[Arjak]

After a couple evenings of play, I have finished Lunar Apocalypse!

In short: It was decent. Well made, but mostly felt very generic compared to L.A. Meltdown. If it weren't for some of the unique level interactivity, I felt like it could have been from any FPS of the time. Not much really stood out to me.

Some random thoughts:

-I had a lot of fun roaming the ducts of Tiberius Station.

-F*ck Lunar Reactor. It was long, hard, and I got so lost exploring a secret area that I almost ran out of Jetpack fuel and couldn't get back. Then I realized I had the key needed to progress all along.

-I liked the train gimmick of Dark Side. It added a dash of flavor to what could've been just another level. The arena in the crater with all the Sentry Drones was pretty obnoxious, though. At least it made for a nice backdrop for my rematch with the Battlelord.

-I was disappointed that the Spacesuits weren't an item like the boots or scuba gear.

-Using the monolith from 2001 was a cute touch.

-The Overlord boss was obnoxious with his spamming of rockets that could kill you in one direct hit, but good use of the Devastator, RPG launcher, and circle-strafing saved the day!

-After slogging through this episode, the ending cutscene gave me a needed good laugh. Then a few minutes later, I laughed again when I realized that Duke was just fulfilling his promise to the Overlord! I have never seen someone, character or otherwise, actually follow through with that threat before!

Next stop: Shrapnel City! It should be fun and refreshing to come back down to Earth, so to speak.

Also, I picked up a copy of Duke it Out in D.C. off eBay, and I just ordered Nuclear Winter as well.

On the subject of the expansions, I was able to find a good copy of D.C. (with the manual and disc in a case in good condition) quite easily, and for very cheap. Finding Nuclear Winter in the same condition was a little harder (and more expensive), but for some reason, I cannot for the life of me locate a good copy of Caribbean that's more than disc only for a reasonable price. Is it more rare? Or is it just that no one is selling their copy because it's the fan favorite of the three?

[Ninety-Six]

Arjak, on 30 August 2019 - 08:05 PM, said:

-I was disappointed that the Spacesuits weren't an item like the boots or scuba gear.

Fun fact: they originally were

[NightFright]

It is safe to assume that in that chamber before the airlock leading to the outdoor area in Dark Side, you were supposed to get one of the space suits to be able to breathe outside. However they changed it so a forcefield made the atmosphere breathable. I guess they thought the space suit is limiting your movement too much, but TBH I don't know exactly why it was cut from the game. There are mods out there which make it work, though. I would have loved to see zero-g areas in the original space episode, but it wasn't meant to be.

Lunar Apocalypse may be a mixed episode with some really hairy situations, but I like it since it's a deviation from the other city episodes with a calmer atmosphere, brilliantly supported by the soundtrack.

[axl]

NightFright, on 31 August 2019 - 07:11 AM, said:

Lunar Apocalypse may be a mixed episode with some really hairy situations, but I like it since it's a deviation from the other city episodes with a calmer atmosphere, brilliantly supported by the soundtrack.

Agreed. I love the concept of Duke kickin' some ass in space and then returning to earth to finish the job there. Level variety is one of the best things about Duke Nukem 3D.

[Arjak]

No, I'm not waiting for Christmas. I've just had a busy couple of weeks and been doing other things. I am back though, and I'm going to start Episode 3 tonight. See you soon!

[Arjak]

Well, that was quick. Shrapnel City has been cleared!

-I liked the concepts of a lot of the levels, but unfortunately, they were usually over so fast that they didn't have an opportunity to really sizzle. Compared to the first couple of episodes, this one felt really short. I was repeatedly shocked by finding the exit to several levels at a point that felt really odd, like the level ended right when it should've been ramping up.

-I got a good laugh out of Duke butchering Born to be Wild. That was the highlight for me.

-I'm really starting to hate those guys who fly around and shoot rockets at you.

-OK, seriously. Why do the Drones make the same sound as the Imps from Doom!? I swear it's almost identical.

-I was really excited to fight the boss in the stadium, but then I killed him in about 10 seconds with my Devastator on my third try. I actually beat the 3D Realms time! Talk about an anticlimax! At least Duke made the field goal afterward, but the complete lack of an ending was a huge disappointment. I know it's a '90s FPS, but even Wolfenstein 3D and Doom gave you a little bit of a wrap-up, even if it was just a screen of text. Heck, Episodes 1 and 2 of this game did that! Why did Episode 3 just end abruptly with a title card!? Talk about lazy!

