?

[Sledgehammer]

Yeah, I guess ZeniMax would just get rid of the music altogether and replace it with something else. Though I think the situation with Doom is much more complicated considering that Prince still owns his music in it as well (at least I assume he does). Would be pretty hilarious if someone tried their luck either way.

[Futuretime23]

The complaint is now publically available: https://www.bloomber...9Co?1569767444#

Some highlights: "Defendant, Randy Pitchford, the Chief Executive Officer of Gearbox,
admitted that Mr. Prince created and owns the music and that Gearbox had no license.
Incredibly, Mr. Pitchford proceeded to use the music without compensation and refused
to remove the music from the game. "


"19. Upon information and belief, in approximately 2010, Gearbox Software
acquired certain rights to the Duke Nukem games from Apogee. Neither Apogee nor
Gearbox advised Mr. Prince about the transaction, nor inquired about his intellectual
property.
20. In October 2016, Mr. Prince learned that Gearbox was about to release a
game called Duke Nukem 3D World Tour.
21. Incredibly, the electronic files for the music within Duke Nukem 3D World
Tour include text specifically stating that Mr. Prince owns the copyright to the music and
has reserved all rights to the music’s use. Yet Gearbox incorporated the music into the
game without ever contacting Mr. Prince and without clearing the rights expressly
mentioned in the electronic files.
22. On October 6, 2016, before Gearbox released the game, Mr. Prince
provided his address to Mr. Pitchford and informed him that Gearbox would need to send
him royalties if it wanted to use Mr. Prince’s music.
23. Mr. Pitchford said Mr. Prince would be “taken care of.” Mr. Pitchford’s
promise was false when made.
24. Before Mr. Prince contacted Mr. Pitchford, no one from Gearbox had
attempted to contact Mr. Prince regarding the use of his music, sound effects, or edited
dialog.
25. Mr. Pitchford began stringing Mr. Prince along with promises that he
would “do right” by Mr. Prince and that Mr. Prince would be “taken care of.” The
promises were false when made.
26. Before Gearbox Software and Gearbox Publishing released Duke Nukem
3D World Tour, Mr. Pitchford received a copy of the 1996 license between Apogee and
Mr. Prince. He thus knew that Mr. Prince owned the rights to the music and that Apogee
had to pay Mr. Prince for its use of the music in prior versions of Duke Nukem games.

30. During discussions with Mr. Prince, Mr. Pitchford and Mr. Gibson
acknowledged that Mr. Prince owned the music he had composed for Duke Nukem 3D
and that Gearbox used in Duke Nukem 3D World Tour.
31. Mr. Pitchford adopted the position that Gearbox had no license to use Mr.
Prince’s music.
32. Mr. Gibson acknowledged that Gearbox had no license to use Mr. Prince’s
music.
33. Upon information and belief, Gearbox did nothing to clear the rights to Mr.
Prince’s music before incorporating it into Duke Nukem 3D World Tour.
34. Eventually, it became evident that Gearbox had no intention of paying Mr.
Prince for its use of his music. Mr. Prince advised Gearbox that it could either pay him
according to the terms of the original license for the music or remove his music from the
game. Mr. Pitchford and Gearbox did neither. "

Lol, Randy being Randy like usual

Also, Prince is suing Valve for knowingly distributing copies of WT despite the copyright infringement by GBX:
"III. Valve knowingly distributed infringing copies.
35. Valve distributed copies of Duke Nukem 3D World Tour.
36. In January 2018, Mr. Prince sent a Notice of Exclusive Right Infringement
to Valve, notifying Valve of his copyright, his address in Tennessee, and Gearbox’s
infringement.
37. The United States Postal Service delivered the Notice of Exclusive Right
Infringement to Valve on February 8, 2018.
38. Valve did not respond to the Notice.
39. Valve continued distributing copies of Duke Nukem 3D World Tour after
February 8, 2018.
40. The copies of Duke Nukem 3D World Tour that Valve distributed after
February 8, 2018, contained Mr. Prince’s copyrighted music."

[Sanek]

[NNC]

Prince is wrong, but Randy deserves all the beatings he gets for his attitude and how he ruined this franchise.

[MusicallyInspired]

Why is Prince wrong?

[NightFright]

What makes me really sad about all this: Arguments about legal issues and copyright infringements is all the Duke Nukem franchise still seems to be good for these days. First it was 3DR, now it's this. God knows how long this one is gonna last, but two things are perfectly clear:

1) Randy has no idea about how to handle the franchise properly and should have never gotten himself involved. He did not save the franchise, he brought it down to its knees.

2) We are not going to see a new Duke Nukem game for a really long time. Every news about the whole topic these days is negative. It's damaged goods. And we all know whom we have to thank for that.

[Sledgehammer]

 MusicallyInspired, on 30 September 2019 - 04:35 AM, said:

Why is Prince wrong?

I think "being a cunt" would be a better way to say it. Randy is a cunt too of course, definitely probably much bigger.

[Zaxx]

 The Watchtower, on 30 September 2019 - 02:30 AM, said:

Prince is wrong

He's not.

+ Bobby Prince is a lawyer so chances are he knows what he's doing.