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DNF 2001 Build Was Allegedly Almost Complete, But It Probably Wasn't  "3DR wants to release it, but it's up to Gearbox"

User is offline   BoowHow 

#751

View PostjustLMAO, on 02 September 2019 - 07:51 AM, said:

I'm guessing the hold up is Shitfart brainstorming ideas for this "Definitive Duke Nukem Collection" he mentioned


Either that, or he is currently busy with Borderlands 3.
0

#752

From a video I've seen, it appears that Randy is an SJW, so he won't do anything with Duke because it would go against his misandric, heterophobic, anti-Caucasian agenda.

This post has been edited by Altered Reality: 02 September 2019 - 10:50 AM

2

User is offline   Lazy Dog 

#753

View PostAltered Reality, on 02 September 2019 - 10:47 AM, said:





Also, my ears are bleeding.

This post has been edited by Lazy Dog: 03 September 2019 - 10:19 PM

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User is online   gemeaux333 

#754

Some clips from the 2001 build ? :

https://www.dsogamin...-nukem-forever/
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User is offline   Tekedon 

#755

View Postgemeaux333, on 26 December 2019 - 10:39 AM, said:

Some clips from the 2001 build ? :

https://www.dsogamin...-nukem-forever/


Too bad there is no link to the clips..
0

User is online   Dr.Panico 

#756

View PostTekedon, on 26 December 2019 - 10:45 AM, said:

Too bad there is no link to the clips..


They're under the text. It's the imgur pictures.
0

User is offline   Lazy Dog 

#757

View PostTekedon, on 26 December 2019 - 10:45 AM, said:

Too bad there is no link to the clips..


?

they show for me

https://i.imgur.com/hPYlKWW.mp4

https://i.imgur.com/5ytXsgx.mp4

here's the source:

http://boards.4chann...hread/490244172

This post has been edited by Lazy Dog: 26 December 2019 - 11:19 AM

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User is offline   Tekedon 

#758

View PostDr.Panico, on 26 December 2019 - 11:12 AM, said:

They're under the text. It's the imgur pictures.


Did not realise. Wow, very impressive skybox for 2001, with the moving traffic and everything. Looks like it might be real.
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User is offline   Commando Nukem 

  • Judge Mental

#759

Oh, it's real. It's sourced from the Schreiber stream of the game he did awhile back. He showed off a number of levels. Apparently some folks who were int he Discord server decided to video capture it even though he said "Ya'll gotta promise me you won't. You sure you ain't screen grabbing?"

Lol.


Duke Nukem Forever : The Ultimate Go Nowhere Cock Tease.
4

User is offline   Outtagum 

#760

View PostLazy Dog, on 26 December 2019 - 11:14 AM, said:


https://i.imgur.com/dGEU2Oy.jpg
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User is offline   Tekedon 

#761

View PostCommando Nukem, on 26 December 2019 - 05:12 PM, said:

Oh, it's real. It's sourced from the Schreiber stream of the game he did awhile back. He showed off a number of levels. Apparently some folks who were int he Discord server decided to video capture it even though he said "Ya'll gotta promise me you won't. You sure you ain't screen grabbing?"

Lol.


Duke Nukem Forever : The Ultimate Go Nowhere Cock Tease.


Cool! Is there any more footage somewhere that you know of?
0

#762

BUT WAIT THERE'S MORE
https://i.imgur.com/R9nEJmR.mp4
https://i.imgur.com/e34yNlF.mp4
https://i.imgur.com/7fHeRSQ.mp4
https://i.imgur.com/Xumxze7.mp4
https://i.imgur.com/wSxoLJC.mp4
and
https://i.imgur.com/s7VKmQN.jpg
8

User is offline   brullov 

  • BAZINGA!

#763

Tell me it does not look fucking good and it's unfinished and nobody cares blah blah blah.
0

User is offline   Kyeb 

#764

Couple more!