Despite my gripes, I'm still having a lot of fun. I will join you all soon for the expansion episode, The Birth!

[NightFright]

I am curious about your opinion regarding ep.4. The Pig Cop Tank and Protector Drone are two quite annoying enemies. If you didn't like the Assault Commanders, you'll hate those two with passion, I'm afraid...

Oh, and it should be noted that the maps in "The Birth" are mostly entries that hadn't made the cut for the original release of the game, so it's kinda "second grade" quality. Sometimes it really shows, weird stuff is happening and you don't quite know why. That's why for me ep.4 is a bit "mysterious".

[NNC]

Duke definitely needed some mid-tier enemies like those though. There were the bosses with like 4000 HP, the mini-Battlelord and his lethal chaingun with 1000 HP, and the only midtier was the Commander, the rest were all below 200 HP. I think Doom did the balance better. It had fast shooter, spread shooter, homing missile shooter, flying shooter, various types of hitscanners, healer, etc. Duke tried to follow this system, but it was too inconsistent. There were no enemies in v1.3D which were easier than Battlelord, but harder than anyone else. The tank and the newbeast were made directly to fill this void. I think they made a mistake of not using mini-Overlord and mini-Cyclops with friendlier rockets in the game. Both should have been fine mid-tier enemies.

[NightFright]

The only thing World Tour did right (regarding mini bosses). Unfortunately, the boss there was a complete fail.

[Arjak]

I see an unusual amount of hate for World Tour. In my experience, when a new expansion is released for a beloved classic, it is usually embraced by the community, thankful for their favorite game getting some love long after its time.

Would someone please explain to me why World Tour is so detested?

[Putrid Pete]

Arjak, on 21 September 2019 - 05:05 PM, said:

I see an unusual amount of hate for World Tour. In my experience, when a new expansion is released for a beloved classic, it is usually embraced by the community, thankful for their favorite game getting some love long after its time.

Would someone please explain to me why World Tour is so detested?

Like yourself, I came to Duke late, in 2013 when I was 23. I was introduced to Duke and all three expansions of it thanks to the Megaton Edition, which conveniently bundled them together. It was a great way of starting to play the Duke franchise with a fantastic price tag (I think it was 10 bucks if my memory serves correctly) but after years passed, it was getting kind of outdated. If you've ever played Shadow Warrior Classic Redux, it was the same deal: it required some tweaks to work correctly. But still, for the price and convenience of having all that Duke content it was great, and you always had EDuke32 as an alternative to running the game. When the 20th Anniversary Edition was introduced, the Megaton edition got the axe from Steam, and the Atomic Edition over at GOG was removed from sale as well. This edition was more costly at 20 dollars, it featured no discount for owners of previous versions of Duke 3D and it included none of the expansions.

You can already sort of guess why people aren't too fond of this edition. However, there was a saving grace: it advertised a brand new episode as a way to get people to purchase it. It even involved some of the original designers for Duke. It seems like a justifiable purchase now just to try that out. So that's all well and good, but the issue was that the episode was decent, yet nothing mind blowing. Couple that with the fact that when the 20th Anniversary edition came out, it had several audio issues and other problems that made it seem... inferior in quality. I mean sure, it added enhanced graphics and what not, but it wasn't that far out from what EDuke32 already did (and does) for free. Like LGR said in his review, the edition wasn't bad, but Duke deserved better. And of course, Gearbox isn't well liked by Duke3D enthusiasts for putting the franchise out to pasture and so it's no surprise the reception of the entry was a bit mixed, at least by dedicated fans.

As for the episode itself? I thought it was fun and well designed, but it had some flaws. The new weapon didn't blew me away, and the boss battle at the end is a complete joke. The new enemy introduced has an interesting combat mechanic but it doesn't really amount to much and once you find out how to deal with it... well, it just looses its shine. It is by no means terrible. It isn't even half bad. I've only played the episode maybe 2 or 3 times, and every single time I had fun overall, but I always feel disappointed by the lame final boss. Should you play it? Absolutely. There are some fine levels in there. It feels 'Duke' enough and it has more of what you'd expect from a new episode. That said it's nothing groundbreaking and I don't see it personally as a 100% mandatory experience for every gamer.

