[zchri9]

Quote

Season finale of Jace Hall Show this Thursday! Featuring Duke Nukem Forever... Follow my twitter for a sneak peek link I'll tweet Wednesday

From Facebook

Thursday at Jacehall.tv

Edit - Sneak Preview - http://rapidshare.com/files/242919113/Duke...8_540P_1.6k.avi

[Psyrgery]

I think it's the closest look we'll ever have on the current build...

But, it's nice. I'll stick to Jace's Twitter and be there when they release the video.

I think it'll be interesting

[zchri9]

Todd Roy over at HDFilms has told me it will be up on jacehall.tv on Thursday.

Quote

Producer of the amazing Jace Hall Show

[KareBear]

I knew about this before any of you.From Jace Halls interview on the avault podcast.

http://podcast.avault.com/ its Episode #30.

[zchri9]

KareBear, on Jun 9 2009, 12:40 AM, said:

I knew about this before any of you.From Jace Halls interview on the avault podcast.

http://podcast.avault.com/ its Episode #30.

and your point is?
If you knew about it you should have posted about it.

[Lt.Havoc]

Not sure what to think about this. Some one in the 3DR forums said it will be just a tribute to Duke Nukem and that it wont have DNF in it, but even if its in, what is Jace trying to accomplish? Maybe things do look better then we thought`?

Well, I will try to see it on wendsday.

[Jobi-Wan Kenobi]

what if Jace recorded the DNF part before the mass exodus in May and the duke tribute was shot later due to this sad fact. So we may see DNF in action but DNF is still screwed!

[Lt.Havoc]

Hmm....yup, thats a mood point you have there. We will know when he runs the show on Thursday (not wendsday, sorry my bad), everything before that is wild speculation, like always.

[Sinisterambo]

Lt.Havoc, on Jun 9 2009, 11:39 AM, said:

Hmm....yup, thats a moot point...

Fixed.

Remember Jace had about 20-25 minutes of footage of DNF from around 18 months ago so if anyone can talk about it, Jace can.

Already posted on 3DRforums:-

http://www.fileden.com/files/2007/8/16/135...6-8-09%20E3.mp3

Positive outlook on DNF's future (about 2/3rds of the way through).

[Lt.Havoc]

They do have a posetive outlook on DNF even after all the things happend? Hmm.......

[Sinisterambo]

Lt.Havoc, on Jun 9 2009, 12:54 PM, said:

They do have a positive outlook on DNF even after all the things happened? Hmm.......

Hmm indeed. This Undead radio podcast (above) has given me the inspiration for a new theory or 'insight' (hehe):-

Maybe Take Two, when showed the game earlier this year, saw how much potential this game has and wanted to own ALL of this game to maximise profits. 3DR closed down production because of how little needs to be done to finish the game and they chose to save the game, instead of 3DR's employee's careers (as I have said before, why continue to pay for developers if they have already done the developing?). I now believe it was Scott who has the reigns at 3DR (although he has gone to Radar Group) and these were his decisions based on how completed the game is and how awesome it is. I know Weider has much more insight (since he used to make this game) but now since the guy on the radio is prepared to state our speculations as fact, it seems like the positive DNF people here (hi rockmx8) may have been right (not rockmx8 btw).

Lots of reasons point to this conclusion and I think this (and the Jace Hall show on Thursday) will give us lots to talk about and speculate over.

Hope for the game has increased (for me, at least) again. I love this emotional DNF roller coaster (don't get your knickers in a twist Lotan, Duke isn't (and never will be) an emo

[crunchysuperman]

Sounds to me like he doesn't know any more than we do.

[Kathy]

Sinisterambo, on Jun 9 2009, 04:02 PM, said:

I love this emotional DNF roller coaster (don't get your knickers in a twist Lotan, Duke isn't (and never will be) an emo.

You've missed one bracket at the end.

[Sinisterambo]

Lotan, on Jun 9 2009, 01:12 PM, said:

You've missed one bracket at the end.

Ah man, I deleted it earlier by accident. Thanks

[kaisersoze]

Sinisterambo, on Jun 9 2009, 07:50 AM, said:

Fixed.

