[Romulus]

icecoldduke, on 20 September 2018 - 09:46 AM, said:

Did you happen to run the star wars demo on a 1080 or 1080 ti at 1080p? Sorry for just throwing a bunch of questions at you, I don't have the hardware yet, and I'm trying to figure out how PolymerRTX will scale. These numbers are helping me out tremendously.

I did, it ran around 12~18 FPS at 1080p, it was stuttering badly and was painful to watch.

[TON]

Another video :

Star Wars demo on the 2080 at 1440P vs 2080 ti at 1440P vs 2080 ti at 2160P

https://youtu.be/MMbgvXde-YA?t=22m12s

[icecoldduke]

Just reposting to ensure this is accurate:

Star Wars Demo Performance (DLSS OFF, Raytracing ON, 1920x1080)

• RTX 2080 FE: 55-92 FPS.
  
• 1080 ti: 12-18 FPS

[Romulus]

icecoldduke, on 20 September 2018 - 11:06 AM, said:

Just reposting to ensure this is accurate:

Star Wars Demo Performance (DLSS OFF, Raytracing ON, 1920x1080)

• RTX 2080 FE: 55-92 FPS.
  
• 1080 ti: 12-18 FPS

Yes, that is correct. At the time I had the CPU at 5.2 GHz, on a stock 8700K the lowest minimum framerate can be up to 5% lower. My AIO kicked the bucket today.

Edit: I double checked with the numbers I wrote down, and I can't seem to confirm whether the 1080p results for the RTX cards were done using DLSS set to on or off. The people I work with initially decided to leave out the Star Was demo results entirely because it isn't representative of a real world game, then half-heartedly added the 1440p and 2160p results, leaving the 1080p results due to CPU becoming a limit.

We were reluctant to use the GTX 1080 Ti for the RayTracing tech demos simply because we knew it doesn't have hardware acceleration, and at the time there were no unified drivers for both set of hardware, the 411.51 set of drivers which was under NDA at the time were the only drivers for the RTX series of cards whereas the 399.24 set of drivers would work with the GTX line up of cards, so we had two separate identical Windows environment on separate SSDs for the GTX cards and the RTX cards so that there were no driver contamination and this was another reason the GTX 1080 Ti wasn't put through the pace of RayTracing benchmarks because nvidia was really late with supplying the RTX drivers.

Now, there is a unified driver up for everyone which is 411.63, and I have the tedious task of updating all the benches using the updated driver, I'll update you with GTX 1080 Ti numbers if I have the chance to.

TON, on 20 September 2018 - 10:54 AM, said:

Another video :

Star Wars demo on the 2080 at 1440P vs 2080 ti at 1440P vs 2080 ti at 2160P

https://youtu.be/MMbgvXde-YA?t=22m12s

DigitalFoundry is one of the best in the industry for their in depth analysis, and I highly suggest everyone to check out their content. These guys even have a comparison video for all the Duke Nukem 3D console ports.

[Hank]

off topic, my apologies

MusicallyInspired, on 20 September 2018 - 04:19 AM, said:

Will Blender take advantage of raytracing accelerated cards I wonder to make rendering faster?

Yes, they will!!
https://twitter.com/...752422485254144

Exiting times.

[icecoldduke]

Just got my 2080

[Romulus]

Congratulations.

Please make sure you uninstall your current nvidia drivers from the control panel, and then run DDU aka Display Driver Uninstaller and clear out the remains from the previous driver installation to avoid any issues that you might encounter.

Updating the latest driver over an existing installation can cause some of the outdated files to remain in your system, which can lead to issues. The "Clean Install" function within the driver installation only resets your own customized profiles that you may have set up for certain applications and games and doesn't get rid of other left overs.

For best results with DDU, it is recommended that you run it from Safe Mode.

[icecoldduke]

After banging my head against a wall for a few hours, I finally got everything working. Apparently I needed to update Windows 10 to 1803 to get DXR HW acceleration. So running a 2080 as a external GPU with a external monitor, over Thunderbolt 3, with DXR acceleration, performance with raytracing increased A LOT. On my 1080 I was barely getting 130fps at 1080p.

At 2433x1515(I know its a odd resolution, but its higher then 1080p) I get 1094 fps, and at 4k I get around 730fps.



So DXR acceleration makes a huge difference in performance.

[icecoldduke]

Also it looks like Optix Acceleration for Turing isn't available yet. I'm going to have to switch over to DirectX Raytracing.

[Mark]

icecoldduke, on 21 September 2018 - 07:33 AM, said:

On my 1080 I was barely getting 130fps at 1080p.

At 2433x1515(I know its a odd resolution, but its higher then 1080p) I get 1094 fps, and at 4k I get around 730fps.

So DXR acceleration makes a huge difference in performance.

Those are some mighty high numbers but I'm waiting for the Eduke32 with Polymer benchmark. 29fps and smoke coming from the card.

[Romulus]

With those high numbers, there's also coil whine on the cards. But it's inaudible inside cases.

[Mblackwell]

I see/read that you can't use OptiX, but:
https://www.phoronix...7-Beta-Released
Please tell me that Nvidia also released this for Windows on day one?