[Sledgehammer]

Arjak, on 21 September 2019 - 05:05 PM, said:

Would someone please explain to me why World Tour is so detested?

If you've got time and very interested about people experience, check this thread. It has everything you need, good expectations, disappointment and other stuff.

[pacman]

lets roock
daamn, those alien bastards are shooting up my riiide *boom*

[NightFright]

WT levels themselves are OK, but the whole edition has Randy's handwriting all over it. The idiotic ending screen for example which is so childish and anticlimactic only Randy could have come up with it. Gearbox also barely managed to issue ONE single update for the game which didn't fix everything, not by a long shot. Then there's JSJ's vocal performance for the highres Duke speech which just doesn't equal the quality of the original vocs. It sounds as if they recorded all files in a single take and sent him home afterwards.

Most of the maps and ALL of Lee's music are fine and for that alone it's worth getting. The new weapon, the Firefly Trooper and that joke of a boss... meh. It's also not really an episode, rather a series of maps in different locations, but without any coherence, transition or meaning. Like a level compilation or something.

At the end of the day it's not the same quality as the original episodes. Sure, Blum and Levelord made those maps, but that alone couldn't bring back the spirit of the game.

[Arjak]

Thanks for the explanations, everyone!

Well, I was hoping to get started on Episode 4 this evening, but it has come to my attention that the latest builds of EDuke32 have a serious bug that greatly affects the playability of one of the levels, so unfortunately, I can't really play it without downloading an old version, and well, I don't wanna.

When the bug is fixed, I will definitely come get some in The Birth!

Or maybe I'll just get bored waiting for the fix and give it a try with the latest version. Whichever comes first.

[NNC]

I think the incinerator is good, and I was happy they reintroduced it after dropping it from the final version. It could have been much more polished, but it's still good.

The episode convinced me Allen H Blum III is still the king of the Build Engine, too bad he is not as dedicated to Duke 3D like Romero is to Doom.

[pacman]

Arjak, on 22 September 2019 - 05:13 PM, said:

Thanks for the explanations, everyone!

Well, I was hoping to get started on Episode 4 this evening, but it has come to my attention that the latest builds of EDuke32 have a serious bug that greatly affects the playability of one of the levels, so unfortunately, I can't really play it without downloading an old version, and well, I don't wanna.

When the bug is fixed, I will definitely come get some in The Birth!

Or maybe I'll just get bored waiting for the fix and give it a try with the latest version. Whichever comes first.

which bug

i finished episode 4 with eduke32 no problems

[NightFright]

It seems there is a problem with an underwater area in E4L4. Diving in the D-Cup Ride room apparently kills you. I haven't tried it yet by myself with latest EDuke32 builds.

[Arjak]

I apologise for the lack of updates. I have had a lot going on, including getting a new job, and my computer becoming practically unusable due to constant crashes. I will hopefully have a new computer up and running soon, and I will definitely try to play The Birth as soon as things settle down. Thank you for your patience.

[Arjak]

OK! I got a new computer last month, and I finally sat down to play The Birth today.

Unfortunately, I've run into a problem. I'm on Duke Burger, and I cannot for the life of me figure out how to get inside. I can't find the blue keycard, all of the doors are locked, and the garage shutter only rises up a couple inches when I activate the switch. I've tried going through windows, blowing up suspicious walls, jumping onto a nearby building, throwing a pipe bomb under the cracked garage shutter, and nothing is working. What am I supposed to do?

[axl]

Arjak, on 20 January 2020 - 10:27 AM, said:

OK! I got a new computer last month, and I finally sat down to play The Birth today.

Unfortunately, I've run into a problem. I'm on Duke Burger, and I cannot for the life of me figure out how to get inside. I can't find the blue keycard, all of the doors are locked, and the garage shutter only rises up a couple inches when I activate the switch. I've tried going through windows, blowing up suspicious walls, jumping onto a nearby building, throwing a pipe bomb under the cracked garage shutter, and nothing is working. What am I supposed to do?

Go to the Duke Nukem Sign where you can order food and press use on the "order here" sign. A small door opposite the sign will open up, revealing the blue key.