Remember Jace had about 20-25 minutes of footage of DNF from around 18 months ago so if anyone can talk about it, Jace can.

Already posted on 3DRforums:-

http://www.fileden.com/files/2007/8/16/135...6-8-09%20E3.mp3

Positive outlook on DNF's future (about 2/3rds of the way through).

Listened to it(thanks for the link btw) and it doesn't seem like he has any really solid "inside sources". Comes across like wishful thinking if you ask me. There's simply
no way this game will get done and released within the next year as he thinks.

The game is dead.

Let it go, move on.

[Lt.Havoc]

No, its not, as long as they dont post it on the front page that they canceld it, everything is open. Also, a good reporter always has his sources and not everything needs to be "from the inside". He said that its hard to get a offical statment from 3DR, but that dosent mean that there are things going on behind the scenes. Also, if he would not think its coming out, why would he then say it?

I mean, really, if he would belive that it isnt coming out, he would have said it, but he didnt. Also, there is still the Jace Hall Show and I am looking forward to it.

[crunchysuperman]

Lt.Havoc, on Jun 9 2009, 09:32 AM, said:

No, its not, as long as they dont post it on the front page that they canceld it, everything is open.

It would be just as easy for them to post "it's not canceled & still coming WID", but they haven't.

[Raziel]

crunchysuperman, on Jun 9 2009, 06:39 AM, said:

It would be just as easy for them to post "it's not canceled & still coming WID", but they haven't.

Well, did you consider that perhaps they don't know the fate of the project either and hence aren't posting anything? The fact that their not saying anything means 2 things. Firstly, they haven't officially cancelled it yet, which is good. Secondly, they are in the middle of a court case and it is probably in their best interests to say as little as possible publicly until it is wise to do so.

Also, this may not be much to go on, but in their public statement they did say one interesting thing... that "3DR retains certain rights to sell the game directly to the public"... It's not much, but it's an indication that they haven't completely given up on the idea that the game might see the light of day.

[ShXIII]

More propaganda, people do the math over the years and all the current events regarding DNF, its dead, you have your hopes in some fat ass who is playing you all for a bunch of suckers. I admit I was one of them from 1997-2001. I'm glad I got out of the downward spiral that is the DNF fanboy bandwagon

[Lt.Havoc]

And why are you then still posting here if you got away? I dont understand that, why do people claim not to be interested in 3DR and DNF anymore and say its "propaganda" and whatnot (yeah, right propaganda that isnt even coming from GB) and yet insist to post here? That makes no sense to me, but then again, we humans arnet very rational in the first place.

[ShXIII]

Who wouldn't be curious about the outcome of DNF? I never said I wasn't curious what i said was I'm not a deranged fan boy

[PokeThePower]

Sinisterambo, on Jun 9 2009, 06:50 AM, said:

http://www.fileden.com/files/2007/8/16/135...6-8-09%20E3.mp3

Positive outlook on DNF's future (about 2/3rds of the way through).

Considering he cites the activities of the website when it was going up and down as evidence for why he thinks it's going to come out, I think it would be unwise to put any stock into what he has to say. It's obvious he's piecing something together with even less information than we all have here.

[Tea Monster]

It could be possible that the game is 'hibernating' while various parties try to gain control of the IP. It all sounds too much like an episode of 'Dallas' and not enough like real life, but I know stuff like this does occasionally happen.

Putting stock in it and pinning hopes on that is kinda silly though.

