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Disassembly  "Adding New Assembly Language Code To Duke3D"

User is offline   Omni 

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#31

Why does it have to be run through Dosbox?
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User is offline   Falco 

  • -1

#32

View PostNukester10, on Nov 17 2010, 12:45 AM, said:

Omni said,


What i basically want is to have what looks and sounds like the original Dos game,yet
be able to have newer features and run it specifically through Dosbox only.


Tetsuo said,

I don't know what your talking about and yes I do want to use it.


Duke 3D isn't going to sound any different in Windows than it does in DOS, unless you have an AWE32/64, or a REALLY crap MPU401 (ESS Audiodrive)
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User is offline   SwissCm 

  • 36

#33

This thread is pretty hilarious to read. Nukester10's absurd levels of naivety take me back when I was around 6 years old and I thought that I could make a game by painting something in MS Paint and renaming the extension to EXE.

I don't think there is any point in arguing with Nukester10 either, since he also reminds myself of me when I was so stubborn in my ways I couldn't ever let go of an idea I had, even if there was a total lack of evidence that said idea was in any way possible. My logic was infallible and anything contrary to my logic was obviously incorrect.

This post has been edited by SwissCm: 17 November 2010 - 04:40 AM

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User is offline   Tetsuo 

  • 89

#34

View PostNukester10, on Nov 16 2010, 10:45 PM, said:

I don't know what your talking about and yes I do want to use it.


You don't seem to want to use a windows version no matter what. That's what I'm talking about. Like others have said you could just turn off those features you don't want in eDuke32 (like texture filtering) play it at 800x600 at the highest, don't load any HRP and play it that way. That way it would be just like you remember it. Playing it in DOSBOX has much higher requirements than playing it in regular DOS back in the day and if you are wanting to run it in there due to older hardware it'd be more efficient to run eDuke32 with the features dialed back. Most of the additional features seem to be related to enhancement to things like graphics and there doesn't seem to be much you could add that isn't an enhancement like that to vanilla dos duke3d anyway. If you are wanting no changes to Duke3D even things like MP3 support would be undesirable. So what features to add into Vanilla DOS Duke3D would be leftover if you left out all those kind of features? Other stuff like GUI stuff (like the config window that pops up before the game) are moot as well.

@SwissCM: Yeah I realize that too although here I'm not really trying to argue just make an assertion and leave it at that. :blink:

--Tetsuo

It's funny how the colors of the real world only seem really real when you viddy them on the screen. -- Alex Delarge, A Clockwork Orange

This post has been edited by Tetsuo: 17 November 2010 - 05:10 AM

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User is offline   Tetsuo 

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#35

View PostFalco, on Nov 16 2010, 11:30 PM, said:

a REALLY crap MPU401 (ESS Audiodrive)


I used to have one of those on the machine I originally played Duke3D on. :blink: I remember the test app for it that had a deep guys voice saying AUDIODRIVE!

By the way I've come to the realization that imposing what are now artificial limits on old games when better options are available doesn't increase my enjoyment of those games. In other words if I had a computer powerful enough and those options available when those games first came out such as 3D acceleration, MP3 audio and the host of other features that are now available I would have used them. Like for example playing ROTT in DOSBOX at 320x200 just makes it harder to see for me.... some may say that's how it's meant to be played but that was just a limit of the hardware at the time and it's hard to see the detail in the enemies for starters. ROTT considered a 486 CPU to be "fast". :blink:

Also doing bilinear filtering (much less trilinear and anisotropic) in software would have been too demanding on our hardware back then so they always used nearest neighbor filtering. So yeah, it was all due to limitations of the time. I would even assert that when 3D accelerators first came out they where still using the same size of textures as just before and there isn't much difference in how they made them especially since some people chose to play without 3D accelerators and so they still looked at them with nearest neighbor sampling. Like for example Quake with its tiny 8-bit paletted textures... (that game looks great with darkplaces and normal mapped HRP now. :blink:) or even Quake II had not much bigger more detailed textures and 3D accelerators had caught on more by then.

It's just that the first impression of a game becomes a lasting impression for some people and they don't want to see it any differently. But I think differently as you can tell from the above... and again if I had high performance texture filtering available to me when DOOM first came out I would have used it as I always disliked the pixelation of the textures up close and dreamed of the day when it wasn't so back then.

But that's just me and you may feel free to disagree. Different strokes and all that. :huh:

--Tetsuo

It's funny how the colors of the real world only seem really real when you viddy them on the screen. -- Alex Delarge, A Clockwork Orange

This post has been edited by Tetsuo: 17 November 2010 - 05:23 AM

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User is offline   Hendricks266 

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  #36

View PostNukester10, on Nov 16 2010, 11:14 PM, said:

All I simply wanted is to have some of the features and flexibility one normally see's quite often in todays games,yet
sticking with a version of Dos so that I could run it through Dosbox. Also being able to add to the sourcecode,making the original code not necessarily better but bigger later on possibly. I don't want to have to download some 7 or 800MB program with better graphics and fancy map editors,call me Retro.

I'm really a big fan of the original look and sound of the original game,to me THAT'S DUKE NUKEM, one exception though
as far as modernization goes and that would be DUKE NUKEM FOREVER but that's a whole other story.

You are conflating EDuke32 with the HRP. EDuke32 is a 2 MB download. That's right, 2,000 KB. Without the HRP, EDuke32 runs as true to the original game as DOSBox. You also have the issue of DOSBox's imperfect emulation of the Adlib card and 3D games.