Btw: in case in you need further help : http://legacy.3dreal...3d/walkthrough/

[Fauch]

Didn't know episode 4's maps were maps that didn't make the cut to the original game, they are fine overall (except Critical Mass which is dickish. oh and Impossible too, but it's a more fun level)
Duke's burger is rather fun, though maybe that key was a problem. Don't remember if I had trouble with it the first time, it's too long ago.
I had massive FPS drops the last time I played Babe Land in world tour edition in the big room near the end. I don't remember if the original game had this issue, I don't remember it running like a slideshow (I mean FPS in the single digits). It seems world tour edition may have some performance issues, especially in true 3D, I sometimes switch back to 2.5D because I get some freezes.

[The Nate]

I was aware Derelict was based on a map from LameDuke, but not the others.

[Jimmy]

It's not so much that they were explicitly "cut" but more that they always intended to release an expansion pack, so some levels/enemies/weapons/features were held back for later. Development of Duke3D didn't really stop until after the Plutonium Pak was officially released.

[Arjak]

OK, after way too long of a break, I'm back to finish Episode 4. I'm about halfway through, I think. I'm in the middle of Babe Land, but I wanted to get some thoughts down before I head to bed.

-That opening cutscene. JESUS.

-I got a good laugh the first time I tried activating an electrical socket.

-Those laser tripbombs in the vent you jump inside in the janitor's closet are a dick move. Thank God for pipe bombs.

-Before I forget, thank you, Axl, for the hint for Duke Burger. I still don't know why I didn't mess with that sign the first time.

-I really liked the puzzle where you have to bounce a Shrinker shot off the mirror to go through the hole.

-I was shocked into appalled laughter when I realized what that burger meat was.

-Scrappy Due was the only dog left alive. I'm sure there's some kind of irony there.

-F**k. Those. Tanks.

-The Protector Drones are a cool new enemy. At first, I hated them because of their powerful melee attacks, acid blood, and general resilience, but they've started to grow on me a little.

-Shop-N-Bag was a fun map. After a while though, the shopping muzak started to drive me insane. Finally, in a moment of desperation, I spotted a small speaker on the ceiling and shot it, and it actually worked! So satisfying! The only part I hated was the end puzzle with the garbage compactor.

-The mascot of Babe Land is even worse than the muzak! I won't lie, I tried kicking it between the legs in a vain effort to make it shut up!



I have to admit, maybe it's just because I took a long break, but I'm really enjoying this episode! Every level has been interesting and unique, and I love the variety of themes and locations. I'll definitely try to finish the episode soon. Until then!

[Jimmy]

Tank pro-tip: Try activating the nuke symbol on its back.

[Phredreeke]

Nuclear winter pro-tip: even though the snowman tanks don't have nuke symbols on their backs (unless you play a mod) you can still blow them up that way

[MrFlibble]

Arjak, on 27 May 2020 - 09:03 PM, said:

I have to admit, maybe it's just because I took a long break, but I'm really enjoying this episode! Every level has been interesting and unique, and I love the variety of themes and locations. I'll definitely try to finish the episode soon. Until then!

I too like the Atomic episode, perhaps more than the previous two. I had Duke3D v1.3d for a very long time before getting the expansion, and the levels felt really fresh and nice, and still very much 1996 Duke at the core. However, Derelict is not my favourite level in the pack, and from what I remember, the power station level (also based on a map found in LameDuke IIRC) was rather unremarkable. I haven't played the episode in a long while though. Babe Land felt cramped to me, the idea in itself is good but I think the tech limitations of the time prevented from exploring its full potential as a Duke map.

BTW, any suggestions for a good usermap with the amusement park theme?

[ck3D]

MrFlibble, on 11 June 2020 - 01:51 AM, said:

BTW, any suggestions for a good usermap with the amusement park theme?

First one to come to mind is Dark Place 5 by Taivo Maripuu, although a gloomy take on it, still a spectacular one: https://www.arrovfnu...5-taivo-maripuu

edit - at least IIRC, it's meant to be an abandoned amusement park? I've seen it described as such before and it surely feels like one to me. But browsing different reviews now, I'm seeing different interpretations.

[MrFlibble]

At any rate, it's a very atmospheric map.