[Raziel]

ShXIII, on Jun 9 2009, 08:47 AM, said:

I never said I wasn't curious what i said was I'm not a deranged fan boy

Neither am I, but I still don't think the project is completely dead, there are still a few ways this can play out, so I'm going to wait and see. The basic possibilities I see are as follows:
1) Game doesn't release
2) Take-Two wins in 2 years and releases the game as-is (as I've stated before, games are built breadth-wise, so even if it's incomplete and buggy, it is probably still clockable at this point and I think this is all they will want - assuming they even care, they might just try and get their 12 million back and be done with DNF). I can't see them spending more on DNF so if they can't release it as-is, I don't think they'll bother, and even if they did, after 2 years of no development picking the project up again is unrealistic.
3) George/Scott passes it to one of the developers of the Radar group along with a few people that know a lot about the game's tech and how to make content for it (this one is quite likely in my opinion assuming the legal battle doesn't freeze development over the next 2 years)
4) George and the remains of 3DR slowly polishes sections of the game at this point and does electronic episode-style releases, after one release they'll be back on their feet
5) Take-Two and 3D Realms settle out of court (this is likely as well and will get the game back into development, although I expect delays since they won't be able to get all of the good guys they had before)
6) Someone chooses to purchase the publishing rights from Take-Two and funds the rest of development (not likely, but not impossible, Microsoft for one would definitely throw money at this one if they can secure it as an XBOX360 exclusive, and no, they won't care if that means the controls suck).
7) Scott decides to pour a bit more into its development. I can't see it being a lot, but enough to get the game shippable
8) Some sort of fund-raiser, like a prologue that costs $5-$10 or something, *SPOILER* like the segment at the beginning where Duke plays Duke3D in his mansion, there is no reason that has to be part of the main duke game, it could be sold separately as a prologue and people will buy it...

I'm sure there are many other possibilities as well. My point is, if it was cancelled they would have clearly stated that, right now, nothing is certain and I think it coming out is just as likely as it not coming out. Or rather, that is what I'd like to say, unfortunately Take-Two is seriously fucking things up right now... if they manage to get the 2 year development freeze approved, then yes, I will say 99% chance the game is dead. If Take-Two doesn't manage to prevent the game from being completed, I think 50/50 are good odds right now.

And no, Take-Two doesn't intend to finish the game, if they win the lawsuit and the game is not in any way shippable, it will not see the light of day. If they wanted it complete, they wouldn't be requesting a development freeze for the next 2 odd years while this legal battle rages on. Think about it, what's the point right? They don't have the resources to work on it, so the freeze seems pointless... But lets say they pull through and get it done, you'd think Take-Two would be happy as the game would get released, right? Well, why freeze development then? Even if they can't complete it, if 3DR just finishes 2% of the game, that is 2% less Take-Two would have to do to get the game on store shelves. To put it bluntly, Take-Two doesn't want the game completed. If it's completed, they have to pay 3DR 4.5 million which they don't want to do, and no, they don't care about you and do not plan to release it out of the goodness of their hearts. If Take-Two wins, you better hope the game is shippable, or it is as good as dead. If 3DR wins, I think there is a good chance it will be passed to another developer along with recommendations on who to hire to help finish the game. Also, if 3DR is not prevented from working on the title by Take-Two, they will keep at least one or two people around working on the tech so someone exists that can readily pick up the game and teach a new team how to work with the tech... If Take-Two succeeds with the development freeze, no one might be around that can actually finish the game. Take-Two is clearly trying to prevent the game from seeing the light of day.

So that's my two cents, realistically, I think the chances of it being released is 25%, I would say 50%, but I think everything depends on the development freeze going ahead or not.

[Sinisterambo]

Caine, on Jun 10 2009, 12:41 AM, said:

...why should duke be an emo?

He shouldn't, lol. It was an old joke I shared with Lotan.

Raziel, your post is very well thought out and a good read. I particulaly liked the word "clockable".

[Raziel]

Sinisterambo, on Jun 9 2009, 04:15 PM, said:

Raziel, your post is very well thought out and a good read. I particulaly liked the word "clockable".

I'm glad you enjoyed it .

I actually suspect Scott/George intended to go with 3 to get the game done but couldn't due to the lawsuit from Take-Two - so they ended up just laying off the entire team without following through with passing the project to another developer. I suspect if the case falls through or development doesn't get frozen, they might still pass it to another developer they have close ties with along with a list of recommended people to acquire to help finish it off.

