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What are you working on for Duke right now?  "Post about whatever Duke related stuff you're doing"

User is offline   brullov 

  • BAZINGA!

#9931

Ninety-Six is right, it's a server room. But to be honest, it's not a fair screenshot, I took full liberty here because the original level has no plot in this place. It's not Freeway or Rabit Transit, Death Row is the closest guess in terms of the genre.
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User is online   Ninety-Six 

#9932

View Postbrullov, on 22 August 2021 - 03:46 AM, said:

Ninety-Six is right, it's a server room. But to be honest, it's not a fair screenshot, I took full liberty here because the original level has no plot in this place. It's not Freeway or Rabit Transit, Death Row is the closest guess in terms of the genre.


I did guess Pigsty.
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User is offline   ck3D 

#9933

Speaking of Freeway, here are a few full visibility screenshots of the map for Project: A.W.O.L. I've been working on, which is a humble, indirect nod to that level - just more straightforward in terms of layout and bigger to match the action-heavy, enhanced AI-based, mission-oriented style. Don't get too attached to the .art as all those textures I've been using I was just told were in fact placeholders the whole time, and so I'm actually in the process of fixing the picnums of 14000 walls and 8000 sprites right now (thank you Mapster32 lords for Alt + C which actually makes that quite fun, especially since the new .art is much better than what's on display here and so while that's still a lot of stuff to double check manually, it still feels like enhancing the level). Otherwise besides that, one or two small sections I have yet to build and the gameplay that I still need to implement then the map is pretty much done, but the skin of the final product will look very different from this, therefore those screenshots are also for posterity.

Attached thumbnail(s)

  • Attached Image: awol002.png
  • Attached Image: awol003.png
  • Attached Image: awol004.png


This post has been edited by ck3D: 22 August 2021 - 06:31 PM

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#9934

Was going to wait for the DLC to come out before coming back to Ion Fury
but why wait I guess
Attached Image: capt0000.png
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User is online   Graphics 

#9935

I'm just porting an old map over to Ion Fury. So far this is what it looks like.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/309341856729268228/881732987580985385/duke0000.png

I love how this game has code for slowing down when going up hills. Very cool stuff.
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User is offline   ck3D 

#9936

^ Nice terrain work there - looking forward to seeing how it looks like once the shading is in place and the scenery has the extra depth. Did this used to be an unreleased Duke 3D map or what's the story?
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#9937

yeah I wonder if there are any tricks
Or just careful use of slops
It really dose looks like HL2 terrain or something
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User is offline   ck3D 

#9938

^ Probably 'just' careful use of slopes, which is no feat to downplay in fact. But if you want to experiment with such terrain mapping yourself, then the sector grid technique I've described on here before (coupled with knowledge of the Mapster32 shortcut for perfect slopes) I'd say is a good first step towards achieving this kind of perfect geometry, since it's all about establishing regularly structured player space you can then try and distort to your liking (and the one of mathematics).

This post has been edited by ck3D: 29 August 2021 - 10:37 PM

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#9939

I can respect how seamless it looks
Not a spiked edge in sight
Attached Image: capt0003.png
Attached Image: capt0004.png
Oh and having to delete large parts of your levels is always a joy :wallbash:

This post has been edited by Truck Stop Santa Claus: 30 August 2021 - 03:45 PM

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User is online   Graphics 

#9940

"Did this used to be an unreleased Duke 3D map or what's the story?"
Just an unreleased map that shows high sloping hills. My new method is better.

"yeah I wonder if there are any tricks. Or just careful use of slops"
Yes there is. I create each possible angle in 3x(10x10) sector. Then copy and paste.

[Currently Working On]
Just finished porting the duke map Mars over to Ion Fury. I kind of prefer my new way of making landscapes over my old. Yeah the old hills map has high angles at a 5x slopes and it looks nice... But no diversity in design. This is more dynamic. Besides, I'm making taller slopes for the new method as I write this.
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/309341856729268228/882047630102888448/duke0001.png

This post has been edited by Graphics: 30 August 2021 - 04:01 PM

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#9941

yeah would great for some serious sam style mayhem
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User is offline   MC84 

#9942

View PostGraphics, on 30 August 2021 - 03:55 PM, said:


"yeah I wonder if there are any tricks. Or just careful use of slops"
Yes there is. I create each possible angle in 3x(10x10) sector. Then copy and paste.


