[Lordareon]

OK, i know there was a project called Duke Nukem 1998 that was meant to recreate duke if it was made and released in that time and all.. but i checked the topic and it seems like dead, 6 months theres nothing there so i was wondering to do the same and start another project but i wanted the community opinion if you prefer Trailer 1998 Style or Trailer 2001 Style, 1998 style looks a lot more movimented, 2001 looks more like Half Life with dialogues and all.. if its a homebrew game i wont have voice actors, recording equipment, etc to do so.. so i was preferring the 1998 Style but i want to know what you all think
1998 Trailer
2001 Trailer
there's also DNF 2003 Extra content that could be considered... i kinda like the music of the extra video, if someone could re-record it just the main loop lik 30 secs, to be put like on the loading screen would be cool no? ah
http://youtu.be/VpW7HKoLNpo

[OpenMaw]

Lordareon, on 20 January 2013 - 04:37 PM, said:

OK, i know there was a project called Duke Nukem 1998 that was meant to recreate duke if it was made and released in that time and all.. but i checked the topic and it seems like dead, 6 months theres nothing there so i was wondering to do the same and start another project but i wanted the community opinion if you prefer Trailer 1998 Style or Trailer 2001 Style, 1998 style looks a lot more movimented, 2001 looks more like Half Life with dialogues and all.. if its a homebrew game i wont have voice actors, recording equipment, etc to do so.. so i was preferring the 1998 Style but i want to know what you all think
1998 Trailer
2001 Trailer
there's also DNF 2003 Extra content that could be considered... i kinda like the music of the extra video, if someone could re-record it just the main loop lik 30 secs, to be put like on the loading screen would be cool no? ah
http://youtu.be/VpW7HKoLNpo

Duke Nukem 1998 was a cluster fuck from what I saw. They were switching engines every 30 seconds between Quake and Unreal, the guy running the project seemed to enjoy harvesting other peoples code and work, and claiming it as his own or having "borrowed it with permission" even though it wasn't his. The project itself had some promise early on, and I was psyched.

However, I feel I must point out that this is a bad way to start. You need to have your own creative intention before you even start. If you don't even have that to begin with, then the project has no hope of getting off the ground. A poll for popularity on this sort of thing is academic, but it won't really provide helpful information. You need to be asking yourself what you want to do, and what will keep your interest while working on it. Creative burnouts are very common on even individual levels. Even among veteran level designers and mod makers here, it happens often.

Another thing to consider is that it's not just enough to be a cheer leader, or an idea man. You have to bring something more to get people interested in such a project. What are your skills? What can you bring to the table other than "idea man"? Can you do artwork? Level design? 3D Modeling? What engine(s) are you considering to work with for this project? Quake? Unity? Unreal?


Also, even if you go with the 1998 version, that doesn't eliminate the issue of voice acting at all. The 1998 version had a cast of characters that all had things to say (and indeed during some closed previews back in 98, many press people got to hear what Gus, Bombshell, the strippers, and some of the other characters sounded like.). So, another suggestion here would be to invest in sound equipment, even some low grade microphones can give you pretty good sound if you push them/configure things properly/employ some tricks within audio editing programs like Audacity or Goldwave.


The track featured in the 2003 and 2006 footage is from Duke Nukem Forever itself, and can be found there. It's nothing really special, just generic rock.

[Micky C]

I think both 1998 and 2001 are unique and good in their own way. It's hard to choose between the two. If you were going to remake one, I'd probably go for 1998 simply because it would be easier I'd say.

But to follow on from what Commando Nukem said, are you capable of making this on your own? Level design, textures, models? And what engine are you thinking of using? Eduke32's good for a lot of things but if you try and use it for a remake it's just going to feel like "another Duke mod" and won't appeal to anyone other than Duke 3D fans.
But, Gearbox might want to shut you down if you do want to use another engine. However if you don't make a huge fuss and work on it outside of the public's eye they can't really do anything about it.

[Gambini]

A remake of the 1998-2001 Duke Nukem Foverer? psss! Why wasting our time on that? That name is cursed.

[dnskill]

DNF has always been the same damn game!!!

Look real close at the trailers and you'll see that most of the storyline stayed intact. The only things that changed over time were:

-Textures/graphics (obviously)
-The weapons/enemies
-DUKE'S QUOTES (this is a major thing)
-Some levels were cut, or at least some NPC from levels were cut
-The expansion pack was at one time part of the game, but they changed the story slightly (Proton was to be in DNF, and in the early trailers you can see the Dukeinators).

So, I do not think it is worth remaking. I think DNF could've been successful in 1998, but it would probably not have lived up to DN3D..