Either way, I think the most critical thing right now is the development freeze, fact is, if that goes through, nothing happens on the game for the next 2 or so years and the lawsuit will stay in full force. End result will probably be non-release. If the development freeze is denied, Take-Two might drop the charges since things won't look good for them if the game does get finished partway through the lawsuit (since they'd be left wide-open for a counter-sue for damages starting a lawsuit based on false information which ruined their public image). Their whole case rests on 3DR not producing anything substantial in the last 12 years, in order to create that illusion to put the case in their favor, development has to end, that is why they're pushing for a development freeze. If there is no development freeze, going through with the case might be too risky and they'd be more willing to try and settle things out of court and get development back on track. Even if things play out this way though, expect at least a year delay to the game since a mostly new team would have to take over development and believe me, we tried this once and called it the snow-white approach, one knowledgeable developer and a whole bunch of newbies... to say it was a painful experience would be an understatement.

[PokeThePower]

Raziel, on Jun 9 2009, 07:07 PM, said:

I actually suspect Scott/George intended to go with 3 to get the game done but couldn't due to the lawsuit from Take-Two - so they ended up just laying off the entire team without following through with passing the project to another developer. I suspect if the case falls through or development doesn't get frozen, they might still pass it to another developer they have close ties with along with a list of recommended people to acquire to help finish it off.

Well here is something to chew on with #3.

The *vast* majority of developers out there are funded via advances. They live basically milestone to milestone and have very little in the bank. If they don't strike a new deal, they die. That's why so many devs went under when publishers had to get tight with their purse strings the past couple of years. There are very very few devs who are capable of funding themselves for any decent amount of time. In order for them to pass it to a Radar team to work on it they would need one of two options:

1) A company that can afford to pay to continue development themselves.
or
2) Find money to pay the advances to the new company.

They couldn't do #2 because if they could, then they could have continued development themselves. If they found #1, that sort of company is highly unlikely to want to do work on DNF because they almost certainly have their own things going and are going to earn significantly more from continuing with those versus splitting whatever profits with 3DR *and* Take 2. And that's in the unlikely chance they even have staff who aren't already taken up by an existing project for the next couple of years.

So I don't see #3 as a viable option either.

[megamustaine]

Was your split with 3DR amicable Wieder? It seems like you had major grievances at the time you left 3DR and are bringing some of that negative energy here. Maybe you are just being realistic about the project, but it seems like you lost all hope with the direction of the project a long time ago, are not one bit surprised that the development team shut down, and have absolutely no faith that we will ever see something with the DNF name on it.

[megamustaine]

http://podcast.com/show/134465/

Check out episode 30 from about 40 minutes on. It has Jace describing what will be in the season finale of the Jace Hall Show. Basically he filmed about 30 minutes of DNF gameplay, and they will be splicing it together as a tribute to DNF. It sounded as if he genuinely loved the game. Hopefully development on the game will continue and we will get to experience what he did sometime down the road.

[PokeThePower]

megamustaine, on Jun 10 2009, 12:51 AM, said:

Was your split with 3DR amicable Wieder? It seems like you had major grievances at the time you left 3DR and are bringing some of that negative energy here. Maybe you are just being realistic about the project, but it seems like you lost all hope with the direction of the project a long time ago, are not one bit surprised that the development team shut down, and have absolutely no faith that we will ever see something with the DNF name on it.

I think I've been pretty moderate to supportive of 3DR, especially prior to all the recent hub-bub. The recent circumstances and the history that leads up to it does make 3DR worthy of some levelheaded commentary on just how we got here.

I don't like seeing people build themselves up for disappointment based on my best analysis of what's been going on so I'm contributing what I can to temper it where I think it's misplaced. In the post above where I counter the "#3" option, for example, I'm just providing food for thought where I don't think he had fully thought through the premise and what it means in the real world. That's what I've been trying to do in a lot of places. That is a post I would have made no matter what the project or company was.

So I'm sorry if it seems like negative energy... but considering the honestly rather dire circumstances the project and company is in right now and the checkered history... it's just a negative situation. I don't think I've been negative about 3DR itself or any individuals involved with it, other than a couple of minor nitpicks about the released footage/scenes and obvious disappointment that the project has ended up in the situation it is in. That does upset me.