[NNC]

I decided to do some research on the internet and checked out how old were some of the classic pro leveldesigners when they created their pro levels for 3D shooter games. I focused on the old games and their designers only, but other big and smaller pro names and their age would be welcome.

John Romero (Doom, Quake etc.) was born in 1967, and was 27 when Doom came out
Tom Hall (Doom, ROTT etc.) was born in 1964, and was 30 when his games came out.
Levelord was born in 1957, and was 39 when Duke came out.
Randy Pitchford was born in 1971, and he was only 25, when his Duke levels came out.
Sandy Petersen (Doom) was born in 1955, and was also pretty "old", 39, when Doom came out.
Timi Willits (Quake) was born in 1971, and was 25, when Quake came out.

I don't have much info about Allen Blum, Keith Schuler, Stephen Cole, Robert Travis, James Wilson or Craig Hubbard, there were much less info about them than id software game designers.

And what's the point of this? I'm just wondering what is the age when people truly can break into professional mapping, which is a different territory to even the best userlevel design. Or in other words: does age matters anyway? Programmers can be extremely young, like Ken Silverman, although IMHO it's a bit different to leveldesign. A math prodigy can do wonders with programming, but to be a good designer, you might need some maturity and experience to truly create something appealing and original scenery and/or mission for a game. But I can be wrong.

[oasiz]

I do think that you need to be 20+ to get it optimal. Add in a year or two for engine experience as you might have to learn it from the ground up during dev.
For consistency and making things intuitive, you need a ton of experience and building up a taste for how things seem "right" to you.
Most importantly, you need team skills as you're not making stuff alone when you do things professionally (You need art/music/models/writing/events/etc..)

This is why modding is a good stepping stone as it teaches all of these skills.
I do think that you can still close in the gap with just tons of work and dedication.

I think programming is a bit different in this sense as you can basically lock yourself alone in a dungeon with a computer for some time and essentially focus on creating tools for others.
Inexperience can lead to difficulties with programmers though, some might not think about maintainability or simply treating new features like a hobby project that breaks existing code all the time.
But I've seen many coders under 20 who can pull off stuff that even impress 30+ year old experienced coders. However coding is a bit different these days from what it used to be.

[Danukem]

It's an interesting question, but why focus on old games to answer it? You will get a more accurate answer by surveying the devs of new games. In the early to mid-90s, level designing for video games was a new job. The people who did it had other careers they were already trained in, and were trying their hands at something new. Nowadays, a kid could plan a career in it ahead of time.

[Mark]

One possibly common link to both past and present is that some 32 year old emerges from their parent's basement to get into professional mapping.

[icecoldduke]

oasiz, on 03 April 2017 - 10:45 AM, said:

This is why modding is a good stepping stone as it teaches all of these skills.

Modding mixed with being in the right place at the right time is what got me into the game industry. Unfortunately a lot of you have had to see the type of crap I made in my early days, but I wouldn't have got my in without it.

[HulkNukem]

Age and college don't matter for a video game career; yes, they can help with experience, but if you just churn out great piece after great piece and you are 13, chances are you will be able to easily find jobs in the industry.
There's that one kid that made that huge Skyrim mod with it's own landmass and quests and everything, and he was only 18 when he released it trying to get a job at Bethesda. He ended up working at I believe either 343 or Bungie
Making custom maps and then later working with a mod team will help acclimate you with creating a project, but you should also be able to do as much as possible (concept art, modelling, textures, level design). Knowing programming wouldn't hurt at all either!
Levels also typically take way more than one person to create now as well.

[icecoldduke]

HulkNukem, on 03 April 2017 - 12:02 PM, said:

Age and college don't matter for a video game career; yes, they can help with experience, but if you just churn out great piece after great piece and you are 13, chances are you will be able to easily find jobs in the industry.

If your a programmer without college and looking to join the game industry, you better be prepared for a bunch of vector math questions during your interview.

[HulkNukem]

Was talking more about the art side

[Cage]

Trooper Dan, on 03 April 2017 - 10:46 AM, said:

It's an interesting question, but why focus on old games to answer it? You will get a more accurate answer by surveying the devs of new games. In the early to mid-90s, level designing for video games was a new job. The people who did it had other careers they were already trained in, and were trying their hands at something new. Nowadays, a kid could plan a career in it ahead of time.

I think it's worth to note that level designers back in the older times were in control of the whole level due to the less complex engines and simpler graphical fidelity - not just layout, but the visuals, gameplay, everything. Modern level pipeline has a definite split between the level design/layout/flow and a visual pass, which can be further split into the environment graphics and light, usually done by separate people/teams. Level scripting and gameplay set up might be out of the hands of level designer too, so that leaves pretty much leaves the planning and general architecture.

So in terms of old/new level design, depends what you compare, the difference between working on levels for Quake and Half Life 2 isn't that drastic, but if you think about something like Doom 2016, it's a whole different ballgame.