Attached thumbnail(s)

  • Attached Image: 1577426003384m.jpg
  • Attached Image: 1577371958752.png

3

User is offline   stumppy84 

#765

Looks pretty good to me and this was only in Vegas - I hope it gets released and some modder team picks it up!
When was this streamed?
0

User is offline   Commando Nukem 

  • Judge Mental

#766

I don't know of any more footage that exists in the wild. At the rate these bits are dropping though, I betcha it's not long before the hours of footage that exist get dropped for all the world to see. It's... It's about time, honestly.

I do know a few people have the full stream recorded on their drives and are either unwilling or unable to release it. I've been shown some of the footage. Some of the stuff above. Other clips showed off things like dismemberment. EDF security and dogs attacking the player. The road on the way to the EDF Military Base with a bomber crashing into the desert. Lightning storms, rain storms. A large inventory of weapons with different options for the guns (Pioe bomb variants.) A lot of the stuff that Wieder has talked about in recent years on here.

A couple things to note:

You can see visual glitches in the footage above. Some of these are part of the fact that it was still in development, and part of it is that it's being run on a modern O.S. The fact it runs at all is a testament to the heartiness of the Unreal engine.

Randy Pitchford is the liar. Not Fred, and not Mr. Charles Wiederhold. There's a lot of game content there. A lot. I would say there's more playable game content in the 2001 build of DNF available than the Half-Life 2 2003 leak/beta. (I'm talking about what worked when it was initially released, mind you, not what has been built and reconstructed by the community in the decades after.) So there's some very complete levels offering hours of gameplay, and then there's bits that go from looking polished to being totally under construction with placeholder shit everywhere.


But that's what I've been saying for years now. That's what I want to have to fuck around with. The rough around the edges work in progress that shows how that particular sausage was made. There's no way that the 2001 build of DNF can be authentically complete. I want the Lame Duke equivalent. That snapshot htat shows us what DNF was like in those days at it's peak.


11

User is offline   R A D A Я 

  • Zionist Shill

#767

I wasn't around back when this thread had just started, but reading the whole thing from the beginning makes it clear that DNF's development was going in a good direction up until George decided to scrap all their work because of an Unreal engine update that added dynamic lighting. The main reason that is absolutely ridiculous is because after all those years and updates, DNF still used Unreal 1 up until release day. I understand scrapping the Quake 2 version of DNF, but why the hell would you scrap a game multiple times all on the same engine? Such a simple eff up too. It is not only George's fault but also the fault of other folks who were close to him (like Scott), who I suppose were just yes-men in meetings and nodded off to whatever George wanted as long as the company got funded. It also pains me to think how different this could have turned out if a well-balanced person like Weider had been around to stop George from doing dumb things (as he previously stated in this thread, he was recovering in the hospital for months at the time these grave decisions were made).
3

User is offline   Commando Nukem 

  • Judge Mental

#768

It's really messed up too, when you take a step back and look at the history of the franchise in context.

Duke and Quake came out on top of each other, and the big thing with Quake are its polygonal assets and 3D world. It was lauded for pushing the boundaries, but, frankly, Duke 3D holds up far better than Quake. It has a far better sense of place in the level design, and the art direction is simply better, more colorful, and more engaging.

If DNF had managed to push forward and get a release in 2002, what would it have been up against? Far Cry? Unreal 2? Quake 3? Soldier of Fortune 2? Those were the games of that era, with Doom 3 and Half-Life 2 still a year or two away with previews in 2003 and releases in 2004. DNF would have been fine graphically, and in terms of what we know of it's gameplay, it would have been amazing.

So history, in my view, would have repeated. DNF, like Duke3D, would not necessarily have been the graphical powerhouse of Doom 3 or Half-Life 2, but it would have been damn fine in its own respect and had gameplay to stand the test of time. Once it was out, 3D Realms could have taken a breath, caught a break, and looked towards the future. Maybe licensed Source or Id Tech 4 to make the next Duke game, or even stuck with Unreal and made Duke 5 over the following three years for Unreal II.
9

User is offline   Tekedon 

#769

View PostCommando Nukem, on 27 December 2019 - 01:00 PM, said:

It's really messed up too, when you take a step back and look at the history of the franchise in context.