EDIT: What I'm trying to say about it being the same damn game... There's no point in remaking the older versions, as there were only some differences between all the different versions, the majority of the game remained the same throughout..... SO, if you didn't like the final release, chances are you would not like the older versions now. I'd say if you wanted to make a, "What DNF should've been like" project, then by all means go for it.

[Micky C]

What are you talking about? The game we ended up with in 2011 is quite different to what was shown in 1998 or 2001.

Instead of giving us a list of what was changed, which is much larger than what you gave, why not give us a list of what was the same? I think most of the examples you'll come up with are cursory and quite inconsequential.

[OpenMaw]

gerolf, on 20 January 2013 - 07:37 PM, said:

DNF has always been the same damn game!!!

Look real close at the trailers and you'll see that most of the storyline stayed intact. The only things that changed over time were:

-Textures/graphics (obviously)
-The weapons/enemies
-DUKE'S QUOTES (this is a major thing)
-Some levels were cut, or at least some NPC from levels were cut
-The expansion pack was at one time part of the game, but they changed the story slightly (Proton was to be in DNF, and in the early trailers you can see the Dukeinators).

So, I do not think it is worth remaking. I think DNF could've been successful in 1998, but it would probably not have lived up to DN3D..

EDIT: What I'm trying to say about it being the same damn game... There's no point in remaking the older versions, as there were only some differences between all the different versions, the majority of the game remained the same throughout..... SO, if you didn't like the final release, chances are you would not like the older versions now. I'd say if you wanted to make a, "What DNF should've been like" project, then by all means go for it.

Not really accurate. The story for DNF as originally conceived in 1997/2001 was very different. It featured Vegas, and Area 51 like the final game, but there was a lot more going on in terms of specific interactivity and the way the mechanics worked. (Just ask weider, he's given us a couple nuggets here and there. The game would have had wicked interactivity back then.) There was a lot more stuff with Proton specifically back in the 97 version.

There were far more varied enemies in the original DNF, there were more NPC characters to interact with that actually had some character. Frankly, the style of the 2001 trailer is STILL more pleasing than what DNF became. (Las Vegas at night, regardless of whether it had been done or not, was the better route to go. I've been to Vegas. It's just as dull during the day as it was in DNF. Though, not nearly as linear.)

[Bloodshot]

I was actually a part of the DN1998 project, but like DNF itself, the project didn't have much direction and the guy in charge went back and fourth between the Q1 engine and Unreal, until finally settling on Unreal (or so I thought). I remade HH as a proof of concept map for it, and I made a couple of models from the DNF98 screenshots like the 98 rocket launcher.

I had suggested that we didn't have much in the way of organization and team leadership and we lacked clear goals, and he finally got a response from ChrisF saying to lay low. Working on stuff like that took a backseat to real life so I didn't really have time to help out anymore, and then some other people left and the whole thing went to shit.

But honestly, you could tell that project was borked early on, because of how disorganized everything was. There was no real direction or workflow, and nobody seemed serious about anything, which was one of the reasons, aside from being pretty busy, that I left. I really did want it to happen though, and that's why I stayed with it for a while, even though everyone working on it was like a 7 year old kid showing off his crayon drawings to his friends.

The best thing to do IMO would be to make a new game, but with the concepts from the 98 and 01 trailer as inspiration. Maybe have the same features, but don't make "DNF - the 98 version" or "DNF - 2001", use them as building blocks and a jump-off point for ideas. And seriously, get a good project manager if you really want this to happen.

As for me, well, I'm even busier now that I'm in college, but I'm working on a UDK project with actual management and competence this time around, and it feels nice to actually have level-headed people to work with

[Lordareon]