[Romulus]

That is really an interesting find.

[icecoldduke]

Just a quick status update: I'm going to start moving my DXR test code over to the build engine. Here's a tease of DXR E1L1 running with DXR acceleration, primary ray hit, rendering barycentric coordinates(which is why its all colorful), at over 1000fps(less then 1ms at 1080p) -- this is running inside of my test project.

[Jan Satcitananda]

Looks promising! Are barycentric coordinates related to local UV? Interesting to see this with textures.

[icecoldduke]

Jan Satcitananda, on 23 September 2018 - 10:16 PM, said:

Looks promising! Are barycentric coordinates related to local UV? Interesting to see this with textures.

Yeah, I was playing around with testing ALU complexity in various raytracing stage shaders. I'm moving all this stuff over to eduke32, at that point everything will be textured.

[Phredreeke]

What would be considered minimum spec for your renderer? I have a GTX 980 and it's already overkill for the games I normally play so I have no intention of upgrading anytime soon.

Given that you're using DirectX and not OpenGL does that mean AMD cards would be in the race too?

[Mark]

https://forums.duke4...post__p__306481

[lamduck]

With a GTX 1070 or 1080, I hope to get good performance, 1080p sustained 30 fps would be great, anything more is icing on the cake. I will enjoy this with 3d models and HRP, it will surely be a blast!

The work in progress is promising!

[Mblackwell]

icecoldduke, on 19 September 2018 - 07:19 PM, said:

Let's just kill this conversation then. I'm going to focus on 970, 980, 1070, 1080 and 2080 series, sound good? That means I'm punting on Vulkan for the time being.

Thanks to Mark referencing this above, I read this again more carefully. Just noting that Vulkan support goes back to Kepler (GeForce 600 Series) and works on Windows 7, 8, and 10 as well as Linux (MacOS requires a library like MoltenVK).

[Hank]

^ I'm lost.
Help please, in English slang: what does punting mean then? I understood it as putting Vulkan on the sidelines for now, since it's implementation for RTX would require the 2080 cards for starters?

[icecoldduke]

Mblackwell, on 24 September 2018 - 08:14 PM, said:

Thanks to Mark referencing this above, I read this again more carefully. Just noting that Vulkan support goes back to Kepler (GeForce 600 Series) and works on Windows 7, 8, and 10 as well as Linux (MacOS requires a library like MoltenVK).

Vulkan RT only supports Turing and beyond.

Hank, on 24 September 2018 - 08:35 PM, said:

^ I'm lost.
Help please, in English slang: what does punting mean then? I understood it as putting Vulkan on the sidelines for now, since it's implementation for RTX would require the 2080 cards for starters?

Punting in this context means "will implement when you guys get the hardware". I'm simply choosing a API that has a fallback layer so it can run on non rtx hardware.

[Mblackwell]

icecoldduke, on 24 September 2018 - 09:28 PM, said:

Vulkan RT only supports Turing and beyond.

Er, where are you reading that?

[Romulus]

You need to have at least resource binding Tier 3 support to use DXR RayTracing Fallback, and it's safe to assume that the requirements for Vulkan RT is something similar, therefore Fermi and Kepler cards are out of that race because they are limited to only Tier 2.

Maxwell, Pascal, Volta and Turing are the only GPUs to support Resource Binding Tier 3 from the green side of GPUs. What's interesting is that AMD cards have resource binding Tier 3 support ranging from as far as GCN 1.

[icecoldduke]

Mblackwell, on 24 September 2018 - 09:52 PM, said:

Er, where are you reading that?

VK RT extensions are not available on my 1080, I just created a simple app to check.

[icecoldduke]

Just so you guys know: DXR Fallback is a open source emulation library created by Microsoft which anyone can download here: https://github.com/M...tracingFallback Your app has to use this library to get fallback support, DXR fallback support is not provided by the driver. It's possible someone will port DXR fallback over to Vulkan, but no one has done that yet, and there is no fallback layer in the driver for raytracing.

[Mark]

With all of these hurdles to jump, its been decided that ICD will fall back to the original project of optimizing the original Polymer for speed and fix the transparency issues. Deal done.

[icecoldduke]

Mark, on 25 September 2018 - 06:45 AM, said:

With all of these hurdles to jump, its been decided that ICD will fall back to the original project of optimizing the original Polymer for speed and fix the transparency issues. Deal done.

It's more then just transparency issues. Various optimizations I'd have to do for rasterization would impact the end user experience. We like the build engine for very specific reasons, and its just not designed around rasterization. Raytracing with the build engine is the right way to go, just takes a bit more setup .

[Mark]

I know. Its just a selfish wish from a grumpy old man that doesn't like big changes.

[Mblackwell]

icecoldduke, on 25 September 2018 - 05:25 AM, said:

VK RT extensions are not available on my 1080, I just created a simple app to check.

I wouldn't expect that to be the case going forward. Check the driver info for Linux and also the whitepaper, and the spec from Khronos.

https://www.khronos...._NVX_raytracing
http://on-demand.gpu...-for-vulkan.pdf