It's rare to see such natural looking terrain in build. Would be cool if you did a tutorial/write up sometime.
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User is online   Graphics 

#9943

"yeah would great for some serious sam style mayhem"
That's kind of what I did. Only it's also an 8 to 16 player co-op or deathmatch.

"It's rare to see such natural looking terrain in build. Would be cool if you did a tutorial/write up sometime."
I'm planning on explaining how I did it with a map that makes it easy for other mappers.

[Current Update]
The map now has enemies and one mission... Defeat the boss in the middle of the map. It's co-op and deathmatch ready.
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/309341856729268228/882159420396670996/duke0000.png
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User is offline   jimbob 

#9944

i like that natural looking terrain :)

still working on my mod, crushing bugs, adding new features wich in turn create new bugs to crush. so for now, crates!
and some TROR, the single best thing to happen to build since build itself.


thinking of adding some new enemies, probably some plain clothed gestapo, maybe a few scientists neutrals to add some live to it aswell. might do some civillian AI aswell at one point. i just need to stop adding too much and release the first episode already :o just two bugs that potentially break the game need to be fixed before i fling it out there. but those are top priority.

Attached thumbnail(s)

  • Attached Image: duke0000.png
  • Attached Image: duke0002.png
  • Attached Image: duke0003.png

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User is online   Graphics 

#9945

"i like that natural looking terrain :)"
Thank you. Also your mod is looking good. Looking forward to trying it out.
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User is online   MusicallyInspired 

  • The Sarien Encounter

#9946

Major Goldeneye vibes.
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User is offline   ck3D 

#9947

View PostMC84, on 30 August 2021 - 08:55 PM, said:

Would be cool if you did a tutorial/write up sometime.


I suspect it would start off as similar to mine here: https://www.moddb.co...pping-technique you'd just need to make some of the blocks different slopes that are compatible with each other (including angles) and then copy-paste and assemble everything (including on the vertical axis with floor elevations, but that's quick). In that tutorial I don't really go in-depth about terrain mapping in particular (maybe I kind of indirectly bring it up on a micro scale when talking about cliffs), but that's the basic concept and one of the many possible extensions and applications of the 'sector grid' approach. As a complement, you could also look up quakis' guide on drawing perfect circles in Build for extra geometry theory.

This post has been edited by ck3D: 31 August 2021 - 11:16 PM

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User is online   Graphics 

#9948

"https://www.moddb.co...pping-technique"
It looks cool. But no... I make something like Lago Parts. Now each part has a side with a color representing how high it is. I then line up all the angles. So there are no walls to be seen. This takes a little math for creating the Lego Parts. For example and this is an easy one. One side is 4x high (left). The other sides 2x (top) 2x (right) high with a flat base (bottom). Where would you put the first vector to make an evenly balanced line that hides the walls?... It's the upper right to the middle of the left... Can you tell me where the second vector goes? If you can tell me. Let's work together. Because this is a lot of work.

This post has been edited by Graphics: 31 August 2021 - 11:35 PM

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User is offline   ck3D 

#9949

Honestly I'm having a hard time just visualizing your description and am too short on time for math problems right now, but I've found a link to quakis' tutorial for geometry that I was talking about earlier: https://forums.duke4...710#entry276710 I suspect you're already familiar with a lot of those principles already as your geometry already is perfectly smooth but whenever in doubt then that's always a good possible reference.

Color coding the different heights is smart, indeed that sort of confirms that we're doing it differently as I never really had to do that since besides the actual 3D shaping/sloping of the sectors, I really mostly use 2D mode even when the time comes to actually assemble the sectors and so I never exactly *needed* 3D mode visual landmarks. I just make all the different bits of terrain self-contained in squares (with as few splits on the side walls as possible, ideally none, so that they can all easily match) with compatibility with each other in mind and then copy/paste/flip/mirror etc. them en masse and assemble the patches in a way that makes sense to me. There are Mapster32 features to subtly rotate sectors that exist, too, but I never use them since that would mess up my attempt at compatibility in between all the squares.