Duke and Quake came out on top of each other, and the big thing with Quake are its polygonal assets and 3D world. It was lauded for pushing the boundaries, but, frankly, Duke 3D holds up far better than Quake. It has a far better sense of place in the level design, and the art direction is simply better, more colorful, and more engaging.

If DNF had managed to push forward and get a release in 2002, what would it have been up against? Far Cry? Unreal 2? Quake 3? Soldier of Fortune 2? Those were the games of that era, with Doom 3 and Half-Life 2 still a year or two away with previews in 2003 and releases in 2004. DNF would have been fine graphically, and in terms of what we know of it's gameplay, it would have been amazing.

So history, in my view, would have repeated. DNF, like Duke3D, would not necessarily have been the graphical powerhouse of Doom 3 or Half-Life 2, but it would have been damn fine in its own respect and had gameplay to stand the test of time. Once it was out, 3D Realms could have taken a breath, caught a break, and looked towards the future. Maybe licensed Source or Id Tech 4 to make the next Duke game, or even stuck with Unreal and made Duke 5 over the following three years for Unreal II.


I agree with this. They should've gotten it out by 2002 using this engine. Maybe the original 3D Realms would still be alive and kicking if that were the case.
1

#770

View PostRadar 100 Watts, on 27 December 2019 - 10:43 AM, said:

I wasn't around back when this thread had just started, but reading the whole thing from the beginning makes it clear that DNF's development was going in a good direction up until George decided to scrap all their work because of an Unreal engine update that added dynamic lighting. The main reason that is absolutely ridiculous is because after all those years and updates, DNF still used Unreal 1 up until release day. I understand scrapping the Quake 2 version of DNF, but why the hell would you scrap a game multiple times all on the same engine? Such a simple eff up too. It is not only George's fault but also the fault of other folks who were close to him (like Scott), who I suppose were just yes-men in meetings and nodded off to whatever George wanted as long as the company got funded. It also pains me to think how different this could have turned out if a well-balanced person like Weider had been around to stop George from doing dumb things (as he previously stated in this thread, he was recovering in the hospital for months at the time these grave decisions were made).


Actually, regarding the "scrap all their work mecause of an update that added dynamic lighting", that's a common misconception (which I think was caused by Fred erroneously claiming that)
Here are the facts by Wieder:
Attached Image: Sin título-2.png


Also note that the custom dynamic lighting renderer came from 3DR itself, not an update by Epic in case you thought it came from them.
5

User is offline   Mr. Tibbs 

#771

Man, I was not expecting to see anything else. So cool to see DNF 2001's gameplay in action after all these years. I really hope the full stream comes out at some point!
1

User is online   KareBear 

#772

https://i.imgur.com/Rrh7jST.png

Another new screenshot from the 4chan thread.

This post has been edited by KareBear: 27 December 2019 - 04:07 PM

1

#773

Interesting seeing more content from the 2001 version. The discussion about DNF's development and what did or did not happen after 2001, reminded me of this thread: https://forums.duke4...-quotes-thread/
0

User is offline   necroslut 

#774

View PostCommando Nukem, on 27 December 2019 - 01:00 PM, said:

It's really messed up too, when you take a step back and look at the history of the franchise in context.

Duke and Quake came out on top of each other, and the big thing with Quake are its polygonal assets and 3D world. It was lauded for pushing the boundaries, but, frankly, Duke 3D holds up far better than Quake. It has a far better sense of place in the level design, and the art direction is simply better, more colorful, and more engaging.

If DNF had managed to push forward and get a release in 2002, what would it have been up against? Far Cry? Unreal 2? Quake 3? Soldier of Fortune 2? Those were the games of that era, with Doom 3 and Half-Life 2 still a year or two away with previews in 2003 and releases in 2004. DNF would have been fine graphically, and in terms of what we know of it's gameplay, it would have been amazing.

To be fair, IIRC both Doom 3 and Half-Life 2 were delayed and we were initially looking at significantly earlier release windows. And while DNF-01 looked great in 2001, it would have looked significantly dated next to those two titles – even if in reality they ended up not releasing until later.