Ok people, lets get your questions answered... well i had the idea of this "remake" since DNF came out(I did liked DNF but it was not that hype that all the trailers showed), i just saw today that was that project Duke Nukem 1998, and i was hoping it was in development, which wasnt the case.
First, the idea that i had for the game was too generic, and first and foremost, it will be a free project so i wanted to create what people wanted to play/see, i have my own ideas but of course it wont please everybody, i just want to make sure im in the right path, ok?
Second, by this poll im just speculating on what can be done, what is wanted to be done, how it should be done. so its just to get an idea of the whole thing
Third, the critic that i read most from DNF was: "It should play more like Duke3D", i agree in parts, but it just cant be like Duke 3D if it was meant to play like modern games. thats just my statement from my point of view.. hence this is to be a "how WE want it to be" we are free to do whatever WE(community) think is better..
Now, you asked me for the idea, here it is (second my thoughts)
The idea was to bring the hype and feeling of what the trailers gave to us. so it should be a remake of DNF, but on the molds from the trailers, but we are able to freely change the plot as we think is necessary. it should remind so much Duke3D but it should look what Quake2 looked to Doom in terms of evolution. im in favour to bring back the Episodes way, like "Lost Vegas", "Hoover Damned", "EDF Base" (sorry for the worst episode names in history eheh it just a tip) and include too some classic DN3D maps in a separate unlockable episode. it should be fast paced as duke3D was, not very much puzzles, some rare conversations, now were i disagree from the trailer is that i wanted the classic Duke Enemies, not those Ant Mutants nor dr Proton.. he is not so scary..neither looks strong.. Cycloid emperor is the way to go. all classic weapons, golden eagle i like, pistol with scope i dislike."
i Hope you all got my point, it just cant be a complete millimetric imitation from the trailers since it is hard to replicate something than just do in another way. but as i said i have my ideas, about monsters, weapons, story.. but you all have yours so i'd like to hear them so we can make what everyone wants.
About Skills, im more of a programmer, im not the graphics guy.. as a "one man only" project i was hoping to get some models and textures from sites, old games perhaps.. but having a team is more like it.
About the ENGINE, i know unity, i seen a bit of Old Unreal engine, a bit of Quake 2, but im not very experienced in any part... So the idea to, not let you guys down, or keep changing from engine to engine, is to me alone to make a "mock up" in the Desired engine, all by myself, if it looks good, then i call a team to get Sounds/Model/Textures to get it done on a solid base.. dont want to waste time of anyone.
About Graphics, i dont think we can do a "AAA" game looking like with UDK, it takes more time, knowledge and i think its not the point. the idea was to use or Quake 2 or Unreal or Unity (again)... the thing i fear from Unreal and Quake is that they are old engines, and i had problem running urneal tournament on my current pc, speed problems.. so Unity is a Good Option, but well have to make it look "ugly" 1998 style in unity.. Quake 2 and Unreal to you "begin" creating something you have to understand it source code and internal workings, Both engines have very low level stuff that we just dont need to waste time learning how it works.. Unity on the other side can get you going right now... luckily well not need advanced Shadow support nor going to mobile platforms, so the free version should suffice...
Also, by picking 1998 version the maps are relatively simple to make in unity and less time consuming...
i also hope that gearbox dont gives us any trouble.. it doesnt have to recognize it, just let it be a free fan game for fans..
i've made some work on the unity but never finished anything.. i started a wolf3D remake, a 3D online Gallery, and other small things..
i Made this mockup from a real location in just 20 minutes today.. its not big thing really, i know, but if we can get an early stage with some basic scripting so we can start to make models and all, it may work pretty fine.


About eDuke, is just what you said, it would look like a Duke3D Mod and not a game in its own right.

As BloodShot quoted

Quote

The best thing to do IMO would be to make a new game, but with the concepts from the 98 and 01 trailer as inspiration. Maybe have the same features, but don't make "DNF - the 98 version" or "DNF - 2001", use them as building blocks and a jump-off point for ideas. And seriously, get a good project manager if you really want this to happen.

thats the ideia, serve as inspiration, the words that define it is "What we Think Duke Nukem Forever Should Have Been, what we expected".
And thats why im making this poll, and will discuss a lot more so we have a clear vision of what it should be and how it should be done, to avoid lack organization.


Well, this is still just an idea, dont take anything serious yet.. if i can come up with something that can be worked upon, ill bring it here.. if i cant then i will not bother you guys neither take your time.

Thanks for the responses and Opinions

[Micky C]

Well if you're hoping to gather a team, this is probably the wrong place. Despite that fact that this is where a lot of the true Duke fans hang out, most of the modders here only have experience with the Build engine, and the few who are capable of making next (or current) gen assets are already tied up in other things and would probably be unwilling to make yet another commitment.

[Lordareon]

Well.. i can look in some other duke forums.. about modelling is just blender we need really

[Mikko]

This is not gonna happen.

[Lordareon]

well.. maybe after i show the demo some people change idea..

[Mikko]

Well I hope your demo is gonna show more than an empty square room with terrible textures and one light.

[Lordareon]

Mikko_Sandt, on 21 January 2013 - 11:17 AM, said:

Well I hope your demo is gonna show more than an empty square room with terrible textures and one light.

ahahah that was just an example, did you take that seriously? haah, well.. if its going to look like Duke 1998~2003 then the textures have to look alike too..
I already said that im no expert in nothing too

[MusicallyInspired]

Ok. Come back with pictures. Good luck.

[Lordareon]

MusicallyInspired, on 21 January 2013 - 03:26 PM, said:

Ok. Come back with pictures. Good luck.

Thanks.. ill come back with the demo Download

[Gambini]

Lordareon, on 20 January 2013 - 11:28 PM, said:

i Made this mockup from a real location in just 20 minutes today.. its not big thing really, i know, but if we can get an early stage with some basic scripting so we can start to make models and all, it may work pretty fine.