In fact I may have some screenshots of my process of making a basic mountain somewhere on my PC (that I took in case my other tutorial would need a follow-up, and also as I was just figuring out my technique myself, so it's not perfect). I'll try to remember to grab and post them the next time I get to access it, with no pretension of them being examples but just means to better convey the gist of what I mean and my personal approach.

This post has been edited by ck3D: 01 September 2021 - 01:50 AM

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User is online   Graphics 

#9950

For a math problem it's rather easy. It's 4 divided by 2 equals 2. Meaning, you make even vectors at +2. I wish I could give you a visual add. Because your right, the description is hard to visualize. The work you do looks great and I'll check out the link from the other mapper. It doesn't hurt to learn new things. After all, for the longest time I couldn't even do TROR until someone explained it too me.

This post has been edited by Graphics: 01 September 2021 - 07:08 AM

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User is offline   ck3D 

#9951

I wouldn't feel so bad for sleeping on TROR, perhaps it's my mistake for sticking to my DOS Duke 3D/Build roots but I still see it as a relative novelty, done right it can really enhance Build mapping but that's a step I have yet to take myself and a lot of other active mappers actually, you might be surprised by how much it really isn't a staple. I've been meaning to find the time to learn it for a minute now, mainly so that I can take part in this: https://forums.duke4...or-cbp-rpoject/ which may interest you by the way if you've missed it.

I'm just glad to see more people approaching Build mapping on a bigger scale than they traditionally would these days, there is something about composing a large open landscape in sandbox type of settings that's a refreshing kind of enjoyable vs. micromanaging tiny detail and individual rooms and corridors where player movement is mostly constricted, when it's actually so good (and fast) in Build games and just waiting for the next opportunity to be exploited. The vertical axis is also one that is (or used to be) commonly slept on, so mountains always look fresh, I do feel like sometimes though it's also good to break down the monotony in the terrain and not make it all so consistent so that you also have abrupt vertical cliffs and some platforming in addition to the otherwise smooth looks, forcing the player to use the jump key on occasion and not just rely on slopes for elevation.

I'm putting some thought into this because I think judging from what you've shown, you already have the basis to make a great full-length single player level with little effort left compared to what you've already thrown in, I think this style would deserve more than a showcase kind of boss map and could easily be turned into a more memorable experience even just gameplay-wise. I'm not sure how many resources this piece of terrain is consuming already, but that's a whole batch you could easily clone and flip and reassemble ad infinitum (theoretically) to expand the terrain even further (but I wouldn't really recommend that - there seems to be a persisting limit to how much ground Build maps can have on display without generating visual errors and sector glitches), or copy-paste and turn into an alternate dimension or version of the same area to then use ROR tricks on really easily, or maybe you could add some breaks and gaps and play with sector elevation in bulk here and there to turn certain areas into separate (floating?) islands; or without even recycling anything, just adding a few key locations to the layout (that would especially be visible and recognizable from distance, I'd recommend using unique palettes) that the player would have to visit in order to trigger the boss fight should be easy enough to implement as well. Anyhow I just feel like your map in its current state could be repurposed in many interesting ways and it may be interesting to consider it a template of sorts; I could easily see someone make a whole episode out of derivations of this existing design.

Also, the reason why I'm pressing the 'sector grid' technique that much is I really believe approaching level design with coordinates and easily manipulable bulks of sectors (instead of intricate micro design) like that really has the potential to be the next step in Build mapping, it just makes the process so much easier in many aspects. My tutorial only goes that far in-depth, myself I was just figuring out its perks as I was writing it and now months later I'm still realizing new ones. Originally I found out about its usefulness when copy-pasting and assembling a bunch of square water sectors to form a big ocean around a level instead of drawing one huge sector that would most likely generate problems within the map (Build doesn't handle those well). Spontaneously I started expanding that habit to terrain design and including all kinds of patterns within the copied sectors and now mapping for me has basically turned into designing then assembling jigsaws, that combined with all the bulk manipulation tools and various shortcuts Mapster32 now offers has been enough to shrink my average time spent on designing one Duke 3D level from roughly three months to roughly two weeks. Basically I think for efficiency it's always good to remember that whatever it is you design also becomes a potential resource to recycle and repurpose and expand on, and I feel like the way you construct terrain would lend itself to such use very easily.