I'm speculating here, but I imagine the relative failures of Shadow Warrior and Blood to compete with Quake II were taken into consideration when it came to "update" DNF. While I'd much rather replay those titles today than QII, it was QII that raked in the cash. It doesn't pay to be a hidden gem or cult classic.

Now, I'm not saying the decisions were right, but I think they, lacking hindsight, were far more understandable than we sometimes make them out to be.

This post has been edited by necroslut: 27 December 2019 - 08:09 PM

0

User is offline   MARTYR 

  • Duke4.net THOT Patrol

#775

View PostFuturetime23, on 27 December 2019 - 01:25 PM, said:

Actually, regarding the "scrap all their work mecause of an update that added dynamic lighting", that's a common misconception (which I think was caused by Fred erroneously claiming that)

Well actually what happened was the added lighting completely borked pretty much every level that had been created, so they had to go back and fix everything. It was a really stupid fucking move.
3

#776

View PostJesus is King, on 27 December 2019 - 08:09 PM, said:

Well actually what happened was the added lighting completely borked pretty much every level that had been created, so they had to go back and fix everything. It was a really stupid fucking move.

You mean the levels being pitch black according to Fred? because Wieder also talked about that being likely caused by a completely different issue, not due to the new renderer: (this also goes into depth into how updates were applied to DNF)
Attached Image: Sin título-2.png

If you meant by borked instead that the assets had to be updated to look good with the new renderer (I.e. spec textures, proper lighting adjustment etc) then nevermind me.
1

User is offline   Person of Color 

  • Senior Unpaid Intern at Viceland

#777

So many veins just ruptured in my cock
3

User is offline   MARTYR 

  • Duke4.net THOT Patrol

#778

The greatest proof that the Duke Nukem Curse exists is that the only person who gets to play Duke Nukem Forever is Frederik Schreiber.
4

User is offline   Commando Nukem 

  • Judge Mental

#779

View PostFuturetime23, on 27 December 2019 - 08:41 PM, said:

You mean the levels being pitch black according to Fred? because Wieder also talked about that being likely caused by a completely different issue, not due to the new renderer: (this also goes into depth into how updates were applied to DNF)
Attachment Sin título-2.png

If you meant by borked instead that the assets had to be updated to look good with the new renderer (I.e. spec textures, proper lighting adjustment etc) then nevermind me.



Yeah, but that is no small issue.

Look at the assets in the above clips and you'll note they already have certain lights and shadows drawn/baked into the textures. When you add dynamic lighting into the mix, that looks AWFUL. So you have to go through every single asset you've made and basically completely remake it to get the proper specs and normal/bump maps. That's a lot of work. A lot of work. It's essentially a content restart because everything has to be done again to the new specifications of the engine.

It, also, in my opinion, never looked that good. The stuff I've seen from 2003 just looks unappealing. The style of the 2001 version is just that... A style. It's striking and it feels like the natural progression of the Duke 3D look.



EDIT: Also, making the assets in that way, for a dynamic lighting system, is a completely new skill that I can only imagine the artists at 3D Realms would have had to learn at the time. That alone takes a long time to master. The process itself isn't necessarily that complex to understand, but getting used to it? And who knows if they had enough of the high end work machines at the time to do it effectively. To get the right kind of specs and normal (Other than hand painting them which is a nightmare.) You have to do your high poly mesh, then your low poly mesh, UV the low poly, bake the high poly to the low poly so you get all the bumps and curves and intricate details captured onto the spec and normal... and then you have to tweak your values and get it looking just right. And if you note, just about every game from that era had a difficult time making things look natural. Things, often, look exaggerated as fuck. With HUGE bump map values.

This post has been edited by Commando Nukem: 28 December 2019 - 08:19 AM

4

User is offline   Tea Monster 

  • Polymancer

#780

Yeah. that's a complete restart from the ground up. All assets, all textures. And you have to make two of everything, a high and a low poly and bake down every single asset and texture in the game.

I can't see how they didn't see that was going to be needed before committing to the new renderer though. "It's black, we have to start over." (Magically fixes renderer) "Oh shit, look at this mess, we have to start over!" Same deal either way.
1

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