[Marcos]

Let'me ask something, is there anything like annotatios or files I don't know, that say why they removed some things from the game or added others? Like why tgey removed the spacesuit or the flamethrower?

[Fox]

The spacesuit was removed probably because the game detects if you are on the outerspace based on the paralaxed ceiling picnum, which is awfull. I imagine the Flamethrower was removed because feature which would case the player or enemies to burn didn't worked well.

[TerminX]

I feel like I've seen a version where the flamethrower worked pretty well, but that it required a lot more sprites to look nice than a 486 could pull off at decent framerate. I could be imagining things, though.

Btw, that version 1.2 has some other interesting differences. I don't think we will ever be able to release it because much of it is identical to what shipped as 1.3D, but it definitely has some neat stuff. Mini Battlelords are pal 19 instead of 21, Stadium is significantly different--I can only guess the direction they went with it didn't work out, resulting in a last minute reversion to what was more or less the 1994 version of the map--the prototype Overlord is present, Hotel Hell had a giant mirror near the front desk so you could see the Battlelord trap before running into it, etc. Dogs and cats living together, mass hysteria!

[TheZombieKiller]

TerminX, on 24 November 2014 - 02:57 AM, said:

I feel like I've seen a version where the flamethrower worked pretty well, but that it required a lot more sprites to look nice than a 486 could pull off at decent framerate. I could be imagining things, though.

Btw, that version 1.2 has some other interesting differences. I don't think we will ever be able to release it because much of it is identical to what shipped as 1.3D, but it definitely has some neat stuff. Mini Battlelords are pal 19 instead of 21, Stadium is significantly different--I can only guess the direction they went with it didn't work out, resulting in a last minute reversion to what was more or less the 1994 version of the map--the prototype Overlord is present, Hotel Hell had a giant mirror near the front desk so you could see the Battlelord trap before running into it, etc. Dogs and cats living together, mass hysteria!

Why don't you just release a diff patch for 1.3D to patch it to the 1.2 version then?

[High Treason]

It's a shame about the things that can't be released due to being too close to the final build. In an ideal world, they could be released; Buying Duke 3D from the new 3D Realms site would allow you to download those prototypes as there would be proof you owned the game, I think most of us would gladly pay for it. But I can understand why releasing it isn't necessarily something a company would want to do.

[Marcos]

How many beta/alpha versions have you already discovered? How many of them are fully functional?

[Fox]

TerminX, on 24 November 2014 - 02:57 AM, said:

Stadium is significantly different--I can only guess the direction they went with it didn't work out, resulting in a last minute reversion to what was more or less the 1994 version of the map

What exactly that Stadium looked like?

[MrFlibble]

TerminX, on 23 November 2014 - 04:14 PM, said:

TerminX, thanks a lot! What was the function of the "Support Version" though? Was it intended for internal testing?

Also I did not entirely understand, did a leak of this version actually happen after all or not?

TerminX, on 24 November 2014 - 02:57 AM, said:

Btw, that version 1.2 has some other interesting differences. I don't think we will ever be able to release it because much of it is identical to what shipped as 1.3D, but it definitely has some neat stuff.

Will you be able to at least release gameplay videos of this version?

oasiz, on 23 November 2014 - 11:37 PM, said:

When it comes to quick kick, it behaves very differently in .99 and I think even up to 1.1 where it just does a really slow kick with the "mighty foot engaged!" text while lowering the weapon automatically for the kick itself.

It is my understanding that up to v1.1 the quick kick was essentially just switching temporarily to the kick and then back to the currently selected weapon.

[hogsy]

Have you guys tried asking Zenimax/Bethesda about Prey again? Seeing as Prey 2 has now been officially announced as cancelled, it's worth a try.

I'm not desperate or anything... Well, maybe a little. I certainly know a lot of the original developers are happy to share information about it, and I know that even a few of the original developers still have some concept-art, builds and other work (including the source-code), but to me the clock is literally ticking when it comes to saving and preserving a lot of this, who knows when some of it might be lost, discarded or whatever. It's a pain that Zenimax/Bethesda are so difficult to get in touch with as well, but I'm sure someone who pushes enough could probably convince someone there.

[icecoldduke]

hogsy, on 24 November 2014 - 07:52 AM, said:

including the source-code

Was there more source code for prey that went public that wasn't in the game sdk?

[hogsy]

icecoldduke, on 24 November 2014 - 09:31 AM, said:

Was there more source code for prey that went public that wasn't in the game sdk?

I'm specifically referring to the '98 and '96 iterations of Prey, not Human Head's Prey.

[icecoldduke]

hogsy, on 24 November 2014 - 10:39 AM, said:

I'm specifically referring to the '98 and '96 iterations of Prey, not Human Head's Prey.

There was code that got leaked from those builds?

[Hendricks266]

icecoldduke, on 24 November 2014 - 10:44 AM, said:

There was code that got leaked from those builds?