Following the same logic, I think there's a Mapster32 script or command that basically turns your level upside down too, like it inverts all the Z coordinates and attributes (not too sure there as I never used it myself). Apply that to your design here and boom you have the skeleton for a jungle- or cave-themed level, just add tree trunks and walls for structure. Or you could have both versions of the design as ROR connected with silent teleporters or over/underwater (the structure would already be in place), or just imagine the same irregularities (maybe with different values) on both the ground and ceiling, perhaps with some sections parallaxed, some not. Just trying to highlight how it's a rather precious structure you've got there, tons of possibilities you've (quite literally) laid out the groundwork for for yourself.

This post has been edited by ck3D: 01 September 2021 - 01:43 PM

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User is online   Graphics 

#9952

I'm still reading what you wrote. As I skim through it you mention some ideas. Here are the things I can do and haven't gotten around to making. An island, using the earthquake physics that collapses to the ground/water or pops up out of the ground/water. A floating island with curves all over it. If I knew that command to flip everything upside down. I would be able to make that, fast. Now here's something I've worked on and tested on eDuke with the help of our websites Discord. A very small island with curves and see through swimmable water around it.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/309341856729268228/882754294716198943/duke0014.png

After I'm done carefully reading what you're saying. I'm going to come back with a more informative reply.

This post has been edited by Graphics: 01 September 2021 - 03:10 PM

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User is offline   ck3D 

#9953

^ This screenshot and concept for the first idea are looking/sounding great and very unique. I love that what you're making is not just static environment and actually evolutive. So many levels out there with structure in place that could easily be applied interactivity to, even with basic floor rise/ceiling fall SE's and some creativity to come up with the appropriate action scenes, it's really cool to hear that you're also thinking in terms of effects and not just immobile designs. Technically all of that must be quite tricky to get to work and look just right, too.

About the command to flip maps upside down, I really couldn't tell you just like that, but it should be documented somewhere in the eDuke32/Mapster32 Wiki if not in the Duke4.net Infosuite. Otherwise using search functions on this forum should do it.

This post has been edited by ck3D: 01 September 2021 - 03:30 PM

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#9954

WGFang2

Attached thumbnail(s)

  • Attached Image: capt0005.png
  • Attached Image: capt0004.png


This post has been edited by William Gee: 02 September 2021 - 02:33 AM

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User is offline   ck3D 

#9955

Wow you managed to top the uniqueness of the aesthetics of the first one... Somehow! Super into all your plays on reds and greens in your recent levels. This is looking fantastic, I'm so glad you're making Duke maps again.

This post has been edited by ck3D: 02 September 2021 - 04:29 AM

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User is offline   Seb Luca 

#9956

@William Gee : really impressive ! GG °0°


_____________________


One other form MTK :

http://www.sebluca.com/LETUEUR/projet2/danslegout.png



This post has been edited by Seb Luca: 02 September 2021 - 10:54 AM

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User is online   Graphics 

#9957

Just finished creating a basic tutorial on creating Landscape Terrain. Here's a link if anyone wants to check it out.

https://www.moddb.co...ape-terrain-v01

PS : Would it be okay if I made the same tutorial on the eDuke forums as well?
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User is online   Graphics 

#9958

Also forgot to mention... William Gee, your maps are awesome as always. Seb Luca, I love the lighting and the curved room with the slopes on the roof. That's very cool looking map you've got there.

This post has been edited by Graphics: 02 September 2021 - 02:57 PM

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User is offline   Seb Luca 

#9959

Thanks :) still GG for your island !

This post has been edited by Seb Luca: 03 September 2021 - 12:20 AM

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User is offline   Reaper_Man 

  • Once and Future King

#9960

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/ClosedShinyArrowcrab-size_restricted.gif

Enjoy this terrible gif of AWOL's current progress, which you can click for a much better gameplay video (don't forget to turn on the sound!) since I can't figure out a way to embed a gfycat link directly
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