View PostNukester10, on Nov 16 2010, 11:14 PM, said:

In case your wondering what features offhand I'm talking about I can only think of a very few at the moment.
Adding your own sound effects would be one.Placing one window over another would be nice also,
maybe even adding models to Dosbuild might be interesting,from what I understand you already can
do this with JFDuke but Dosbox doesn't support JFDuke so once again a dilemma stands.

Where to start...
The original, original Duke 3D supports adding sound effects.
What do you mean by "Placing one window over another"? Multiple instances? You can do that if you run multiple copies of DOSBox.
EDuke32 is a superset of JFDuke3D.
You could not add polygonal models to DOS Duke without porting over one of the 3D OpenGL renderers. OpenGL is not supported under DOS.
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User is offline   CruX 

  • 691

#37

View PostNukester10, on Nov 16 2010, 09:14 PM, said:

All I simply wanted is to have some of the features and flexibility one normally see's quite often in todays games,yet
sticking with a version of Dos so that I could run it through Dosbox. Also being able to add to the sourcecode,making the original code not necessarily better but bigger later on possibly. I don't want to have to download some 7 or 800MB program with better graphics and fancy map editors,call me Retro.

I'm really a big fan of the original look and sound of the original game,to me THAT'S DUKE NUKEM, one exception though
as far as modernization goes and that would be DUKE NUKEM FOREVER but that's a whole other story.

In case your wondering what features offhand I'm talking about I can only think of a very few at the moment.
Adding your own sound effects would be one.Placing one window over another would be nice also,
maybe even adding models to Dosbuild might be interesting,from what I understand you already can
do this with JFDuke but Dosbox doesn't support JFDuke so once again a dilemma stands.


Just based on the two things I've bolded, it's hard to imagine you've even played DN3D with eDuke, let alone opened a CON file. :blink:

rebel without a cause or effect
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User is offline   DavoX 

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#38

View PostHendricks266, on Nov 17 2010, 02:09 PM, said:

What do you mean by "Placing one window over another"? Multiple instances? You can do that if you run multiple copies of DOSBox.


Nah, he probably means Room over room.
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User is offline   Nukester10 

  • 95

#39

Ok, I got eduke32!

Sorry,If I had everybody going for a minute,I tried this program last year and I couldn't get it going.
Now I understand why,I didn't purchase the disk until this year,last year I was using a Megaupload
version which obviously didn't include all the files needed even so with limited files it ran through Dosbox just fine.

Did I like eduke32 in comparison?

All I can say is Wow,it's like this is what they where shooting for when the game first came out.
After moving my Duke files from Dosbox and placing them in eduke32,I clicked on the eduke32 exe.
At first I thought I still didn't have it setup right but actually noticed that it takes about 20 to 30 seconds
for the gui to pop up,I'm wondering if that's a normal start time for everyone else?Mapster32 seems to
load pretty fast,about 5 seconds.

I noticed too that there wasn't an install file,so if I want to get to either pretty quick,I can't go Start>Programs>eduke32,
but that's not important,I could just place a shortcut from both eduke32 and mapster32 on my desktop,problem solved.

After being used to playing Duke3D in Dosbox 640x480 for so long I set this up the same way.
Just starting it up,

Options?

Do you want to play off of the exe file or other?
I ticked that I wanted to play off of the origional exe file.

Open Glide?
Nope,I ticked the other option which I think is Direct Draw but I'm not sure.

I started to play the E1L1 Map,the sound and 8 bit looking graphics I noticed right away where much better more crispyer,
but what amazed me the most was the speed at which you could move even while monsters where
poppin up all over the place and explosions where happening all around you and yet the framerate stayed consistent the whole time.

I then checked out mapster32,again amazing,the first thing I thought was that editing should be a breeze under this
environment.I also had previous problems copying and pasting sectors to the point where I just gave up and recreated them one at a time.I'm hoping I won't have to go through this now again,my guess is I won't.I've been wanting to create a Phantasm Mod for a few years now but I stopped that project after
I found out that I couldn't even add my own sounds.If not a Phantasm Mod,maybe I'll come up with something new,for everybody to check out.Can you add your own sounds? Can you import models?
If so,what program would be compatible to create your models in?
These are just some of the questions I have,if you know the answers please let me in on it?
Here's my reply to what I was talking about earlier,

DavoX said,

Quote

What do you mean by "Placing one window over another"? Multiple instances? You can do that if you run multiple copies of DOSBox.


No,what I was talking about is try to make a doorway and then create another doorway/window on top of that it can't be
done.....right? Now can you do this in mapster32 anyone,cause I'd really like to see how that's done?

I really feel now like I want to play the whole game over again and I probably will,Thanks all for the help,it's like it's a new game!

This post has been edited by Nukester10: 17 November 2010 - 08:21 PM

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User is offline   CruX 

  • 691

#40

View PostNukester10, on Nov 17 2010, 08:11 PM, said:

Can you add your own sounds? Can you import models?


Yes, you can do all of this and way, way more with eDuke. Check out the modifications discussion forum to get an idea.

rebel without a cause or effect
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User is offline   Hendricks266 

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  #41

I'm glad you understand now. :P

View PostNukester10, on Nov 17 2010, 10:11 PM, said:

No,what I was talking about is try to make a doorway and then create another doorway/window on top of that it can't be
done.....right? Now can you do this in mapster32 anyone,cause I'd really like to see how that's done?

This is called room over room (ROR) and is being worked on for EDuke32. It is currently functional in the classic and Polymost renderers.
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User is offline   DavoX 

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#42

Hey Nukester10, check this video to see what can be done with Eduke32:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wmq5m4Y__Ro...feature=related
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