That is brillant. Are you a Pro or something?

[Lordareon]

well... i think i did bad showing that example ¬¬... anyway, here it is, after only one day of work, what i could dig out with unity and some resources on the web and HRP..

Download

And im going to say again im not expert in anything, i havent done a lot of things, the demo is a mockup.

[Lunick]

Lordareon, on 21 January 2013 - 10:32 PM, said:

well... i think i did bad showing that example ¬¬... anyway, here it is, after only one day of work, what i could dig out with unity and some resources on the web and HRP..

Download

And im going to say again im not expert in anything, i havent done a lot of things, the demo is a mockup.

This has potential...

[Lordareon]

i would like opinion from all of you, thanks Lunick

[OpenMaw]

It's very sketchy and rough, obviously, but it's definitely something.

[Lordareon]

Well.. i think that "From Nothing to That" in one day its pretty good.. next step is to make the stadium playable, and other 2 missions from the trailer.. and better polish it
in other topic... which Grabbag you think fits better for the 1998~2001 era to be used in the game?

[Bloodshot]

I know this is only if this actually takes off, but you could possibly get farther with GBX then other projects have since official Duke Nukem stuff has been put on the back burner until they finish more of their current projects. (that is, assuming you could get it out before a new DN game is released)

And of course if they really didn't want you doing it, you could always just keep it within these forums if you still had a desire to create it.

That is of course, only if you manage to get a competent team together and get this off the ground.

[Lordareon]

Bloodshot, on 22 January 2013 - 02:02 PM, said:

I know this is only if this actually takes off, but you could possibly get farther with GBX then other projects have since official Duke Nukem stuff has been put on the back burner until they finish more of their current projects. (that is, assuming you could get it out before a new DN game is released)

And of course if they really didn't want you doing it, you could always just keep it within these forums if you still had a desire to create it.

That is of course, only if you manage to get a competent team together and get this off the ground.

You mean, contacting them to release this or something like?
and about the demo, what you think?

[Bloodshot]

Obviously very rough, but not bad for a proof-of-concept

Well what I meant was typically you would want to get GBX's permission so you don't get shut down with a C&D. If you don't plan on making a well-known release, however, you'd likely be able to get away with a small release on the forums here or something.

[Micky C]

Lordareon, on 21 January 2013 - 10:32 PM, said:

well... i think i did bad showing that example ¬¬... anyway, here it is, after only one day of work, what i could dig out with unity and some resources on the web and HRP..

Download

And im going to say again im not expert in anything, i havent done a lot of things, the demo is a mockup.

Can someone actually show a picture or something of what this is?

Bloodshot, on 22 January 2013 - 02:02 PM, said:

I know this is only if this actually takes off, but you could possibly get farther with GBX then other projects have since official Duke Nukem stuff has been put on the back burner until they finish more of their current projects. (that is, assuming you could get it out before a new DN game is released)

And of course if they really didn't want you doing it, you could always just keep it within these forums if you still had a desire to create it.

That is of course, only if you manage to get a competent team together and get this off the ground.

Do not try to get permission from Gearbox. If you are going to work on this, try and hide from them as much as possible. Even Duke Nukem Reloaded, which had a whole team of people and Gearbox's permission wasn't able to be released. Granted Reloaded had its own share of problems and we don't really know what's behind the scenes, but considering the way Gearbox treated DNF I'd be inclined to believe that they were at least partly responsible, if not mostly.

[Lordareon]

Micky C, on 22 January 2013 - 03:23 PM, said:

Can someone actually show a picture or something of what this is?

its the download of a little proff of concept, very sketchy, its better you download because the images doesnt show everything though

Quote

Do not try to get permission from Gearbox. If you are going to work on this, try and hide from them as much as possible. Even Duke Nukem Reloaded, which had a whole team of people and Gearbox's permission wasn't able to be released. Granted Reloaded had its own share of problems and we don't really know what's behind the scenes, but considering the way Gearbox treated DNF I'd be inclined to believe that they were at least partly responsible, if not mostly.

well.. we can try anyway..

[Sangman]

Don't get me wrong, I'm glad to finally see a project starting up with some effort going into it by the starter, but how exactly is that a proof of concept? Instead of trying to do something with 1998 or 2001 DNF you quickly put together some elements from 1996 Duke3D, which is not at all what you're going for if I read this thread.

[Lordareon]

i tried to remake the stadium level but all i had duke related stuff was slightly higher resolutions of the textures from Duke 3D.. assuming there would be an stadium version on the 1998 Duke i tried to to a little more "updated" stadium to start.. i know it doesnt look like q2 or unreal, the models i found on the net were better than on that time.. changing the textures to a more old feeling will come later on.. that was jsut a mockup