Reading comprehension.

hogsy, on 24 November 2014 - 07:52 AM, said:

and I know that even a few of the original developers still have some concept-art, builds and other work (including the source-code)

[icecoldduke]

Hendricks266, on 24 November 2014 - 12:45 PM, said:

Reading comprehension.

Touche .

[PikaCommando]

TerminX, on 24 November 2014 - 02:57 AM, said:

I feel like I've seen a version where the flamethrower worked pretty well, but that it required a lot more sprites to look nice than a 486 could pull off at decent framerate. I could be imagining things, though.

Btw, that version 1.2 has some other interesting differences. I don't think we will ever be able to release it because much of it is identical to what shipped as 1.3D, but it definitely has some neat stuff. Mini Battlelords are pal 19 instead of 21, Stadium is significantly different--I can only guess the direction they went with it didn't work out, resulting in a last minute reversion to what was more or less the 1994 version of the map--the prototype Overlord is present, Hotel Hell had a giant mirror near the front desk so you could see the Battlelord trap before running into it, etc. Dogs and cats living together, mass hysteria!

How significantly different is Stadium? Does that mean it was a full stage before? Also, does the prototype Overlord in that build coexist with final Overlord, or was final Overlord a last minute change?

[DNSkill]

I think the versions similar to the final would be worth releasing for $. Maybe they could come with purchasing DN3D off the 3DR's site.

[Kathy]

Yeah, they could call it... Late Access.

[MrFlibble]

Continuing with the small semi-random questions, is there any evidence as to why the demo loops were removed from Shadow Warrior v1.2?

Also DOSGuy from RGB Classic Games suggested that

DOSGuy said:

the shuriken pointer was replaced with a yin yang symbol when 3DR found out that they would need to remove shurikens from the UK version of the game to comply with anti-ninja weapon laws.

Is that right? (The discussion was about the menu selector having been changed from a rotating shuriken to a Yin Yang symbol.)

[Gargoyle]

Speaking of Plutonium Pack, are the alleged Levelord E4 levels actually there?

gerolf, on 25 November 2014 - 09:26 AM, said:

I think the versions similar to the final would be worth releasing for $. Maybe they could come with purchasing DN3D off the 3DR's site.

This so much. Exclusive bonus for 3DR customers! And shareware episode for distribution.

[PikaCommando]

Is this the earliest build?

It's pretty painful to watch :/

[icecoldduke]

PikaCommando, on 27 November 2014 - 07:31 PM, said:

Is this the earliest build?

It's pretty painful to watch :/

What do you expect from a any early build of any game? Especially when they are using new tech(the build engine), they were probably just trying to get something on it's feet at the time.

[MYHOUSE.MAP]

The hidden secret is that prototypes often look like dogshit, no matter what phase the game is in. That's kinda why they're PROTOTYPES in the first place.

Even LD's readme clearly states "...and what most developer's hide from you and when the press visits", and that was compiled later than this version. They damn well know that their game isn't all that hot, so they pick the stuff that looks acceptable and show it to the press.

[TerminX]

This is the earliest build.

[OpenMaw]

TerminX, on 27 November 2014 - 10:42 PM, said:

This is the earliest build.

Is there/will there be some kind of documentation to go with it? I mean historical stuff, what the intentions were at the time, what was being done within the engine, the goals at the time, and so forth?

[Frederik Schreiber]

Commando Nukem, on 28 November 2014 - 12:51 AM, said:

Is there/will there be some kind of documentation to go with it? I mean historical stuff, what the intentions were at the time, what was being done within the engine, the goals at the time, and so forth?

We'll do several historical pieces, yes!

[Robman]

Fred, I watched your twitchtv playthrough of Shadow Warrior... Let the real you shine through in your typing, more profanity please

More sailor, less politician.

[icecoldduke]

TerminX, on 27 November 2014 - 10:42 PM, said:

This is the earliest build.

Do you know at which point they decided to go with the CON script?

[MrFlibble]

Another question (if you don't mind that is!): is there any information about when exactly it was decided that the shareware episode would contain less levels than the registered episodes? IIRC, Duke3D was either the first Apogee model game to have a shorter shareware episode, or at least the first in the FPS genre. Were there any more maps supposed to be in the first episode at the point where it was already L.A. Meltdown (at least thematically if not by name)?

[TerminX]

At one point the episode started in a space station (before you escape back to Earth...) and ended with you going back into space again. Sorry if that's vague, there has just been a LOT of data to go through--enough to almost get mixed up on some of it. I turn 30 in January and there are more files here than there have been days in my life.

[MYHOUSE.MAP]

TerminX, on 28 November 2014 - 01:05 PM, said:

At one point the episode started in a space station (before you escape back to Earth...) and ended with you going back into space again. Sorry if that's vague, there has just been a LOT of data to go through--enough to almost get mixed up on some of it. I turn 30 in January and there are more files here than there have been days in my life.

Well, that explains the sudden jump from space to city levels. I originally thought it was because E1 became a testbed for the new, final-style city levels they were making.